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katewilson
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Mon Mar 08, 2010 2:24 pm      Reply with quote
Hi all, I spend a lot of hours following this topic and expertise and am very exited to start my DIY soon. I have few question and hope somebody will help me out:

Kickass Viterol/LAA Serum / Kassy's Kickass Concoction
Do you think if I order the current version of Viterol A from eccicalspa still will be the right kind for this recipe ( the gel, or etc..), if not I will use the 20% or 15% VC with out VA.

between 15% C, E + Ferulic Acid (FA) with HA Serum( 6/23/09) or 20% C Serum (2/8/2009).
I am really tempted to use this 15% instead of 20% because it is very popular in the forum, but I thought I can tolerate 20%. Do you think the higher % the better ?

Simple Semi-DIY Nourishing Serum
Do you think this is a good one for me with my general concern (thickening the skin and anti_aging) or do you have another suggestion?
sister sweets
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Mon Mar 08, 2010 5:48 pm      Reply with quote
katewilson wrote:
Hi all, I spend a lot of hours following this topic and expertise and am very exited to start my DIY soon. I have few question and hope somebody will help me out:

Kickass Viterol/LAA Serum / Kassy's Kickass Concoction
Do you think if I order the current version of Viterol A from eccicalspa still will be the right kind for this recipe ( the gel, or etc..), if not I will use the 20% or 15% VC with out VA.




Hello Kate,
The viterol A is not standardized so I'd skip it.... I have used both of the following recipes and share over and over with friends who love the stuff.

2010

15% Vitamin C, E + FA Serum with Jojoba, 1oz

1 tsp L-AA
1 tsp SKB
1 tsp Jojoba Oil
3 tsp H2O
1/4 tsp Ferulic Acid
1/4 tsp Vitamin E Oil
1/4 tsp Vodka or Witch Hazel (vodka is best and purest though.)

Using 2 shot glasses; In glass #1 dissolve L-AA in the distilled H2O. (I'd suggest a warm water bath while stirring till dissolved if you must.

Glass #2; In goes the Ferulic Acid, followed by vodka. Stir a few seconds. (It should just look like a yellowish opague serum.) Now add and stir in each of the remaining ingredients blending each in one at a time, starting with SKB first. (I find I get a smoother, more even serum when I warm the SKB in the microwave a few seconds, till a bit liquidy.)

When the L-AA has fully dissolved (looks like clear water) in glass #1, combine both phases together while slowly adding and stirring till contents of both glassed are combined.

*Note* I've had no physical sign of oxidation while leaving this serum at room temperature. It's now been 9 weeks. So I'm comfortable recommending a cool, dark place and to use up within 8 weeks. Keep exposure to air and light at a minimum as with any C serum!

ETA: The stability of this serum at room temp is not only my experience, but has been the case with many DIY'ers, not only here at EDS but elsewhere also! It's also been the favorite!



1oz 15%, C, E + Ferulic

Will last 8 weeks or so.. It is very stable,
(The vit E, SKB + FA all make it very stable!)

What you need for 1oz C,E, Ferulic 15%;
- 2 glass shot glasses
- 1oz cobalt or amber dropper or pump bottle
- 1 tsp L-Ascorbic Acid
- 1/4 tsp (1 ml) Vitamin E (equals 1%)
- .5% of Ferulic Acid (1 good pinch)
- 2 tsp SKB (Sea Kelp Bioferment)
- 3 + 1/2 tsp of distilled water
- 1/2 tsp of vodka (don't laugh, you need it to dissolve the FA so it's not gritty, and it also keeps the ph low enough!)

What to do;

- In first shot glass, put 1 tsp C into the 3 + 1/2 tsp of distilled water. Put on the side, stirring occasionally till FULLY dissolved (This can be anywhere from 10 minutes to an hour.)

- In 2nd shot glass put in 1/2 tsp vodka, and sprinkle the FA in and mix. (Little formulator spatulas are great for this!) When it has dissolved fully, add in the vitamin E + SKB and stir it all up well.

- When the LAA has fully dissolved in the 1st shot glass, mix the contents of both glasses together, stir very well, and carefully pour into your 1oz bottle.

Keeping it in a cool dry, dark place, or fridge will keep it potent + stable!

Kate - I use this one when I use my prolight red - but if you have any LED it's a good option. I really like it.



PRE-TREATMENT SERUM FOR LED USE

3oz distilled water
1 TBS AHA cream (I use Alpha Hydroxy Souffle, but I guess any would do)
1 TBS SKB (Sea Kelp Bioferment)
1/2 tsp HA (Hyaluronic Acid)
1/4 tsp Green Tea Extract

Gently warm the water in the microwave for 5 or 6 seconds and set aside.

Mix the HA + Green Tea into the SKB, add that mixture to the AHA cream, then very gradually add the water, while stirring constntly.

For those of you who use and are well conditioned to copper peptides, it would be a good addition to this serum in a very small quantity..(like drops, not spoonfuls..

Hope this puts you on your path. Kassy has made some great recipes for all of us. Good Luck Kate.

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Nimue
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Mon Mar 08, 2010 9:10 pm      Reply with quote
I got the "EC mode zinc c" vitamin C serum. It was a serum base and a packet of vitamin C that I mixed together myself. It's an airless pump and I like that. It's a light clear serum, so I'll be able to watch out for when it starts turning yellow. I also added in the PSF antioxidant booster (propylene glycol and ferulic acid).

I used it twice so far. In the morning, maybe 5 minutes before applying (physical) sunscreen. How long am I supposed to wait? I'm not totally happy with it, because it tingled and it seemed to dry my skin, so now my skin looks dry.

Maybe I could mix in something like a little vitamin E oil? But I'm worried that it won't mix/ emulsify properly. (this is why I opted to buy a pre packaged mix rather than formulate it myself)

Ingredients: Aqua, Ascorbic Acid, Glucose, Zinc Gluconate, Panthenol, Allantoin, Aloe Barbadensis Leaf Juice, Disodium EDTA, Citric Acid, Sodium Benzoate, Xanthan Gum.

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sister sweets
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Mon Mar 08, 2010 9:22 pm      Reply with quote
Nimue - What is in EC mode zinc c" vitamin C serum?
I will assume there is no E in it since you want to add. When I add to my C serum - the E is mixed in a bit of Sea Kelp Biofirment before added to the watery L-AA mix.
Need to know the ingredients you have already. Does the PSF product have E?

Maybe you could put something with some nice nourishing lipids over it since it is drying. Skinactives Every Lipid Serum ELS would be good. Just give the C about 20 minutes or more to penetrate first.

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Mon Mar 08, 2010 9:28 pm      Reply with quote
Nimue wrote:


Ingredients: Aqua, Ascorbic Acid, Glucose, Zinc Gluconate, Panthenol, Allantoin, Aloe Barbadensis Leaf Juice, Disodium EDTA, Citric Acid, Sodium Benzoate, Xanthan Gum.


The ingredients are listed right here! I would suggest if you add a little E you add a little glycerin to emulsify it and prevent separation.

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Nimue
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Mon Mar 08, 2010 10:43 pm      Reply with quote
The PSF product is just propylene glycol and ferulic acid. I just contacted PSF to ask how much FA is actually in there.

I'm pretty annoyed that this vit C serum is messing up my routine, this means I have to do some extra moisturizing if I keep using it. Before, ALL I did in the morning after showering was apply physical sunscreen. That was it.

Laughing I'm already thinking of trying a DIY version of skinmedica's vitamin C. -silicones + LAA + tetrahexyldecyl ascorbate (oil version of C)

sister sweets wrote:
Nimue - What is in EC mode zinc c" vitamin C serum?
I will assume there is no E in it since you want to add. When I add to my C serum - the E is mixed in a bit of Sea Kelp Biofirment before added to the watery L-AA mix.
Need to know the ingredients you have already. Does the PSF product have E?

Maybe you could put something with some nice nourishing lipids over it since it is drying. Skinactives Every Lipid Serum ELS would be good. Just give the C about 20 minutes or more to penetrate first.

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Nimue
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Mon Mar 08, 2010 10:46 pm      Reply with quote
DarkMoon wrote:


The ingredients are listed right here! I would suggest if you add a little E you add a little glycerin to emulsify it and prevent separation.


Thanks! Should it be same amount of vitamin E and glycerin?

And here I thought I would have a great fresh product that was already prepackaged for me that wouldn't need any DIY cauldron brewing... Rolling Eyes

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DarkMoon
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Tue Mar 09, 2010 5:24 am      Reply with quote
Nimue,

Hi, If you add Vitamin E and Glycerin I suggest 2X the glycerin than Vitamin E. Since you already have this mixed and in an airless pump? It might be your best bet to layer a nice moisturizer over your serum after application. I just know if you add the E you need something to keep it emulsified and glycerin will do that and is a great humectant as well. Smile

HTH

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Nimue
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Tue Mar 09, 2010 8:27 am      Reply with quote
DarkMoon wrote:
Nimue,

Hi, If you add Vitamin E and Glycerin I suggest 2X the glycerin than Vitamin E. Since you already have this mixed and in an airless pump? It might be your best bet to layer a nice moisturizer over your serum after application. I just know if you add the E you need something to keep it emulsified and glycerin will do that and is a great humectant as well. Smile

HTH


It's not a traditional airless pump. This is what I have, and there's a little video showing how it works:

http://www.malibuwellness.com/content/CN_Product_Detail.aspx?ID=38201

If I unscrew the top, it becomes a jar. Then I screw the top back on, pump it a couple of times to get rid of the excess air, and it's an airless pump. I like the design, I'll reuse this thing for when I will DIY vit C. (they also sell this jar thing by itself)

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Tue Mar 09, 2010 8:40 am      Reply with quote
Nimue,

That is a unique system! Thanks for posting the link. I think you could go either way and add the Glycerin and Vitamin E quite easily with the container, or just layer a moisturizer over it to help with the drying.

DM Smile

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Tue Mar 09, 2010 10:50 am      Reply with quote
DarkMoon wrote:
Nimue,

That is a unique system! Thanks for posting the link. I think you could go either way and add the Glycerin and Vitamin E quite easily with the container, or just layer a moisturizer over it to help with the drying.

DM Smile


When I bought it there was a special and I got the free refill as well so I figured the price worked out to be reasonable. I'm not sure what I'm going to do- if I'm going to add the vit E and glycerin directly or just layer over with something moisturizing after using it. I want to see how long it takes for it to oxidize so I don't want to mess with it too much.

After using it 2 mornings in a row, my skin was dry and irritated. I'm going to scale back, take a day or two off and try using it about 3 times a week, at night and see how that works. This way I'll actually be do the 20 minute wait time and I'll be able to follow it with something moisturizing.

I got a response from PSF- the antioxidant booster gives a concentration of .5% in 30 ml of serum. This means that there was about .15 of a gram of the ferulic acid in the booster (or 7.5%) and it gives me a concentration of about .35% in my 50 ml serum.

Next time I do this, I'll add some extra ferulic acid from a supplier and dissolve it in the antioxidant booster before adding it to the serum. What % of ferulic acid is ideal?

Also, has anyone tried a DIY anhydrous vitamin C?

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DarkMoon
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Tue Mar 09, 2010 11:26 am      Reply with quote
The FA needs to be dissolved in alcohol and the % is at 0.5% (not rubbing alcohol) many use Vodka. There are some anhydrous C recipes in the recipe index I have one and also other members have a perk here,

http://www.essentialdayspa.com/forum/viewthread.php?tid=11902

HTH

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katewilson
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Wed Mar 10, 2010 12:45 pm      Reply with quote
sister sweets, thank you for the the help!
I don't read this forum as much as I wish to but I should start my first DIY asap or I am way behind all over again
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Wed Mar 10, 2010 5:33 pm      Reply with quote
Best of luck to you Kate. It makes a quick and easy project - I promise. And so worth it.

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Wed Mar 10, 2010 8:24 pm      Reply with quote
Asking what the THDA & MSM is. Im new here and want to make my own Vitamin C serum. Embarassed
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Wed Mar 10, 2010 8:41 pm      Reply with quote
DarkMoon wrote:
This will answer about the THDA it is avaliable at:

http://www.lotioncrafters.com
http://www.bulkactives.com

It is a lipid (oil soluble form of Vitamin C) actually a derivative.


DarkMoon wrote:
Here is some info from Bulkactives site but lotioncrafters also carries it.

Appearance: Colorless to pale yellow liquid CAS# 183476-82-6
INCI Name: Tetrahexyldecyl Ascorbate Chem. Name: Ascorbyl Tetraisopalmitate
Suggested percentage: .5% to 7%
Solubility: excellent solubility in carrier oils, mineral oils, ethanol, silicone.  Insoluble in water, propylene glycol, glycerin.
Inorganic Organic balance (IOB) : 0.274 HLB: 2.74 (IOB 0.274 x 10 = HLB 2.74)
 
This oil soluble product can easily be added to a base cream or lotion.
It can also be emulsified with Gelmaker PLUS and a 1% HA mixture to create a very light 'serum'.
Combine with L-ascorbic acid in a silicone base for an Anhydrous Vitamin C combo.

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Wed Mar 10, 2010 9:11 pm      Reply with quote
Bippie wrote:
Asking what the THDA & MSM is. Im new here and want to make my own Vitamin C serum. Embarassed


Hi,
You will find information about MSM here, I don't use it in anything myself but hope this helps.

http://stanford.wellsphere.com/wellpage/methylsulfonylmethane-(msm)

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Jackie284
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Thu Mar 11, 2010 3:13 am      Reply with quote
Hi everyone,

I have a few purchased bottles of vit c serum, and was wondering if I could add ferulic acid to them. Or is it possible to apply ferulic acid separately ?

many thanks

Jackie xx
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Thu Mar 11, 2010 7:37 am      Reply with quote
Jackie284 wrote:
Hi everyone,

I have a few purchased bottles of vit c serum, and was wondering if I could add ferulic acid to them. Or is it possible to apply ferulic acid separately ?

many thanks

Jackie xx


I don't see why not. I don't know how the ferulic would degrade your C-serum but adding additional liquid will decrease the % of C. Just try to get an accurate measurement of how much serum you have so you don't overdo the ferulic.
The only problem I can see is getting the ferulic to dissolve. You might want to dispense half of the c-serum into a beaker; dissolve the ferulic in a little water with some vodka. The vodka will allow you to use less water. Then mix into half once fully mixed then add the other half of the c-serum.
HTH

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Thu Mar 11, 2010 7:49 am      Reply with quote
Alley,

That might require straight Vodka or Everclear, as I recall many have had a hard time dissolving the ferulic acid in even straight vodka. Have you had good luck with a mix of water and vodka?Just curious as I said the ferulic acid has been a problem for a number of people getting it dissolved? Smile

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Thu Mar 11, 2010 7:56 am      Reply with quote
I usually add the ferulic straight to the H2o & L-aa then add about 2mls of vodka and it dissolves right away. The h20 is cloudy but not gritty.

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Thu Mar 11, 2010 8:01 am      Reply with quote
Alley wrote:
I usually add the ferulic straight to the H2o & L-aa then add about 2mls of vodka and it dissolves right away. The h20 is cloudy but not gritty.


Thanks for that, makes me wonder why others have had such issues, was it you that had the lumpy batch and crushed it against the sides to rid it of lumps? Maybe that's the answer.

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Thu Mar 11, 2010 8:05 am      Reply with quote
I don't remember doing that but God's knows thoses 1st few DIY attempts were not all that successful.. Laughing

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Thu Mar 11, 2010 8:10 am      Reply with quote
Alley wrote:
I don't remember doing that but God's knows thoses 1st few DIY attempts were not all that successful.. Laughing


LOL I would have to dig back and see, well at least it's working now! Smile Those first attempts often end up down the drain! Smile

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Thu Mar 11, 2010 9:40 am      Reply with quote
Darkmoon - my DIY attempt may have to go down the drain as well.

I made a 2nd batch of Vit C serum. My first one was very small and just H2O and Vit C.

My 2nd one was larger and I used:
1 tsp Vit C
3 tsp distilled H2O (warmed)
2 Vit E gel caps.

I tried to disolve the Vit C in the warmed H2O before adding the gel caps. It took forever to disolve. And, after adding the Vit E I get the 'water and oil don't mix' problem. Plus, I added a little bit to a sample sized (empty) bottle of Skin Cueticals I had (washed out, of course) and the next morning the crystals were stuck to the dropper.

What have I done wrong? Are crystals suppose to stick to the dropper and how do you get the oil to mix well. Should I leave this part out with such a sm amount (5ml)? Maybe I don't need Vit E - my last batch did not change color over 2 wks time.

Also, how can I get the crystals to disolve better? I recieved my crystals with my owndoc roller.

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