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Approaching 30--need help to revamp skin routine!!

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ava10
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Tue Aug 22, 2017 10:44 am      Reply with quote
Hello everyone!

Been a while since I was last here. I have only recently started paying attention to my skin again. I always used sunscreen, but fell off on regular exfoliating and using actives. Here is my current routine:

Morning
Cleanse w/ Purity Made Simple
**Adding Hada Labo Hyaluronic Acid Toner**
Wait 10 minutes or so
Shiseido Ultimate Sun Protection spf 60

Evening
Cleanse w/ Purity Made Simple and Clarisonic Deep Pore brush
Walgreens Studio 35 AHA Cream
Wait 20 minutes
**Adding Hada Labo Hyaluronic Acid Toner**

Twice a week
Olay Regenerist Microdermabrasion Peel
Queen Helene Mint Julip Masque

Issues: Since I used SPF and have generally oily skin, I have really no wrinkles, only slight lines under my eyes which may be dehydration. Dehydration and clogged pores are my biggest concerns actually! I have dehydration lines if I scrunch up my cheek, which is why I am adding the hyaluronic toner from Hada Labo. I also have small whiteheads I can see if I look super close in the mirror on my T-zone.

Questions!! Am I using the toner in the right place (especially in the evening after the AHA cream)?? Also, I know my routine is super simple, but once I acclimate to the toner, I am also going to add Timeless C serum. Any other critiques/suggestions?

Thank you for all your help! Smile
TheresaMary
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Thu Aug 24, 2017 5:24 am      Reply with quote
To me I'd actually suggest using the toner after cleansing before applying the cream. You see particularly as its an acidic toner, you want the skin to readjust after cleaning and return to a normalish ph level before applying AHA. Otherwise the cream won't be able to penetrate as deeply.

You may be overdoing it with both an acidic toner and AHA cream too. There isn't any need to double up at all.

Applying the toner after the cream will stop the toner rebalancing the skin.
ava10 wrote:
Questions!! Am I using the toner in the right place (especially in the evening after the AHA cream)?? Also, I know my routine is super simple, but once I acclimate to the toner, I am also going to add Timeless C serum. Any other critiques/suggestions?

Thank you for all your help! Smile
ava10
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Thu Aug 24, 2017 6:58 am      Reply with quote
Thanks so much! I will change the order of the toner and the cream. The thing is, I didn't think this toner was particularly acidic-- it's supposed to have a neutral pH. Also I don't think the toner provides exfoliation which is why I also have the AHA cream.
TheresaMary
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Thu Aug 24, 2017 7:47 am      Reply with quote
The name you said was "Hada Labo Hyaluronic Acid Toner" and like most acidic toners,
they aren't actually neutral but encourage the skin to return to a neutral ph due to the acidic activity that takes place on contact with the skin.

Back in the day there was a high craze for going for toners which felt like they were burning the skin off but in all reality you don't need such a sensation for a toner to be effective, far from it.
ava10 wrote:
Thanks so much! I will change the order of the toner and the cream. The thing is, I didn't think this toner was particularly acidic-- it's supposed to have a neutral pH. Also I don't think the toner provides exfoliation which is why I also have the AHA cream.
ava10
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Thu Aug 24, 2017 8:04 am      Reply with quote
Thanks again! Yes it does have acid in the name, but hyaluronic acid does not sting, at least not me. It is very hydrating.
TheresaMary
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Thu Aug 24, 2017 8:32 am      Reply with quote
Not all hyaluronic acids are uniform in strength or character, and its not uncommon to go some time before you experience stinging, same with any topical out there.

Whilst it is a good ingredient,
there are some people who are actually against it as a topical for the belief that in wetting the skin it encourages bacteria etc to take up residency.
However I have used several different forms of it without issue too.

However with hyaluronic acid there is a distinct difference between a toner and an actual moisturiser (such as a gel) too. The toner you are using has acid in the name which suggests there would usually be another acid type in that. Most toners with acids in them (and there are hundreds) do not always sting - but it depends on the strength of the acid.

ava10 wrote:
Thanks again! Yes it does have acid in the name, but hyaluronic acid does not sting, at least not me. It is very hydrating.
ava10
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Thu Aug 24, 2017 9:36 am      Reply with quote
That's very interesting. I did not know all that. Smile This toner is more like a moisturizer. But hmmm maybe I will lay off some on the exfoliating steps in my routine.
TheresaMary
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Fri Aug 25, 2017 4:32 am      Reply with quote
In rereading your post you mention dehydration but also whiteheads. Whiteheads I seem to recall are caused by oil getting trapped into the pores themselves, so the cleanse that I've heard raves about for both blackheads and whitehead is the Oil Cleansing Method. This will help both with the whiteheads but also the dehydrated skin too. There isn't any moisturizer in your morning routine and that could be also something that needs adjusting. You see skin that's moisturized doesn't create whiteheads for no reason, however skin that's drying out will do so.
ava10
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Fri Aug 25, 2017 6:36 am      Reply with quote
Thanks for that. I was using Cerave PM before but I stopped because I felt it was making my skin oily. Even using it as a moisturizer, I've had these whiteheads. Ughhhh I've had them since high school!!!!! 15 years!!!!! I am finally being more proactive about them. The dehydration I've had off and on for like 5 years. Finally trying to fix that too.

The only thing that reduced, almost eliminated, the whiteheads in the past was a strict routine of chemical exfoliating and Queen Helene Mint Julep Masque. Now I am trying to get back to that routine but it's only been a couple of months.
TheresaMary
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Fri Aug 25, 2017 7:15 am      Reply with quote
Well if Cerave was making your skin oily then it was good to stop using it for sure. I'm not sure if you read, but OCM has helped with a lot of people and both whiteheads (mila) and blackheads too. So its worth trying that out.

I know dehydration is bad, but I don't buy a lot of the recommendations of it. For example, if a person is dehydrate and starts drinking more water, then to me it makes sense that they get out of it. However I know one person was saying it takes 6 months but that just doesn't add up to me.

ava10 wrote:
Thanks for that. I was using Cerave PM before but I stopped because I felt it was making my skin oily. Even using it as a moisturizer, I've had these whiteheads. Ughhhh I've had them since high school!!!!! 15 years!!!!! I am finally being more proactive about them. The dehydration I've had off and on for like 5 years. Finally trying to fix that too.

The only thing that reduced, almost eliminated, the whiteheads in the past was a strict routine of chemical exfoliating and Queen Helene Mint Julep Masque. Now I am trying to get back to that routine but it's only been a couple of months.
ava10
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Fri Aug 25, 2017 7:54 am      Reply with quote
Yes, I saw your recommendation for OCM but I don't think I can try it right now because I just don't have the time. Even my very simple routine takes up a lot of time at night :/ I can't hog the bathroom living in a family and I like my sleep!!! OCM from my understanding takes much longer than using a one step cleanser. If nothing else works tho, I will have to figure it out.

As for dehydration, I don't know, it only seems to be my face. My urine is always clear or a light yellow (TMI??! LOL) so I think I do get enough water.
TheresaMary
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Fri Aug 25, 2017 8:37 am      Reply with quote
I don't think OCM takes up time, if anything because it uses oils it saves time because you are cleansing and moisturising. The reason I suggested it was the whiteheads comment, but if you got that handled with the masks then don't bother. Was only a suggestion and if what you are dong is working then so much the better.

Re dehydration - it doesn't sound like it is dehydration at all now from what you say.
ava10
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Fri Aug 25, 2017 8:43 am      Reply with quote
Don't you need to steam your face with OCM? That would take time I always thought, plus all the massaging.

Yeah, the dehydrated skin is what I think I have because it is crepey when I make an expression. Or if I push my cheek up with my finger, you can see very fine, crepey lines. That is dehydration, right?
TheresaMary
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Fri Aug 25, 2017 1:36 pm      Reply with quote
No you don't at all but I can see how that might be of benefit. Do your research and you will see. Steaming isn't part of OCM.

Not dehydration isn't that at all. That happens to non dehydrated skin too but dehydrated skin doesn't snap back.

You are using terms that are confusing because you think it means something else. Maybe do a bit more research first!
ava10 wrote:
Don't you need to steam your face with OCM? That would take time I always thought, plus all the massaging.

Yeah, the dehydrated skin is what I think I have because it is crepey when I make an expression. Or if I push my cheek up with my finger, you can see very fine, crepey lines. That is dehydration, right?
ava10
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Fri Aug 25, 2017 1:47 pm      Reply with quote
Thanks, I will look more into OCM because when I looked it up years ago, it involved steaming with a hot cloth each time based on all the instructions I read. If there is a simpler version, I could do that.

As far as dehydrated skin goes, I am now more confused by your answer. My skin looks normal until I pinch it or make some sort of expression: then it has very, very fine lines and a crepe like texture if I look really close. I wish I could photograph it but it doesn't show up in pictures. Dehydrated skin is the only answer I've found to this so if it's not that, I am lost.
pailinnwithwings
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Sat Aug 26, 2017 12:42 am      Reply with quote
Hey there, I'm pretty new to skincare and I just found this forum! I was reading this and saw that a lot of people talking about AHA...

I recently found out about chemical exfoliants and used this as a resource. I can't link it but if you google (skincarisma aha vs bha) it comes up. All the other information seem like it was correct it was just where they recommended to use it.

I realised they said that they recommend exfoliants after cleansing but that is different to what is being said here... Can someone please help? I have combo skin with Acne and PIH. Thanks... sorry if this is not allowed.
Ottawa Shopper
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Sun Sep 10, 2017 7:00 am      Reply with quote
30 is not "that old".
I am 40 and would like to think that is not very old yet.
Some of my friends still go out, DJ and are 45, 50,I even know a man who is probably 70 and still goes out to listen to music and has a disco radio show.

I actually took a dance class and was at the same time slot as a 5 year old and a 10 year old girl...that kind of made me feel a bit "old" then...lol.

Sorry that is not really any skin care advice here.
TheresaMary
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Mon Sep 11, 2017 6:57 am      Reply with quote
AHAs and BHAs are exfoliants in their own right, but they come in many different forms and not all are the same. So for example in the original post here they are talking about an AHA toner. That is going to be very mild in comparison to say a gel AHA.
Now its not different than whats being said here (i.e. in that its applied after cleansing).
Different age groups and skin types have different needs/concerns so its impossiblet o put a set in stone routine for everyone. Although AHAs when they are used properly can be very effective – they aren’t for everyone. Some skins do not like them at all. Same with glycolic acid toners and gels. They work better for some but not for others.
It depends on your skin type, age and what your current routine is.
pailinnwithwings wrote:
Hey there, I'm pretty new to skincare and I just found this forum! I was reading this and saw that a lot of people talking about AHA...

I recently found out about chemical exfoliants and used this as a resource. I can't link it but if you google (skincarisma aha vs bha) it comes up. All the other information seem like it was correct it was just where they recommended to use it.

I realised they said that they recommend exfoliants after cleansing but that is different to what is being said here... Can someone please help? I have combo skin with Acne and PIH. Thanks... sorry if this is not allowed.
TheresaMary
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Mon Sep 11, 2017 6:58 am      Reply with quote
I'm approaching my 70's this year and don't feel that's old either! Age isn't anything but a number anyhow!
Ottawa Shopper wrote:
30 is not "that old".
I am 40 and would like to think that is not very old yet.
Some of my friends still go out, DJ and are 45, 50,I even know a man who is probably 70 and still goes out to listen to music and has a disco radio show.

I actually took a dance class and was at the same time slot as a 5 year old and a 10 year old girl...that kind of made me feel a bit "old" then...lol.

Sorry that is not really any skin care advice here.
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Wed Sep 13, 2017 2:17 pm      Reply with quote
Hyaluronic Acid is *not* an acid in the way we traditionally think about acids. The following is some somewhat detailed info on Hyaluronic Acid (which I will bracket out in case you or anyone else wants to skip it and go straight to my thoughts on your current skin regime and skin challenges). Smile

********
Hyaluronic acid is produced naturally by our bodies where it supports tissue health. While its primary function within the body is not necessarily skin hydration, hyaluronic acid is capable of holding up to 1000 times its own weight in water, making it a decent hydrator for most if not all skin types.

So if our bodies already naturally produce hyaluronic acid, then why do we need it in our skincare products? As noted above, the primary function of hyaluronic acid produced by the body isn’t necessarily skin hydration. But also--and more importantly--every day as hyaluronic acid is naturally produced by the body it is also broken down. Therefore, in skincare, products containing hyaluronic acid can help fill those gaps. This becomes especially important as we get older as--due to many factors--our skin's ability to naturally and effectively maintain moisture levels decreases over time.

Some products may contain hyaluronic acid in varying “molecular weights” such as “low, “medium,” and/or “high.” Hyaluronic acid in its most basic form is made of of larger molecules, meaning they will remain on skin’s outer surface as they are too large to penetrate into the skin. So, large molecule hyaluronic acid will only temporarily hydrate the surface of the skin. Hyaluronic acid in varying “weights,” however, will be able to address surface hydration as well as penetrate deeper into our skin layers. This increased hydration also serves to “plump” the skin on multiple levels, achieving an overall more visible plumping effect.

Varying weights of hyaluronic acid can also aid in the delivery of other active ingredients to multiple layers of the skin. Personally, I see this as being the primary benefit of products with hyaluronic acid, and therefore I tend toward products that contain hyaluronic acid *as well as* other beneficial ingredients.

FINAL NOTE: Since hyaluronic acid essentially attracts water, it can draw water from within the skin, from the environment (such as moisture in the air), and/or from products containing water that are applied to the skin. Therefore, it is believed that if you live in a dry climate or your environment is also dry (with little to no humidity), hyaluronic acid isn't going to do much for you. My thoughts on this are that in addition to using hyaluronic acid, you should also be layering with products that contain water-based moisture.
**********

So, anyway, the hyaluronic acid toner you are currently using is fine for the purposes of hydration.

However, the "slight lines under the eyes" you are describing as dehydration sounds very much like dehydration to me. I wanna be clear here about dehydration. Dryness and dehydration are not the same. Dryness refers to skin lacking in oil, while dehydration refers to skin lacking in water. Therefore you can be oily and dehydrated. In fact, the majority of clients I see are dehydrated to some extent.

You can drink plenty of water and your skin can still be dehydrated. Because water-loss in the skin can be caused by a variety of factors such as lack of sleep, medications, environment, stress... on and on. How we *address* dehydration in the skin is to make sure we use products that supply additional water moisture when needed as well as support water retention in the skin.

I would suggest adding another step for DAY after the HA Toner to supplement the benefits of hyaluronic acid and address your dehydration. So this would either be an eye cream or an all-over face cream or serum with water-binding ingredients.

In addition I might think about using your HA Toner at NIGHT after cleansing. I could not find an ingredient list for your AHA cream but I *suspect* a few things. 1: that it may not be providing enough water moisture to supplement your HA Toner and 2: It might have some ingredients in it that are causing your whiteheads?

Also, since I can't find an ingredient list for your AHA cream, I don't know the formulation of AHA. However since you're having issues with dehydration, I might prefer a Lactic Acid for you (which tends to have more humectant properties than Glycolic).

And maybe also a BHA in addition to AHA for addressing the congestion in your pores.

Hopefully this helps! Let us know how you get on and feel free to hit me up with any other questions!
TheresaMary
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Thu Sep 14, 2017 1:48 am      Reply with quote
Whilst this is true, an AHA cream is an acid. AHA stands for ALPHA HYDROXY ACID and is definitely nothing like hyaluronic acid in its nature and so it does not abide by the same rules. If you reread the post above you will see the poster mentions specifically using AHA Cream.

missbabypaw wrote:
Hyaluronic Acid is *not* an acid in the way we traditionally think about acids. The following is some somewhat detailed info on Hyaluronic Acid (which I will bracket out in case you or anyone else wants to skip it and go straight to my thoughts on your current skin regime and skin challenges). Smile
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Fri Sep 15, 2017 10:05 am      Reply with quote
TheresaMary wrote:
Whilst this is true, an AHA cream is an acid. AHA stands for ALPHA HYDROXY ACID and is definitely nothing like hyaluronic acid in its nature and so it does not abide by the same rules. If you reread the post above you will see the poster mentions specifically using AHA Cream.


I think maybe the lines of communication are being crossed here or I didn't do a good enough job in my post explaining things. I only meant to clarify to the original poster that her toner with Hyaluronic Acid is fine for the purposes of hydration (because hyaluronic acid is not an AHA, a BHA, or an "acid" in the way we traditionally might view them in terms of skincare). Smile

However in viewing her regime in total, she may need to supplement her HA toner with other products to really support her hydration levels.

Yes, the original poster is also using an AHA cream and that is a separate issue. In this case I couldn't find an ingredient list for the specific cream she is using, so I don't know the type or percentage of AHA in the formulation (glycolic, lactic, a mix, etc?). So, is it effectively performing as an AHA should--is it too weak or too strong? I also cannot say if there may be other ingredients in this AHA cream which may be causing whiteheads. So I'm curious about that.
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Fri Sep 15, 2017 8:12 pm      Reply with quote
i think when you approach 30, you should try more department store products instead of drugstore products.

from what i know the hadalabo is more like a drugstore brand for teenagers, and a toner does not do much.

I think you should add a serum in your routine.
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