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Tue Oct 24, 2006 12:21 am |
This subject has been brought up in Japanese media many times mostly in regard to Japanese who go to live in Paris for longer-stays (ie studying) and suffer severe cultural shock given the way Paris is portrayed here. But I guess there have been so many cases recorded it has now made international media. It is sad, but at the same time a little amusing ( that is the in me coming out...)
Paris leaves Japanese tourists ill
October 23, 2006 12:00am
AROUND a dozen Japanese tourists a year need psychological treatment after visiting Paris as the reality of unfriendly locals and scruffy streets clashes with their expectations, a newspaper has reported.
"A third of patients get better immediately, a third suffer relapses and the rest have psychoses," Hotel-Dieu hospital psychologist, Yousef
Mahmoudia, told the newspaper Journal du Dimanche.
Already this year, Japan's embassy in Paris has had to repatriate at least four visitors - including two women who believed their hotel room was being bugged and there was a plot against them.
Previous cases include a man convinced he was the French "Sun King", Louis XIV, and a woman who believed she was being attacked with microwaves, the paper cited Japanese embassy official Yoshikatsu Aoyagi as saying.
"Fragile travellers can lose their bearings. When the idea they have of the country meets the reality of what they discover it can provoke a crisis," psychologist Herve Benhamou told the paper.
The phenomenon, which the newspaper dubbed "Paris Syndrome", was first detailed in the psychiatric journal Nervure in 2004.
Bernard Delage of Jeunes Japon, an association that helps Japanese families settle in France, said: "In Japanese shops, the customer is king,
whereas here assistants hardly look at them ... People using public transport all look stern, and handbag snatchers increase the ill feeling."
A Japanese woman, Aimi, told the paper: "For us, Paris is a dream city. All the French are beautiful and elegant ... And then, when they arrive, the Japanese find the French character is the complete opposite of their own."
(oh and my little personal addition... I do not think it is that the streets are "scruffy and locals unfriendly" - TOTALLY the opposite of what I experienced in Paris - but compared to the image that is drummed into the heads of Japanese, the reality would seem so.. and of course, anyone who has experienced Japanese-style service would know that the entire world pales compared to it. My first ever overseas trip was two weeks in Japan followed by a week in Hong Kong and I was gobsmacked at how unhelpful people in Hong Kong were.. of course they weren't - OK, well some really were - but I had just been spoiled rotten by Japanese service for two weeks, so it just seemed that way. On my next trip, I knew what to expect and everything was hunky dory.) |
_________________ SKIN: combination, reactive to climate changes and extremely fair. "Women complain about premenstrual syndrome, but I think of it as the only time of the month that I can be myself." --Roseanne |
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Tue Oct 24, 2006 1:07 am |
absolutely dumbstruck |
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Tue Oct 24, 2006 1:33 am |
Ya see, the problem is that the image many Japanese (especially women) have of Paris is women all looking like they came off the cover of Vogue and sashaying down the Champs-Elysées decked out head-to-toe in Vuitton, Hermes or Chanel. They envision everyone sipping top-class wines and eating the finest cuisine in elegant surroundings and all living in chic apartments with a view of La Tour Eiffel. They have a classic Parisienne image from fashion mags and TV. But I still don’t understand how they can have such a distorted view of things.. I mean, you don’t have to be a genius to know that an ENTIRE city would not shop at Chanel and live the high-life. I doubt they expect the high immigrant population either. Ah, but perhaps it is the presence of Eau de Urine at the Metro stations that gets them (sure put my olfactory out of commission for a day or so ) - oh, hang on.. that fragrance is prominent in many Tokyo subways too… |
_________________ SKIN: combination, reactive to climate changes and extremely fair. "Women complain about premenstrual syndrome, but I think of it as the only time of the month that I can be myself." --Roseanne |
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Tue Oct 24, 2006 1:48 am |
tiger_tim wrote: |
Ah, but perhaps it is the presence of Eau de Urine at the Metro stations that gets them (sure put my olfactory out of commission for a day or so ) - oh, hang on.. that fragrance is prominent in many Tokyo subways too… |
actually, i found it to be much more subtle here than in new york. must be the wine! actually, i was thinking that they would be enthralled with the myriads of merde available on every street. it's especially beautiful, almost like an expressionist painting, when it rains. ah, and gliding through it in heels whilst the smell wafts up to greet your nose. what's not to love??? |
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Tue Oct 24, 2006 1:54 am |
la vie en rose wrote: |
actually, i was thinking that they would be enthralled with the myriads of merde available on every street. it's especially beautiful, almost like an expressionist painting, when it rains. ah, and gliding through it in heels whilst the smell wafts up to greet your nose. what's not to love??? |
ooh, yes, especially when wearing strappy sandals in the rain and it gets between your toes |
_________________ SKIN: combination, reactive to climate changes and extremely fair. "Women complain about premenstrual syndrome, but I think of it as the only time of the month that I can be myself." --Roseanne |
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Tue Oct 24, 2006 2:12 am |
tiger_tim wrote: |
ooh, yes, especially when wearing strappy sandals in the rain and it gets between your toes |
you're evil! |
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Tue Oct 24, 2006 2:25 am |
Just came back from the a trip in Paris (my darling hb is french) and i also noticed the unfriendly french in the metro (well, the stench and the merde is not worse than in other big European cities...). But then the next weekend i went in my home country (Hungary) and met some really unfriendly people, in spite of speaking with them in their native tongue - so i guess, it's just the "normal" European average (unfortunately). But then again, I've never been in Tokio...
I live in Vienna, where people are not really unfriendly - they just don't bother... BTW, SAs in Paris are getting better : some of them even speak english... |
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Tue Oct 24, 2006 2:28 am |
The poor Japaneese tourists - yet again made the laughing stock of the world! |
_________________ Location: Denmark. Me = 32, think I'm combo without oiliness + sometimes sensitive. Have noticed that skin doesn't heal as quickly anymore and I've developed fine lines around my eyes... Hormonal breakouts which are sometimes cystic. PCOS |
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Tue Oct 24, 2006 12:32 pm |
Hmm, from what I've heard - Japanese tourists are usually treated extremely well when SHOPPING. And yup, at Hermes - the clerks were actually fawning on a group.
Me, I'm Japanese but 5th generation Hawaiian. Me and my caucasian hubby had a difficult time in Paris.
1. The streets are really dirty if you go off the beaten path - mostly because people do not curb nor clean up after their dogs. I saw a street that was full of landmines.
2. We stopped at a bakery and I tried to buy a pastry. It's called "Opera". I pointed (glass case) and said 'opera'. The clerk kept pulling everything else AROUND the one item. Finally, someone in the back of the line asked what I wanted. She said 'opera' with a French accent and suddenly I got what I wanted.
We heard that the French are nicer if you make an attempt to speak French - and I did - but just got shaking heads. |
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Tue Oct 24, 2006 3:14 pm |
Rjez wrote: |
1. The streets are really dirty if you go off the beaten path - mostly because people do not curb nor clean up after their dogs. I saw a street that was full of landmines.
2. We stopped at a bakery and I tried to buy a pastry. It's called "Opera". I pointed (glass case) and said 'opera'. The clerk kept pulling everything else AROUND the one item. Finally, someone in the back of the line asked what I wanted. She said 'opera' with a French accent and suddenly I got what I wanted.
We heard that the French are nicer if you make an attempt to speak French - and I did - but just got shaking heads. |
in defense....
well, number one is true, and that actually goes for *most* streets not in the immediate tourist areas. they are cleaned up twice a day and i have seen a few closet cleaners (actually cleaning after their dogs when no one was looking. ) and, sorry to say, you actually learn to look where you're stepping....
number two is more difficult. growing up in l.a., i was exposed to many different accents and less than perfect language. i can understand it and am very tolerant. most parisians were not exposed to this and have a seriously difficult time understanding our french accents, even the most warm-hearted tolerant ones. they're not being jerks, they truly don't know what you're saying. (i seemingly cannot properly pronounce "l'ancienne" when i order my baguette -- even though i get the same friggin' one several times a week. yet the women that runs the bakery is absolutely lovely and works there slave hours.)
there are snobs in paris, true, and a hell of a lot of merde. there is also a huge amount of warmth and humour, you just need to break through the surface. if you can't tell, i'm madly in love with paris. the *real* paris. and, oui, even the parisians. |
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Tue Oct 24, 2006 4:07 pm |
I guess what got me was that it was a glass pastry case. I honestly do think she was being obstinate because I was pointing. How can you pick up almost a dozen items all around the ONE thing I want?
But we did enjoy everything else about Paris.
We were there for Sun Microsystems President Club. My hubby (then BF) was a systems engineer and nominated by his sales reps.
That was probably the best club trip EVER:
Two tickets and room paid by Sun.
They made all travel arrangements even if you requested flying out early or late.
We flew in several days early and they already had a concierge at the airport and waiting cabs.
Cab driver gave us a 'Sun card'. Call that number and they knew who we were - all paid for.
Concierge room set up for each hotel. We could go there and they'd make any extra travel or entertainment arrangements (we went to Belgium for a few days too).
Received gifts and bottled water in our room each night. Last evening was a bottle of champagne and Tiffany glasses.
First night: dinner cruise on the Seine.
Second night: They gave us $300 each in play money that was good for that night. They "RENTED" the town of Montmartre. It was sealed off to anyone not wearing a Sun badge. So went spent the fake money at restaurants and stores.
Third night: A cocktail party in the Louvre. Yup, Sun was the first company to rent the museum. I have a photo of me walking down the hall with a glass of champagne in one hand, and my heels in the other.
Last night: A formal costume ball and private tour of Versailles. We got to see rooms that are no longer open to the public and had a formal dinner in the underground ballroom. Didn't know about it? The last time it was used was for a party by Louis XIV. |
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Tue Oct 24, 2006 4:15 pm |
want to adopt me as your third dog??? |
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Tue Oct 24, 2006 4:41 pm |
hahaha .. forgot to mention, this was YEARS ago ... during the dotcom boom when Sun had tons of money. The year after they hired Elton John for a private concert.
No one gives Club trips like those anymore.
It was funny because hubby and I had just started dating. He takes me to Paris and Belgium ... I take him to our company event ... hamburgers at the local park ... wooohooo. |
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Tue Oct 24, 2006 4:56 pm |
Rjez wrote: |
That was probably the best club trip EVER: |
That sounds AMAZING!!! What a great, fun time it sounds like you had.
I've never been to Paris yet, but one day I would love to visit. One of the girls I work with went earlier this year and loved it. |
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Tue Oct 24, 2006 5:58 pm |
Ok, I need to chime in.. now granted it has been ::gasp:: about 13 years since I was in Paris city stomping around the place (my cousin took us on a walking tour that exhausted us) but I need to say the following about the trip...
1. Although I enjoy the jokes about it..for the life of me I cannot remember seeing doggy poop.
2. I never thought/noticed that the place was dirty (the metro was a whole different scenario and I have nothing but horror stories/experiences )
3. I never once had trouble with any form of rudeness (even though my French is woeful) ... though it was fun watching my cousin get into a fight with the train ticket seller (oh that was a HILARIOUS situation - she was insistant, but the ticket seller was right but gave up on her).. and my ex getting the agro trying to buy coffee at the airport (but he was an ass who would rub anyone the wrong way).. but those were the only 2 events.
4. we even managed to buy whatever food we wanted in everything from a cute little sidewalk place over near notre dame to goodies at a local deli..to.. oh, the dinner at montmarte was pretty disappointing considering it was a few mere morsels for a lot of dosh.
Ah, but I was young and in love (with the city, not my ex. ) |
_________________ SKIN: combination, reactive to climate changes and extremely fair. "Women complain about premenstrual syndrome, but I think of it as the only time of the month that I can be myself." --Roseanne |
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Wed Oct 25, 2006 12:42 am |
I started to visit France first after i met my hubby (then BF, of course) - which is 4 years ago. Of course, right on the beginning he took me for a week to Paris and he was quite disappointed that it wasn' t a love-affair for the first sight (i mean, a love affair with Paris...). But I was already influenced by his friends, lots of young french, they hated Paris because of the masses, the awful traffic, the horrible rent and other immense costs - they just wanted to escape from Paris. And i also had the prejudice about the arrogant french, refusing to speak any other language. So i was careful with loosing my heart.
In the meantime i've been several times in Paris and am on the way to develop not only an affair, but a lasting relationship with this amazing city. it's truly amazing, i can only recommend a trip there (but still, i don't want to live there...). |
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Wed Oct 25, 2006 9:38 am |
tiger_tim wrote: |
2. I never thought/noticed that the place was dirty (the metro was a whole different scenario and I have nothing but horror stories/experiences ) |
Which was totally different for us. We thought the Metro was clean and spectacular. Since we live in the SF bay area - our public transportation is woefully inadequate.
Europe, Asia - every foreign country we've been to has such a great public transportation system.
Coming from a Hawai'i girl - it is interesting to remember that most tourists have one chance to make an impression. It's painful for me to see tourists in Waikiki thinking that that's the real Hawai'i. |
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