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Thu Oct 19, 2006 9:49 pm  |
This is my 5 week, half face experiment using Quasar (Q/BQ) and LightStim (LS). This is my personal experience with both machines. I don’t have any or know any theory behind LED technologies. All my knowledge is from the internet. Hopefully my experiment can answer some members’ questions. I do not work for any of these companies. This post took me a few days to finish, so if you see me repeating or saying something back and forth you know why!!!
This is going to be a very long post. I’ll do some comparisons between these two machines including customer service. If you did not want to read the details, my conclusion is:
Improvement:
Both sides of my face are very similar. I think both machines worked about the same, but Quasar might be a little bit better. AND Quasar takes SO MUCH LESS time than LightStim. If BQ took twice as much time to reach Quasar’s result, then BQ still takes MUCH less time than LightStim.
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Personal Background: Asian, 47, medium to light Asian skin tone, combo skin towards dry side, non-sensitive (rubber tough), easily tanned and almost never burned. Skin issues: 1. Under Eye Areas: dark circles, fine lines, dry, bags, sagging. 2. Upper Eye Lids: drooping. 3. Hyperpigmentation, 4. Deep Laugh Lines (nose to mouth)
Comparisons:
Price: LS: $197 + $16.32 Shipping (priority mail in US) with 2 free skin care products, BQ: $400 ($450 BIN) + $20 Shipping (eye goggles included), Q: $1500 (now is $1700) + 2 free skin care products & eye goggles, Shipping is free 2nd day air.
Return Policy: LS: 90 Days, BQ: 30 Days, Q: 60 Days.
Housing: LS: Good Quality Plastic (white) with foam (grey) on handle, BQ/Q: Good Quality Aluminum. Both machines need to be pluged into a wall outlet.
Probe size: LS: Diameter: 2.5”, Treatment Area: 19.6 square inches, BQ: 1.25”, Treatment Area: 4.9 square inches, Q: 1.75”, Treatment Area: 9.6 square inches.
Timer: LS: None; Q: 2 min (Pulsed), 4 min (CW)
Wavelengths: Both LS and BQ/Q have 2 different RED wavelengths and 2 Infrared wavelengths (600nm-1000nm)
Frequency: LS: Continued Wave, BQ/Q: CW, Pulsed: Low, High
Number of LED lights & size: LS: 72, 3mm, Q: 24, 5mm (12 Red, 12 Infrared), BQ: 24, 3mm (12 Red, 12 Infrared)
LED: LS: all LEDs are exposed and they actually touch your skin during treatment. So, if you pressed the probe too hard you’d have hundreds of LED marks on your face.
BQ/Q: all LEDs are inside housing, like a flash light.
Power: Both Alex and Craig told me their joule per square cm per second, BUT I forgot, SORRY.
Heat: If I turned on Quasar and LS at the same time, after a while Quasar’s probe is warmer than LS. Does this mean Quasar has more power? Not necessarily. The healing power is not from the heat, but most from the joules generated. Different designs might cause how much heat it generated too.
Carrying Case: LS: Medium weight white cardboard box with bubble wrap.
BQ/Q: High quality air tight black plastic case with foam protection.
Instructions: Both machines’ instructions are not that clear to me. I was pretty disappointed that Quasar did not come with a live demo DVD.
Customer Service: Both companies have good customer service. Alex (Advanced Therapeutics) is always there (James joined in after I purchased). If Craig, the inventor of LightStim, is there, he’s very helpful and has answered MOST of my questions. But if he’s not there, then nobody can answer technical questions.
Warranty: LS: 2 years, BQ: 1 year, Q: 2 years
Treatment Time:
Q: 28 Min/Weekly, BQ: 28 Min/Semi-Weekly (2 pulsed passes + 1 CW spot treatment).
LightStim has 3 suggested treatment routines:
1. Daily: AM &/or PM: 45 ~ 60 sec each position, 1 Pass, about 13.5 ~ 18 min/session. So about 27 ~ 36 min PER DAY (including neck). I checked the positions again (my face), it’s about 18 positions to cover the whole face and neck.
2. Semi-Weekly: AM & PM, 60 ~ 120 sec each position, 2 Passes, 36 ~ 72 min / session, 72 to 144 min for AM + PM
3. Weekly: AM & PM, 120 sec each position, 4 Passes, 144 min / session, 288 min for AM + PM
In LS manual, it states most people have good results from #1. Use #1 first, after 3 weeks if no improvement, try #2. If using # 2, after 3 weeks if no improvement, try #3. The treatment time in LS manual is much less than my experience and calculation. In the manual, #2 takes 30~40 min/session, 60~80 min AM + PM. #3 takes 60 ~80min/session, 120 ~ 160 min AM + PM. But it still takes much more time than BQ (28 min semi-weekly) or Quasar (28 min weekly) according to LS manual.
Probe Contact: LS: touching skin or up to 1” away from skin. BQ/Q: Need to lightly touch skin; no light should escape to reach max result.
My first two Quasar WHOLE face treatments were 08/29/06 and 09/02/06.
1st treatment: Low frequency, 1 Pass, High frequency, 1 pass, CW: Spot Treatment, Total 30 min => No visible improvement,
2nd treatment: CW: 16 min => Dry face for 2 days
My half face experiment started from 09/07/06: Left: LightStim, daily routine: AM & PM, 15~20min/session, Right: Quasar, every 5th day, PM, 28~32min/session. Up to 10/12/06 I did 7 Quasar Treatments (every 5th day) on the right side of my face.
Result:
10/16/06 Both sides of my face looked the same. No “BIG” improvement for me. I really did not think LED machines helped me that much. I had weekly pictures taken (sides and front) since March. From my pictures I did not see any improvement on my laugh lines at all. They’re not professional shots and the angles might be off a little bit. Frustrated and mad, I examined my face very carefully on 10/16/06 night. I found my skin texture is better and I have kind of glow. I think because I was tooooo concentrated on my 4 bigger skin issues I did not see the improvement on other areas. I did not have 11s or forehead lines unless I frown or lift up my brows. I did those expressions on 10/16/06 to check and found those lines are softer.
Result Update:
10/18/06, I did a whole face Quasar treatment last night. I did 2 passes high frequency and CW for spot treatment. The only difference between this treatment from other Quasar treatment was I increased treatment time about 30 ~ 60sec each section. And 8 min CW spot treatment instead of 4. Before, in between, and after the treatment I sprayed PSF O2 Serum. After the 1st pass I saw a much brightened face in the mirror. And after the full treatment I saw a glowing face and my face seemed to have more definitions. I told my husband “Finally this thing is working!!” And I could not move my eyes from watching myself in the mirror. As I mentioned earlier, I was too concentrated on my 4 major issues and totally ignored other areas that showed improvement. I don’t know how much it’ll help me with my laugh lines or sun spots, but I’m really happy how it shrunk my pores.
Comments from Friends during last 5 weeks: 1 co-worker said my skin looked smoother a few times, and really thinks the LED machine works. 1 co-worker said my skin looked clearer, 1 friend said my skin is glowing. Another friend said my skin looked firmer. My husband, kids & relatives have not made any comment about my face.
Conclusion:
1. Effectiveness: Both machines worked about the same but BQ / Q might be a little bit better. BQ/Q takes a lot less time.
2. LED works better on the problems that are beginning to form (D………). I don’t know how long and how much it’ll help on deeper wrinkles like my laugh lines.
Interesting findings:
Twice after I did Quasar treatments, I have friends commented on my skin the next day (4th, 6th). Yes, only half of my face was treated. And after my 5th (half face), & 8th (full face) Quasar treatments I felt my face looked so good.
Pulsed vs. Continued Wave: I do not know if Pulsed frequency is proven to be non-significant or not. But from internet search, some LED Light Therapy machines using both Continued Wave and Pulsed frequency, some using Pulsed only, and some using CW only.
Probe Size: A bigger probe does not mean the treatment time will be shorter. It all depends on how much power the machine generates. And from treatment time, BQ/Q should be much powerful.
Concentration Cone (Q): It’s very handy to use it for spot treatment of broken capillaries, sun spots & 11’s. Focus on small areas so you won’t OVER TREAT other areas if using the probe. I doubt the Concentration Cone will collect all light energy and shoot out from the small opening. That’s lots of energy!! This is what my R&D dept told me. He might be wrong.
Probe Gliding: This is really painful especially if I don’t use anything on my face. I do not understand the theory behind this (Quasar). If I lifted up the probe only 0.1cm moving from one position to another, how much light energy is going to escape?
Eye areas: Both Alex and Craig told me I can put their machine on top of my eyes as long as my eyes are closed. I tried it few times but got scared. Now I put the probe about 1cm below my brows and as close as possible to my eyes when doing under eye areas, keeping my eyes closed.
Interesting reading: https://plus37.safe-order.net/heelspurs/a/led/led_research.html
Comments: For members who are interested in LED light therapy, those who are just starting to use the tool, and for members who did not see improvement after several treatments:
1. Following the suggested routine in the manual, by Alex or James. If you did not see improvement then modify the routine a little, do some experiments. Everybody reacts to LED differently.
2. Exam your face carefully, not just the areas you wish LED will help but all areas.
3. As Caspers Mum said to me when I asked for help on my laugh lines: “Skin Care can only do so much, there’s no miracle”. All of these OTC products can only do so much. As I mentioned earlier, if your problem is just beginning to form, then you might see improvement quickly. But if your wrinkles are well pronounced then I don’t know how much LED is going to help and how long it’s going to take. Katee’s laugh lines almost diminished but mine have stayed the same. Your age and skin condition matters too.
I was thinking of doing a LightStim Weekly routine to see if I would get the same brightened, and glowing face as I got from Quasar but could not find time to do it.
I think I covered everything here. And thank you for your patience if you read this from the beginning to end. I’ll update my results if I see more improvements. |
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53, DermaQuest, NCN Products, PMD, Dermarolling |
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Thu Oct 19, 2006 9:55 pm |
Thanks for taking so much time and trouble to write this review - it's wonderful. Just what I needed to know.
One thing - can I ask? You say you get these comments. Are they completely unsolicited or do they know about the BQ? I wasn't sure from what you said. |
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Thu Oct 19, 2006 10:19 pm |
| Molly wrote: |
One thing - can I ask? You say you get these comments. Are they completely unsolicited or do they know about the BQ? I wasn't sure from what you said. |
Two friends told me w/o I asking (They did not know about Quasar). 1 co-worker who I constantly asking him LED questions told me my skin looked smoother few times w/o I asking. I asked him if he's sure and he gave me a big YES. (He knows about Quasar.) Only 1 co-work who said my skin looked clearer was answering my question. (He did not know about Quasar.) |
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53, DermaQuest, NCN Products, PMD, Dermarolling |
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Thu Oct 19, 2006 11:35 pm |
| Wow MACrisis. This is a really great review, and thanks for taking the time to compare as well! |
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Fri Oct 20, 2006 12:27 am |
| Quote: |
This is going to be a very long post. I’ll do some comparisons between these two machines including customer service. If you did not want to read the details, my conclusion is:
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SKIN: combination, reactive to climate changes and extremely fair. "Women complain about premenstrual syndrome, but I think of it as the only time of the month that I can be myself." --Roseanne |
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Fri Oct 20, 2006 4:35 am |
Gosh, MACrisis, that's a super helpful thing you shared with us! thankyou.
I'm impressed with how methodical you have been.
I have one question! 
Given the amount of time it takes , do you think the results are significant enough to continue long term? |
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Fri Oct 20, 2006 5:35 am |
Thanks MACrisis.......That was very helpfull. I was thinking of getting a lightstim to try it myself, so now I wont bother.  |
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3938 |
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Fri Oct 20, 2006 7:10 am |
| Great Review Maccrisis. |
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43, Lightly oily, calm rosacia now with thanks to Dr Denese Products/Serums. I use & LOVE Dr. Denese Formulas. Now I use Light Foudation, Bare Escentuals MV, MAC eyeliner, Mirenesse Mascara. |
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Fri Oct 20, 2006 7:20 am |
| FoxyMama1 wrote: |
| Thanks MACrisis.......That was very helpfull. I was thinking of getting a lightstim to try it myself, so now I wont bother. |
Wait until other member's review on LightStim. I really wish I could find time to do a LightStim weekly routine on the left side of my face and Quasar on the right to compare. |
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53, DermaQuest, NCN Products, PMD, Dermarolling |
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Fri Oct 20, 2006 8:19 am |
Fantastic, MACrisis. That's definitely an above and beyond the call of duty review. Great work!  |
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Fri Oct 20, 2006 8:58 am |
| Great in-depth review and you covered everything I was curious about. Thanks so much for taking the time and effort. |
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Joined the 50 club several years back, blonde w/ fair/sensitive skin, Texas humidity and prone to rosacea, light breakouts and sunburns, combo skin type, starting to see sundamage and fine lines |
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Fri Oct 20, 2006 10:02 am |
| What a sweetie you are for taking the time to put together such a thorough review. I'm sure everyone involved in using LED devices appreciates it as much as I did! |
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Fri Oct 20, 2006 10:18 am |
| catski wrote: |
I have one question! [/color]
Given the amount of time it takes , do you think the results are significant enough to continue long term? |
I think so. As I mentioned in many posts that I have rubber tough skin and many, many skin care products I used did not show any improvement while other members rave about them. This is the 1st skin care tool I used that really showed improvement. I will continue using it and see if I can get more improvement.
My last Quasar treatment was 10/17/06 night. And today 10/20/06 my face is still GLOWING!!!  
I think LightStim is a good machine too but takes too much time in my experiment. |
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53, DermaQuest, NCN Products, PMD, Dermarolling |
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Fri Oct 20, 2006 11:42 am |
MACrisis,
What a fantastic review. It has helped me decide which one I want now I just have to save up my pennies.
Thanks for taking the time to write it. Expensive test for you though. |
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50, happy reluma user started 16.6.12 original formula. PMD user. started LouLou's ageless regime. |
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Fri Oct 20, 2006 12:02 pm |
MACCrisis, great experiment and, good lord, girl, you are a patient thing! Thanks so much for posting your results.
I am glad I have the Baby Q! It`s given me a really lovely, far more even skin tone. In fact, my new hair stylist commented on my skin last Tuesday. She said I had very pretty coloring and wondered what my ethnicity was. She is Columbian and holistically-minded, too, so we were chatting it up about all things skin care, makeup, fashion, etc. It was a hoot!
Anyway, I know the BQ is working and am glad I got it. |
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42; medium, warm-toned; large pores prone to congestion; oily; using Karin Herzog exclusively right now!  |
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Fri Oct 20, 2006 12:42 pm |
Thanks MACrisis. 
I'm really grateful for all the clarification you've given.
Glad you're looking glowy too - you certainly deserve to be lookin' gooood  |
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Fri Oct 20, 2006 1:38 pm |
Hello, My name is Mary. I'm a newbie that has been following the LED threads. I'm in the market for an LED device for facial skin, and to treat a nasty tennis elbow tendonitis. I've had five LED treatments to my face using a Facial Sensations unit. It has been difficult to find out the joule output for that unit, or I might just buy one! I loved what it did to my face. The unit is noted as the "New Dermamaster", but the company is out of business.
I have the Power: joules/cm 2 answers.
Quasar 2.6 joules/cm2
Baby Q 1.3 joules/cm2
Lightstim did email me with their answer, and it really baffles me. They said:
We had a 3rd party test for us about 5 weeks ago and their answer to us is 17 to 23 Joules/cm2.
All the best,
(name removed by Mabsy)
If the power is that high the unit would MELT! The machines with that # of joules are around $15,000. I'm confused. |
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Fri Oct 20, 2006 2:00 pm |
Hi Mary:
Thank you for posting the joules each machines generated.
I believe the joules numuber you posted has different time uint between Quasr /BQ and LightStim. I remembered after Craig told me the jules LightStim generated I had to re-calculate it to compare with Quasar / BQ.
If the Facial Sensations Machine you mentioned is the one I know that combined LED and vibration (massage)together then I know there's a company sells used ones (Usage clock only show 40 hours) around $1500. You can search online. |
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53, DermaQuest, NCN Products, PMD, Dermarolling |
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Fri Oct 20, 2006 2:54 pm |
| Wow incredible review..thanks!!!! |
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Fri Oct 20, 2006 3:07 pm |
I feel somebody hasing been poking my back since I pressed the submit button last night. And the feeling is getting stronger and stronger!!! 
I want to thank kls who shared her BQ experience with me AND helped me proof reading my review before I post it to make my review more readable and clearer. |
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53, DermaQuest, NCN Products, PMD, Dermarolling |
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Fri Oct 20, 2006 3:58 pm |
| Thank you so much for your review!! I know you put a lot of time {and money} into this.. That was very generous on your part to share your findings.. |
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Colorful Colorado! Highlands Ranch, a burb south of Denver... |
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Fri Oct 20, 2006 4:00 pm |
| MACrisis wrote: |
I feel somebody hasing been poking my back since I pressed the submit button last night. And the feeling is getting stronger and stronger!!!
I want to thank kls who shared her BQ experience with me AND helped me proof reading my review before I post it to make my review more readable and clearer. |
i've been waiting for you review for weeks, you tease, but it was well worth the wait!
in the meanwhile, pain got me impatient and i went ahead and bought the Baby Q. (feel much better now that i know it has the MACrisis seal of approval ) i will review it properly on a thread of it's own after using it for more than two days (that's how long i've had it). still, thought i'd mention that even in this short time it has done wonders for residual pain in my wrist and hand. if anyone has problems with carpal tunnel and has the BQ, i highly recommend you trying it. |
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Fri Oct 20, 2006 4:22 pm |
 Did someone mention my name??
 Thanks MACrisis! You can count on me anytime! |
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Fri Oct 20, 2006 8:46 pm |
| Thanks for the indepth review. I've been following this closely. I've had Photo Facials in the past with some good results. My main concerns are brown spots and broken capillaries. Can you comment on these concerns? Thanks. |
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Fri Oct 20, 2006 8:57 pm |
| Hi, I'm a newbie investigating purchase of one of the LED machines & have been following the LED threads. Thanks so much, especially MACrisis for sharing such helpful, detailed information. I was considering the Lightstim but now I am undecided. Also, nobody seems to be reporting any real improvement with pigmentation with these devices and this is what I mainly want to target. There are also several LED devices being advertised on ebay anywhere between $80 -$700 and I was wondering if anyone had heard anything about them? |
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