Pls advise on order of use
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free skin care · Wed Jun 25, 2008 3:35 am

Please can someone advise whether the following regime is the best ‘order of use’ considering the products I am using?

AM

Cleanse/Tone
Skinceuticals CE Ferulic
Oil of Olay Definity
Moisturiser (currently using drugstore brand but on lookout for appropriate replacement)
LRP Fluide Extreme

PM
DDF Cleanser
DDF Toner
Emu oil
Oil of Olay Definity
Cellex C New Skin Complex/Decleor Baume Essential

Would it be benefical to use the C serum in the evening as well? Could I use either emu oil or camellia oil on top of the c serum before the moisturiser?

Thank you so much, I really appreciate your help. Very Happy

free skin care · Wed Jun 25, 2008 11:14 am

Hi Nikita, it looks like you're using things in the right order. You don't have to use the CE Ferulic at night too, it's only meant to be used once a day - in the morning.

free skin care · Wed Jun 25, 2008 11:46 am

right, it is sufficient to use vit.C once a day. And here are some more tips that I`ve learned on this forum:

you shouldn`t apply vit.C on wet skin or it can oxidize vit.C, so there is 10 min waiting time after cleansing. You skin should be completely dry.
Also leave at least 10 minutes for vit.C to absorb, before applying anything else.

free skin care · Wed Jun 25, 2008 2:00 pm

Hi Nikita, A good rule of thumb to remember is to apply "thin to thick"... So it would be;

Serums -
Lotions -
Creams -

Let each absorb well before applying the next. I'd also add that the "Olay" product you mentioned is a moisturizer as well, so you can skip an additional one there..

Also keep in mind that piling more and more on, isn't necessarily better. Keep it simple with good quality products. And unless you really feel you 'need' the toner, I would omit that, and get yourself a microfiber cloth instead.

You chose really nice products BTW.... Wink

free skin care · Wed Jun 25, 2008 2:58 pm

Hi all...thanks so much for your replies! I only started the regime described above yesterday (!!) as I just received my order of the CE Ferlic and Definity. I had scanned the forum trying to select the best products for my skin, I hope I have made the right choices!

Today I def did apply too many layers, which then meant my sunscreen didnt absorb well and I had a white cast all day. I think I will skip the moisturiser tomorrow, its just on the definity instructions it says to follow with a moisturiser and as I have fairly dry skin I thought it best not to skip it. However, the CE Ferulic seems to be quite moisturising as well so I dont think I will lose out if I skip that step in the morning.

Thanks for the tip about wet skin and waiting before applying c serum. Im in such a rush in the morning its easy to forget and not wait before applying each stage.

Just one last thing, on the days I choose not to use definity, could I use either emu or camellia oil on top of the vit c serum instead?

Thanks again for all your help, its really appreciated Very Happy

free skin care · Wed Jun 25, 2008 3:31 pm

Nikita wrote:

Thanks for the tip about wet skin and waiting before applying c serum. Im in such a rush in the morning its easy to forget and not wait before applying each stage.

Nikita, vit.C requires at least 10 min waiting time after applying as well. So: cleansing - 10 min - vit.C - 10 min (minimum) - anything else

it should be Ok to use emu or other oil on top of vit.C as long as you wait for it be absorbed. As far as I know, when vit.C is absorbed, it sinks completely into skin and you are free to use whatever you want (with the exception of copper peptides though).

free skin care · Wed Jun 25, 2008 3:48 pm

Hi, Nikita.
After cleansing, I apply my vit C serum, wait 10-15 minutes, and then apply emu oil (mixed with some HA serum or SKB to make it sink right in), and sunscreen when required.

Emu oil is an excellent moisturizer. I think it's unnecessary to apply a moisturizer on top. I agree with Kassy - there's no need to layer different moisturizers.

I have now learnt from Aiva that I should wait 10 minutes between cleansing and applying vit C serum, and will do my best to follow this advice from tomorrow morning. Smile

free skin care · Wed Jun 25, 2008 3:51 pm

Ok got that..10 minutes before and 10 minutes after! Which I have to get up 20 minutes earlier!! Shock

Thank you guys:)

free skin care · Wed Jun 25, 2008 4:34 pm

That's a good call to skip the moisturizer step. My sunscreen is definitely enough of a moisturizer.

Nikita wrote:

Hi all...thanks so much for your replies! I only started the regime described above yesterday (!!) as I just received my order of the CE Ferlic and Definity. I had scanned the forum trying to select the best products for my skin, I hope I have made the right choices!

Today I def did apply too many layers, which then meant my sunscreen didnt absorb well and I had a white cast all day. I think I will skip the moisturiser tomorrow, its just on the definity instructions it says to follow with a moisturiser and as I have fairly dry skin I thought it best not to skip it. However, the CE Ferulic seems to be quite moisturising as well so I dont think I will lose out if I skip that step in the morning.

Thanks for the tip about wet skin and waiting before applying c serum. Im in such a rush in the morning its easy to forget and not wait before applying each stage.

Just one last thing, on the days I choose not to use definity, could I use either emu or camellia oil on top of the vit c serum instead?

Thanks again for all your help, its really appreciated Very Happy

free skin care · Wed Jun 25, 2008 6:44 pm

Thanks for the tip about waiting after cleansing for the Vit C, Aiva. I knew to wait after but not before...

free skin care · Wed Jun 25, 2008 8:09 pm

Your AM routine looks VERY good Nikita! We almost have the same regimen (except I use Oil of Olay Total Effects, although I would use definity if it wasnt fragranced). For the Vitamin C (L-ascorbic acid) it would actually be ideal to wait around 20-30 minutes (I think thats why Aiva said at least 10 min) if possible bc the ascorbic acid needs to be unionized (needs a ph of 3.5 to penetrate the skin). Although sometimes its not practical of course, but if your not rushed in the morning its best to wait a little longer. I only do longer than 20 minutes when I don't have any place to be, other than that its usually 10-20 minutes. Just something to keep in mind...

Also, ascorbic acid stays in your skin for up to 72 hours so technically you wouldnt have to use a C serum everyday, if you perhaps wanted to save some money.

Have you ever considered using a retinoid in the evening??? It's THE most effective anti-aging treatment available (rebuilds collagen and elastin). Order of importance usu goes 1) sunscreen 2)retinoid 3)antioxidants...

free skin care · Thu Jun 26, 2008 3:08 am

Using definity with LRP fluide extreme does not work. Two days in a row I have ended up with a very visible white cast which then balls up and rubs off. It's not nice. Yet when I used my normal moisturiser under the LRP it was fine. So I think I will have to leave the definity till the evening.

Septembergirl thanks for the tip about mixing the oil, but I dont have any of the products you mentioned so will have to look into that!

Ocean, thank you for your advise about the retinoid. I havent ever used one before, but would like to incorporate it into my routine. Are there any you recommend? Though I am 35 I have fairly good skin, no lines or wrinkles as yet, just a few pale freckles. My skin can be quite dry though, and I do get the very occasional spot.

You guys are brill, thanks for all your help!

free skin care · Thu Jun 26, 2008 3:24 am

Septembergirl wrote:

I have now learnt from Aiva that I should wait 10 minutes between cleansing and applying vit C serum, and will do my best to follow this advice from tomorrow morning. Smile

I don`t think these 10 min between cleansing & vit.C are very strict, they are here just to ensure that your skin is completely dry when you apply your vit.C
good luck! Very Happy

free skin care · Thu Jun 26, 2008 4:19 am

as for the 10 min after vit.C, yes, this is at least. Ocean is right ( hi, Ocean wave

), 20-30 min waiting will be the best.
but who has half an hour in the morning? Embarassed

free skin care · Thu Jun 26, 2008 5:50 am

I'm pretty sure that oils should go on after creams. So your emu oil should be applied last. Also, emu oil is a "pusher" - it pushes other products into the skin.

free skin care · Fri Jun 27, 2008 4:56 pm

Quote:

Ocean, thank you for your advise about the retinoid. I havent ever used one before, but would like to incorporate it into my routine. Are there any you recommend? Though I am 35 I have fairly good skin, no lines or wrinkles as yet, just a few pale freckles. My skin can be quite dry though, and I do get the very occasional spot.

Sorry for the late reply Nikita, I use Renova as my retinoid bc its less irritating due to the emolient base. However I am definitely going to switch to a generic retinoid or Retin-A bc Renova is not covered by insurance and cost around $180!!! Prescription retinoid is definitely the best choice. You should probably start off with a .025% tretinoin (the active ingredient) retinoid. It takes a while for the skin to adjust. The different brands of retinoids all have the same active ingredient tretinoin they only differ in the base (ie more moisturizing cream, a gel base etc). There are synthetic retinoids that are equivalent to tretinoin like Tazorac or Avage, but are more irritating and do not activate all the receptors in the skin like tretinoin.

The best OTC product would probably be Avene Diacneal, it has retinaldehyde and glycolic acid. It is stronger than retinol and gives similar results to rx retinoids. So you could always start with this or a regular OTC retinol product to get your skin used to retinoids.

With a retinoid in your routine at night, plus the other products you are using: vitamin C and other antioxidants (CE Ferulic), one of the best sunscreens (LRP), and moisturizer like olay definity with niacinamde, i think you have the perfect regimen.

***forgot to mention that you can get retinoid w/o a prescription online, thats where most people get them***

free skin care · Sat Jun 28, 2008 1:04 am

Hi Ocean thanks again for your reply. You have such a wealth of knowledge!
Ive searched a bit on google and all I can find about retinoid is with the treatment of acne. It all sounds bit scary to use!
Also, being in the UK it will most probably be much more difficult to obtain, but I will need to spend a bit more time researching it.

I am sure the benefits of its use are numerous, but could you just give me an overview of what it is used for, even if you dont have acne?

Thanks again. Smile

free skin care · Sat Jun 28, 2008 1:10 am

Just looked on the skinceuticals site, they do a 0.5% product:
http://www.skinceuticals.co.uk/retinol.html

Would that be a good one to start with, or is it too strong?

free skin care · Sat Jun 28, 2008 4:09 am

Nikita wrote:

Just looked on the skinceuticals site, they do a 0.5% product:
http://www.skinceuticals.co.uk/retinol.html

Would that be a good one to start with, or is it too strong?

I think this is a great retinol product to start with. Smile

free skin care · Sat Jun 28, 2008 6:29 am

My sister is in India right now and can get the retinol for me, apparently she asked in the chemist and can get both a .025% and .050% with the active ingredient tretinoin in them. They are very cheap, approx. £1 for a 25ml tube. I have asked her to buy some for me.

So how would I go about using these? Am I right in thinking that I would start off with 2/3 days per week and then build up to daily use, using it for 6 weeks on and 6 weeks off? I already use Cellex C's new skin complex which I believe has AHA's in it. Is this (tretinoin) product safe to use on such a regular basis?

Would an appropriate PM regime with tretinoin in be:

Cleanse
Emu Oil
tretinoin
moisturiser (but then is it ok to use any night cream with tretinoin?)

Thanks for your help:)

free skin care · Sat Jun 28, 2008 7:00 am

Nikita wrote:

My sister is in India right now and can get the retinol for me, apparently she asked in the chemist and can get both a .025% and .050% with the active ingredient tretinoin in them. They are very cheap, approx. £1 for a 25ml tube. I have asked her to buy some for me.

So how would I go about using these? Am I right in thinking that I would start off with 2/3 days per week and then build up to daily use, using it for 6 weeks on and 6 weeks off? I already use Cellex C's new skin complex which I believe has AHA's in it. Is this (tretinoin) product safe to use on such a regular basis?

Would an appropriate PM regime with tretinoin in be:

Cleanse
Emu Oil
tretinoin
moisturiser (but then is it ok to use any night cream with tretinoin?)

Thanks for your help:)

The tretinoin products have better scientific backing for their efficiency than OTC retinol products.

I recently bought several tubes of 0.025 and 0.050 % tretinoin gels from an Indian online pharmacy. I have started with the weakest solution and use it 2 - 3 times a week and will gradually build up to everyday use. You can use it without breaks. I have never heard that it's necessary to take six weeks off.

Tretinoin must be applied on cleansed skin (no emu oil). Preferably, tretinoin should be used on its own without a moisturizer on top. I believe you can use a moisturizer or emu oil on top if your skin gets very dry.

Personally, I would have skipped the glycolic acid product, since tretinoin is an exfoliating agent.

HTH. Smile

free skin care · Sat Jun 28, 2008 7:04 am

Nikita wrote:

My sister is in India right now and can get the retinol for me, apparently she asked in the chemist and can get both a .025% and .050% with the active ingredient tretinoin in them. They are very cheap, approx. £1 for a 25ml tube. I have asked her to buy some for me.

So how would I go about using these? Am I right in thinking that I would start off with 2/3 days per week and then build up to daily use, using it for 6 weeks on and 6 weeks off? I already use Cellex C's new skin complex which I believe has AHA's in it. Is this (tretinoin) product safe to use on such a regular basis?

Would an appropriate PM regime with tretinoin in be:

Cleanse
Emu Oil
tretinoin
moisturiser (but then is it ok to use any night cream with tretinoin?)

Thanks for your help:)

Start off with the 0.25% every other day and see how your skin reacts. Your routine should be:

Cleanse - wait 30mins
Tretinoin
Moisturiser - not really needed if you are using emu oil. But if you must, don't use one with AHA's at the same time as Retin-A.
Emu oil

6 weeks on/6weeks off is fine if you want to give your skin a rest. Many people however, use Retin-A on a daily basis long term - I do, and have had no problems.

free skin care · Sat Jun 28, 2008 7:10 am

Aiva wrote:

as for the 10 min after vit.C, yes, this is at least. Ocean is right ( hi, Ocean wave

), 20-30 min waiting will be the best.
but who has half an hour in the morning? Embarassed

I know I don't! When I start using a vitamin C serum, I'll be using it at night. I wouldn't want to be layering too much product in the morning anyway.

free skin care · Sat Jun 28, 2008 9:55 am

Thanks for your replies. My skin is quite dry, I suffer from eczema on my elbow, though not on my face. Even when I put the emu oil on my skin does feel dry, which is why I think that the tretinoin will be too drying for me on its own. Would Olay definity be ok to use?

And once I do build up to daily use, do I have to use it every single night or is it okay to take break from it? I read about the 6 week cycle somewhere on another forum, something about 6 weeks of retinA and then 6 weeks of AHA, maybe Ive got it wrong.

So as long as I use the tretinoin first, and then wait for a while before applying emu oil/moisturiser thats ok?

free skin care · Sat Jun 28, 2008 10:06 am

I have never heard of 6 weeks on/6 weeks off tretinoin cycle. Either never heard of alternating tretinoin with AHA. why should you? tretinoid is a very strong exfoliant and people have enough peeling from it. What will be beneficial is some mild scrub to take away the peeling skin if you will have such.

As far as I know tretinoin should be used 2-3 nights a week at first, then every other night, then every night for a year or so. After 1 or 1.5 year you can switch to maintenance, using it 2-3 times a week.

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