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DermaRoller

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mangosteen
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Thu Dec 04, 2008 11:45 am      Reply with quote
taobunny wrote:
taobunny wrote:
... The good news is that, this time, I have what looks to be minimal track marks. I think this might be because this time I took Bethany's excellent advice and hopped in the shower immediately after - and spent a long, long, long time sluicing my face with warm water.

Will let you know what happens in the next few days - after all the swelling and pinkness go away. (Unless my face falls off in the meantime! Wink )


Ohhhhhkay - spoke too soon. So, here I was - all happy that I had what looked to be minimal trackmarks. Yeah, right. This morning, woke up to a wonderful complexion of blood blisters all over my cheeks. (I kind of look like that girl in the Wendy's fast food logo - but only not as cute...) Most of the blood blisters are this size ---> o --- But some are this size ---> O. What fun. Should make my meeting with a client tomorrow morning very interesting... I'm gonna have to wake up an hour early - just to get a head start with the heavy duty concealer...

Don't know *why* I get such a strong reaction - but it could be that I do bruise easily - so, perhaps my clotting factors aren't as high. I think next time, I'm going to do the long shower - but tepid - and then ice immediately afterwards. Guess the good news is that I know I *definitely* hit the dermis... (sigh)

Remind me again, I do this to look pretty, right??? Embarassed


taobunny-

I have gotten blood blisters just as you described after my last three rolls. Strangely, I did not get them after my first six weekly rolls, then took a break for a month, and have been getting the post-roll blood blisters since. I also have been on Retin-A for years. I haven't taken a pain-killer of any variety for a long time, so that is not the issue for me. Mine fade away completely within three days.

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Lowbrowscientist
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Thu Dec 04, 2008 12:19 pm      Reply with quote
bethany wrote:
Lowbrowscientist wrote:
Since the .25mm needles are not long enough to induce collagen production, is the inflammation still a necessary evil? Or, unlike the CIT rolls, can I hit the anti-inflammatories right away? Perhaps the inflammation plays a role in thickening the epidermis...?


That is an interesting question, but I am going to say that it is not critical to wait to apply anti-inflammatories with the short needles.

I only say that because I previously asked Dr. Liebl about inflammation with .15mm needles, and he stated that studies did not identify any real inflammation (he clearly has not seen you or me after a short needle roll). However, using the .15mm needles 2-3x a week does indeed thicken the epidermis (per him).

I am wondering if you might not have to needle so intensely with the .25mm since the primary goal is product penetration, instead of triggering the wound cascade through extensive "wounding." What do you think?


Beth, thanks so much for your response... I feel as though I've been a bit negligent in doing my own research and am standing on your metaphorical shoulders to get much of this information.

As you've pointed out, I think the smoking gun in this case is that no real inflammation was even noted in their studies with shorter needles. So, with that in mind, I will go a bit easier with the .25mm (what I was doing this summer was probably fine) and work on the inflammation right away. I think you've mentioned this before, but I'm wondering again if your skin's higher-than-usual inflammatory response is partly responsible for your excellent CI results (in addition to the more developed vascular network)... in which case, I have pretty good odds of getting similar benefits.

Just lately, my face has been looking worse than usual, but I remember people commenting that there was post-roll "sag" that would occur when the inflammation died down. Since I've been spot treating on a fairly regular basis, I'm trusting that this is what's going on and I'm not that worried about it. I have resolved, though, to only do a 1.5mm full face roll every six weeks, and I might skip the in-between spot treating altogether.
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Thu Dec 04, 2008 12:26 pm      Reply with quote
mangosteen wrote:
taobunny-

I have gotten blood blisters just as you described after my last three rolls. Strangely, I did not get them after my first six weekly rolls, then took a break for a month, and have been getting the post-roll blood blisters since. I also have been on Retin-A for years. I haven't taken a pain-killer of any variety for a long time, so that is not the issue for me. Mine fade away completely within three days.


Is it possible that, since you're a rolling veteran Smile , you're rolling more intensely now than you were before?

I know this has been the case for me (though I am by no means a rolling veteran)... that's very odd, though, that you'd have that reaction now, when you didn't before. Maybe it's also a sign that you've increased your vascular network?
mangosteen
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Thu Dec 04, 2008 12:35 pm      Reply with quote
Lowbrowscientist wrote:
mangosteen wrote:
taobunny-

I have gotten blood blisters just as you described after my last three rolls. Strangely, I did not get them after my first six weekly rolls, then took a break for a month, and have been getting the post-roll blood blisters since. I also have been on Retin-A for years. I haven't taken a pain-killer of any variety for a long time, so that is not the issue for me. Mine fade away completely within three days.


Is it possible that, since you're a rolling veteran Smile , you're rolling more intensely now than you were before?

I know this has been the case for me (though I am by no means a rolling veteran)... that's very odd, though, that you'd have that reaction now, when you didn't before. Maybe it's also a sign that you've increased your vascular network?


I am definitely rolling more intensely now than I was in my virgin rolling days. In fact, sometimes I feel more like I am "dermaplowing" than "dermarolling". Shock Than could indeed be the cause of my blood blisters.

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45 yo, AALS, Rex Kara II, Foreo, Carolyn's Facial Fitness, Tanaka massage (every morning), dermarolling (1.5mm every 6-8 weeks), Retin-A, Epionce
taobunny
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Thu Dec 04, 2008 2:29 pm      Reply with quote
mangosteen wrote:

taobunny-

I have gotten blood blisters just as you described after my last three rolls. Strangely, I did not get them after my first six weekly rolls, then took a break for a month, and have been getting the post-roll blood blisters since. I also have been on Retin-A for years. I haven't taken a pain-killer of any variety for a long time, so that is not the issue for me. Mine fade away completely within three days.


Thanks, Mangosteen - it helps to hear that someone else is getting the same "result"... It's really not painful - and I don't think I did any real damage - it's just kind of strange looking. Glad to hear that yours faded away in three days. (I'll keep ya'll posted on how long mine take! LOL)

I think Lowbrow is right in that maybe the increased vascularity is to "blame" for the increased bleeding. And, though I'm not a rolling veteran - I definitely did a very strong roll this time. I'll have to see if a combination of stopping the ibuprofen two weeks before, along with a tepid shower after the roll - with a bit of ice afterwards (just until things really clot (ew!). I think I may also do the roll in the morning - so that I'm vertical for most of the day afterwards. (Maybe doing a roll - and then going to bed an hour later wasn't the smartest thing to do.)

All I can say is I'm glad I'm an artist - because it definitely took some paintbrush skills this morning to cover up the marks on my face! Laughing
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Thu Dec 04, 2008 5:48 pm      Reply with quote
Keliu wrote:
bethany wrote:
I only say that because I previously asked Dr. Liebl about inflammation with .15mm needles, and he stated that studies did not identify any real inflammation (he clearly has not seen you or me after a short needle roll). [b]However, using the .15mm needles 2-3x a week does indeed thicken the epidermis [/b](per him).


Bethany, can you point out to me where he stated that, is it on record in the Dermaroller info thread - if it isn't, don't worry about it.


Found what I was looking for here:

http://www.dermaroller.de/us/epidermis-thickness/epidermis-thickness.html

"In recent research we found out that even the short needles of the Home Care Dermaroller C8 with a needle length of only 0.15 to 0.2 mm (0.0078 inch) have a positive effect on the epidermis without any skin care products".
bethany
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Thu Dec 04, 2008 6:42 pm      Reply with quote
Keliu wrote:
Keliu wrote:
bethany wrote:
I only say that because I previously asked Dr. Liebl about inflammation with .15mm needles, and he stated that studies did not identify any real inflammation (he clearly has not seen you or me after a short needle roll). [b]However, using the .15mm needles 2-3x a week does indeed thicken the epidermis [/b](per him).


Bethany, can you point out to me where he stated that, is it on record in the Dermaroller info thread - if it isn't, don't worry about it.


Found what I was looking for here:

http://www.dermaroller.de/us/epidermis-thickness/epidermis-thickness.html

"In recent research we found out that even the short needles of the Home Care Dermaroller C8 with a needle length of only 0.15 to 0.2 mm (0.0078 inch) have a positive effect on the epidermis without any skin care products".


Here you go:

Quote:
But we have proof that even shorter needles like such from the Home Care Dermaroller (0.2 mm) thickens the epidermis by 30 to 40% when used twice a week for about 2 to 3 month.

http://dermaroller.wordpress.com/2008/05/17/question-about-collagen-function/

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bethany
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Thu Dec 04, 2008 6:54 pm      Reply with quote
Lowbrowscientist wrote:
I think you've mentioned this before, but I'm wondering again if your skin's higher-than-usual inflammatory response is partly responsible for your excellent CI results (in addition to the more developed vascular network)... in which case, I have pretty good odds of getting similar benefits.

Just lately, my face has been looking worse than usual, but I remember people commenting that there was post-roll "sag" that would occur when the inflammation died down. Since I've been spot treating on a fairly regular basis, I'm trusting that this is what's going on and I'm not that worried about it. I have resolved, though, to only do a 1.5mm full face roll every six weeks, and I might skip the in-between spot treating altogether.


I think my tendency to become inflammed may have definitely helped in driving my great results (along with the pre- and post-protocols, and intensive rolls).

I did a number of targeted treatments every 2 weeks, and after thinking about it further, I have pretty much given it up myself...especially since I have become more informed on facial exercise. Of course, I also go through periods of dermarolling exhaustion where I am just not interested in rolling...all that drinking and pain is draining! Very Happy

I am now choosing to do the intense rolls every 6 weeks or so, and facial exercise (Ageless) the rest of the weeks in between...I think it is a better balance, and limits some of the trauma (and too much of anything is not a good thing!).

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taobunny
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Fri Dec 05, 2008 4:32 pm      Reply with quote
Hi Rollergals!

So, I managed to figure out how to take pictures of my poor face... And, I've got them hosted...

However, don't know how to get them to show up in the thread - so here are the links...

First one is from Wednesday night:
http://img114.imageshack.us/img114/4263/img0544ns7.jpg

Second one is from this afternoon (Friday):
http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/1987/img0596rp8.jpg

As you can see, the one near the corner of my mouth has resolved quite a bit - but the ones on my cheek(s) are going to take a bit of time until they fade. (Unlike Mangosteen, I don't think I'm going to be so lucky that they'll be completely faded in three days...Sad )

Anyway - any input (other than to stop dermarolling - LOL) would be appreciated! TIA!
bethany
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Fri Dec 05, 2008 5:11 pm      Reply with quote
taobunny wrote:
Hi Rollergals!

So, I managed to figure out how to take pictures of my poor face... And, I've got them hosted...

However, don't know how to get them to show up in the thread - so here are the links...

First one is from Wednesday night:
http://img114.imageshack.us/img114/4263/img0544ns7.jpg

Second one is from this afternoon (Friday):
http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/1987/img0596rp8.jpg

As you can see, the one near the corner of my mouth has resolved quite a bit - but the ones on my cheek(s) are going to take a bit of time until they fade. (Unlike Mangosteen, I don't think I'm going to be so lucky that they'll be completely faded in three days...Sad )

Anyway - any input (other than to stop dermarolling - LOL) would be appreciated! TIA!


OMG...those are horrible!!! Shock Shock Shock That was FAR worse than what I was expecting to see.

I think you definitely HAVE to lay off the ibuprofen 2 weeks before a roll, since it does greatly increase the likelihood of bleeding.

Otherwise, you may have to invest in some of that heavy duty camouflage makeup (like for large birthmarks).

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bethany
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Fri Dec 05, 2008 5:13 pm      Reply with quote
mangosteen wrote:


I am definitely rolling more intensely now than I was in my virgin rolling days. In fact, sometimes I feel more like I am "dermaplowing" than "dermarolling". Shock Than could indeed be the cause of my blood blisters.


I have to admit that this line totally cracked me up! Laughing Laughing Laughing

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Fri Dec 05, 2008 6:21 pm      Reply with quote
taobunny wrote:
Hi Rollergals!

So, I managed to figure out how to take pictures of my poor face... And, I've got them hosted...

However, don't know how to get them to show up in the thread - so here are the links...

First one is from Wednesday night:
http://img114.imageshack.us/img114/4263/img0544ns7.jpg

Second one is from this afternoon (Friday):
http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/1987/img0596rp8.jpg

As you can see, the one near the corner of my mouth has resolved quite a bit - but the ones on my cheek(s) are going to take a bit of time until they fade. (Unlike Mangosteen, I don't think I'm going to be so lucky that they'll be completely faded in three days...Sad )

Anyway - any input (other than to stop dermarolling - LOL) would be appreciated! TIA!



OMG's right! They are bad.

Tao get some Colortration concealer, it's the best stuff ever. Covers anything. You can buy a trial sized pack of colours pretty cheap, and which ever colour suits will last quite a while.

Sorry that's all I can offer.
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Fri Dec 05, 2008 9:17 pm      Reply with quote
taobunny, that looks pretty bad. Are you using anything on your skin to help heal those spots? I am actually wondering if the Nu Derm is not making you more reactive to the dermarolling.
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Fri Dec 05, 2008 9:56 pm      Reply with quote
hi taobunny,
I cant help but wonder if your roller has a bent needle because of the larger holes.
Have you added MSM and VitC to your supplements ? that may help things heal faster.
Thanks for sharing your pics,it really helps to "see" whats going on.
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Fri Dec 05, 2008 10:50 pm      Reply with quote
That looks extremely painful. I was wondering why I kept getting a little pinprick in some places as I rolled, and discovered one of the needles is bent and catches the skin. Does anyone know if there is a very small roller to be found anywhere? Like half the standard size? I have very deep set eyes and can't get the Dermaroller into the sides where I have a large crease. (Sounds weird, I know...)
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Fri Dec 05, 2008 11:31 pm      Reply with quote
just bought a roller of leaf & rusher on skinstore and started to use it for 3 days, really hope to learn from this post.
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Sat Dec 06, 2008 5:17 am      Reply with quote
Antonia wrote:
That looks extremely painful. I was wondering why I kept getting a little pinprick in some places as I rolled, and discovered one of the needles is bent and catches the skin. Does anyone know if there is a very small roller to be found anywhere? Like half the standard size? I have very deep set eyes and can't get the Dermaroller into the sides where I have a large crease. (Sounds weird, I know...)


Antonia there's a 3 line roller which is about half the size of the standard roller. You can get one from Jack.

His email address is backstrecords2@yahoo.com
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Sat Dec 06, 2008 7:13 am      Reply with quote
Hi everyone~
I was looking for information on Dermarollers when I chance upon this forum and am glad I did. Very Happy

I purchased a 0.25mm roller for my scalp to improve the absorption of Folligen(CPs)

I understand that most users clean their skins with anti-bactria lotions/gel before using the rollers. It's pretty difficult for me to do the same for my scalp, so will it be alright if i just head straight for the rolling followed by my CPs?
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Sat Dec 06, 2008 12:28 pm      Reply with quote
Mishey! Thanks so much. I was trying again with the larger roller last night and the socket is so deep that it just won't go near the wrinkle/line. My sockets are like those of an ape. I think I'm a genetic throwback as my parents were first cousins. Laughing Laughing Laughing
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Sat Dec 06, 2008 1:03 pm      Reply with quote
muimui wrote:
I understand that most users clean their skins with anti-bactria lotions/gel before using the rollers. It's pretty difficult for me to do the same for my scalp, so will it be alright if i just head straight for the rolling followed by my CPs?


I would at least wash your hair first...you do not want any residual hair product entering your scalp.

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bethany
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Sat Dec 06, 2008 1:06 pm      Reply with quote
tuna wrote:
just bought a roller of leaf & rusher on skinstore and started to use it for 3 days, really hope to learn from this post.


Tuna,

PLEASE make sure that you read the last 20 pages of this thread, and the CIT/Dermarolling articles thread.

Keep in mind that the Leaf & Rusher roller contains the shortest needles, and will hel only with product penetration and thickening the epidermis...you will not see new collagen development, etc.

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bethany
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Sat Dec 06, 2008 1:10 pm      Reply with quote
I just posted a 10% additional discount for dr-roller.eu through the end of December. They now offer the .15mm baby roller, the regular rollers, and the 3Line roller (all Dr. Roller brand), as well as multiple roller discounts.

Please see page 7 of the Discounted Dermarollers thread below for details:

http://www.essentialdayspa.com/forum/viewthread.php?tid=29392&postdays=0&postorder=asc&&start=150

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mb935
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Sat Dec 06, 2008 1:40 pm      Reply with quote
I dont know if this was ever mentioned....

I decided to try a numbing cream for my 2.0 dermaroller just to make the process less painful of course...

Im trying to spend less so I called my local drugstore. The pharmacist said I could use Orajel or Ambesol on my face!!!

What are your opinions on that???
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Sat Dec 06, 2008 1:50 pm      Reply with quote
MB, I got the same response from the pharmacy too and actually bought a tube of Orajel, which is supposed to instantly numb the gums. I tried a patch test on my arm and didn't feel any numbness at all, but I have to admit I didn't leave it on for any length of time. I expected (and didn't get, instant numbness),it does contain 20% Benzocaine though. I'd imagine it is effective for gums since the skin is much more sensitive than facial skin.
Next time I do a targeted roll, I'll try it out for myself and leave it on for awhile - I hate to waste it Very Happy.
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Sat Dec 06, 2008 9:41 pm      Reply with quote
bethany wrote:
I just posted a 10% additional discount for dr-roller.eu through the end of December. They now offer the .15mm baby roller, the regular rollers, and the 3Line roller (all Dr. Roller brand), as well as multiple roller discounts.

Please see page 7 of the Discounted Dermarollers thread below for details:

http://www.essentialdayspa.com/forum/viewthread.php?tid=29392&postdays=0&postorder=asc&&start=150


Bugger!

I just ordered two rollers from them just over a week ago. Damn! Sad
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