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DermaRoller

EDS Skin Care Forums Forum Index » Skincare Tools & Do-It-Yourself Skincare
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Pandax12
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Thu Apr 30, 2015 10:40 pm      Reply with quote
PittyPat1960 wrote:
I am new to this forum but have done some derma rolling but not faithfully. I have looked at You Tube videos and done other research.

My confusion is needle length, and how many days per week one should use for the face. Taking into account the inflammation factor, the time the skin needs to heal between treatments etc. this appears to be a controversial subject with many opinions by well respected professionals. And then there is the question of should you "treat" the skin with topicals during, or wait til after. If I am asking a redundant question please forgive as this thread is L O N G but I believe derma rolling is a very valuable tool and I would love to benefit from other's experiences!
Thanks!! Laughing


Yes there are so many opinions about how to dermaroll. I've been rolling for several years now. Have read all of Sarah's advice at owndoc.com, all of Dr. Setterfield's info and all of Dr. Fernandez info. You really can't go wrong rolling your face/neck/hands once ever 4-6 weeks. I go with 4 weeks as I tend to follow Dr. Setterfield mostly. Now that is for medical rolls. People's definition of what length constitutes a medical roll differs. I believe 0.5mm-1.0mm is just right. I switch back and forth from 0.75mm-1.0mm

Cosmetic rolls (.20mm-.30mm)can be done daily. I find this a PITA and only do it every other night. Very Happy
I really like what Dr. Setterfield has said about how even cosmetic rolls induce collagen rather than just enhance product penetration. Something no one else is talking about.

I personally think that much of the "stuff" you see being applied before medical rolls on Youtube is mostly fluff. Hey they have to justify charging you so much money. Rolling Eyes
It's the rolling itself that is doing the magic. And don't you just love the horse needles that are often used in those videos. Yikes.
Cosmetic rolls are a different issue. I apply retin-a about 30 minutes after a cosmetic roll.
PittyPat1960
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Tue May 05, 2015 12:58 am      Reply with quote
Pandax12: thanks for taking the time to respond to my inquiry!! Interesting that you apply Retin-A after. I thought I read from one of the Drs. that applying a prescription topical after forced it into the deeper layers of skin that it wasn't meant to penetrate. Pretty confusing with the different points of view!! Then I factor in Dr. Perricone's position that irritation of the skin like that causes inflammation which promotes aging of the skin.

Well I plan on continuing with my rolling! I love the way my skin looks the next day!! I also keep a record of everything I do so as to find what works for me. But still figuring out needle length, and schedule. Thanks for all of the input!!

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Pandax12
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Tue May 05, 2015 7:46 am      Reply with quote
You have to remember Dr. Perricone's want's you to buy his $250 serums. Rolling Eyes
wrinklefreeforever
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Sat May 09, 2015 2:03 pm      Reply with quote
Looks like the derminator is not avail until the 15th now. First it was the 8th. I can't wait to order, but they keep moving it.
flipper
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Sun May 10, 2015 10:30 am      Reply with quote
Derminator in stock date moved to May 20. Rolling Eyes
Pandax12
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Tue May 12, 2015 10:43 pm      Reply with quote
http://needlingguide.com/the-discontinuation-of-derma-pen-llc-devices-and-the-future-of-microneedling/
wrinklefreeforever
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Wed May 13, 2015 3:45 pm      Reply with quote
So Dermapen is closing down. Did I read that right? Also, it looks like they sell their Dermapen ... would that be better than the derminator, the same, or what does everyone think?
strawberryjen
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Thu May 21, 2015 7:17 am      Reply with quote
Hello everyone,
I have been following this thread for a little while and really impressed with the amount of information on here, thank you all! However, I have a very specific situation and I was wondering if you could help.
I have been using a 1.5mm dermaroller on my face for about 5 weeks now and LOVE IT! I had no wrinkles to begin with as I’m quite young but my skin looks less tired and more fresh, I look younger and healthier, yet less prone to spots. I have just purchased a 3mm derma roller from eBay with the intention of using it on my thighs. I (somewhat stupidly) underwent liposuction in this area last year and it has resulted in loose, sagging and lumpy skin irregularities. I have considered having further surgery (specifically, a thigh lift) to correct this, as it would tighten the skin but this is very invasive and extreme surgery so I don’t know that I would want to go under the knife again. I have read on these forums that some people have noticed quite a dramatic tightening of their skin following regular use of the derma roller and was wondering if anyone can comment on the effect it has had on their thighs, whether cellulite or loose skin in this area? Can you make any recommendations about what cream/ oil to use afterwards? I have been told that this area is particularly resistant to treatments, but am hoping with regular use of the derma roller as well as healthy diet and exercise, I will notice a significant difference. If you have any experience in this area or have seen/ heard of other people’s success, I would be really excited to hear!

Thank you,

Jen
hydrogeogirl
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Fri May 22, 2015 5:10 am      Reply with quote
It is optimum to prepare your skin for a derma roll by using Retin A at night and Vitamin C serum in the morning for 3 to 4 weeks prior to rolling with long needles. An oil soluble vitamin A and C serum is best used after a roll as these vitamins can then be delivered to support collagen production in a non-irritating form.

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58 in 2/2017. Author of "Skin Remodeling DIY, An Introduction to the Underground World of Do-It-Yourself Skin Care" May 2015. Sunscreen/skin protection, DIY C serum, firming serums, Retin-A, OCM, FlexEffect from 2002, lymphatic massage, 6 rolls/year 1.5 mm derma roller from 2008, Infrared/Red LED from 2009, Galvanic/Ultrasound intermittent
Reginaphalange
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Fri May 29, 2015 1:46 pm      Reply with quote
Hi everyone I'm Toni, totally new to this site and the idea of derma rolling. I am 27 and recently noticed a lot of stretch marks under my bum and on my calves, I have had a few there for a long time but they were never this bad, I noticed a new one today that is purple . Anyway, I am not liking the whole thing and want to do something about so I am looking for advice, I have bought a 1mm roller and I have some bio oil and vitamin e oil, are those any good? My stretch marks are more like dents in the skin not purple or red in colour. Can I cover a few areas in one session? So roll my calves and under bum all in one go then re do again in a few weeks? Any advice will be great thank you
Lenamill
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Fri May 29, 2015 5:19 pm      Reply with quote
Hi all! Long-time lurker Smile Just want to say - haven't tried the derma-roller, still working up courage.
However re:cellulite/stretch marks, I had a surgery (laparotomy) in late March that left me with sagging belly skin. I've also been dealing with cellulite/stretch marks in the usual places. My little trifecta. Recently I started taking grapeseed extract (relatively high concentration of polyphenols) - it seems to help with the cellulite. Also a scoop of collagen hydrolysate mixed with vitamin C powder in water about 1/2 hours before meals, morning, noon and night. I have had a dramatic improvement over the past week and 1/2. Skin tightening up and stretch marks less and less visible. My surgical scar has been healing rapidly, still discolored but I can't feel any bump. Another thing - if you have a problem with cellulite, you absolutely must cut out all sugar (if you haven't yet).
Edit: Also, rosehip seed oil is a miracle for stretch marks. I bio oil in the past, but the rosehip oil works much better for me.
nycatlover
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Sat May 30, 2015 10:33 am      Reply with quote
Has anyone here derma roll with a mask (such as eminence ones) or face oil?
Gypsy_Red
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Sat May 30, 2015 10:39 am      Reply with quote
Lenamill wrote:
Hi all! Long-time lurker Smile Just want to say - haven't tried the derma-roller, still working up courage.
However re:cellulite/stretch marks, I had a surgery (laparotomy) in late March that left me with sagging belly skin. I've also been dealing with cellulite/stretch marks in the usual places. My little trifecta. Recently I started taking grapeseed extract (relatively high concentration of polyphenols) - it seems to help with the cellulite. Also a scoop of collagen hydrolysate mixed with vitamin C powder in water about 1/2 hours before meals, morning, noon and night. I have had a dramatic improvement over the past week and 1/2. Skin tightening up and stretch marks less and less visible. My surgical scar has been healing rapidly, still discolored but I can't feel any bump. Another thing - if you have a problem with cellulite, you absolutely must cut out all sugar (if you haven't yet).
Edit: Also, rosehip seed oil is a miracle for stretch marks. I bio oil in the past, but the rosehip oil works much better for me.


What brand of vitamin c powder are you using and how much per dose. Also, are you doing 1 tbsp of the collagen per dose, so it adds up to 3 tbsp a day?

Thanks
Pandax12
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Mon Jun 01, 2015 9:40 pm      Reply with quote
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/niptuckcoach/2015/06/01/microneedling-talk-with-dermal-needling-guru-dr-lance-setterfield
flipper
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Wed Jun 03, 2015 5:11 am      Reply with quote
it doesn't look like Vaughter Wellness (own doc) is selling Emla anymore. Where can I get it online without paying a fortune. Sarah had it for less than $10 if I recall.
wrinklefreeforever
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Wed Jun 17, 2015 10:43 pm      Reply with quote
HEY ALL - I GOT MY DERMINATOR TODAY!!

I am so excited to use it and will report back all my results. A little confused as to what to use before and after. I just ran out of my vitamin C serum and would love a recommendation for another one. Didn't really love the one I had. Also, looking for hyaluronic acid and vitamin A suggestions. What is the sequence of when to put which serum on? Everyone here has so much experience! Planning on doing my face and neck tomorrow!!!
wrinklefreeforever
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Wed Jun 17, 2015 10:53 pm      Reply with quote
LenaMill can you talk more about the grapeseed extract and how it's working for cellulite?
meldak
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Sat Jun 27, 2015 1:27 am      Reply with quote
with the kindest regards, which dermaroller should i buy? i need for acne scars, 1.5 mm. However, I don't know which one to purchase.
Oldfield
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Sat Jun 27, 2015 11:26 pm      Reply with quote
I always buy mine from Ebay, most of the time from Hong Kong sellers. They are a lot cheaper. I never had any bad experience.
meldak
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Sun Jun 28, 2015 4:13 am      Reply with quote
o okay. which one to be choose; the titanium or steel one?
Pandax12
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Sun Jun 28, 2015 7:43 am      Reply with quote
meldak wrote:
with the kindest regards, which dermaroller should i buy? i need for acne scars, 1.5 mm. However, I don't know which one to purchase.


Are you just using it for acne scars and not the rest of your face? In that case I would go with either a dermastamp and or single needle. Suction pump is another option. I assume you have read the PDF rolling instructions at owndoc.com
Great advice there on acne scars.
Pandax12
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Sun Jun 28, 2015 7:43 am      Reply with quote
meldak wrote:
with the kindest regards, which dermaroller should i buy? i need for acne scars, 1.5 mm. However, I don't know which one to purchase.


Are you just using it for acne scars and not the rest of your face? In that case I would go with either a dermastamp and or single needle. Suction pump is another option. I assume you have read the PDF rolling instructions at owndoc.com
Great advice there on acne scars.

http://dermaroller.owndoc.com/dermaroller-instructions.pdf

http://shop.owndoc.com/product-list.php?dermaneedling-pg1-cid48.html

I've bought most all my rollers on ebay. Never had a issue doing this.
meldak
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Mon Jun 29, 2015 11:36 am      Reply with quote
Pandax thank you for your reply. Owndoc does not ship to my country:(
hdevries
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Fri Jul 17, 2015 1:55 pm      Reply with quote
Is it absolutely necessary to use a serum or any other product in addition to dermarolling?

It all seems incredibly expensive so I'd like to know if it's worth it.
Pandax12
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Fri Jul 17, 2015 8:28 pm      Reply with quote
hdevries wrote:
Is it absolutely necessary to use a serum or any other product in addition to dermarolling?

It all seems incredibly expensive so I'd like to know if it's worth it.


Nope it is not essential to use serums and other products when dermarolling. These things can enhance the rolling results, especially during cosmetic rolls, but it's the rolling itself that is the "Bulldozer" if you will.

Dr. Setterfield explains it well here:

Cosmetic vs Medical Needling

Typically, dermal needling is divided into "Cosmetic" and "Medical" based on the length of needles (Cosmetic: less than 0.5 mm; Medical: 0.5 mm and greater), and the depth reached in the skin (see diagram page 4Cool. Cosmetic needling micro-injures the epidermis, and medical needling, the dermis. (Page 48 Concise Guide to Dermal Needling Expanded Medical Edition.)

There are two completely different pathways involved, both of which lead to increased collagen production.

A. The "cosmetic" pathway -- Initially it was believed that cosmetic needling only allowed greater absorption of products. However, keratinocyte injury triggers a cascade of cell-to-cell communication that leads to up-regulation of genes. This results in normal collagen production in the absence of inflammation, and the optimization of cellular function at a number of levels, both of which contribute to the anti-aging effect.

B. The "medical" pathway -- Injury at the dermal level triggers a completely different kind of cascade with platelets playing the predominant role. Platelets are like a first-aid kit containing growth factors and cytokines that are released at time of injury to facilitate repair. It is important to note that inflammation drives this process and when in excess, may lead to scar collagen or fibrosis. Thus, in the context of medical needling, best results are obtained by cancelling this negative effect through use of anti-inflammatory products and treatment modalities, such as LED.

I personally feel that a 1.0mm is the minimum length for medical rolls. I'm not 100% sold that 0.5mm is adequate but I could be wrong.
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