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Don't have time to wait 30 mins after BHA in the morning
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FaithTruth
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Sun Feb 25, 2007 6:37 pm      Reply with quote
Should I even bother with that step then?
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Sat Mar 17, 2007 10:09 pm      Reply with quote
I used BHA from Paula's chice. Based on her website if you use the products from her line then there is no need to wait since all her products are ph compatible with her BHA. But I will still try wait to wait for at least a couple mintues. What I do is I wash my face first then I tone and put on the BHA product. Then I move on to brush my teeth - by the time I finish brush throughly and I finish with putting the rest of my skin care product(s) - serum plus and Moisturizers.
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Sun Mar 18, 2007 11:53 am      Reply with quote
Yeah, I don't have 30 minutes to spare either, so I just apply it right after I brush my teeth and wash my face in the morning, then do everything else (shower without getting my face wet so the BHA doesn't rinse off, make coffee, etc.) before applying my moisturizer, sunscreen, etc. It's not 30 minutes, but I figure any amount of exfoliation time is better than nothing at all. I forget what the exact scientific explanation is, but from what I recall, the 30 minutes is to make sure you've fully exhausted the exfoliating power of the BHA. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.

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Sun Mar 18, 2007 1:29 pm      Reply with quote
FaithTruth wrote:
Should I even bother with that step then?


I don't have time also to wait. Although, I am not using BHA or AHA at the moment, except in my body lotion, the rule is the same with Vitamin C.
What I do is, apply my Vivier Vit. C serum and then I get dressed, go back and put on my eye cream, moisterizer and sunblock and that is about it.
On the weekends, I have more time and I don't mind waiting. Smile
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Sun Mar 18, 2007 1:54 pm      Reply with quote
I think Tangal would be the perfect person to answer this...
but in my experience, my skin is sooo much more responsive when I wait the 30 minutes. I wasn't even waiting when I used Paula's Choice BHA and it didn't do anything for me. So I didn't bother to keep ordering it. Then when I decided to re-introduce a BHA (I use "I Feel Pretty") I used it for a few weeks until I read Tangal's thread about wait times. I then started to adjust and wait 30 minutes...wow! My skin cleared up and my face reacts much more successfully to my spot treatment when I wait.

I put it on right after my shower...and then check my email, fix breakfast, etc...then continue with my routine.

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Sun Mar 18, 2007 2:26 pm      Reply with quote
If I can remember, I will wash my face and apply the BHA as soon as I wake up. Then I go and get lunches ready for my kids. That would take 30 mins. Then I could continue on with my skincare routines. Most of the times though I don't remember and I always wake up later than I should.
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Sun Mar 18, 2007 4:00 pm      Reply with quote
Once the pH of the BHA is affected (by applying something with a higher pH on top of it), the exfoliation is decreased by a tremendous amount. So you'll still get some benefits, but not nearly the benefits you get if you wait 30 minutes. (I think the % is something like 80% more exfoliation if you wait)

So to me (and this is just my personal feeling), to not wait is like wasting product/money.

A lot of people find that applying their BHA or BHA/AHA products in the evening eliminates the morning crunch. They just wash their face a little earlier in the evening, apply the BHA (or BHA/AHA), wait the 30 minutes, then proceed.

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Sun Mar 18, 2007 4:28 pm      Reply with quote
Until I had to stop EVERYTHING I quite liked that the 10% LA I used in the morning only had to be on for a minute or two and then washed off.

Teh only time I ever manage the 30 min wait (when I used exfol) was when I was up early to catch the train. Tehn it was wash exfol vit c. Drive to station get my seat and the rest of my gunk!

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Sun Mar 18, 2007 4:39 pm      Reply with quote
Lactic acid doesn't work in the same way as BHA.

Some people wash the 10% lactic acid off - others leave it on. I used to leave it on - and I believe Tangal did also.

When I use the 2% BHA/4% AHA, I leave it on - and I think Tangal leaves her 5% BHA/10% AHA on, too.

It really just depends upon your skin. Some skin can't tolerate acids being left on - others tolerate it well.

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Mon Mar 19, 2007 5:45 am      Reply with quote
kim@ifeelpretty wrote:
Lactic acid doesn't work in the same way as BHA.

Some people wash the 10% lactic acid off - others leave it on. I used to leave it on - and I believe Tangal did also.

When I use the 2% BHA/4% AHA, I leave it on - and I think Tangal leaves her 5% BHA/10% AHA on, too.

It really just depends upon your skin. Some skin can't tolerate acids being left on - others tolerate it well.


It still exfoliates the skin though doesn't it? Not that i am using anything now Sad

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Mon Mar 19, 2007 5:55 am      Reply with quote
guapagirl wrote:
Until I had to stop EVERYTHING I quite liked that the 10% LA I used in the morning only had to be on for a minute or two and then washed off.

Guapa - Why have you stopped EVERYTHING? Just out of pure nosiness Liar
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Mon Mar 19, 2007 5:59 am      Reply with quote
kim@ifeelpretty wrote:

A lot of people find that applying their BHA or BHA/AHA products in the evening eliminates the morning crunch. They just wash their face a little earlier in the evening, apply the BHA (or BHA/AHA), wait the 30 minutes, then proceed.


Now this seems like something that could work for me..as I'm always in a hurry in the morning. Is there any disadvantage to using it in the evening?
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Mon Mar 19, 2007 7:53 am      Reply with quote
I wouldn't think so...as long as you get the maximum time for exfoliation, I don't think it matters when you use it.

I just manage to fit it into my routine. I'd actually like to use it twice a day, but I never know when I'm heading to bed and I often don't wash my face until right before bed. I need to think ahead! Laughing

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Mon Mar 19, 2007 7:54 am      Reply with quote
hmm so one doesn't HAVE to wait 30 min for AHA/BHA?

kim@ifeelpretty wrote:
Lactic acid doesn't work in the same way as BHA.

Some people wash the 10% lactic acid off - others leave it on.
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Mon Mar 19, 2007 7:57 am      Reply with quote
Agent OO-CAT wrote:
hmm so one doesn't HAVE to wait 30 min for AHA/BHA?

kim@ifeelpretty wrote:
Lactic acid doesn't work in the same way as BHA.

Some people wash the 10% lactic acid off - others leave it on.


You don't have to wait, but you won't get the same exfoliation benefits if you were to wait.
Smile It needs 20-30 minutes to work...but it doesn't last much longer than that. That's probably why it doesn't matter if you wash it off or not, once it's done working, it's done.

From what I understand Lactic Acid (AHA) works on the skin surface while BHA works in the pore.

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kim@ifeelpretty
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Mon Mar 19, 2007 8:21 am      Reply with quote
Paris Troika is correct - you don't HAVE to wait the 30 minutes. But if you don't, you're not getting nearly the exfoliation benefits that you would if you waited. This is mostly for BHA. But with the lower percentages of AHA, leaving it on, undisturbed for at least 30 minutes is going to get you much better results. With the higher % - some people can't tolerate more than a few minutes - in those cases, you have to go with what your skin tolerates. So it's more like you're doing a mini peel in those instances. But there are advantages to leaving the lower % acids on.

Lactic acid & other AHA's work by exfoliating the surface of the skin. BHA works by exfoliating from inside the pores. That's why BHA works best for clogged pores & blackheads & AHA works best on fine lines & making skin look more 'fresh & glowing'.

There is no disadvantage to using BHA or AHA in the evening. It works the same no matter when it's applied. Like PT said, some people like to use it twice daily (although that really isn't recommended for AHAs - those are recommended for every other day use - but BHA can easily be applied twice daily if one works up to it).

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Mon Mar 19, 2007 1:59 pm      Reply with quote
Molly wrote:
guapagirl wrote:
Until I had to stop EVERYTHING I quite liked that the 10% LA I used in the morning only had to be on for a minute or two and then washed off.

Guapa - Why have you stopped EVERYTHING? Just out of pure nosiness Liar


uh, I mentioned it in world of mirth's thread. I have had some kind of horrible reaction or something. I don't know what because my routine hasn't changed for at least 6 weeks (though I did do a LA peel at about 20%ish but ~Ihad healed up from that), but I got a huge rash over large areas of my face and my previously smooth and faily unlined skin fells and looks like a crocks Crying or Very sad

I've just been using emu and ha with a barrier cream type thing over the top if I need to go out (tis cold and windy here at the moment!). The rash has gone, and my skin is feeling a bit smoother but still really lined. I'm waiting for a new bottle of CP super serum because I ran out about 3 weeks ago. I really really feel like I want to exfoliate to get rid of the roughness, but I am managing to resist which I think is hte best thing.

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Mon Mar 19, 2007 2:54 pm      Reply with quote
I just do it in the evening. I would never be able to wait for 30 minutes in the morning.

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Tue Apr 24, 2007 3:04 pm      Reply with quote
Now I understand why the Juice Beauty Green Apple Peel works so well after I leave it on for 30+ minutes! For a entire year now I thought the great results were from the extra time that the product was sitting on my face!! Brick wall At no time did I make the connection to my pH levels returning to normal 30 minutes AFTER the peel was applied! The wait time between products is much more significant than I realised!! This explains why the results were more noticeable when I compared a 30 minute peel to a 15 minute application. I just didn't click to the notion that every time I washed the 15 minute peel off and immediately applied another product, my skins pH levels were not balanced yet and I was likely neutralizing a significant amount of the peels exfoliating process in it's tracks (what a waste those peels were!). The next time I use the Green Apple peel I am not going to leave it on as long but will continue to wait at least 30 minutes before I apply another product. Technically the results should be just as good as the longer peel time...right? I don't know about anyone else, but I have found the lack of peel classification and missing strength percentage on the Green Apple Peel packaging very frustrating. I called the company directly about this very issue and was passed to 3 different people in order to receive some sort of semi-decent answer. In the end I was told that the Green Apple peel is a combination AHA/BHA (fruit) peel and is around 10-15% in strength. To be honest, this did not make a lot of sense to me as I have yet to hear of any peel that slides up and down in strength. Of course the entire peel business is still new to me, so if someone knows the scoop on %'s, please chime in.

Can someone also please help me re-confirm what the pH level of my cleanser should be before I apply any AHA/BHA peel or AHA/BHA skincare products. I have been using a cleanser that has a pH level of 4 to 4.2 and believed this was appropriate. I did not, however, fully realize that a cleanser with such a low pH is behaving like an exfoliator on my skin. In fact I thought that 4.4 was the skins natural pH level and that the cleanser I was using was close enough which meant it wasn't really 'doing' anything in particular other than helping to keep my skin balanced & clean. I have since been told that a pH of 5.5 is closer to the skin's natural level and that my daily cleanser is considered low which means it's on the acidic side (and is exfoliating every time I use it even though I wasn't aware of this). Is this something I should be concerned about, or is this no big deal? Should I try to find another cleanser with a higher pH level to rotate with? I was really taken aback today when someone told me I was over-exfoliating with my current regime which consists primarily of an organic Vit C serum (MAP), DMAE+AlphaLipoic+C Ester cream and the JB Green Apple line of antioxidant creams & serums & weekly peels - all of which have some form of organic AHA/BHA in them. I feel like my head is spinning with pH levels and would greatly appreciate any feedback on the best types of pH level cleansers to use and if I should have one for the morning and a different one at night. Thanks so much everyone!

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Tue Apr 24, 2007 3:08 pm      Reply with quote
Your cleanser's pH is fine - as long as you're not having any adverse effects from it.

I used to use a cleanser with a lower pH & eventually it became irritating to my skin & I ended up with a lot of wrinkles under my eyes. It took awhile for me to figure out what was causing it - and then it took a couple of months for my skin to get back to normal.

But if your skin tolerates the lower pH cleanser, then it's fine - and you can apply your BHA/AHA right after cleansing.

My cleanser is about 5.5 and that seems to be the best pH for me.

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Tue Apr 24, 2007 3:30 pm      Reply with quote
kim@ifeelpretty wrote:
Your cleanser's pH is fine - as long as you're not having any adverse effects from it.

I used to use a cleanser with a lower pH & eventually it became irritating to my skin & I ended up with a lot of wrinkles under my eyes. It took awhile for me to figure out what was causing it - and then it took a couple of months for my skin to get back to normal.

But if your skin tolerates the lower pH cleanser, then it's fine - and you can apply your BHA/AHA right after cleansing.

My cleanser is about 5.5 and that seems to be the best pH for me.

Hi Kim! Thanks so much for your response. The scary thing is I have been developing wrinkles under my eyes (which have literally appeared out of no where) and I had NO IDEA why!!! I've been drinking 2-3 liters of water every day thinking I must be dehydrated, but now I think it may be the low pH cleanser that I've been using 2X daily(?).

If I switch to a 5.5 cleanser, can I use it with AHA/BHA products? I may have to experiment with a higher pH cleanser ASAP to see if this helps with the under-eye wrinkle issues that have me in a tail-spin lately.

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Tue Apr 24, 2007 4:15 pm      Reply with quote
That is exactly what happened to me! My undereye area looked horrible!!

But just be warned - it took a good 2 months for mine to get back to normal - so it doesn't get better immediately.

I use a 5.5 pH cleanser with my BHA/AHA products. I only cleanse once daily, in the evening, then every other night, I apply my BHA/AHA right after cleansing.

I just try to be extra gentle with my eye area. I use an eyemakeup remover made from oils only & I gently soak off the eyemakeup. Then I cleanse my face - and I don't avoid the eye area, but I don't concentrate on it either. So it does get some cleanser, just not a lot. Then I rinse carefully. I don't use the BHA/AHA around my eyes (some people tolerate it, but I can't) - I just use my pearlfection cream, line eraser, and Clarifying and/or Rejuvenating serums.

Good luck solving your problem!!

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Tue Apr 24, 2007 4:27 pm      Reply with quote
Kim,
Just curious if you use CP's at all? I tried just rinsing in the am but found it didn't seem to work if I used CP the night before.

kimberly
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Tue Apr 24, 2007 4:31 pm      Reply with quote
Yes, I use diluted regular CP serum around my eyes (sorry, forgot about that!) & Super CP serum on my face, neck, & chest. But I only apply in the morning & most of the time, it's just every other day. I've been using them for several years now, so I'm just on the 'maintenance' program now, LOL.

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Tue Apr 24, 2007 7:08 pm      Reply with quote
So, a cleanser with a pH of 5.5 is better for your skin? How do you know what the pH of the cleanser is? Or, maybe a better question can someone list some cleansers with a pH of 5.5?
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