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Wed Apr 23, 2008 7:42 am  |
| stovetop wrote: |
I have just finished reading all the posts in this thread but am uncertain as to what age group KH seems to be effective with. Could someone please enlighten me? I am interested in ordering from one product line, shipping charges from multiple vendors could easily pay for more KH products. What products would be recommended for over 55 - with sagging, wrinkles and rosacea?  |
Stovetop,
I'd suggest you email JoElla as well and ask her recommendations. If you'd prefer, there is a good source of information regarding who should use what at the KH uk site. Look to the left hand side of the screen and click on knowledge. But honestly, as a former rep for KH, no one knows it like JoElla. Yogi has rosacea and I believe she's spoken with JoElla about this. |
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Wed Apr 23, 2008 7:52 am |
| mpstat wrote: |
I got KH products a week ago, and applied VK2 to my face at that time. My skin turned sore red, and I got lots of peeling similar to retin-a in the beginning and more severe. I did not think that I applied too much, but apparently I did. I have been waiting for my skin to get normal again, and going to apply it in super low amounts, and will proceed slowly. I believe that it should work well with this approach.
I also applied Sillouhette on my hands a couple of times and it was fine, no problems. |
mpstat.
Several questions for you. I assume you applied more than a pea sized amount? And did you layer your KH product with something else? |
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Recent Karin Herzog convert. |
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Wed Apr 23, 2008 8:09 am |
I definitely applied way more then pea size amount, so it is totally my fault that I did not follow the instruction exactly. I used C23, waited as I thought enough time, and applied VK2... a couple of mistakes here, but I am not upset about it at all, even opposite I am glad to know that KH works as intended. I use Vit C in the mornings, and going to use KH in the evenings on top of retin-a, or maybe alternate KH with retin-a in the evenings, and in very small amounts. I am positive it will be fine, and believe in oxygen power, just need to figure out the regimen  |
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Wed Apr 23, 2008 8:11 am |
| mpstat wrote: |
| I definitely applied way more then pea size amount, so it is totally my fault that I did not follow the instruction exactly. I used C23, waited as I thought enough time, and applied VK2... a couple of mistakes here, but I am not upset about it at all, even opposite I am glad to know that KH works as intended. I use Vit C in the mornings, and going to use KH in the evenings on top of retin-a, or maybe alternate KH with retin-a in the evenings, and in very small amounts. I am positive it will be fine, and believe in oxygen power, just need to figure out the regimen |
Ahhh. That makes sense. Good luck! |
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Recent Karin Herzog convert. |
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havana8
Moderator
 
Joined: 09 Sep 2005
Posts: 3449
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Wed Apr 23, 2008 10:53 am |
| mpstat wrote: |
| I definitely applied way more then pea size amount, so it is totally my fault that I did not follow the instruction exactly. I used C23, waited as I thought enough time, and applied VK2... a couple of mistakes here, but I am not upset about it at all, even opposite I am glad to know that KH works as intended. I use Vit C in the mornings, and going to use KH in the evenings on top of retin-a, or maybe alternate KH with retin-a in the evenings, and in very small amounts. I am positive it will be fine, and believe in oxygen power, just need to figure out the regimen |
mpstat, Cellbone aside, are you using KH in combination with anything else? |
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Wed Apr 23, 2008 11:54 am |
| havana8 - I have not used KH a lot yet, but going to use it along with camellia oil and maybe retin-a. I tried it a bit with camellia oil seemed to be OK. |
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Wed Apr 23, 2008 7:25 pm |
Sis, I just saw your post in the 302 thread. I'm glad you're loving the KH. I've a question for you. Had you finished your Booster prior to starting KH?
Riley, I was in the car peering at my face, rearview mirrors with the sunroof don't lie, and my nose freckles have faded quite a bit. A couple are getting hard to see. |
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Wed Apr 23, 2008 8:09 pm |
Hi Blues,
Yes, must admit the 302 has me intrigued. I like the simplicity concept and I really like when a product has been researched and developed more or less as a labor of love VS big companies and all their marketing and big bucks entering the picture.
That said, I am indeed loving KH. I've wanted to get away from heavy duty acids for a while. I did finish up the Booster and for me the biggest change was a texture change - something I hadn't gotten with other products. I ended it just in time to start the KH... perfect. Now what to do with the last of my C serum and the copper peptides. I plan to embrace the idea of rotating actives and avoiding acids (though I'm loving the fruit acid - AHA thing just like all of you).
I also just bought another jar of pumpkin mask from NCN at same time I got the KH and I will use it but once a week only. And I'm kicking back on my clarisonic to twice a week. JoElla actually recommended once a week - on Friday night she said for something special - and follow up with the essential mask.
I am using the VK2 and I love the profesional cleansing cream - what a terrific product. Some of the 302 cleansers look good too but I guess it's naughty to mix the 302 with other products. 
As far as future KH - I'm considering eye cream, and the cellulite duo - possibly the Apricot???? Waiting to hear Vit H reveiws also.
Thank you Blues for getting us all revved and lovin the KH.
Sis |
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Wed Apr 23, 2008 8:16 pm |
| sister sweets wrote: |
Hi Blues,
Yes, must admit the 302 has me intrigued. I like the simplicity concept and I really like when a product has been researched and developed more or less as a labor of love VS big companies and all their marketing and big bucks entering the picture.
That said, I am indeed loving KH. I've wanted to get away from heavy duty acids for a while. I did finish up the Booster and for me the biggest change was a texture change - something I hadn't gotten with other products. I ended it just in time to start the KH... perfect. Now what to do with the last of my C serum and the copper peptides. I plan to embrace the idea of rotating actives and avoiding acids (though I'm loving the fruit acid - AHA thing just like all of you).
I also just bought another jar of pumpkin mask from NCN at same time I got the KH and I will use it but once a week only. And I'm kicking back on my clarisonic to twice a week. JoElla actually recommended once a week - on Friday night she said for something special - and follow up with the essential mask.
I am using the VK2 and I love the profesional cleansing cream - what a terrific product. Some of the 302 cleansers look good too but I guess it's naughty to mix the 302 with other products.
As far as future KH - I'm considering eye cream, and the cellulite duo - possibly the Apricot???? Waiting to hear Vit H reveiws also.
Thank you Blues for getting us all revved and lovin the KH.
Sis |
Thanks Sis, for the update. I find the concept of the 302 interesting as well. I read some reviews on it at acne.org that scared me a little so that lemming is going away. I asked about the Booster because I realized today that both Mpstat and I had some peeling and I wondered if the Booster really intensified things enough to cause the peeling. I'm glad you're liking the KH and I agree that the cleanser is wonderful. Be careful with the NCN. You might want to not use your vk2 the night before. |
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Thu Apr 24, 2008 7:14 am |
That's great about the freckles, Blues.
I have a question for all. I notice some of you are talking about not using acids. Is that due to the thread on 302? I ask because, obviously, KH has AHA, which is acid, so I am a little confused and just wanted to clarify that for myself!
Today, I looked at my vertical lip lines in the mirror when I was driving. They looked almost like they had disappeared. Sadly, this, at least for now, was not permanent because when I got home, they were back. I am going to take a pic this weekend, which will be end of week 2 for me, just to see if I can see any difference. Anyway, that was just so thrilling even for a short time to see my verticals fade, because nothing has been able to fade them yet! |
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Thu Apr 24, 2008 10:17 am |
| rileygirl wrote: |
That's great about the freckles, Blues.
I have a question for all. I notice some of you are talking about not using acids. Is that due to the thread on 302? I ask because, obviously, KH has AHA, which is acid, so I am a little confused and just wanted to clarify that for myself!
Today, I looked at my vertical lip lines in the mirror when I was driving. They looked almost like they had disappeared. Sadly, this, at least for now, was not permanent because when I got home, they were back. I am going to take a pic this weekend, which will be end of week 2 for me, just to see in if I can see any difference. Anyway, that was just so thrilling even for a short time to see my verticals fade, because nothing has been able to fade them yet! |
Riley, I decided to try KH because I wanted something without peptides and acids. The 302 thread had nothing to do with my decision. I am going to hold out on the AHA cream and see what happens. I'll add it in a few days a week if needed. However, I'm testing the Vita A a few days a week and find it very soothing. I want to see what others say first about the 302. I went back and looked at some older threads and see others purchased it but no one has come forward to say anything. Additionally, like I told Sis, there were some scary reviews at acne.org. A friend of mine who had used 302 found the following message at a site where she had purchased 302 in the past. I've copied the message below.
We are discontinuing the 302 skincare line because they are no longer allowing customers to sell their products online. This is simply a way for them to keep their prices higher for patients who cannot compare prices online. We don't agree with that policy. I apologize. |
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Thu Apr 24, 2008 10:45 am |
| Thanks, Blues. I understand! |
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Thu Apr 24, 2008 12:40 pm |
| BluesHeart wrote: |
Additionally, like I told Sis, there were some scary reviews at acne.org. A friend of mine who had used 302 found the following message at a site where she had purchased 302 in the past. I've copied the message below.
We are discontinuing the 302 skincare line because they are no longer allowing customers to sell their products online. This is simply a way for them to keep their prices higher for patients who cannot compare prices online. We don't agree with that policy. I apologize. |
Hi Blues Heart,
I have to clarify something. It is true 302 is actively trying to shut down online sales. But the real reason (which Dr Huber told me) is that they want clients to go through an esthetician first. When you have online sales, you can pretty much buy anything you want and thats great for convenience. But they are worried people will not buy the correct products or follow directions. They realize how expensive it is, and want you to be sure you are getting the right products. The estheticians who carry the line have to attend training seminars. You can consult with one of their estheticians for free. It is a powerful line of products. They sell wholesale to estheticians, who in turn set their own prices. If you want to compare prices, you can still call different estheticians.
Yes there are alot of horror stories on acne.org. Alot of them from people desperate to find the miracle cure for scarring. But if you don't follow directions, it may be counterproductive and cause more problems (see my original note). You have to follow directions and be observant about what is going on with your skin. And maybe some weren't following directions or patient enough. Who knows. No skincare product works the same for everybody. So you have keep all that in mind. I posted on acne.org originally and I encountered so much hostility and negatism, I just left. I was very scared the same thing would happen here. But I knew this audience was much more educated and open minded. So sorry I hijacked your thread. I just had to tell you what the real reason was for them stopping online sales. |
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Thu Apr 24, 2008 12:52 pm |
| boski wrote: |
| BluesHeart wrote: |
Additionally, like I told Sis, there were some scary reviews at acne.org. A friend of mine who had used 302 found the following message at a site where she had purchased 302 in the past. I've copied the message below.
We are discontinuing the 302 skincare line because they are no longer allowing customers to sell their products online. This is simply a way for them to keep their prices higher for patients who cannot compare prices online. We don't agree with that policy. I apologize. |
Hi Blues Heart,
I have to clarify something. It is true 302 is actively trying to shut down online sales. But the real reason (which Dr Huber told me) is that they want clients to go through an esthetician first. When you have online sales, you can pretty much buy anything you want and thats great for convenience. But they are worried people will not buy the correct products or follow directions. They realize how expensive it is, and want you to be sure you are getting the right products. The estheticians who carry the line have to attend training seminars. You can consult with one of their estheticians for free. It is a powerful line of products. They sell wholesale to estheticians, who in turn set their own prices. If you want to compare prices, you can still call different estheticians.
Yes there are alot of horror stories on acne.org. Alot of them from people desperate to find the miracle cure for scarring. But if you don't follow directions, it may be counterproductive and cause more problems (see my original note). You have to follow directions and be observant about what is going on with your skin. And maybe some weren't following directions or patient enough. Who knows. No skincare product works the same for everybody. So you have keep all that in mind. I posted on acne.org originally and I encountered so much hostility and negatism, I just left. I was very scared the same thing would happen here. But I knew this audience was much more educated and open minded. So sorry I hijacked your thread. I just had to tell you what the real reason was for them stopping online sales. |
Thanks Boski, I didn't want to stick this in your thread. I understand where you're coming from but the reviews turned me off. I'll wait to hear from Moncia34 and others who've purchased. Thanks again. |
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Thu Apr 24, 2008 1:20 pm |
Totally understandable. But keep in mind the audience at Acne.org is much younger, sometimes less mature, and generally less informed about how skin works.
If you want some real interesting reading, read the original thread. There are several other threads too about 302. All old threads. 302 just seems to stir up controversy when it is mentioned. But anti-aging was not why these people were using 302, they were expecting reduction in scarring, which is a much more difficult issue to address. Eventually, I think people got scared of posting anything positive. So you don't see any posts after 2005 or 2006. I just got fed up with having to defend myself. This is where I first heard about 302 myself. You will find my posts sprinkled in there as nancypick.
http://www.acne.org/messageboard/index.php?showtopic=39987&hl=302+drops |
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Thu Apr 24, 2008 1:30 pm |
| boski wrote: |
Totally understandable. But keep in mind the audience at Acne.org is much younger, sometimes less mature, and generally less informed about how skin works.
If you want some real interesting reading, read the original thread. There are several other threads too about 302. All old threads. 302 just seems to stir up controversy when it is mentioned. But anti-aging was not why these people were using 302, they were expecting reduction in scarring, which is a much more difficult issue to address. Eventually, I think people got scared of posting anything positive. So you don't see any posts after 2005 or 2006. I just got fed up with having to defend myself. This is where I first heard about 302 myself. You will find my posts sprinkled in there as nancypick.
http://www.acne.org/messageboard/index.php?showt
opic=39987&hl=302+drops |
Thanks Boski, I went and looked at the forum you mentioned earlier and didn't find much. Luckily for me, I've no acne issues nor do I have scarring. If I did, I'd maybe be more apt to try it. As with most skincare, reading directions and following them will do wonders, LOL. I think I'm going to follow Septembergirl's progress with her eyes and see what happens. I believe there is a trend towards gentler skincare thus the interest in products such as Osmosis, *though, not sure I understand his use of the retinols with his theory*, 302, KH, ect. Here at EDS, before one can purchase certain lines you have to call one of the EDS estheticians, is that what 302 is attempting to do? Do you know how Monica fared with 302? Thanks again! |
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Thu Apr 24, 2008 2:16 pm |
They are not shutting down the websites that carry 302, just the shopping carts. You will notice some sites will not show prices but do list what they carry, so you are forced to call first (Spa sole and Ellens Place are like that).
Yes, they just want everybody to call a trained esthetician before purchasing to discuss their skin issues and establish a relationship, so if the client encounters problems, they can "hand hold" them and give them possible solutions.
I was reading my old posts on acne.org for the first time in a couple years. I forgot I had just started KH when I found 302...and it seems I used the 2 lines together. How ironic! I even broke some rules in the beginning... I'm not perfect either 
I haven't heard from Monica in a long time. I didn't know she was on 302. |
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Thu Apr 24, 2008 2:31 pm |
Blues,
I will be careful with NCN peel - I know it can be a doozy. I have eliminated all other acids from my daily routine.
I plan on following September girls progress with the eye derum from 302 also.
I did read quite a bit of the acne forum - clicked in with what Boski sent. This was the 2005 version and there were a lot of happy people - like Boski herself - that reported in. There were also numerous comments about it being very good for anti-aging - some comments were that it was more targeted to help anti-agin.
I do see a trend here in less use of acids and similar products.
I have only used acids since late last summer and started feeling like they weren't susch a good thing over the long haul. This is when I started researching.
I do think exfoliation has a definite place - just not everyday. Like JoElla says - our faces are different everyday and you need to decide what your face needs on each day by how it looks and feels.
I'd like to find a vit C that is more acceptable in the non-acid protocol. Anyone have any suggestions? I know Blues is looking too. |
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Thu Apr 24, 2008 3:00 pm |
| boski wrote: |
They are not shutting down the websites that carry 302, just the shopping carts. You will notice some sites will not show prices but do list what they carry, so you are forced to call first (Spa sole and Ellens Place are like that).
Yes, they just want everybody to call a trained esthetician before purchasing to discuss their skin issues and establish a relationship, so if the client encounters problems, they can "hand hold" them and give them possible solutions.
I was reading my old posts on acne.org for the first time in a couple years. I forgot I had just started KH when I found 302...and it seems I used the 2 lines together. How ironic! I even broke some rules in the beginning... I'm not perfect either
I haven't heard from Monica in a long time. I didn't know she was on 302. |
Hi Boski,
Yes, I saw the post where you were using the Vita Kombi 3 on your scarring. Interesting. |
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Thu Apr 24, 2008 6:53 pm |
Yes, I saw that post. I thought 302 should not be mixed with other lines. Or maybe this is a new theory with the line???
It seems that a few years ago mixing was not considered as taboo. |
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Thu Apr 24, 2008 7:04 pm |
| sister sweets wrote: |
Yes, I saw that post. I thought 302 should not be mixed with other lines. Or maybe this is a new theory with the line???
It seems that a few years ago mixing was not considered as taboo. |
From what I understood from boski's post was that she cheated a little. I'm wondering if Dr Huber has had to switch things up a little. Or maybe he means no acid based lines. The more I read the more confused I get. I was under the impression that he believes peptides to be no no's but yet his eye serum contains peptides.
To get back on track, I'm going to go use the devine cleanser and do my nightly ritual. Essential mask for me tonight. |
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Thu Apr 24, 2008 7:10 pm |
| sister sweets wrote: |
Yes, I saw that post. I thought 302 should not be mixed with other lines. Or maybe this is a new theory with the line???
It seems that a few years ago mixing was not considered as taboo. |
Yeah, I think they have learned alot since that experience with Acne.org. Now, they are more insistent on not using other lines, at least when you first start. At that time 3 years ago, I was unfamiliar with the 302 line and wanted to stick with with I was using too (just like you do now). When I realized that this 302 stuff actually was doing something, I decided to streamline my routine and stopped KH. I didn't really like the scent of their creams and I was afraid of it clogging my skin, being so oily. But it's a great line, just not for me. |
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Thu Apr 24, 2008 8:06 pm |
Boski,
Thank you for your honest interest in skin health - I know you are really rooting for the best for all of us. I am intrigued with this line - I won't lie to you. I've been in contact with a woman from Avanya MMU and she swears by it too.
I am enjoying the KH line - and I was shocked that I can use the professional cleanser on my oily skin. It feels marvelous - but then it's working for me so of course I like it.
All that said - I have a little disappointment over the thought that I should not add anything from 302 - would love to use the cleanser and probably the C drops to start - alternating with my VKombi2. But if it's not going to work - why bother spending the money and the time? I also am considering using my KH for a few months and then switching over to 302 for a time and seeing what that brings. I've always switched around in the past and my face is still here 
Final thing - if KH is not based on acids and neither is 302 I wonder what the conflict is? Really?
For the time being I'm still in the baby stages of KH and really loving it more than any line I've used thus far. Who would've thought I'd stop with the acids and the CP's? |
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Thu Apr 24, 2008 8:20 pm |
| sister sweets wrote: |
Boski,
Thank you for your honest interest in skin health - I know you are really rooting for the best for all of us. I am intrigued with this line - I won't lie to you. I've been in contact with a woman from Avanya MMU and she swears by it too.
I am enjoying the KH line - and I was shocked that I can use the professional cleanser on my oily skin. It feels marvelous - but then it's working for me so of course I like it.
All that said - I have a little disappointment over the thought that I should not add anything from 302 - would love to use the cleanser and probably the C drops to start - alternating with my VKombi2. But if it's not going to work - why bother spending the money and the time? I also am considering using my KH for a few months and then switching over to 302 for a time and seeing what that brings. I've always switched around in the past and my face is still here
Final thing - if KH is not based on acids and neither is 302 I wonder what the conflict is? Really?
For the time being I'm still in the baby stages of KH and really loving it more than any line I've used thus far. Who would've thought I'd stop with the acids and the CP's? |
I was going to hold off on this, Sis but a friend of mine here at EDS who doesn't post much has been in contact with a spa, recommended by the 302 people. The spa also sells KH. She told my friend that she recommended three months on with KH and then three with 302. My friend has written another spa and is awaiting they're recommendation. She wants to compare what they say. So that is an option for you. I'm going to sit on this because I want some questions answered first regarding the use of the eo's and the peptides. Let us know what you decide and I'll let you know my friend finds out. |
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