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Sun May 16, 2004 9:58 pm  |
As the subject header suggests, and at the risk of sounding very naive...I figured it would be best if there was a reference post as to the benefits of vitamin C serums and AHAs such as glycolic acid, and BHAs such as salicylic acid. What the pros and cons might be.
I am trying to research on my own but the honest advice of those who have used/use these products and the lovely ladies of EDS is far more valuable and I believe should help everyone like me who is a little, umm well say, confused  . Thanks. |
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Jadeeyes
New Member
 
Joined: 22 Apr 2004
Posts: 9
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Mabsy
Moderator
Joined: 17 Aug 2003
Posts: 9644
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Tue May 18, 2004 5:16 am |
Thanks for posting the references Julia!
Roopdh - well my (naive) understanding or observations about the three are:
AHA - helps speed up exfoliation of dead skin cells - thus revealing fresh new skin. This may give you a brigther complexion, perhaps reduce the depth of some wrinkes as well and help fade some discoloration. The removal of dead skin cells can subsequently help reduce acne because pores are not being blocked by dead skin cells (which is what commonly leads to acne). Must wear sunblock when using this.
BHA - More effective at penetrating pores than it's AHA cousin - so often used to directly fight acne (frequently in combination with AHAs). Thus you see this featuring in pimple remedies.Not as good in fighting wrinkles etc as AHA because it doesn't penetrate the skin enough but stays on the surface.
Vit C - powerful antioxidant that may help smooth the skin, decrease depth of wrinkles, fade pigmentation etc. No exfoliating effects found here 
That's the summary of my knowledge about it |
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Tue May 18, 2004 6:21 am |
Hi, Mabsy:
When should one introduce vit C product into one's skincare regime? It seems to me that vit C products are targeted more to fighting wrinkles, but if I dont have wrinkles, can I use it too? What do you think? Thanks! |
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Tue May 18, 2004 9:16 am |
I did quite a bit of research on C before using it. If you want to read the research by the father of topical Vitamin C himself, enter "Dr. Sheldon Pinnell" into any search engine. He worked at Duke University and did much of the research that has led to techniques to stabilize C so it can be used topically today. He started Cellex-C and his children founded Skinceuticals. I have used both products but have moved on to another C serum - C+ Firming Serum from an online only company -www.cellularskinrx.com. It's half the price of the others and since I'm going to use C forever, figured I better find the best value now...
Here's why to use C:
-Antioxidant prevents free radical damage. When your skin is exposed to UV light, pollution, smoke and other environmental insults, it forms free radicals. These are little O1 molecules running around looking for other O molecules to hook up with - O! wants mostly to be O2. Usually the O1 attached itself to your collagen layer. The result: the layer becomes brittle and thin over time. That's when you start noticing that your skin is thinner and crepier-feeling and looking. The protection that C gives against free radical damage stops this from happening. The result: your skin maintains it's natural firmness and tone.
-Additionally, C has been show to actually stimulate collagen production. A thicker collagen layer means you look younger - think of how firm and thick a child's skin appears.
-No matter what you get - make sure it's l-ascorbic acid (not magnesium ascorbyl palmitate, etc. - these must be metabolized by your skin into l-ascorbic acid. The extra step makes them harder to absorb and less effective.) Make sure it is stable. C cannot be put with E or other oils - it will degrade. Simplest solutions are best with low ph. Go for 10-15% concentrations. Any greater does not help. Skin can only absorb so much C (just like your body) and higher concentrations will only irritate.
I apologize for the length but hope this helps. Good luck! |
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Tue May 18, 2004 10:06 am |
Maybe a bit off-topic, but still related... Almost six months ago, I started using the Facial Cream from MD Formulations, with 14% glycolic acid, because of very dry and flaky skin. It has helped wonderfully, and has also helped me get rid of the stubborn pimples I had a tendency to get on my chin. But can I go on using this forever? I have used it both day and night under my regular moisturizer (and with a SPF 15 on top at daytime). Can AHAs do anything at all to prevent aging? Or is it better to consider a Vit-C product? If so, in addition to the AHAs, or as a substitute?
(BTW: I am 32, no visible signs of aging, but want to prevent) |
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Tue May 18, 2004 10:21 am |
| Sounds like you are right on top of the premature aging issue and taking good care of your skin. AHA's are wonderful for brightening, improving clarity, evening out skin tone due to the exfoiation properties. I don't see any reason why you couldn't use forever. (If your skin can take it - 14% is pretty high...at least for my skin.) I use my C in the AM. Alternate Retin-A and an AHA moisturizer (8%) every other night. If I use all together, it's hell to pay with irritation, etc. I always tell anyone and everyone - if you do just one thing for your skin - use sunscreen! Since you've got that taken care of - looks like you can look forward to looking 32 for a long, long time. |
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Tue May 18, 2004 10:33 am |
So I don't need both, then? I will of course talk to my esthetician once I'm back home, but you seem very competent to me. I feel I'm on the right track with the AHA (btw, it stung like hell in the beginning, but I haven't noticed any redness or anything after that period, and my skin is even LESS dry), and hardly use any masks and only twice a week the Daily Microfoliant from Dermalogica. Sometimes less is definitely more!
Now I just need to find a good moisturizing eye cream (Cellcosmet?) to be happy... |
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Tue May 18, 2004 10:42 am |
| I would use both - C in AM and AHA at night. The C is just so great for prevention and protection.... |
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Tue May 18, 2004 11:19 am |
I have another quick question and that is I have combo skin and everyone seems to recommend the AHA's for dry skin types.
Will it be too rich for me or someone who has oilier skin than myself even? |
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Tue May 18, 2004 11:31 am |
As far as I know, (or from my own expeience) the AHA is actually good for or more suitable for oily skin than dry skin  AHA/BHA may be a bit drying for dry skin (depends on the strength). Since I have combination skin, I usually need extra moisturization in addition to AHA/BHA esp. in winter. |
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Tue May 18, 2004 11:40 am |
| I agree. I have combo skin and have never had a problem with the AHA's. BHA's however, do tend to dry my skin out. |
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Tue May 18, 2004 11:55 am |
| Any recs for AHA's or BHA'S? |
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Tue May 18, 2004 11:58 am |
| oh, roopdh, I use the cheapest one imaginable - I'm embarrassed to admit it. AlphaHydrox face cream and/or the Suave Alpha Hydrox cream. You're laughing at me now, aren't you? They work for me though. I have a precious little one and I have to look good but have to do it on the cheap. Saving for bigger priorities, you know... |
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Tue May 18, 2004 1:46 pm |
Betterat40....
Thanks for all this wisdom...I am in the process of choosing a Vit C serum (for the very first time) and this is valuable information which will help me shortlist(  )...
Thank U!!
Nikita |
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Tue May 18, 2004 2:32 pm |
Okay here's another quick question...do you use glycolic acid on its own in a serum form (or lotion I suppose) or is it better to get it in another forumulation like an MD product, etc?
not sure if I asked this question correctly  |
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Tue May 18, 2004 2:34 pm |
| No problem, Nikita. I just can't see any reason to pay 80 bucks for something I can find for less than half. I just hate that women are forced to pay so much for all the things that help us to look good. I've spent a fortune on creams, etc. that did nothing. Now, I'm older and I've figured out the "game"...If I can't find info that tells me it works or get personal recs then I say no way now. I know that's not so much fun or thrilling as a $200 day at the cosmetic counter..but now, I like to have the $200 day at the Four Seasons instead. |
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Tue May 18, 2004 2:40 pm |
| Roo, are you asking me? It's just a cream and it's alpha hydroxy acid - not in glycolic acid form. I'm sure there are better ones out there. I just know these cheapies work for me. |
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Tue May 18, 2004 7:31 pm |
Thanks betterat40, sounds like a good option the AHA lotion.
Any other recs on using AHA's in glycolic form alone, or in formulations? In either case what product/brand is recommended?
Also what age can one start using Vitamin C? |
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Mabsy
Moderator
Joined: 17 Aug 2003
Posts: 9644
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Wed May 19, 2004 5:13 am |
Hi Bbiz!
I think that while people that have wrinkles would see more visible results with vit C serums than say people without wrinkles, the benefit is there for both. Vit C also prevents damage from environmental causes so even though you may not see any obvious benefit it is "working" to protect your skin.
I use it (I'm 27) even though I don't have any wrinkles. Mainly because I've read a fair bit about it and it sounds like a good preventative treatment.
| bbiz wrote: |
Hi, Mabsy:
When should one introduce vit C product into one's skincare regime? It seems to me that vit C products are targeted more to fighting wrinkles, but if I dont have wrinkles, can I use it too? What do you think? Thanks! |
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Wed May 19, 2004 5:17 am |
What is a good serum to try for a first-time-user? Any tips?
As I wrote above, my skin is dry, and I use a cream with glycolic acid at night under my moisurizer. |
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Wed May 19, 2004 5:27 am |
| Nemi, I posted above but I use a 12% concentration, low ph to help with absorption, and stable l-ascorbic acid serum. I found it atwww.cellularskinrx.com. I used Cellex-C and Skinceuticals before and I found they worked just fine. I just thought they were a bit pricey. I found this C Serum for $38 and a full one ounce. I've been using it for about four months now and I love it. You are smart to think about starting on C to counteract environmental pollution, smoke and UV light. (not a sunscreen though)...Good luck! |
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Wed May 19, 2004 5:37 am |
Wow, the price is really nice! But so many companies charge ridiculous shipping rates to send to Norway, so EDS is maybe a good option after all? I am considering the SkinCeuticals Serum 10. But a friend of mine told me that it's best to start using such a thing in the winter, and not during the summer months, since it can be irritating? Any opinions on that issue?  |
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Wed May 19, 2004 7:00 am |
Okay after some researching on EDS I came across a few glycolic acid formulations in the MD line of products (mind you given that there are so many lines sold here, I really only got to scroll through one or two last night  ).
Well I didn't come across any strictly glycolic acid tonics or what not, but I did manage to see a few creams and lotions that had AHA's/glycolic acid in them. Is this how most of the ladies (and gents) are incorporating the AHA's into your skincare regimen? And which products are you using...I'm eager to get started on using these
*********edited*********
I found a glycolic toner from DDF, anyone rec. this? |
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Mabsy
Moderator
Joined: 17 Aug 2003
Posts: 9644
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Thu May 20, 2004 2:06 am |
Nemi - I haven't had any problems with irritation, but you should start off with a low concentration (e.g. 10%). I actually think that vit C serums would be most beneficial in summer because they help block damage from UV rays. I haven't heard or read any recommendations for starting on vit C serums in winter. I'm currently using the Vivier 20% serum and have not experienced any irritation at all. Keep in mind that my skin is not sensitive though and rarely reacts badly to skincare.
Roopdh - I'm not sure that there are any strictly glycolic acid tonics. Glycolic acid has to be used in low concentrations so you will see it mostly as an aditive and not a concentrated product (if that's what you mean).
Mabsy |
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