My "method" and "theory" of using BP and
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free skin care · Tue Jul 15, 2008 8:05 pm

So, for the last couple days I have been performing a small test, to see if I can prove a theory. So here is how it goes. I get small red bumps, they can appear and disappear in a matter of hours. It almost appears sort of like a rash, but they are a blemish of some sort, I just don't know how they come and go so quickly..so at night I have been applying my retinol night cream (Neutrogena) and letting sit for 20 minutes. Then I apply my Tazorac cream, only on the areas that I would normally get blemishes. I let that be for 20 minutes, then I apply my BP spot treatment (clean & clear Persa Gel) I have been doing this for two nights now, both mornings I wake up, I have NO red dots, NONE...no breakouts. So I have been told, that I am not suppose to mix Tazorac and BP products, they cancel each other out. I am not so sure that is the case anymore. What I find is happening, my skin is not dry because the taz is keeping it oily enough but yet the BP is drying out the source. I am going to keep continuing this, but I was wondering if anyone had any theories on this?

free skin care · Tue Jul 15, 2008 8:13 pm

I got those "24" hour spots on tazorac/retinoic acid as well.

I think..and this is just a theory, that retinoic acid causes an anti-inflammatory response in the skin, and that can weaken the immune system as well...

The reason I say this is because I tend to have very allergenic skin when I am using retinoic acid, the only other time I get a reaction like this is if I am in a house with like...4 cats.

Taking a benadryl will clear up the "24" hour spots for me, so I don't really think they are acne...just something like hives.

free skin care · Tue Jul 15, 2008 11:27 pm

Quote:

I got those "24" hour spots on tazorac/retinoic acid as well.

I think..and this is just a theory, that retinoic acid causes an anti-inflammatory response in the skin, and that can weaken the immune system as well...

The reason I say this is because I tend to have very allergenic skin when I am using retinoic acid, the only other time I get a reaction like this is if I am in a house with like...4 cats.

Taking a benadryl will clear up the "24" hour spots for me, so I don't really think they are acne...just something like hives.

I definitely agree, my skin is already sensitive but I believe retinoic acid does make it more sensitive to allergies. For example if I don't go outside then no problems, but when I play tennis/run etc outside then I'll have random red patches.

To increase skin resistance I've been using products with niacinamide and barrier repair triglycerides, cholesterol, fatty acids etc to strengthen the skin barrier and has really helped. I actually don't experience it much anymore.

free skin care · Wed Jul 16, 2008 2:57 pm

Ocean 14, you peaked my curiosity...sounds like you have skin like me. I don't understand the random red bumps (small be it) but how can they come and go in just a matter of hours. My red bumps can be very bright red sometimes, but then...whoola...they are gone...I do notice I get them when I go outside and sweat, doing the lawn, or just putting around the house.

Quote:

To increase skin resistance I've been using products with niacinamide and barrier repair triglycerides, cholesterol, fatty acids etc to strengthen the skin barrier and has really helped. I actually don't experience it much anymore.

I don't really understand "strengthening the skin barrier". What products are you specifically using to do so? What are fatty acids? Help

free skin care · Wed Jul 16, 2008 4:23 pm

bergquis wrote:

Ocean 14, you peaked my curiosity...sounds like you have skin like me. I don't understand the random red bumps (small be it) but how can they come and go in just a matter of hours. My red bumps can be very bright red sometimes, but then...whoola...they are gone...I do notice I get them when I go outside and sweat, doing the lawn, or just putting around the house.

Quote:

To increase skin resistance I've been using products with niacinamide and barrier repair triglycerides, cholesterol, fatty acids etc to strengthen the skin barrier and has really helped. I actually don't experience it much anymore.

I don't really understand "strengthening the skin barrier". What products are you specifically using to do so? What are fatty acids? Help

Sounds like allergies to me, try taking a Benadryl next time they show up and seeing the reaction?

free skin care · Wed Jul 16, 2008 4:26 pm

thanks for the advice, been there done that too many times to count...it doesn't help.

My red bumps happen daily, even when I am not outside, they just seem to happen MORE of them, when I am and I sweat. Even standing there. Crying or Very sad

free skin care · Thu Jul 17, 2008 3:35 pm

bergquis wrote:

....So I have been told, that I am not suppose to mix Tazorac and BP products, they cancel each other out.

I do think that theory has changed and that it is ok to use BP with synthetic retinoids (taz/differin) but not ok to use with natural retinoids (retin-a/renova).

free skin care · Thu Jul 17, 2008 7:08 pm

bergquis wrote:

thanks for the advice, been there done that too many times to count...it doesn't help.

My red bumps happen daily, even when I am not outside, they just seem to happen MORE of them, when I am and I sweat. Even standing there. Crying or Very sad

m I do get this when I sweat..like in the corners of my knees.

The "miracle cream" i posted about has really helped this though. and I notice it gets worse if I eat a lot of sugary/salty foods.

free skin care · Fri Jul 18, 2008 7:18 pm

Quote:

I don't really understand "strengthening the skin barrier". What products are you specifically using to do so? What are fatty acids? Help

Hey Bergquis sorry for the late response!

I think we get the exact same type of reaction. I noticed that whenever I sweat or exercise outside this seems to happen. By strengthening the skin barrier the skin becomes more tolerant to allergens and other things that cause skin reactions. The skin barrier is composed of lipids that include ceramides, fatty acids, and cholesterol that all help to retain moisture and protects us from the outside elements. When the barrier is compromised thats when we see conditions that include dry skin, inflammation, eczema etc. Products that have niacinamide have been proven to increase the natural synthesis of lipids and ceramides and photos shown the stratum corneum of the skin is a lot thicker to those who don't use products with niacinamide. Other ingredients to look for are the ceramides (specifically ceramide III, which is one of the best to penetrate the skin), fatty acids (these include linolenic/linoleic acids, etc) and cholesterol. These will help repair the skin barrier and strengthen it as well.

Also looks for anti-inflammatory ingredients like bisabol, allantoin, licorice extract, green tea, etc that will calm your skin when its irritated. I just recently ordered MD Formulations Antioxidant Spray exactly for the purpose of helping my skin when its irritated as well as strengthening it. It has ceramide III, linoleic/linolenic fatty acids, cholesterol, bisabol, licorice extract etc so I am excited to try this one out. Other ones that are good is Atopalm, Oil of Olay (high conc. of niacinamide), Cerave, MD Formulations Antiox line, Dove Sensitive Essentials (cheaper than the others I've mentioned but has both anti-inflammatory and the lipids I've mentioned).

Hope this helps!

free skin care · Fri Jul 18, 2008 7:23 pm

This is from an article about niacinamide and strengthening the skin barrier to better tolerate retinoids...

Niacinamide Shown to Increase Tolerance and Effectiveness of Topical Retinoid Therapy

While retinoid (vitamin a) therapies are among the most effective topical anti-aging treatments available, they can irritate or damage the skin's barrier and therefore are not fully utilized. P&G Beauty scientists found that if the skin's barrier could be strengthened, retinoid treatments could be more widely utilized. In a recently published paper (Draelos et al Cutis 2066;78:275-281) P&G Beauty reports results showing that the addition of niacinamide-containing moisturizer (which has barrier-building properties) to tretinoin (concentration of .025 percent) therapy improves anti-aging results and patient tolerance.

Use of a niacinamide containing moisturizer (Moisturizer A) reduces irritation associated with topical retinoid (0.025% tretinoin) treatment
In the 10-week randomized, split-face clinical trial, 40 female subjects applied blind-coded moisturizers with and without niacinamide for a 2-week preconditioning period and during an 8-week retinoid treatment period. Significant improvements in investigator-assessed skin texture were observed, including a reduced appearance of fine lines after the treatment period (p<0.01) for the niacinamide leg vs. the control. Additionally noted was reduced skin dryness and irritation in the niacinamide study leg (p<0.05).

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