 |
 |
| Author |
Message |
|
|
|
Tue Apr 03, 2007 7:16 pm  |
Hi everyone:
I know a lot of people are against the use of mineral oil and petrolatum in cosmetics/skincare but I'm not don't really understand why. Afterall, isn't baby oil made of mineral oil? Why would product be geared towards babies if it was harmful? And i have been using vaseline petroleum jelly for my entire life and it's the only thing that keeps my lips from chapping. The reason I ask is because I'm looking for an effective makeup remover and MUA absolutely raves about Pond's cold cream, which is bascially mineral oil, beeswax, and petrolatum. Are these ingredients harmful to the skin or are they simply outdated?
i tried MAC cleanse Off Oil a while back and had a horrible reaction to the cleanser so I'm really looking for a no-fuss makeup remover preferably without fragrance and doesn't clog pores. |
|
|
|
|
|
Tue Apr 03, 2007 8:03 pm |
| yeah..i dont understand why people are against it. please if someone knows why, let me know! |
_________________
Chicago.23, asian normal to combination skin |
|
|
|
|
Tue Apr 03, 2007 8:20 pm |
| Here's my two cents: I don't like mineral oil/petroleum jelly because it's occlusive. It suffocates your skin, and doesn't allow it to expel toxins. Because it IS so occlusive it does have its uses--- when my lips are REALLY chapped I will put some sort of treatment on them, and then seal it in with vaseline. However, I would not like to use it as every day skincare. Also, I definitely DO NOT agree with using it on babies' skin!! Just because it's in baby products doesn't automatically mean that it's ok for skin--- there's all kinds of awful stuff in those products! When I have kids of my own, I plan on using Burt's Bees Baby Bee stuff--- I use their stuff on myself now and I love it. |
_________________
27, sensitive/reactive/acne prone skin, dark brown hair, blue eyes, possibly the palest woman alive... |
|
|
|
|
Tue Apr 03, 2007 8:29 pm |
| manslayerliz wrote: |
| Here's my two cents: I don't like mineral oil/petroleum jelly because it's occlusive. It suffocates your skin, and doesn't allow it to expel toxins. Because it IS so occlusive it does have its uses--- when my lips are REALLY chapped I will put some sort of treatment on them, and then seal it in with vaseline. However, I would not like to use it as every day skincare. Also, I definitely DO NOT agree with using it on babies' skin!! Just because it's in baby products doesn't automatically mean that it's ok for skin--- there's all kinds of awful stuff in those products! When I have kids of my own, I plan on using Burt's Bees Baby Bee stuff--- I use their stuff on myself now and I love it. |
I agree with it's occlusivity. I've gtten terrible breakouts from using mineral oil. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Tue Apr 03, 2007 9:33 pm |
Agree with Liz, once you have used a wide range of products you realise just because it is in skincare it doesn't mean it is good. Skincare that contains petrolatum by products are cheap to manufacture, easy to create, have relatively high acceptability by most skin types BUT consumers don't realise the actual going-ons of a particular ingredient and don't know what the effects of long term use are. Well processed mineral oils don't contain trace chemicals but are still very suffocating on the skin - plant oils alternatives contain nutrients and vitamins and can actually be absorbed by the skin.
I have also at times wondered how skincare of half a century ago, mainly cold creams were seemingly so "effective"... Perhaps they do a great job for people with unreactive and dry skin and they are the ones that leave the positive feedback? But if like many of us here who have oily skin and acne prone conditions then even these age old classic formulations would not be suitable for us. |
|
|
|
|
|
Tue Apr 03, 2007 9:42 pm |
| This is so maddening to me. Mineral oil and petrolatum are considered to be the safest non irritating moisturizing ingredients ever found. They do not suffocate skin. Ladies you must read some of the cosmetic journal references on ingredients. These are the sources I always refer to when I question an ingredient. |
|
|
|
|
|
Tue Apr 03, 2007 11:39 pm |
| SusieQ wrote: |
| This is so maddening to me. Mineral oil and petrolatum are considered to be the safest non irritating moisturizing ingredients ever found. They do not suffocate skin. Ladies you must read some of the cosmetic journal references on ingredients. These are the sources I always refer to when I question an ingredient. |
I agree with SusieQ about the mineral oil (don't know about petrolatum) there is a lot of research showing it's one of the best things for barrier repair and totally benign in that respect, but that function means it is extremely occlusive so it may well not suit acne prone types. |
|
|
|
|
|
Wed Apr 04, 2007 12:18 am |
| Molly wrote: |
| SusieQ wrote: |
| This is so maddening to me. Mineral oil and petrolatum are considered to be the safest non irritating moisturizing ingredients ever found. They do not suffocate skin. Ladies you must read some of the cosmetic journal references on ingredients. These are the sources I always refer to when I question an ingredient. |
I agree with SusieQ about the mineral oil (don't know about petrolatum) there is a lot of research showing it's one of the best things for barrier repair and totally benign in that respect, but that function means it is extremely occlusive so it may well not suit acne prone types. |
i am acne prone, but seem to be able to handle a little mineral oil, but can't handle shea and rosehip oil -- so it's really each to his own....
LL -- i have not tried the Pond's, but i do use Eve Lom which is my HG makeup remover (and mineral oil is the first ingredient, i believe). however, using a cloth to remove it is a *must* -- otherwise it would clog pores -- so i can't exactly call it no-fuss. it also does have a slight smell, but i don't find this offensive in any way.
just bacause some ingredient is not popular or poo-poo'ed on this forum, does not mean it isn't right for you. i gather the Pond's isn't particularly expensive. i think you should give it a try and see if it works for you. my one bit of advice, though, is definitely get some microfiber cloth to help with the removal process or use a non-irritating toner after. if you are *not* acne prone, then even this might not be an absolute must. |
|
|
|
|
 |
Wed Apr 04, 2007 12:40 am |
| SusieQ wrote: |
| This is so maddening to me. Mineral oil and petrolatum are considered to be the safest non irritating moisturizing ingredients ever found. They do not suffocate skin. Ladies you must read some of the cosmetic journal references on ingredients. These are the sources I always refer to when I question an ingredient. |
You guys!!!!
This makes me so angry, sorry. I completely appreciate this effort, since there are a lot of ingredients out there scare people and that are completely anodyne. BUT mineral oil is not one of them. There is just as much independent online research proving quite the opposite of what SusieQ and Molly claim. The absoolute, unarguable truth is that mineral oil (i.e. parrafinum liquidum or petrolatum) IS a refined petrochemical. It is made in the VERY same crude oil refineries that give us our gasoline, our engine lubricants, and a lot of other 'hazardous' materials. When all those "hazardous" materials have been distilled through the refinery process, what's left is this "by-product." It is then "further refined" to comply with your country's acceptable human levels of hydrocarbons and polynuclear aromatic compounds, which are KNOWN CARCINOGENICS.
Now, we all know how the oil industry has lobbied the congress of my country to do all sorts of illegal things throughout the world; thus, it is in their best interest to maximize positive marketing and minimize negative repercussions in their production of mineral oil for the cosmetic industry.
For myself, it is the PROVEN lack of tight regulation on purity tests for mineral oil that makes me not want to use it:
| Quote: |
Purity Specifications
The most important purity test for petrolatum is the analytical procedure for PNA’s. Certain
condensed polynuclear aromatic compounds have been shown to cause cancer in animals and
humans. In the mid 1960’s, the FDA and others undertook extensive research programs to
develop a method that limited the PNA content of petrolatum and petroleum wax. The
Page 3
3
culmination of this work led to the test that is currently found in the CFR under petroleum wax,
21 CFR 172.886(b).
Based on the recovery of model PNA’s added to petroleum wax samples, Howard et al.
estimated that the total PNA’s “would be of the order of 0.6 ppm (excluding chrysenes and
triphenylene).”
4
Since the absorbance maxima for petrolatum in 21 CFR 172.880 (See Table 1)
are slightly higher than those for wax, the total PNA’s in petrolatum are around 1 ppm if the
absorbances are near the maxima.
Table 1
Petrolatum Listings in
Code of Federal Regulations
21 CFR 172.880 (Direct Addition to Food)
UV limits:
280 – 289 nm: 0.25 max
290 – 299 nm: 0.20 max
300 – 359 nm: 0.14 max
360 – 400 nm: 0.04 max
21 CFR 178.3700 (Food Contact)
UV limits: Same as above
21 CFR 573.720 (Animal Feed)
UV limits: Same as above
In this procedure PNA’s are extracted into a mixture of dimethyl sulfoxide and phosphoric acid.
After numerous washes the concentrated PNA’s are measured by UV absorption in isooctane.
This is the primary method for the analysis of total PNA’s as described in 21 CFR 172.886(b). If
the absorbances at this point in the procedure are below the limits set by 21 CFR 172.880, the
sample is considered a “pass.” We should point out that the 5
th
edition of the FCC, effective
January 1, 2004, references this same purity requirement for Petrolatum.
5
If the sample fails at
this point, 21 CFR 172.886(b) permits (in the secondary part of the method) additional “clean
up” to remove interfering compounds. Since this optional part of the procedure involves
numerous manipulations, reliable results may be difficult to obtain. It is industry practice to run
the primary part of the procedure only. If the sample does not pass, additional processing is
called for rather than additional testing. Using only the primary part of the procedure provides a
margin of safety in limiting the total PNA’s in the product. It also avoids exposure to benzene,
which is used in the secondary part of the test but not in the primary part. Benzene is known to
cause leukemia in humans so its use in routine lab procedures is avoided where possible.
|
and:
| Quote: |
Recent Regulatory Activity
Over the past decade mineral oils and petroleum waxes have come under greater scrutiny from
regulators, particularly those in Europe. Petrolatum is implicated because it can be considered a
combination of mineral oil and wax. The concern was raised because it was shown that very
small portions of the hydrocarbons were absorbed by a particular strain of rat, Fisher 344, during
feeding studies. The hydrocarbons accumulated in the liver and mesenteric lymph nodes of the
Fisher rats and resulted in the normal immune response that any foreign body would cause.
Absorption was found in other animals but not to the extent found in the Fisher rat. All of the
animals were able to clear the oil from their systems over time when it was eliminated from their
diets.
After reviewing these data regulators at the FDA have not changed the food status of petrolatum
or of petroleum wax and mineral oil. European regulators have limited the food contact of
mineral oils and waxes and therefore petrolatum.
8
Microcrystalline wax and high viscosity
mineral oils, the two major components of petrolatum, were rated as having the least effect on
the animals by JECFA
9
(Joint Expert Committee of the World Health Organization and the Food
and Agriculture Organization of the United Nations) and by the European Union’s (EU)
Scientific Committee on Food.
10
These views are reflected in new regulations with higher
Allowable Daily Intakes (ADI’s) for high molecular weight mineral oils and microcrystalline
wax. It is important to point out that after years of animal feeding studies there is no evidence
that these materials have been implicated as carcinogens. A review of this work was presented at
the 2002 NPRA meeting in Houston.
11
|
I don't care that after "year of testing" these residual materials in mineral oil are not considered carcinogenic--I'm sure it is not causing cancer all over the place. The thing that turns me off completely to mineral oil is the details about its refinery process--in order to get it to be something that is cosmetically viable, they add all sorts of chemicals to an already hazardous material in order to 'neutralize' it--and being the oil industry--it is in their best interests to do the least possible amount of work in order to make it viable for human consumption, as the above regulatory process shows. It might be good for barrier repair, but I'd much rather but a botanical oil on my face, sorry! I am basically suspicious of any cosmetic company that uses mineral oil, since knowing this fact, I wonder about the integrity of their other ingredients. The bottom line is: mineral oil is in so many commercial products because historically, the oil industry found a way to market its leftover by-products to them. I assure you that the cosmetic industry didn't run up to the crude oil refineries to ask what they had to offer.
--avalange |
_________________
http://newnaturalbeauty.tumblr.com/ 37, light-toned olive skin, broken caps, normal skin. My staples: Osea cleansing milk, Algae Oil, Advanced Protection Cream, Eyes & Lips, Tata Harper, Julie Hewett makeup, Amazing Cosmetics Powder, & By Terry Light Expert, Burnout, and daily inversion therapy and green smoothies! |
|
|
|
|
Wed Apr 04, 2007 12:53 am |
I personally don't like petrolatum or mineral oils because they clog my skin, give me spots and huge pores. the skin cannot breathe. I think using something like vaseline on the lips is ok because the lips don't have oil glands so get dry easily and using vaseline on them isn't going to clog pores as there aren't any on the lips so that is ok but i wouldn't want to use the ingrediants on my face.
I can't stand vaseline or anything like it anyway. |
|
|
|
|
|
Wed Apr 04, 2007 3:47 am |
| manslayerliz wrote: |
| Here's my two cents: I don't like mineral oil/petroleum jelly because it's occlusive. It suffocates your skin, and doesn't allow it to expel toxins. Because it IS so occlusive it does have its uses--- when my lips are REALLY chapped I will put some sort of treatment on them, and then seal it in with vaseline. However, I would not like to use it as every day skincare. Also, I definitely DO NOT agree with using it on babies' skin!! Just because it's in baby products doesn't automatically mean that it's ok for skin--- there's all kinds of awful stuff in those products! When I have kids of my own, I plan on using Burt's Bees Baby Bee stuff--- I use their stuff on myself now and I love it. |
I agree with everything Liz has said. Petroleum(vaseline) suffocates your skin, causing your skin not to breathe, therefore I'd get clogged pores. I've personally tried putting neosporin and vaseline on my face to help treat my pimples before for about a month.. and then after I stopped, then I suddenly noticed that my face is covered with plenty of large pores.. Not a pretty thing. Also..when your skin can't breathe, it gets dry and dehydrated. I'd bathe my baby in Burt's Bees Baby Bee's products!! |
|
|
|
|
|
Wed Apr 04, 2007 5:49 am |
| Lisey wrote: |
| manslayerliz wrote: |
| Here's my two cents: I don't like mineral oil/petroleum jelly because it's occlusive. It suffocates your skin, and doesn't allow it to expel toxins. Because it IS so occlusive it does have its uses--- when my lips are REALLY chapped I will put some sort of treatment on them, and then seal it in with vaseline. However, I would not like to use it as every day skincare. Also, I definitely DO NOT agree with using it on babies' skin!! Just because it's in baby products doesn't automatically mean that it's ok for skin--- there's all kinds of awful stuff in those products! When I have kids of my own, I plan on using Burt's Bees Baby Bee stuff--- I use their stuff on myself now and I love it. |
I agree with everything Liz has said. Petroleum(vaseline) suffocates your skin, causing your skin not to breathe, therefore I'd get clogged pores. I've personally tried putting neosporin and vaseline on my face to help treat my pimples before for about a month.. and then after I stopped, then I suddenly noticed that my face is covered with plenty of large pores.. Not a pretty thing. Also..when your skin can't breathe, it gets dry and dehydrated. I'd bathe my baby in Burt's Bees Baby Bee's products!! |
oh yeah, that's the OTHER reason why I don't like it.
--avalange |
_________________
http://newnaturalbeauty.tumblr.com/ 37, light-toned olive skin, broken caps, normal skin. My staples: Osea cleansing milk, Algae Oil, Advanced Protection Cream, Eyes & Lips, Tata Harper, Julie Hewett makeup, Amazing Cosmetics Powder, & By Terry Light Expert, Burnout, and daily inversion therapy and green smoothies! |
|
|
|
|
Wed Apr 04, 2007 6:07 am |
| SusieQ wrote: |
| This is so maddening to me. Mineral oil and petrolatum are considered to be the safest non irritating moisturizing ingredients ever found. They do not suffocate skin. Ladies you must read some of the cosmetic journal references on ingredients. These are the sources I always refer to when I question an ingredient. |
Sorry your information is incorrect. There has been a lot of study and evidence to prove that mineral oil which is a petroleum by product can irritate and aggravate skin conditions. It has no skin benefit whatsoever and can leave a greasy after-feel. It's only purpose is to give slip and glide to products and increase their spreadability.  |
|
|
|
|
|
Wed Apr 04, 2007 6:41 am |
| I have done some reading on this topic and I am still on the fence. One avenue of research says one thing and then there is another to contradict it. Totally confusing. All I know is that when no other moisturizer works I put a little vasaline on and my skin is moisturized. I use it after my microdermabrasions as a night time moisturizer and I wake up to totally moisturized glowing skin. Anything else and I dry out like crazy. |
|
|
|
|
|
Wed Apr 04, 2007 7:51 am |
Wow! Such contradictory opinions about mineral oil and petrolatum! I still don't feel confident about using or not using mineral oil and petrolatum. I will continue using petroleum jelly on my lips because I find that it's the only thing that helps with my chapped lips, but I am still really confused about using the Ponds cold cream. I suppose there are better alternatives out there, but like I said in my first post, I am looking for a products with as few ingredients as possible so that I can more readily identify ingredients that will irritate my skin.
I read through the "Which Cream Cleanser for Remove Makeup" thread and most of the people replied with Dr. H's Cleansing Cream. I know a lot of people have had great results with Dr. H but his ingredients list for the Cream cleanser sort of scares me. Peanut oil and soybean oil are supposed to be quite comedogenic and I already have acne prone skin. Plus, I find that essential oils aggravate my skin as well. So what's a girl to do!?
Thanks! |
|
|
|
|
|
Wed Apr 04, 2007 8:06 am |
botanical oils remove makeup extremely effectively! I know some people love hazelnut and macadamia, sesame, camellia, the list is really endless. I personally don't want to put any $$$ in the petrochemical industry's pockets, not to mention the fact that I cannot be sure that what I'm really putting on my face isn't a cocktail of chemicals and potentially hazardous waste material...
--avalange |
_________________
http://newnaturalbeauty.tumblr.com/ 37, light-toned olive skin, broken caps, normal skin. My staples: Osea cleansing milk, Algae Oil, Advanced Protection Cream, Eyes & Lips, Tata Harper, Julie Hewett makeup, Amazing Cosmetics Powder, & By Terry Light Expert, Burnout, and daily inversion therapy and green smoothies! |
|
|
|
|
Wed Apr 04, 2007 8:48 am |
Hi LL,
I hear you ... and know what you're going through! 
Simple vegetable source oils are fabulous for removing makeup ... and even for deeply cleansing your acne prone skin.
If you search here on EDS you'll find tons of threads about OCM [Oil Cleansing Method] ... and it was the first step towards my skin clearing!  I know it sounds somewhat radical and/or contradictory ... but it really does work.
I've been doing OCM for over a year and a half now ... and it's been a "face" saver!
That said ... if you just want something to remove your makeup ... and you want to know what the ingredients are ... go into your kitchen ... grab your Crisco cooking oil [which I gather is almost entirely soy oil] ... pour about a teaspoon's worth of it into your palm ... spread it on your face and lightly massage it around. There's no need to tissue this off, although you can.
You can use your regular cleanser to remove all traces of the oil.
There are a whole host of great vegetable source oils that are wonderful to use ... and since you are removing all traces of it, the oils don't have a chance to clog your pores.
That's certainly the most economical way to go ...
If you check out the DIY section, you'll find a lot of stuff about oils in there.
Good luck
HTH
Mary |
_________________
Over 50, combo, OCM. Originator of Pearl Paste ... www.silkenpearl.com |
|
|
|
|
Wed Apr 04, 2007 8:57 am |
I would be interested to hear what John C. Hill has to say on the subject...
As for me, I use products with mineral oil and petrolatum(not exclusively, but I won't stop usingsomething if it contains it); I believe other things will harm me first before my body lotion will. I mean, let's be honest here. There are bigger hills to die on. |
|
|
RedRose73
New Member
 
Joined: 04 Apr 2007
Posts: 3
|
|
|
Wed Apr 04, 2007 12:03 pm |
| I use petorleum jelly occasionally, i cant stand to use it when it is hot, but it does true wonders for skin. |
|
|
|
|
|
Wed Apr 04, 2007 1:22 pm |
I have used Ponds Cold Cream and I loved it for years. I have since found better cleansers but I always keep a jar of it around. I'm not sure what to tell you about the ingredents....all I can say is it removes makeup and does not dry out your face.
Good luck! |
|
|
|
|
|
Wed Apr 04, 2007 2:42 pm |
When I used Pond's Cold Cream to remove my makeup--and it did a great job doing that--I immediately tissed my makeup off, then washed my face with a mild, low pH cleanser. With the tissuing and subsequent washing, the cold cream (with its possibly bad ingredients) gets washed away anyway, so what's the harm??? If getting rid of your makeup is what you want, I don't see any problem in using a mineral oil product! BTW, someone who has worked in the cosmetic industry for a number of years explained this to me. HTH!
BTW, the only reason I haven't continued with the Ponds' is because I recently switched over to the OCM method. That takes EVERYTHING off and it feels great too.. After the OCM wash and rinse, I then use Nivea moisturing toner to get rid of any leftover residue on my face.. |
|
|
|
|
|
Wed Apr 04, 2007 3:04 pm |
| SusieQ wrote: |
| This is so maddening to me. Mineral oil and petrolatum are considered to be the safest non irritating moisturizing ingredients ever found. They do not suffocate skin. Ladies you must read some of the cosmetic journal references on ingredients. These are the sources I always refer to when I question an ingredient. |
There are different grades to both, SQ is right as long as its a super high grade, the ones the clog and cause issues have given all of them a bad name, they are in fact, in high grades VERY GOOD for your skin.
edited to add, and everyone else is right if its a lower grade! So in my opinion, its good if you have the right stuff and horrible if you don't. |
|
|
|
|
|
Wed Apr 04, 2007 6:43 pm |
Thanks for everyone's suggestions. I was contemplating jojoba oil for a while, but I had a really terrible reaction to MAc's Cleanse Off Oil so I'm really reluctant to try the OCM. I may try using just jojoba oil as a makeup remover and then follow with my regular cleanser but I just wanted to learn about the negative (and positive) reactions to mineral oil and petrolatum.
Thanks! |
|
|
|
|
|
Wed Apr 04, 2007 7:41 pm |
| I am sorry to say but it was Aveda who started the protest against these ingredients a long time ago. It is foolish to assume that they can harm the skin by forming an oil film and suffocating it. Lots of ingredients come from awful sounding sources but are totally safe. Salt is a good example. Cosmetics grade mineral oil and petrolatum are the safest, most non irritating ingredients ever found. They are very good anti-oxidants by keeping air off the skin but they don't suffocate skin. |
|
|
|
|
| Wed Apr 24, 2024 7:24 pm |
If this is your first visit to the EDS Forums please take the time to register. Registration is required for you to post on the forums. Registration will also give you the ability to track messages of interest, send private messages to other users, participate in Gift Certificates draws and enjoy automatic discounts for shopping at our online store. Registration is free and takes just a few seconds to complete.
Click Here to join our community.
If you are already a registered member on the forums, please login to gain full access to the site. |
|
 |
|
|
