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Fri Apr 17, 2009 11:12 am  |
I am trying to summarize all that I have read and learned about facial aging and I would love it if posters would chime in and edit or comment on my information:
The face appears to age due to:
(A) wrinkles - resulting from collagen loss and sun damage
Remedies:
retinoids - scientifically proven to soften existing wrinkles, reversing some and preventing new ones
Botox - proven to relax lines temporarily
Vitamin C serums - proven to soften wrinkles and prevent new ones from forming.
laser treatments - proven to soften wrinkles.
chemical peels - proven to soften lines if appropriate peel is used.
dermal fillers - used to fill in and soften lines temporarily
dermarolling - soften wrinkles (proven by anecdotal evidence only?)
plastic surgery - lines removed when skin is tightened
(B) Degradation of skin texture: more noticable pores, hyperpigmentation, roughness, unevenness, etc., mostly due to sun damage
Remedies:
retinoids - proven to improve skin texture, make it smoother, less pigmentation
Vitamin C - proven to improve skin texture (pigmentation, roughness)
chemical peels and lasers - proven to improve texture (smoother, less pigmentation)
(C) Sagging - the pull of gravity over time and fat loss causes parts of the face to fall lower
Remedies:
dermal fillers - fillers can support certain areas of the face to keep tissue from falling further
facial exercises - (?) any research on this anywhere?
plastic surgery - skin is lifted
(d) Loss of facial volume - due to fat loss and collagen loss and exacerbated by sagging
Remedies:
dermal fillers - can add back lost facial volume
fat transfer - fat transferred to the face from other area of the body to replace lost volume |
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Fri Apr 17, 2009 3:03 pm |
As all the Facial Exercise aficionados here can attest, this will help with restoring/maintaining volume as well as counteracting sag. The massage component revs up the circulation and helps exfoliate old cells and build collagen.
LED lights have some merit too!
ALSO:
Supplementing with MSM/C and BioSil, among other things.
Sun avoidance.
Adequate sleep/exercise
Water intake |
_________________
✪ My go-to products: MyFawnie.BigCartel.com ✪ |
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Fri Apr 17, 2009 6:31 pm |
This is some information that was in New Beauty magazine. I am just copying it here in case anyone is interested.
Aging Factor 1: Diminishing levels of fat.
The best way to prevent excessive fat loss in your face is by maintaining a healthy diet and a steady weight.
Aging Factor 2: Too much fat.
Aging Factor 3: Loss of collagen and elastin.
Collagen Loss Accelerators: Overexposure to sun. Other factors that contribute to collagen breakdown: pollution, smoke, and the weather.
Facial expressions; with every facial expression made, tiny amounts of collagen are slowly depleted.
Taking preventative measures: topical antioxidants and a healthy diet are key. A diet high in antioxidants, omega 3 fatty acids, milk thistle, and vitamins B1, B6, C, and D is beneficial.
(Interestingly, New Beauty also says that "there is still relatively little solid research on skin benefits of oral or topical antioxidants and much of the supporting evidence is indirect", but many doctors are convinced of their efficacy.)
Aging Factor 4: Bone changes.
Facial bones can lose density and thickness over time, causing them to change size and shape.
Also, the magazine says that menopause is a big player in how the face ages. Hormonal changes impact the skins natural elasticity and plumpness, and lines and wrinkles deep into folds. Hormones are also believed to play a role in bone changes. |
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Sat Apr 18, 2009 3:25 am |
Thank you for the feedback!
I have read of many here who use facial exercises and attest to the effectiveness.
Nevertheless, conventional medical wisdom seems to argue against the anecdotal evidence.
Do you know if there has been any scientific research that actually measures the results of facial exercise?
Thanks! Barefoot |
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Sat Apr 18, 2009 6:00 am |
| Barefootgirl wrote: |
Thank you for the feedback!
I have read of many here who use facial exercises and attest to the effectiveness.
Nevertheless, conventional medical wisdom seems to argue against the anecdotal evidence.
Do you know if there has been any scientific research that actually measures the results of facial exercise?
Thanks! Barefoot |
This is an interesting topic and some excellent points.
My opinions about conventional wisdom and facial exercise:
The model of conventional wisdom is more reactionary (plastic surgery) Vs preventive (facial exercises) in nature. This is where a bulk of research dollars go to.
The alternative medicine field which focuses more on prevention and healthy cure which works with the body is not based on scientific research. (chinese medicine has been around for centuries, homeopathy, supplementation, ayurvedic medicine, etc - none of it backed by research funds)... Yet they endure.
Research is very costly and most of what has endured in many areas does so because it stands the test of time and because of anectdotal evidence.
Also, I do not agree that conventional medicine does not rely on anecdotal evidence as part of it's outcomes assessment. Research may say that a certain medicine is valuable for inflammation (Celebrex for example) and after it has been used for a time it is pulled from the shelves. Why? Anectdotal evidence shows that it has caused negative outcomes and these outweigh the researched benefits.
In my opinion just because millions and millions of research dollars are not spent researching facial exercise does not mean it does not work. Research money is often used to make money and often to promote a cause, a medicine, etc.
The question is... Who has something to gain from researching facial exercise or more importantly, who is going to fund the research? I'm sure if the money were there, the research could be accomplished and the outcomes would be proved.
50 years ago conventional medicine didn't know the power of exercise and it condoned smoking. Anecdotal evidence proved otherwise. And THEN came the research. |
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Sat Apr 18, 2009 7:50 am |
I agree with Sis and before and after pictures of individuals that are doing facial exercises is proof enough for me....provided they are legit  And the best evidence that I currently have is looking at my face daily in the mirror after two years of facial exercises and then looking at my before pictures in 2007....I look like I have had a face lift. Facial exercises are fabulous for lifting the sag!
Toby |
_________________
female,"50 something" medium to thick normal skin, no wrinkles,Lightstim,Easy Eye Solutions,Green Smoothies,Ageless Secret Gold, Pico Toner,Beautiful Image |
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Sat Apr 18, 2009 9:01 am |
| I am the third one to join sister sweets and Toby to support facial exercises. From personal experience it is one of the best things I have done for myself! As many on this and some other boards would attest facial exercises work and work well! |
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Sat Apr 18, 2009 9:02 am |
I'm a really big fan of science myself, but also realise that scientific studies cost a lot of money and this money most times comes from drug and skincare companies, who are not keen on spending money on something they can't patent and make money from later. Nothing wrong with that really - i wouldn't be happy if i was a shareholder of a company who spent big$$$$ on researching something they didn't have the rights to.
Still, it may perhaps explain why some "natural" type ingredients or other things that can't be patented/licensed don't always have the studies to back them up. I can't imagine there's too many wealthy benefactors out there who would be willing to finance a study on the skin benefits of, say, rosehip or avocado oil ... or facial exercises
BTW, I don't do facial exercises.. but I am thinking about it  |
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Sat Apr 18, 2009 4:58 pm |
Couldn't agree more appletini.
Ageless: Five minutes a day to a better toned & lifted face. Inexpensive, no bad side effects, easy to do, time efficient, convenient.... And you will see the results within a few short months or like some within weeks of time. |
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Sun Apr 19, 2009 2:53 pm |
Thanks for the replies..a person would be crazy to argue with the good results that many report from the facial exercises, but it seems to me that the results should be measurable by more than appearance alone because appearances can be skewed - angles, mirrors, lighting, etc.
I am just curious to know if anyone has done any actual measurements - granted, the measurements would likely be small, but significant.
Generally speaking, the US economy is primarily driven by a profit motive, so any procedures which are less expensive will likely not get the reseach or the press....
Here are some perfect examples:
lasers vs. dermarolling, vs. chemical peels vs surgery vs. Botox
The procedures that return the most on investment will be most well known and most often discussed.
Sad but true. I learned this when I first studied the differences between sunscreens sold here in the U.S. versus sunscreens in Australia or Canada - same with low glycemic diet plans...
Time and again, you will find other countries are farther ahead of the US when it comes to less expensive, but equally or more effective alternatives to health and beauty.
Nevertheless, I want to keep this discussion focused on facial aging, not politics
Again, thanks -
BF |
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Sun Apr 19, 2009 4:03 pm |
Well, I don't know how you'd measure facial lift - sounds tough to me but I can attest to Toby's pictures - she does look like she had a natural looking face lift. And I think she really tried to account for the variables of light, angles, etc.
It is difficult to measure some of the parameters. I will tell you that since massaging faithfully my skin is thicker and firmer to the touch and this is noticeable. I know that blood flow is an important component of healthy tissue. Ask any dentist about the gingiva of a smoker - the gums look positively dead in some people due to lack of blood flow. The damage to a smokers gums and attachment is immense due in part to this.
The reverse happens with facial exercise and massage. Massage and facial exercise stimulates blood and lymphatic flow which will enable the tissues to remain more youthful and vital. These benefits are in addition to the work you give to the muscles that lift the underlying structure.
I can tell you I hate to miss a day of facial exercise. When I finish my exercises I feel so empowered knowing all that I've done is taking me a step closer to the 'face lift' that Toby has!!! I'm getting there. |
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Mon Apr 20, 2009 2:40 am |
Hi,
I think where I am going with this is skin laxity which can be measured.
Muscles can be tightened and firmed, but skin cannot? Loose skin is loose skin and I've always understood that jowls and the like result more from skin loosening and falling - than the underlying muscle tissues.
From WebMd: "When the skin loses its elasticity, gravity causes drooping of the eyebrows and eyelids, looseness and fullness under the cheeks and jaw (jowls and "double chin"), and longer ear lobes."
I do not understand how exercises can shorten or tighten loose skin and that's what I would like to learn more about, because it seems implausible.
Thanks, BF |
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Mon Apr 20, 2009 3:54 am |
| Barefootgirl wrote: |
Hi,
I think where I am going with this is skin laxity which can be measured.
Muscles can be tightened and firmed, but skin cannot? Loose skin is loose skin and I've always understood that jowls and the like result more from skin loosening and falling - than the underlying muscle tissues.
From WebMd: "When the skin loses its elasticity, gravity causes drooping of the eyebrows and eyelids, looseness and fullness under the cheeks and jaw (jowls and "double chin"), and longer ear lobes."
I do not understand how exercises can shorten or tighten loose skin and that's what I would like to learn more about, because it seems implausible.
Thanks, BF |
I have to agree. After 6 weeks (or so) of Ageless I have to report there isn't a bit of difference (other than I can do the exercises more correctly now). Members on the big thread insist that some people can't see results until various " X " amounts of time, but when do you know when that is? And when do you know that it's time to forget about it? I'm beginning to feel a little silly about doing them - like I am really fooling myself.
I continue the exercises & listen only to responses in my age category (a few are here but not many). 
I strongly believe that skin care can make your skin look younger and absolutely refined - whatever your age. But, after a certain point, how your skin "hangs" belongs to surgeons. 
BTW I go for frequent facials and have never said anything to my aesthetitian about the exercising of my face. Last friday, I asked her if she noticed a difference - namely tightness - in my face since my last visit and she said that she did not. |
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Mon Apr 20, 2009 6:44 am |
| Barefootgirl wrote: |
Muscles can be tightened and firmed, but skin cannot? Loose skin is loose skin and I've always understood that jowls and the like result more from skin loosening and falling - than the underlying muscle tissues.
From WebMd: "When the skin loses its elasticity, gravity causes drooping of the eyebrows and eyelids, looseness and fullness under the cheeks and jaw (jowls and "double chin"), and longer ear lobes."
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I just read something to that effect in the new Allure magazine. Granted it is a magazine and not peoples experience, but this is what Allure had to say in the "Skin Myths" tiny article.
Myth: Facial exercises will keep the skin from sagging.
The Truth: It's the skin that gets saggy, not the muscles. |
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Mon Apr 20, 2009 8:10 am |
| There are several contributing factors to sagging looking face, that includes underlying muscles and skin. Facial exercises help to address sagging resulting from facial muscles, while facial massage helps to address skin sagging. Most plastic surgeons and like would say that facial exercises do not improve sagging face, while many facial builders can attest to the contrary. I have seen cases when facial exercises resulted in what looks like facelift, while there was no facelift at all, just facial exercises. Or when people that used to use fillers did not need them anymore once results of facial exercises kicked in. |
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Mon Apr 20, 2009 8:15 am |
| Good point mpstat. My NL lines are very softened and some days almost nonexistant. I thought I'd need a filler appointment and was planning things that way. Facial exercises have contoured my face in such a way that I no longer need that option. |
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Mon Apr 20, 2009 10:50 am |
| The skin on your face is attached to the muscles underneath. When the sagging muscles are lifed so is the skin. When they do facelifts they tighten the muscles. With facial exercises you're essentially doing the same thing in a natural method. |
_________________
29, Tazorac, PCA cleanser/moisturizer, Clarisonic, Dermaroller/Retin-A/DIY Vit-C, Dry brushing, Ageless if you Dare |
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Mon Apr 20, 2009 11:33 am |
RuthMarion, I`am not doing facial exercises (yet!), but I`m exercising my body regularly at a fitness studio and I should say 6 weeks may be not enough to start noticing changes. It surely depends on your muscles` resistance and condition, with me it was that I began to notice a difference in several months of regular exercises. I was really thinking it was all in vain and had no sense, but then I noticed that my muscles had much better tonus.
So I would suggest for you not to give up with facial exercises yet and try to do them several months more. You surely should increase exertion as much as you can. My fitness-trainer said to do it, gradually you should take more and more weight, otherwise exercises were useless he said. I think the same goes with facial exercises. Surely I will not promise you a miracle if your facial skin has a considerable sag, but you will definitely have positive changes over time.
that was my 2cents, sorry  |
_________________
31, combo - oily, breakout-prone, fair complexion, sensitive and prone to rosacea |
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Mon Apr 20, 2009 3:11 pm |
I was PM'd by another asking that I put in my 2 cents...
So... You can NOT build muscle in your face WITHOUT impacting the connective tissues... which in turn will impact the integrity of the skin... By stating connective tissue, I mean, collagen, elastin, and most importantly fibroblast cells. So, YES, you can in fact thicken the skin...
Now... if your skin is hanging like a sharpie puppy.. chances are, almost 100% you will not build enough muscle to bring in the slack... You could make a considerable improvement, but you'd still look "old" by today's standards.
Speaking of Sag, had a person started Facial Building PRIOR to sag, not necessarily wrinkles, You would literally be capable of seriously holding back the hands of time... age limits are of no issue...
Regardless, you will have to take care of your body and skin... if you don't take care of the package... expect it to arrive in disarray!
I'm linking to our site showing studies and quotes that support the positive effects of Facial Building... http://www.flexeffect.com/research.htm
We in fact did a SMALL study with a physical therapy group to measure muscle densities and such. From a stat. standpoint... probably not a large enough group... However, the results warrant a further study...again... it's a matter of sponsoring such a study... $$$$$$$$.
I do notice that although many (not all) plastic surgeons and the cosmetic industry aren't keen to proving that Facial Building well help a person look younger... the world of physical therapy, is quite excited. They are excited, first and foremost with the ability to aid PT patients that have suffered from Strokes, accidents resulting in damage to muscle, and bells palsy for example as their medical text books also fail to offer adequate tools for productive therapy. They would consider the looking younger a side effect. Similar to retin-a as an acne treatment. Which makes since... turning over cells at a rapid pace that was lost do to aging.
Really, I'm not in the mode of convincing any longer. I'm happy to educate based on our experience with thousands of clients. However, their results though positive are not obtained in the sterile environment of a lab. If you need that... well... I don't recommend holding your breath.
I do understand wanting the science. I should talk to my sister now, who is in fact a scientist (biologist, chemist, physics) and see why she needs no convincing? Probably 'cause she's lived with the proof... And seen it herself. The question becomes, can you repeat the process with another and get same/similar results. Yes, but there is an accounting for of variables... which means that no all results will be exactly alike. You could have 5 people do the same exact leg workout... but DNA is going to give you 5 very different looking sets of legs. Unless you're dealing with the Rockettes!
One more quick note... I realize there are people that have amazing results in a few short weeks/months. I don't know the variables in their life that make it so... but to expect a major difference in 6 weeks... you're asking to be disappointed.
I generally tell people that in 6 weeks, you will FEEL a difference in your face. In 3-6 months, you will start to see things... that you're not really even sure is there. In 6-9 months, your friends and family starting asking if you're wearing a different color something (eye makeup, lipstick), did you color your hair, did you lose weight... Generally in a year, especially if someone hasn't seen you in a while, they will ask you what you're doing! This is if you are already showing signs of aging. If you start earlier... Well, then you just keep looking young for your age. |
_________________
Claudia of FlexEffect... 43, fair skin, occasional breakout, Using ECO FROG (my own=disclaimer), and TrueScience (I also sell this)... Happy with that...Come visit on FB! |
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Mon Apr 20, 2009 7:04 pm |
| I just looked again at the before and afters and they are so amazing. You can't doubt some of these results. (Toby you should be in there!). |
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Mon Apr 20, 2009 7:31 pm |
| Wow!! It is a valuable information. Thank you so much |
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Mon Apr 20, 2009 7:44 pm |
After doing Flexeffect for one year I sent my before and after pictures to Rita Paige at Prolight to evaluate my skin for an LED light. We had a telephone conversation prior to my pictures going to her. She wanted to know my skin care regime and when I told her I was doing facial exercises she told me that was the best thing for sagging skin...along with massage. She said that the LED lights were great, but the facial exercises were the bullet for the sag. Then when I sent her my pictures and we spoke on the phone she said said she had my pictures up on her computer screen and someone working in her business came up and commented on the "good face lift"  that I had gotten. Rita used to work for a plastic surgeon and viewing befores and afters was a common thing she would do. She mentioned that my results came from facial exercises and that person didn't believe her. Folks this is a true story. Facial exercises work, but it does take time.....it took time to get the sag so it will take time to lift it. If you need to know Rita's credentials check here...she firmly believes in facial exercises.
http://www.prolightaesthetics.com/aboutus.html |
_________________
female,"50 something" medium to thick normal skin, no wrinkles,Lightstim,Easy Eye Solutions,Green Smoothies,Ageless Secret Gold, Pico Toner,Beautiful Image |
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Mon Apr 20, 2009 8:23 pm |
| Toby - thanks for chiming in! |
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Mon Apr 20, 2009 10:03 pm |
| What are the best products with retinoids or vic c , that u could recommend? |
_________________
Skin: problem dry sensitive |
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Tue Apr 21, 2009 4:03 am |
| Aga wrote: |
| What are the best products with retinoids or vic c , that u could recommend? |
For the retinoids, you can check into Retin A, Tazorac, etc. A topical C that is really good is Skinceuticals C, E, Ferulic. Do a board search and you will find a ton of info on these items. |
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