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Mon Jul 12, 2010 10:03 pm  |
| I will be new to the whole derma rolling experience. I'll be getting a derma roller to help with the cellulite on the back of my thighs and butt as well as the stretch marks on my hips. I read that a lot of you "pre-treat" with Retin-A and Vit C. I'm not too sure what that means. Does it mean putting Vit A + C onto the stretch marks weeks before rolling? Can I just roll and then put the retin-A? Also, is it necessary to be using Vit C? How often do i roll? Can i use derma roll as a preventative measure to those areas of my body that doesn't have stretch marks yet, but with age might get stretch marks? |
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Late 20's, clarisonic, Vit C serum, hormonal acne, congested pores, combination skin, living in Vancouver Canada |
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Tue Jul 13, 2010 4:38 pm |
Im curious to hear from people who use a 1.5mm dermaroller more frequently then once a month.
Ive been using my dermaroller for a while, on stretch marks on my stomach from pregnancy. I used to dermaroller frequently, sometimes a few times a month, sometimes a couple times a week, sometimes 2 days in a row even.
I ended up stopping completely because I read this forum, people warning about overuse. And I can say it was about 2 months since I last rolled and my skin looks better, not worse. So Im not so sure I believe that one site that talks about overuse (the one someone linked to). Every other site have said its fine to use more often. |
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Wed Jul 14, 2010 1:48 am |
| PapayaWhip67 wrote: |
Im curious to hear from people who use a 1.5mm dermaroller more frequently then once a month.
Ive been using my dermaroller for a while, on stretch marks on my stomach from pregnancy. I used to dermaroller frequently, sometimes a few times a month, sometimes a couple times a week, sometimes 2 days in a row even.
I ended up stopping completely because I read this forum, people warning about overuse. And I can say it was about 2 months since I last rolled and my skin looks better, not worse. So Im not so sure I believe that one site that talks about overuse (the one someone linked to). Every other site have said its fine to use more often. |
Everybody who wants to stick needles in their skin (sorry if that sounds rude/harsh) NEEDS to research, research, research. Why aren’t people doing this?
Some websites that SELL the dermarollers say you can roll more times in a month because they are simply selling them, that's all, they are a business out to make money, they are not a doctor. They are probably telling their customers to use the roller more often so that the customer then has to purchase from them again more often (which means more money for them!!!) due to the frequent use because eventually a roller will need replacing. They aren’t really bothered how you should/shouldn’t use them, but I can just see it happening that they get taken off the market due to customers improper use and damage being done.
This is Miranda posted the links to all the CORRECT info you will need, please take some of your time to read these.
I'm really not meaning to be rude here, I only want to help, but it's getting a little frustrating when people come here without reading through this thread or doing their own research. I can tell when someone has or hasn't done their research. I was new once and didn't have a clue about rolling, and I ALSO at first thought "why can't I roll 2 times a week? it says so on this website (the Scientia website)”, and I posted in the BIG derma rolling thread and was told by the regular very experienced users that that info was infact incorrect and not a good idea to be rolling my skin that often. I researched all I could before I rolled.
You may say your skin looks ok/better, but it’s only been two months. Who knows, in 6-12 months time you may not be saying the same thing, but if you continue to roll at this rate you may well regret it as it has been warned this is not the thing to do.
There’s info on this site stating that if you roll once every 4-6 weeks what will happen, it’s very detailed, a little scientific if you like. And there is also info on this site that tells you what can happen to your skin if you roll too often.
Like I say to everyone, it’s your body, your skin… do as you please, but don’t say I didn’t warn you.
Maybe the people who think it’s correct to roll more than once a month can make a new thread with that in the title, so then people (if there are any on this board) who are rolling often with a 1.5mm roller can chat about their experiences, you may even get more people than just me commenting and helping you with why that isn’t a good idea.
PapayaWhip67 if you feel you don’t believe what I posted in the quotes/links then maybe start a new thread titled “Why is it bad to roll more than once a month with a 1.5mm roller?” and see if you get the answers you’re looking for.
Good luck. |
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Wed Jul 14, 2010 3:05 am |
Good grief! How many more posts from newbies who obviously haven't bothered reading any specialist info!
My skin is hugely important to me; I hate the fact that I have scars so I am trying to do something about them but I won't sacrifice the condition my skin is in right now in the name of self-esteem (scars aren't dangerous it's just they don't look nice and make me and many others feel bad about ourselves).
Why would anyone who has been rolling for two months say that the doctors/specialists are wrong and that they are right in that deep rolling excessively is not detrimental?
Why are the questions "can I roll then put Retin A" or "How often do I roll" being asked?
The reason why this thread is becoming so useless for new people to read through is because it's being filled up with questions that shouldn't even be asked if one has done even just 30 mins worth of research.
I read through the whole of the mammoth Dermarolling thread plus this one plus every piece of legit info I could find before I started puncturing my skin. Yes I made some mistakes along the way and needed some questions answered. But really folks, these last few posts are just space-wasters and both Barry and PapayaWhip's techniques are positively harmful.
For the last time use link below, read ALL of them and then you will have a pretty good idea on how to roll safely and correctly.
http://www.essentialdayspa.com/forum/viewtopic.php?tid=29860
And have patience. |
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Wed Jul 14, 2010 8:11 pm |
Actually I did research it before I started using it, so dont jump to conclusions. I researched everything from skin anatomy, stretch mark formation, collagen, skin healing, products etc so I could find the best solution for my stretch marks. And what I found is that stretch marks are on the bottom layer of the dermis (the retciular layer), which consists of thick collagen fibers. To repair the depth and lenght of stretch marks you have to build collagen back into that layer. Then I found that the epidermis varies in thickness from .05 mm in the thinnest parts to 1.5mm in the thickest. And the dermis varies from .3mm to 3mm depending on the area of the body. On your stomach using a dermaroller you will barely (if even) poke the layer of the dermis that holds the packed collagen fibers (depending on pressure you use also though). So really using a 1.5mm dermaroller with light to medium pressure basically just helps with product absorption. I dont think better product absorption will harm my skin.
By the way I didnt say I used it for 2 months. I used it for about 5 months, on average 5-10 times a month. I stopped using 2 months ago because I read this forum and wanted to make sure I wasnt actually causing more damage. Within the past 2 months any swelling, irritation, and collagen healing processes have finished by now. The process of skin renewel takes about 28 days. So I think if I have actually been causing more harm, I wouldnt be seeing positive results 2 months later. |
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Thu Jul 15, 2010 4:44 am |
| PapayaWhip67 wrote: |
On your stomach using a dermaroller you will barely (if even) poke the layer of the dermis that holds the packed collagen fibers (depending on pressure you use also though).
So I think if I have actually been causing more harm, I wouldnt be seeing positive results 2 months later. |
Sorry my apologies, obviously you are far more of an expert on rolling than Dr. Fernandes et al.
BTW don't stretchmarks result from a collapse in the skin tissue? So stretchmarks on your stomach will have a 1.5mm roller reaching the dermis so therefore will be doing more than product penetration?
Carry on over-rolling PW67, your short term discovery may actually change the protocol in derma rolling and you will be hailed as the founder of that allusive quick cure for stretchmarks.  |
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Thu Jul 15, 2010 12:08 pm |
I never said Im an expert at this, but clearly I researched it more then you if your idea of research is to find one doctors opinion and just take it.
Stretch marks are caused by a tearing in the reticular layer of the dermis. The layers of skin above it do not collapse in any way so I dont see what you're saying? |
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Thu Jul 15, 2010 2:50 pm |
| PapayaWhip67 wrote: |
| So really using a 1.5mm dermaroller with light to medium pressure basically just helps with product absorption. I dont think better product absorption will harm my skin. |
You didn't mention this in your first post. You can roll more than once a month for product penetration, but personally I'd prefer to use a .25mm not a 1.5mm roller. I use the 1.5mm for hard/deeper rolls.
| PapayaWhip67 wrote: |
if your idea of research is to find one doctors opinion and just take it.
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But Dr Fernandes isn't just any old doctor, he is one of the inventors of the Dermaroller... So if we should be listening to anyone, it should be him.
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The History of Derma Rollers
In 1996 Dr Des Fernandes (founder of Environ Skincare, and South African Dermatologist) first introduced a needling device, it was a small needle stamp, to induce collagen and used as a regular treatment in his surgical practice. He delivered his first paper on skin needling of the upper lips to the ISAPA Congress in Taipe in 1996. He then went on to develop Environ’s Roll Cit, which was one of the first rollers available for personal use at home. |
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Thu Jul 15, 2010 4:32 pm |
Well Dr Fernandes is, I think, talking about using more pressure and doing more aggressive rolls, which I agree shouldnt be done more often then once every 3-5 weeks.
You guys have been saying a 1.5mm dermaroller shouldnt be used anymore then 4 times a week, I agree ..if you roll with alot of pressure. But I personally think that you can use a 1.5mm dermaroller more frequently than once a month, with light to moderate pressure as it doesnt reach the layer of the dermis which holds all the packed collagen.
So I came on here (to do more research) and see if anybody else has been getting positive results rolling more frequently with a 1.5mm roller. |
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Thu Jul 15, 2010 4:35 pm |
| Most of the sites I have read that give directions on how to use a dermaroller dont say to use aggressive rolls, they usually say to use light to moderate pressure, which is why Ive been researching around that. |
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Thu Jul 15, 2010 5:38 pm |
| Kay2008 wrote: |
| You may say your skin looks ok/better, but it’s only been two months. Who knows, in 6-12 months time you may not be saying the same thing |
Maybe in 5 mins we will all be dead
| This is Miranda wrote: |
| Why would anyone who has been rolling for two months say that the doctors/specialists are wrong and that they are right in that deep rolling excessively is not detrimental? |
Cause they are often/have often been wrong?
especially when using pseudoscience? |
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Thu Jul 15, 2010 5:58 pm |
| Kay2008 wrote: |
| PapayaWhip67 wrote: |
| if your idea of research is to find one doctors opinion and just take it. |
But Dr Fernandes isn't just any old doctor, he is one of the inventors of the Dermaroller... So if we should be listening to anyone, it should be him.
| Quote: |
The History of Derma Rollers
In 1996 Dr Des Fernandes (founder of Environ Skincare, and South African Dermatologist) first introduced a needling device, it was a small needle stamp, to induce collagen and used as a regular treatment in his surgical practice. He delivered his first paper on skin needling of the upper lips to the ISAPA Congress in Taipe in 1996. He then went on to develop Environ’s Roll Cit, which was one of the first rollers available for personal use at home. |
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Wasnt this the same guy who was selling rollers for like $500 a piece before all the bootleggers went to work, lol? |
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Vivella
New Member
 
Joined: 10 Nov 2009
Posts: 4
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Thu Jul 22, 2010 7:47 am |
Hi all
I am just about do do my first roll, and I just wanted some advice. I am doing it on my hips - sm's both sides. The question is about how to do the roll.
I've obviously seen the star shapped pattern - 5 rolls (back forth = 2 rolls) each line, up, down, then diagonally. However this doesn't seem like enough coverage. little bits being missed out between the lines, and what about the middle - it get's rolled 20 times, whilst the rest only get 5.
I thought doing a rectangle perhaps 4 of them around the hip - where you go across 5 times each line, down the rectangle, then up and down 5 times, each line across the rectangle.
In one of the articles, it says to do it quite thoroughly, and the second method there seems more thorough than the star.
I'm sorry to be so specific - but this is quite a serious thing to do, and I need to know how to do it properly.
This question has probably been asked before, but I would love to know exactly how you all do the roll or what method you prefer.
And if you can't understand how I've described it (I've read others' describing it and it's nearly impossible to describe without confusing you by the third word  ) that's fine just mention how you do it.
I would be very grateful for any response.
Thanks
Viv |
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Thu Jul 22, 2010 10:51 pm |
| My stretch marks are all over my stomach, so I start at the bottom and roll sideways across my whole stomach back and forth a bunch of times, then move it to the space above it and roll it left and right across my stomach and do that all the way up. Then I do the same thing going down then diagonal. |
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Sun Jul 25, 2010 10:58 am |
HI guys!
I was just wondering... how does going for you old rollers? Is there any improvement?
I only rolled once six months ago and only one thigh, and I could say it look better, much better, SM there are not silver anymore,they are creamy, I don't know is that wright description...and they are more flat,not so deep anymore...
anyway, I was just wondering how is going for you... |
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he hi |
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Sun Jul 25, 2010 3:54 pm |
| Hi Nenka I experienced the same as you. My stretch marks were wide, very old, silvery and shiny. Mine did not change the color after dermarolling but they did after single needling. They lost that shiny whiteness. They are still white but it is darker and matte. I have been needling for many months and some of my stretch marks are breaking into smaller ones. I inspected it with a magnifying glass every month. Single needling is laborious but it is worth it. |
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RisA
New Member
Joined: 25 Jul 2010
Posts: 4
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Sun Jul 25, 2010 9:41 pm |
| marta1 wrote: |
| Hi Nenka I experienced the same as you. My stretch marks were wide, very old, silvery and shiny. Mine did not change the color after dermarolling but they did after single needling. They lost that shiny whiteness. They are still white but it is darker and matte. I have been needling for many months and some of my stretch marks are breaking into smaller ones. I inspected it with a magnifying glass every month. Single needling is laborious but it is worth it. |
Just curious if you or anyone else has experienced any improvement in texture of their stretch marks in the skin.
For example if your stetch marks were indented did it raise and even out? |
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Mon Jul 26, 2010 2:02 am |
| My stretch marks are still indented but the texture improved. The rough edges are gone and the scar tissue is smoother. They are indented but much less visible. Since some of my stretch marks started to break up I have hopes for further improvement. I have never expected my stretch marks to completely disappear. Any improvement means a lot to me because I have spent so much money in the past with no result. My boyfriend whom I have been for many years said that my stretch marks were less visible. He knows I am needling because I cannot hide it from him. It stays red for many days. I use a 1.5 roller and single needles. |
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Mon Jul 26, 2010 4:26 am |
| well, i can't describe mine, they are much more shallow and in them there are normal skin it remind me of a zebra were dark is normal skin and white is stretch, and I rolled only once, but pretty aggressive, it was swollen for a week and red for a week and a half... and smaller ones i can't even see... |
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he hi |
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Mon Jul 26, 2010 8:01 am |
| how long does the redness and swelling stays after rolling??I don't want to tell my boyfriend when I 'll start rolling .. |
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Thu Jul 29, 2010 3:17 am |
hello everyone this is my first post on EDS however i was reading through this forum for some time now (this really is a great forum btw)
I have some questions concerning dermarolling which i have not been able to find the answer for as i am new to this technique and will be attempting my first rolling within days.
1)What are the effects of rolling the undamaged skin surrounding the stretch marks? if any at all or fairly negligible.
2)What is the procedure immediately before rolling ,as i understood that cleaning/disinfecting area and tool then rolling however i read mention that people apply their topical mixtures such as vit c serum before rolling.Is this advised or can i simply leave it till after?
3)I read also that topical mixtures should be applied asap after rolling before pores close, is this true? i ask because i was taking into consideration showering after then applying or should i forget the shower and dive straight into it.
4) I have not been reading much about matryxl use with derma rolling why is this?
5)I will be using trilastin SR as my source for vitamin A ,does anyone have any views on the effectiveness of this product?
Thank you in advance |
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Thu Jul 29, 2010 5:19 pm |
| PapayaWhip67 wrote: |
So I came on here (to do more research) and see if anybody else has been getting positive results rolling more frequently with a 1.5mm roller. |
No. There are people here who have been doing this for years. Their experience was that you should not do this that often. There are smaller needles for more frequent rolls. It has all been documented and discussed before. |
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RisA
New Member
Joined: 25 Jul 2010
Posts: 4
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Sat Jul 31, 2010 11:27 am |
Thank you both so much for replying, it's so refreshing to hear of this type of sucess.
I would be happy with ANY improvements Even a 1% is better than nothing IMO. |
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Sun Aug 01, 2010 3:24 am |
| i did my first roll on my thighs today. Followed all conceivable instructions, used emla generously with cling wrap for about 1 hour 15mins as well as an ice pack and it hurt like hell! using a 1.5mm i could barely finish the session however i got results just as everyone else did. sunburn, minimal pin point bleeding. what i did do wrong? what can i do to prevent the pain ? it really was horrible |
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Sun Aug 01, 2010 4:20 am |
| stephen1001 wrote: |
| i did my first roll on my thighs today. Followed all conceivable instructions, used emla generously with cling wrap for about 1 hour 15mins as well as an ice pack and it hurt like hell! using a 1.5mm i could barely finish the session however i got results just as everyone else did. sunburn, minimal pin point bleeding. what i did do wrong? what can i do to prevent the pain ? it really was horrible |
How long did you leave the EMLA on? it should be more than 30 mins, then wipe off and start your session. If you've done everything and still think it's painful...Just suck it up and be a man :P |
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