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Fri Apr 11, 2008 12:59 pm  |
| I am so upset that my ultimate, holy grail, three times a year wrinkle treatment may be dangerous. Have any of you heard about the latest rat studies. The toxin (in rats) has been shown to migrate to certain areas in the brain. Such areas have somthing to do with long term memory and spatial movements. I am just sick about this. The toxin used in the study wasn't exactly like botox and rats do not necessarily transpose to humans. (at least that what the doctors and Allergan say). I hope that MONKEY studies in the future can refute this! In the meantime, are you guys going to curtail your Botox treatments until new info comes out? Or will your vanity win out? |
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Fri Apr 11, 2008 4:26 pm |
| I am really on the fence about this one!I havent had botox for 7 mos but was thinking about doing it for crows feet on left eye,it works great there....now I am afraid to do anything.DDT was used to spray mattresses before they knew the long term effects.I am wondering what the effects of botox might be in the future(same with cell phones too-now they think they cause brain tumors 10 yrs down the road) |
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Fri Apr 11, 2008 8:04 pm |
| belledivine67 wrote: |
| I am so upset that my ultimate, holy grail, three times a year wrinkle treatment may be dangerous. Have any of you heard about the latest rat studies. |
Why so surprised? Poison always poses a danger! |
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♥I'm flattered by all the lovely PM's, but I don't get here much these days. Please don't be afraid to post your quearies to other DIY members who will be glad to help you (or sell you their wares..lol) Still happy with LED, dermarolling and a DIY antioxidant regime. Peace & Hugs to all.♥ |
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Fri Apr 11, 2008 10:12 pm |
eww..you want them to KILL MORE animals just cuz your skin is aging  ... |
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Sat Apr 12, 2008 8:36 am |
| I haven't done botox in about 6 months. I'd rather not get it done again but I hate the frown lines worse.... I've used frownies in the past and they work somewhat. |
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Sat Apr 12, 2008 8:54 am |
Having just had my 11's redone (and also my hubby)I choose to continue. I haven't had any issues and I have been doing them, although sparingly, for about 5 years now. I've done my crows feet once and forhead once, but my main concern is the 11's and that it helps my migraines.
I know tons of people who do and some uses are now approved for children. Who knows what the future will tell, whether I was right or wrong, but I am making my choice and not being forced to do it, so I cannot go back and blame anyone else but me. And I am more than willing to be that test subject rather than have an animal do it for me, I can make a conscious choice to do it or not.
It's not just a vanity thing for me as the 11's aren't THAT bad, but it sure helps those migraines. I haven't had one in 5 years.
It's a very personal and controversial choice. |
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Joined the 50 club several years back, blonde w/ fair/sensitive skin, Texas humidity and prone to rosacea, light breakouts and sunburns, combo skin type, starting to see sundamage and fine lines |
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mlitz80
New Member
 
Joined: 27 Mar 2008
Posts: 6
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Sat Apr 12, 2008 9:02 am |
| post removed by moderator for self promotion |
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Sat Apr 12, 2008 9:07 am |
| It is a hard decision. I absolutely love the effect it has on my crows feet and horizontal forehead lines. I have a very small, expressive face and botox is the only thing that truly erases the wrinkles. In about two months, I will have to make a decision. Hopefully new research will come out quickly to assuage my fears! You know that the doctors / pharaceautical companies are probably on the edges of their seats. Botox, after all, is what starts most people on cosmetic procedures. |
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Sat Apr 12, 2008 9:47 am |
| And think how MANY people use it, and not just for cosmetic reasons. TMJ and jaw problems, chronic sweating on feet, hands and underarms, voice loss, and the list goes on. It would have MAJOR ramifications if it was proven to be adverse. Good luck on your decision and I certainly understand your dilemma. |
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Joined the 50 club several years back, blonde w/ fair/sensitive skin, Texas humidity and prone to rosacea, light breakouts and sunburns, combo skin type, starting to see sundamage and fine lines |
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Sat Apr 12, 2008 11:46 am |
I have never had Botox but found the new research upsetting. Has any of your doctors stopped injecting Botox until further studies are done? Doctors and the company that makes Botox stand to lose a lot of money.
There were times I thought of having Botox on my forehead. Somehow the thought always scared me. |
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As I am getting older I realize my biggest beauty secret is smile more and frown less. Be aware that wrinkles do not make a person unattractive. Cynicism, unforgiveness, anger and jealousy are the real culprits. Sixty something  |
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Sat Apr 12, 2008 12:48 pm |
eww..you want them to KILL MORE animals just cuz your skin is aging Sad...
I AGREE!!!!
i wont use emu oil because of that same fact - not sure if the birds are actually killed for the oil - but still enough of a turn-off |
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Sat Apr 12, 2008 12:56 pm |
| belledivine67 wrote: |
| Hopefully new research will come out quickly to assuage my fears! |
It's too big of a money maker for the industry, to not find a way out to assuage peoples fears.
While your waiting for the new research, why don't you do a little googling of your own for; 'Botox' + 'side effects' + 'deaths' + 'photos'... Tons of horror stories abound on the net. It would be a shame for these people to have there stories and or deaths ignored, while botox recipients + people thinking about it, wait with bated breath, for yet more 'animal' studies. (I won't even get started on what and how animal studies are performed. It's truly a disgrace!)
For those who want justification for having it done, I'm sure some will be forthcoming. It's like most things I guess, if we wait long enough, eventually someone will say what we want to hear.
Some things in life are just down right dangerous, but we ignore the dangers, because the pleasures they afford us, seem to outweigh the risks......Until it's too late! Playing Russian Roulette to often, will sooner or later claim a victim.. And that goes for lots of things, certainly not just Botox. The risks for Botox side effects are on the low end of the spectrum. But lets face it, poison can't be a good thing right?
I apologize if anybody is offended or put off by anything I said. It is only my humble opinion. I would enjoy hearing the arguments "pro" Botox as well. |
_________________
♥I'm flattered by all the lovely PM's, but I don't get here much these days. Please don't be afraid to post your quearies to other DIY members who will be glad to help you (or sell you their wares..lol) Still happy with LED, dermarolling and a DIY antioxidant regime. Peace & Hugs to all.♥ |
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Sat Apr 12, 2008 1:09 pm |
I, for one, am not waiting for more animal studies as I feel like they are doing their trials on me. I guess I feel as far as pro botox goes it's a personal choice. I don't do it often or very much.
I called my derm and put this question to him (close personal friend as well) as he and his wife, a nutritionist, run their med spa. He said there have been no bulletins run and they are the leading injectors in this area. He injects himself and his daughter and wife and felt if it wasn't safe he would not inject them. Now that said, there are warnings against just about everything these days, so buyer beware. We could scare ourselves off most things! |
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Joined the 50 club several years back, blonde w/ fair/sensitive skin, Texas humidity and prone to rosacea, light breakouts and sunburns, combo skin type, starting to see sundamage and fine lines |
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Sun Apr 13, 2008 1:15 am |
| I know...this information is shocking. I also read about Botox causing even deaths. I've never actually had Botox done, but as the years pass by, I have definitely found myself considering having it done. Now I know the answer and it is a big NO! Too scary. |
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Sun Apr 13, 2008 7:06 am |
Seriously guys, think about Frownies. I use them every nite and they work really well on my forehead lines. They are only faintly noticeable (to me anyway). Most of my friends couldn't even notice the lines anymore on me. It may have you look strange for the evening, but worth all the effort and worry about long term effects about a potential toxin that we still do not know enough about.
I use them every nite, but after one month you only have to use them 3-4 nites a week. The only reason I have to use them every nite is because I have UNUSUALLY STRONG forehead muscles that wrinkle up at the slightest facial expression. |
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Sun Apr 13, 2008 10:41 am |
| For those of you who have done Botox - do you see some weakening of the muscles with longer term use of the Botox? I've heard that it can actually decrease the strength of the muscle over time - maybe weakening from lack of use or just the effects of the Botox decreasing the ability of the muscle to contract and wrinkle the face. |
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Sun Apr 13, 2008 10:55 am |
| sister sweets wrote: |
| For those of you who have done Botox - do you see some weakening of the muscles with longer term use of the Botox? I've heard that it can actually decrease the strength of the muscle over time - maybe weakening from lack of use or just the effects of the Botox decreasing the ability of the muscle to contract and wrinkle the face. |
My Doctor has said that the muscles become weaker over time from lack of use. Just as an arm or leg muscle would become weaker if not used. |
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Sun Apr 13, 2008 2:40 pm |
| I find that I can go longer in between botox on my 11"s and use less each time. The reason is that you retrain the muscle when you don't use it as well, so it retrains it to relax. |
_________________
Joined the 50 club several years back, blonde w/ fair/sensitive skin, Texas humidity and prone to rosacea, light breakouts and sunburns, combo skin type, starting to see sundamage and fine lines |
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Sun Apr 13, 2008 4:48 pm |
| Errr.....over 40,000 people a yr die from taking OTC aspirin, noone is rushing to ban that or even beginning to freak about that,thats a LOT more deaths than from botox. |
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Sun Apr 13, 2008 6:36 pm |
I have used Botox for 2 years, and the results have been fantastic. Unfortunately, I am somewhat resistant and it takes roughly 70 units (at a 2.5 dilution) to impact my glabella, eyes, and forehead. Because I require a ton of Botox, I will probably look at some additional options that may help me decrease my Botox usage (but probably not eliminate it completely).
I don't want to get off topic, but for those throwing rocks at Botox, one must also keep in mind that lots of things discussed on this site are not as safe as they seem.
Ex: Hyaluronic Acid is said to overwet skin cells, and possibly promote growth and spread of cancer cells. (I had a link, but am not allowed to post it)
Quotes from Dr. Pickart at the Skin Biology forum since I can't post links to any of this for some very stupid reason:
"Hyaluronic acid wets the outer skin proteins. Your skin will look better but age faster like the old night creams on "I Love Lucy". The outer skin proteins protect the skin. If they are too wet, they become less protective, then bacteria and viruses enter the skin and produce more spots and blemsishes.
Also the outer skin proteins must be fairly dry. The dryness is the signal for the skin to send new keratinocytes to the skin's surface. This speeds the removal of older skin."
"Hyaluronic acid does not cause cancer but does speed the spread of cancers. The patients using hyaluronic acid implants is the same group that become at risk for cancer because of their age. Also, when hyaluronic acid is applied to the skin as a "moisturizer", it wets the skin and degrades the skin barrier. This make it easier for bacteria and viruses to enter the skin.
Keeping the outer layers of the skin wet results in a slowing of skin renewal and speeds aging. New keratinocytes are sent to the surface in response to dryness in the outer skin layers."
My takeaway from all of this? We're all going to die anyway, so I may make some choices that make me a little happier during this short life. Yes, I may have a few less brain cells when I get older due to Botox, but if it blunts how horrid old age is, I may be ok with that, lol. |
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Sun Apr 13, 2008 7:20 pm |
I hear ya bethany...
I justified my smoking habit for 40 plus years, and so far got away with it.
Life is all about choices..Some are good, and some not so much.. Hopefully none of us will have those 'bad' choices, come back to bite us in the 'booty'. |
_________________
♥I'm flattered by all the lovely PM's, but I don't get here much these days. Please don't be afraid to post your quearies to other DIY members who will be glad to help you (or sell you their wares..lol) Still happy with LED, dermarolling and a DIY antioxidant regime. Peace & Hugs to all.♥ |
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Sun Apr 13, 2008 7:30 pm |
 thats pretty funny bethany! I have to say that NOTHING nails crows feet like botox! Creams do not really do anything, maybe soften a little but they are still definitely there. Honestly botox makes an amazing difference in some people, it works great on my crows feet but does not last long....only about 6 weeks so I have a hard time justifying the cost....I only do it now for special occasions....It does however make you feel better and give you more self confidence and makes you a little happier because you look good...... |
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Sun Apr 13, 2008 7:39 pm |
My sister spends a FORTUNE on laser treatments every 3-4 months in NYC at one of the "dermatologists to the stars"...they have made virtually no difference in her skin over 5 years. But when she got Botox, I said "Finally!! Something that actually works, and boy, does it work well!!" (and I got some, lol)
And once you actually try it, it is REALLY hard to imagine not continuing with it...it is THAT good!
And no, it's not cheap...but neither are all the potions that everyone here buys, either! |
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Sun Apr 13, 2008 8:02 pm |
| yes I have had a lot of laser treatments=$$$$ down the drain, total waste. Botox does rock...its important to ask what the cost pr unit is, not the cost pr area.the cost pr unit can range from 9 to $14 or more.I do love it I admit it! |
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Sun Apr 13, 2008 8:15 pm |
I currently pay $12/unit.
You also want to go to a doctor that is part of the Botox Rewards program since you get $25 towards each visit...that adds up over time! |
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