Anti-Aging LightStim
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Fri Jan 02, 2009 4:16 pm

I checked Skinbiology's site and Loren Pickart stated that if you use a red LED light after copper peptides it increases the uptake in the skin up to 30 times (blue lights up to 39 times)
I've using CPs with my light stim and it seems to be helping to start tighten up the skin some. I've using CPs on my body alone without this happening. I lost 90 + lbs about 10 years ago.
But it is a damned time consuming process. I haven't been working out since I've been using the light stim on my body this way. Darn!

free skin care · Fri Jan 02, 2009 8:34 pm

That's interesting. I would have thought the green colouring would have been too occlusive for the light to properly penetrate. I thought that (with the BQ at any rate) anything applied to the skin before use had to be clear or at least very light.

free skin care · Fri Jan 02, 2009 11:38 pm

I don't know a thing about Copper Peptides, but I do know that the light will not penetrate anything occlusive, i.e. mineral oil, petrolatum, silicones etc.. If Dr P made that statement, I'd feel comfortable in that his products must not contain anything occlusive.

I alternate my LED treatments on bare, clean skin or sometimes with a homemade watery serum slapped together with one of my favorite oils and perhaps a few added vitamins. I don't use anything with preservatives in conjunction with the LED, and basically keep preservatives to a minimum always.

I wholeheartedly believe applying *beneficial* topicals 30 minutes prior to an LED treatment, will intensify the results, and push those products much deeper into the skin.

Fri Jan 02, 2009 11:38 pm

I'm using the super serum which is dark but it's just the peptide water and a little acid. I'm using a dime sized drop for one area-- arms, breasts, lower abdominal area. I cover the area with a few drops of squalene and I let it soak in-- to further force the copper peptides into my skin.The initial results are promising, but the time it takes is a pain in the butt. I'll update on results. The skin on the triceps is firmer than before and I've been only doing it for 3 weeks. I wish I took initial pictures, but I only took pictures of my face and my hands before using the AALS

Fri Jan 02, 2009 11:46 pm

GHK-Cu into human skin using a Fanz Cell. The experimental LED device was made by Photomedix.

The light was at a wavelength of 450 nanometers which is blue light.

The result is the 24 hour skin uptake (Value plus SD = standard deviation)

Here's one of the posts. I can't find the other.

Lindylass

Control GHK-Cu 139 (SD 1 Cool

nanograms per cm square skin area

GHK-Cu and Pulsed LED Light - 4726 (SD 997) nanometers per cm square skin area.

So, the light system increased GHK-Cu uptake into the skin by 39 fold.

However, we are receiving a number of reports from clinics and spas that regular red LED lights give great results when used after CP Serum, Super CP serum, or Folligen Solution.
This message has been edited. Last edited by: Dr. Pickart, 17 December 2008 08:11 PM

Sat Jan 03, 2009 12:04 am

Posted 11 December 2008 06:34 PM Hide Post
I have seen data on GHK-Cu and pulsed red light.

It increased GHK-Cu uptake about 30-fold.

The red lights are low energy wavelengths and should be safe.

free skin care · Sat Jan 03, 2009 3:27 am

Lindylass....how long have you been using the CP's with the Stim before you noticed anything happening on your face? I do have CP serum, but only use it a few times a week although I haven't used it with the Stim, maybe I will give that a try. I always worry about the "uglies" with CP and have been careful even to dilute my serum which I believe is the weakest of the CP family....

free skin care · Sat Jan 03, 2009 12:28 pm

While all this interesting info is emerging, I'll stop using up my CPs for my feet (which are ugly to begin with) and hold onto them for a little longer. The only thing I noticed when applying Supercop x 2 to my face was an increase in the size of pores next to my nose. Perhaps that's because they didn't penetrate deep enough. So I'll give it another go. Aaah this forum! Where else to find such brilliant minds, similar obsessions, and feelings of "excited hope"?

Sat Jan 03, 2009 1:22 pm

I can't use even the weakest of the CP serums on my face because it makes my eczema worse--I get inflammation lines and red itchy patches-- the uglies. And that's without the lightstim INCREASING the uptake of the CP. But my body skin doesn't have that problem--it's thicker and more resilent, so I can use the super serum. The places that the tightening is becoming obvious is the crepy areas like the the triceps, and the area that bulges over the bra strap right under the arms and the sides of my breasts and lower abdominal area. The skin is thicker and less crepey. No visible changes on my butt, but the skin on my hips appears tighter as well.

free skin care · Sat Jan 03, 2009 1:55 pm

Lindy, did I interpret that correctly? You have been using CPs on the skin covering the triceps area and in three weeks you have seen results? That's amazing and I'm copper peptide-green with envy. I used the weakest version on my arms and had to take codeine. I did this for about six weeks. Fortunately, I don't have any addictive reactions to codeine. Laughing

I didn't see any difference at all. I was also using in on the skin of my inner arms (where it hurt the most). That's where I really need help. Dr. Pickart had never heard of this reaction before and suggested it might be something other than the CPs, but I had the same problem, lesser degree of pain with a Neo-Strata peptide product.

Sat Jan 03, 2009 3:36 pm

Yes, I'm seeing decent results in a short period of time. Years ago, I used copper peptides on my body for about 6 months and I had negligible results, but using it in conjuntion with my light stim is making all the difference in the world. I don't know if I can afford to spend a couple of hours with the light stim a day though. It is such a waste of time but I've wanted to something about my skin since I took off the 90 lbs. Its a shame that your arms can't tolerate it. My face is the same way. If I mix 5 drops of the weakest serum and spread it around my face and neck I get itchy red patches that won't go away. So my face it's just the AALS alone. Stoney from the Skinbiology forum is also using an LED with CPs and she says it's generating collagen galore for her as well. I'm not sure if we are just good responders, but it makes up for the hypersensitive reactions I have to a variety of different products. But I can use this way only for my body. For my face I mostly want to control eczema with just the AALS.

free skin care · Sat Jan 03, 2009 4:09 pm

Last time I ordered from Nanci at NCN she sent me a little sample bottle of CP Serum...

I'm assuming it's the weakest, but how would I know. It just says "Dr. Loren Pickart's CP Serum"

Now you guys have me wanting to give it a try with my red/infrared LS, but I don't have a clue how to use it... Can I just mix a couple of drops with distilled water?

Heaven knows, I don't need any more 'uglies' going on ... Rolling Eyes

Sat Jan 03, 2009 4:38 pm

CP serum is the weaker serum. Then there is super cp serum. Standard starting dose for the face is 4 drops but if the lightstim is increasing the uptake 30 fold, you might try 2 or 3 drops mixed with a little water no more than every other day just to start with to see what happens. If you have no adverse reaction you can increase the amount you use and the amount of days. Pickart recommends for people with sensitive skin to use a biological oil like squalene/emu before cps to slow the uptake. If you want to increase the uptake put on the serum and then put a few drops of a biological oil over it to push it in to your skin. I wish I could use it on my face too. Sad

free skin care · Sat Jan 03, 2009 4:46 pm

I can answer some questions about CPs for you. I've been using them for 10 months and can rave about the results I've had from CPs (along w/ Retin A/BHA for exfoliation & better penetration of the CPs).

I've been following the roller and (more recently) LED threads to see if those products can enhance my results of the CPs.

I've already experienced tightening and reduction of crepey skin along w/ diminishing of pore size w/ the products I use.

kassy - follow lindylass's advice about diluting the CPs w/ H2O until you get use to it. I started out diluting mine w a ratio of 1 drop CP to 7 drops water and increasing the CPs every 2 wks until I was use to them. I did not experience the uglies w/ this method. I would be a good idea to do this w/ the LEDs until you can use CPS full strength.

lindylass - you might want to try the GHK Serum. I used it on my eyes and just loved it. It showed great results and had a very nice feel to it. It is the gentlest of the CPs and is the one they used in the studies.

free skin care · Sat Jan 03, 2009 4:49 pm

I just wanted to add that (since having followed somewhat siliently, the LED and roller threads), that I have bought and used a few times - the 1.5 roller.

I am trying to figure out which LED to buy next.

free skin care · Sat Jan 03, 2009 5:34 pm

Hi Everyone - I've been using CP's for about 18 months- first the regular CP serum for about 9 months and then the super CP serum for about 9 months. I have also been using the AALS for 11 months now. I don't know if it was the CP's or the AALS that made my cheeks fuller and the skin on my neck thicker or the combination, but it works! I have been reading the SkinBiology forum for well over a year and they highly recommended CP's with red/infrared LED's.
Have had no adverse effects. I am now 57 and
have a nice glow and even tone - just the sagging starting in. Feel free to use CP's and
the LED lights - it works. PS - Also reduces
hyperpigmentation. Happy New Year - DiPhx

free skin care · Sat Jan 03, 2009 5:58 pm

Thanks "All" for the CP info and advice..

I think I'm going to give it a go starting tomorrow night..

I'll start with "foxe's" advice of 1 drop CP Serum to 7 drops water..

Now all I'm wondering is if I should use the original LS (red/infrared) or the AALS (amber/red/infrared).......Or maybe I'll alternate with both ... hmm

!

free skin care · Sat Jan 03, 2009 7:10 pm

Kassy - I wuold continue to use the AALS -both will really get the collagen going! DiPhx

free skin care · Sat Jan 03, 2009 7:20 pm

Wow!! Things are getting exciting over here!! ha ha....

Sorry Lindylass, I thought you were using the Stim and CP's on your face..its the body you are using them on with results..that is great!! Oh lord, if I start Stim'ing my whole body that might take all day!! Laughing

Well, I am going to give the CP serum and the Stim a try on my face. I have been using at least 9 drops of CP diluted with water since the get go...ooops!! I didn't realize that you were supposed to start off with only a few...I guess I should count myself fortunate I didn't get a bad case of the uglies, but then again, I only use it a few days a week and have been doing so for a few months.

free skin care · Sat Jan 03, 2009 11:33 pm

Kassy (or anyone else who wants to try the CPs). I read so much info here about CPs before I took the plunge that I decided to take the conservative route. You may not need to go as slow as I did, but if you want to avoid any irritations (ie: uglies), slower is better.

Here's my routine I used, you may adjust as needed:

Week 1: 7 drops H2O to 1 drop CP
Week 3: 6 drops H2O:2 drops CP
Week 5: 5 drops H2O:3 drops CP
Week 7: 4 drops H2O:4 drops CP
Week 9: 3 drops H2O:5 drops CP
Week10: 2 drops H2O:6 drops CP
Week12: 1 drop H2O:7 drops CP
Week14: 8 drops CP

This is a very conservative route. I did not see any uglies unless I tried to speed it up a bit. When I moved up to the Super CP Serum, I diluted again, but used the regular CP Serum like the water (7 drops CP Serum to 1 drop Super CP). This stuff is strong, so go slow.

I really want to buy a LED for the benefits w/ the CPs. Which one, I don't know..... It is nice to hear of the results that Dr. P has said the LED gives to them.

free skin care · Sat Jan 03, 2009 11:38 pm

bren - if you've used 9 drops of CPs (diluted) from the get-go, then you don't need to back off of that. You're a lucky one to not see any uglies, tho. You can probably start to dilute it less and less if you've had no problems. When you've used the CP Serum undiluted for a while, you may consider moving up in strength (Super CP is the next step up from CP Serum). The serums are the best ones to use w/ the LEDs since they are a watery base and absorb quickly (10 mins or less).

free skin care · Sun Jan 04, 2009 12:02 am

foxe wrote:

Here's my routine I used, you may adjust as needed:

Week 1: 7 drops H2O to 1 drop CP
Week 3: 6 drops H2O:2 drops CP
Week 5: 5 drops H2O:3 drops CP
Week 7: 4 drops H2O:4 drops CP
Week 9: 3 drops H2O:5 drops CP
Week10: 2 drops H2O:6 drops CP
Week12: 1 drop H2O:7 drops CP
Week14: 8 drops CP

This is a very conservative route.

I really want to buy a LED for the benefits w/ the CPs. Which one, I don't know..... It is nice to hear of the results that Dr. P has said the LED gives to them.

This is exactly what I needed to know foxe, thank you!

If all goes well, and I last through week 14 without ill effect, do I move up to the next level of CP strength, using the same drop system all over again? (I'm being very optomistic aren't I .. Rolling Eyes

)

I'm going to start it tomorrow night, and will report here weekly. Chances are I will only use the LED 3 times per week though.

I have one more question, if anyone can help.. Since I have both the Original and AALS's, I am willing to do a test to see if one works better than the other with CP's...I'd rather not test it on my face though, but can CP's be used on the hands?

Sun Jan 04, 2009 2:37 am

Kassy, do you know if the AALS will thicken the epidermis?

Kassy, do you know if the AALS will rebuild a damaged/nonexistent epidermis?

The epidermis contains no collagen or fibroblasts.

Many thanks!

free skin care · Sun Jan 04, 2009 4:24 am

Foxe...thanks for the input. Yeah, I have to say I am lucky about the uglies. Scary thought I could have had them and I don't think I would have handled that very well... I have such absorbent/dry skin I don't think one or two drops of CP diluted with water would cover one cheek!
So, is it ok to use the CP serum with the Stim every day or should I only use the CP with the Stim a few times a week? I am still on the daily mode with the Stim as I have only been using it since Dec 20th. I use a retinol (Green Cream) at night, so this would mean I would have to change my routine a bit and use the and Stim during the day to accommodate my CP....

free skin care · Sun Jan 04, 2009 9:02 am

Kassy_A wrote:

I have one more question, if anyone can help.. Since I have both the Original and AALS's, I am willing to do a test to see if one works better than the other with CP's...I'd rather not test it on my face though, but can CP's be used on the hands?

Yes, CP's can be used on hands. Some people have used it to tighten up their belly skin when going through weight loss. If I ever lose these darn extra pounds, I'd like to try it on my upper arm "wings".

I used regular CP serum on my hands, and it made no difference (as opposed to making my face glow at one point). So then I tried Super CP serum on my hands. I suppose it was working, as a large scar on the back of my hand started to itch a bit. I gave all my CP serums to my poor brother, who suffers from severe psoriasis, and so I had to discontinue use before I saw results on hands.

You do need to exfoliate, though, since CP's work by bringing the damaged skin to the surface. I'm not sure what would be best for that on the hands. I was using Exfol serum, which was probably too mild.

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