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Fri Apr 25, 2008 6:01 am  |
| I wrote to the same esthetician as Bethany and received a fairly simple, short answer to my question as well. I did end up ordering through her though simply because it was the one site I found that I could order everything online without having to have a phone consultation first. I had done so much research on my own and talked with boski enough that I felt comfortable with my product choices already. However, in all fairness, I see Dr. Huber's point. If I didn't have boski and my own nerdy need to research products throroughly I could easily buy the wrong products for my needs through online shopping. I do wish he'd approve of an email consultation though (like many ladies do with JoElla for Osmosis or Karin Herzog). I'm always concerned with phone consultations that I'm going to get talked into buying extra products if I get a sales oriented (rather than customer satisfaction oriented) esthetician. I am comfortable with Dr. Huber's intentions based on boski's opinion of him but I doubt he has the time to keep a close eye on every representative that sells his products. I was a bit disappointed in the short response I got from the online esthetician although her recommendations were in line with what the 302 site recommended for my skin issues. |
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32 years old, combination skin, working on lots of age-related changes (fine lines, dull skin, hyperpigmentation) since I hit the big 3-0. Loving the 302 line. |
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Fri Apr 25, 2008 6:58 am |
| BBD wrote: |
| Hmmm. I'm a medical writer and I write about cosmetic procedures (injectable fillers, usually) as well as drugs. Boski, tell the good doctor that you know an award-winning medical writer who will help him edit his book in exchange for products and consultation! |
What an offer!! I will certainly pass that along to him. PM me with your email and I'll get him in touch with you. |
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Fri Apr 25, 2008 7:21 am |
I really don't think it's a marketing ploy to get people to buy their products. They are making it more difficult to buy their products, and they don't advertise at all. It's all word of mouth. I believe they just want to have more control of the situation so people don't get into a situation where they make things worse and then start badmouthing the products. For example, if you totally ignore all the precautions and protocols on the website, go buy the strongest products in their line (the super serum and lightening drops for example) and start slathering it on day and night, every day, you ARE going to get irritated and dry even without acid use. It's all a matter of educating yourself and then you can decide on a course of action in partnership with the esthetician.
The place that mamawalnut bought from seems like she is not complying with company policy and still using shopping carts with prices. Don't know how much longer she will be able to do that. Because they will eventually stop supplying her.
They have a money-back guarantee I found out, if you are not satisfied for any reason, you can return the product for refund (less shipping). I didn't see this before, but it's on their website:
http://302skincare.com/consumer_faq.html |
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Fri Apr 25, 2008 7:31 am |
| leeleedeedee wrote: |
| Perhaps we are jumping the gun buy thinking that it is just a marketing ploy when the website says their products should not be used with any others. We haven't yet got a definitive answer as to why they should be used on their own but it doesn't mean that their isn't a very plausable answer. |
I don't believe it is a marketing "ploy" in this instance. I consider it more of a marketing "strategy," based on the goal of maximizing customer results in the shortest period of time (which is a much more ethical approach than a ploy). And that ultimately drives increased revenues for them (which may actually be their secondary goal).
I think their intentions are definitely very good. |
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No longer answering PM's due to numerous weird messages. |
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Fri Apr 25, 2008 7:43 am |
| Bethany.....got your point. All of this info on 302 skin care came at the right time for me because I was looking around for some new skin care products. I don't have anything to "use up" as I have used up all that I have. That's why I jumped in and purchased some of the 302 products. It's always good to be careful and research and ask a lot of questions. I was very inpulsive this time. I hope I don't regret that. |
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Fri Apr 25, 2008 7:57 am |
| boski wrote: |
The place that mamawalnut bought from seems like she is not complying with company policy and still using shopping carts with prices. Don't know how much longer she will be able to do that. Because they will eventually stop supplying her.
They have a money-back guarantee I found out, if you are not satisfied for any reason, you can return the product for refund (less shipping). I didn't see this before, but it's on their website:
http://302skincare.com/consumer_faq.html |
I agree that the website I ordered from is probably not in compliance with the 302 policy, especially since after searching online it was the only site I found that I could order the 302 drops without calling first. It was posted on another thread how OCMed quit selling 302 late last year after the company put a stop to their online sales without consultations. I have a feeling this site will have to change their ways at some point. And I guess I'll have to get ready to use the phone to place any future orders. 
ETA: I see how people can debate the two sides of making 302 only available after an esthetician consultation (beneficial for sales vs beneficial for customers' results) but for me the main point for me is whether these products work or not. That is the reason I love this forum - honest, unbiased opinions from real users. Boski's results and my search for an effective non-acid line are what convinced me to give it a try. |
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32 years old, combination skin, working on lots of age-related changes (fine lines, dull skin, hyperpigmentation) since I hit the big 3-0. Loving the 302 line. |
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Fri Apr 25, 2008 8:14 am |
I have communicated with Dr. Huber himself, and asked about using outside products along with the 302 line. My understanding is that as long as they are non-acid and non-inflammatory (i.e. no peptides, no acids, no growth factors, etc.), it is fine...but that any active should not be used daily. I was also told that infrequent use of tazorac or other non-acid retinoids are acceptable. Not retin-A, however. I do think one should just use 302 alone first, to wean the skin off of irritants, etc. prior to reintroducing outside products.
I was NOT told this, but my best guess would be that using acids or irritating topicals along with 302 may be damaging to the skin because the 302 molecule (named for its size) can indeed penetrate the upper layers of the skin, and perhaps there is a risk of the 302 bringing other acids and other topical irritants that one may be be using too deep into the skin as well. Again, just my hypothesis. |
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Fri Apr 25, 2008 8:43 am |
Love the fact they have a money back guarantee if you arent happy with the products, not so loving the fact I need a phone consultation, when I'm in the UK and they arent!
agree an email consultation/questionaire thing would be more convenient..
But it's a small point, after all.  |
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Fri Apr 25, 2008 12:03 pm |
| Question: Has anyone used the 302 drops or serum around the eye area? I see that they have an eye product but it does not contain the avocatin 302 that these products have. |
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havana8
Moderator
 
Joined: 09 Sep 2005
Posts: 3449
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Fri Apr 25, 2008 12:41 pm |
| lilredhead wrote: |
| Question: Has anyone used the 302 drops or serum around the eye area? I see that they have an eye product but it does not contain the avocatin 302 that these products have. |
In the expanded ingredient listings posted on Spa Solé's website there is something called avocado glycerides although that doesn't sound the same as the patented Avocatin 302 (avogen™)...
Ingredients as posted on 302: Extracts from certified organic plants: german chamomile, rosemary, lemon balm, lavender and green tea; rice peptides, fibronectin, glycerine, mixed silicones, prepolymer 2, cellulose polymer, urea, vanilla extract, methylisothiazolinone, mint extract
Ingredients as posted on Spa Solé: Certified organic, aqueous extracts of salvia sclarea (clary sage), rosemarinus officinalis (rosemary), citrus nobilis/lavandula intermedia (mandarin lavender), lippia citriodora (lemon verbena); avocado glycerides, phyto-squalane, certified kosher glycerine, ppg-12/smdi copolymer (polyolprepolymer 2), cetyl hydroxycellulose, ammonium acrylate, urea. stearyldimoniumhydroxypropyl laurylglucosides chloride, lavender oil, tangerine oil, peppermint oil, disodium EDTA |
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Fri Apr 25, 2008 12:47 pm |
That is something that has me totally baffled. Different sites listing different ingredients for these products. Maybe someone who has the eye stuff can tell us what the ingredients are and if it has the avocatin 302 in it. I'd still like to know if you can use the other stuff around the eyes though. The ingredient lists I've found for all of the products vary by seller.  |
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havana8
Moderator
Joined: 09 Sep 2005
Posts: 3449
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Fri Apr 25, 2008 12:53 pm |
updating what I posted earlier with Spa Solé's listings…
A-boost
Ingredients as posted on 302: Phyto-lipids of avocado, organic jojoba oil, retinyl palmitate, retinol, camphor tangerine and mint extracts
Ingredients as posted on Spa Solé: Deionized Water, Vitamin A Ester, Squalane, Capric Triglycerides, Cetearyl Alcohol, Lauryl PEG/PPG-18/18 Methicone, Cetearyl Methicone, Dimethicone, PPG-12/SMDI Copolymer, Ceteareth-20, Polysorbate 60, Hydroxycellulose, Methyldibromo Glutaronitrile
C-boost
Ingredients as posted on 302: Phyto-lipids of avocado, organic jojoba oil, tetrahexyldecylascorbate, tangerine oil, camphor, lavender oil and mint extract
Ingredients as posted on Spa Solé: Deionized Water, Vitamin C Ester, Squalane, Capric Triglycerides, Cetearyl Alcohol, Lauryl PEG/PPG-18/18 Methicone, Cetearyl Methicone, Dimethicone, PPG-12/SMDI Copolymer, Ceteareth-20, Polysorbate 60, Hydroxycellulose, Methyldibromo Glutaronitrile |
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Fri Apr 25, 2008 12:53 pm |
| Me three! |
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Recent Karin Herzog convert. |
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Fri Apr 25, 2008 1:56 pm |
| On the 302 website it says that the eye serum contains: short chain rice peptides, amino acid fibronectin and urea along with Avocatin 302. And, that is why I purchased this product.I don't think I would have if I did not specifically read this on their website re the eye serum. |
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Fri Apr 25, 2008 3:55 pm |
Curiosity got the best of me and I went into the Lisa Bradley salon in San Francisco. I talked to her awhile about the line and she said it can be used with other products as long as they aren't acidic. She said that alot of customers of hers that fly alot use this line.
She only carries certain products and was told by the company recently that they are adding some new moisturizers.
It is a totally different approach to skincare. It is all about thickening the skin especially the older you get. |
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Fri Apr 25, 2008 4:05 pm |
| cookie wrote: |
Curiosity got the best of me and I went into the Lisa Bradley salon in San Francisco. I talked to her awhile about the line and she said it can be used with other products as long as they aren't acidic. She said that alot of customers of hers that fly alot use this line.
She only carries certain products and was told by the company recently that they are adding some new moisturizers.
It is a totally different approach to skincare. It is all about thickening the skin especially the older you get. |
I know you, Cookie. You were smoking that cc again, weren't you? What did you try? Did she explain why she only carries certain items? |
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Recent Karin Herzog convert. |
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Fri Apr 25, 2008 4:15 pm |
Damn it Blues, my CC is on serious fire. I bought the cleanser, serum and C-boost. She carries these certain products and feels they are the necessary ones in the line.
normal to dry cleanser
calming mist
302 serum
A-boost
C-boost
the beauty bar
body moisturizer which she says flies out of there.
She game me a sample of her own moisturizer to try over the drops but said that any can be used as long as it doesn't have acids. I have the Vita-a- apricot and that does. She also said to alternate every day with the serum and drops and didn't seem concerned about starting immediately.
She has been in the business for a long time and is really impressed with this line. I REALLY didn't want to hear that. I have absolutely NO willpower!!!!!!!!!! |
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Fri Apr 25, 2008 4:18 pm |
It is Lisa Bradbury salon not
Bradley for anyone that live in San Francisco. |
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Fri Apr 25, 2008 4:25 pm |
| MBGirl wrote: |
I have communicated with Dr. Huber himself, and asked about using outside products along with the 302 line. My understanding is that as long as they are non-acid and non-inflammatory (i.e. no peptides, no acids, no growth factors, etc.), it is fine...but that any active should not be used daily. I was also told that infrequent use of tazorac or other non-acid retinoids are acceptable. Not retin-A, however. I do think one should just use 302 alone first, to wean the skin off of irritants, etc. prior to reintroducing outside products.
I was NOT told this, but my best guess would be that using acids or irritating topicals along with 302 may be damaging to the skin because the 302 molecule (named for its size) can indeed penetrate the upper layers of the skin, and perhaps there is a risk of the 302 bringing other acids and other topical irritants that one may be be using too deep into the skin as well. Again, just my hypothesis. |
Now this is the kind of info I was looking for! And it also shows that the company is open to sharing info...a very good thing.
But I can't give up my Retin A now....I just bought 6 new tubes from Mexico!!! 
Drat. |
_________________
No longer answering PM's due to numerous weird messages. |
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havana8
Moderator
Joined: 09 Sep 2005
Posts: 3449
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Fri Apr 25, 2008 5:01 pm |
| cookie wrote: |
Damn it Blues, my CC is on serious fire. I bought the cleanser, serum and C-boost. She carries these certain products and feels they are the necessary ones in the line.
normal to dry cleanser
calming mist
302 serum
A-boost
C-boost
the beauty bar
body moisturizer which she says flies out of there.
She game me a sample of her own moisturizer to try over the drops but said that any can be used as long as it doesn't have acids. I have the Vita-a- apricot and that does. She also said to alternate every day with the serum and drops and didn't seem concerned about starting immediately.
She has been in the business for a long time and is really impressed with this line. I REALLY didn't want to hear that. I have absolutely NO willpower!!!!!!!!!! |
Cookie, so she uses the products herself? How did her complexion look? |
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Fri Apr 25, 2008 5:03 pm |
Cookie,
I'll be anxiously waiting to hear what you're results are with the C boost. Did she recommend how to use these with KH? |
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Recent Karin Herzog convert. |
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Fri Apr 25, 2008 9:44 pm |
Hi Cookie,
this is the news I've been waiting for - incorporating the 302 with KH. Knew it had to be okay if done in the right way. thanks. SIS. |
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Fri Apr 25, 2008 10:12 pm |
| leeleedeedee wrote: |
| On the 302 website it says that the eye serum contains: short chain rice peptides, amino acid fibronectin and urea along with Avocatin 302. And, that is why I purchased this product.I don't think I would have if I did not specifically read this on their website re the eye serum. |
On the 302 website it states under the eye products mechanisms section that "avocatin 302 provides sustainable protein synthesis" but when you refer to the ingredients list on this site as well as all of the other sites the ingredient itself is not listed in the eye product.
This is the source of my confusion. I am wondering if the eye product is simply meant to enhance the other products in the eye area.
However, the serum and drops seem to contain a number of irritants. So could any of you folks tell me if you have been using the 302 serum or drops under the eye area. And if it can be used comfortably?
My eye area seems to be where I need the most help, but I dont want a case of conjuctivitis or anything!!
Any help would be appreciated.
Leeleedeedee, do you still have your original package for the eye product as maybe the avocatin 302 is listed on it and the website simply made an error in omitting it? Oh bugger me and my inquisitive mind, nothing is ever simple for me!!!!!  |
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Fri Apr 25, 2008 10:25 pm |
| Lilredhead - inquiring minds want to know. |
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Fri Apr 25, 2008 11:58 pm |
| One of the ingredients in the eye product is methylisothiazolinone and there are numerous opinions of this ingredient as to whether it should be used on the skin. Some have said it can contribute to nerve damage and most refer to it being an ingredient in household cleaning products to prevent bacteria. Does anyone know any positive info on this ingredient? |
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Skin: Over 60, ex combination now sensitive, Cellcosmet |
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