Anyone has heard of Bone facial exercise?
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free skin care · Sat Dec 12, 2009 10:21 am

Asked this already w/ no response - not sure if it was just a dumb question... or no one knew the anwer..

can these be done with cheek and chin implants??

Im guessing maybe not - since it sounds like the bone is maneuvered somewhat to get the affects - but I just wanted to ask to get a straight answer by someone who knows more about this

thanks

free skin care · Sat Dec 12, 2009 11:46 am

I wanted to edit my last post and couldnt.....

I just finished reading the last page.> So basically all of the links and info given arent even for bone massage??

So does that mean maybe implants arent an issue?

free skin care · Sat Dec 12, 2009 12:16 pm

mb935 wrote:

I wanted to edit my last post and couldnt.....

I just finished reading the last page.> So basically all of the links and info given arent even for bone massage??

So does that mean maybe implants arent an issue?

Hopefully critic will see this. I don't think it would affect the implants, as it is the lymphatic drainage massage. I wouldn't worry unless the doc told you not to massage the area.

free skin care · Sat Dec 12, 2009 2:06 pm

Well I really don't know how this works with implants, but as massage is pretty strong it seems to me that it could affect implants. There is no place in the face which is not under the strong pressure with this massage - I think that your doctor is only one who can tell you.

free skin care · Sat Dec 12, 2009 3:42 pm

mb935 wrote:

can these be done with cheek and chin implants??

I would be worried about the exercises that push up on the cheek bones - maybe you would have to modify this aspect and be more gentle. I don't see why you couldn't do the lymphatic drainage aspect of the massage, without all the pushing and shoving of the cheek area. If you've had the cheek implants for a reasonable length of time, the massage might be fine.

But it's always best to be on the safe side and ask your doctor.

free skin care · Sat Dec 12, 2009 4:23 pm

mb935 wrote:

I just finished reading the last page.> So basically all of the links and info given arent even for bone massage??

There are quite a few different massage techniques discussed in this thread, which is why it is no surprise that everyone is getting confused!

The main one being discussed is the Tanaka massage.

There are also links to 'Bone massage'. Such as this one: http://beautystyle.jp.msn.com/beauty/feature/0906korgi/3_1.htm (you need to get google to translate it)

There are also very brief discussions of gua sha (using an instrument to scrape the skin), and tapping your face (more details of both are in the TCM thread).

Also, for what it's worth in my opinion the Tanaka massage is not simply a lymphatic massage, it also incorporates acupressure and elements of 'bone massage'. That is why it works so much better than just a straightforward lymphatic massage.

As to implants, I wouldn't have a clue, maybe try the Tanaka massage with very little pressure in certain areas and see how it goes. But basically this is supposed to be a massage that is done with a firm/strong pressure. Your arms should ache a little after.

free skin care · Sun Dec 13, 2009 3:10 am

Critic just started up a new thread, with some great info about Tanaka which I didn't know and I think people might find interesting. Its purely for the technique and no product selling Very Happy

free skin care · Sun Dec 13, 2009 4:24 am

*mirjana* wrote:

Well I really don't know how this works with implants, but as massage is pretty strong it seems to me that it could affect implants. There is no place in the face which is not under the strong pressure with this massage - I think that your doctor is only one who can tell you.

It does not mention in the book, but agreed that the push cheekbone, N/L are very strong.

free skin care · Mon Dec 14, 2009 3:06 am

For the NL section - are we just supposed to push the nl line itself? I'm trying to figure out how this would get rid of the NL line? Anyone got ideas?

free skin care · Mon Dec 14, 2009 8:09 am

hawthorn,

I think for asian people the concept of straigthening the nose is more like making the bridge of the nose pop out and not being so curvy.
So maybe for your croked nose this is not exactly what you want.

However I have found a site that has lots of japanish goodies including one nose straigtener that gets the whole nose, not just the tip:

http://sagaciousshopping-beauty.blogspot.com/

They are called nose up, or nose straighteners. The one you got seems the coco nose clip.

There are also korean detox patches for your feet. I could give this a try.

hawthorn wrote:

Oh Critic, wanted to ask you, have you heard of Nosehuggies? I just found them online and am very excited! I've been trying to straighten my slightly crooked nose, and have been experimenting thanks to all your info on bone exercises. I have no idea if this works, but am going to give it a try (it's super cheap) I remember you saying Ageless had broadened your nose and didn't like it, maybe this could help?

free skin care · Mon Dec 14, 2009 8:25 am

Is there anyone here who has been doing it for a long time who is not of asian decent? I'm curious as to the long term effects. Both moonstone and Critic say they tried popular american programs and both had horrible results and I'm wondering whether non-asians would end up long term with bad results if this is focused on changing bone. I mean if you build bone, then how do you get rid of it if you build too much?

Also the eye area for us Westerns is different than Asians, so maybe their exercises will effect us differently?

Also with the muscle programs, they tend to say if you stop the exercises the results reverse back over time, but with bone I'm wondering whether they are permanent and if you get build can you undo it?

free skin care · Mon Dec 14, 2009 8:34 am

Jackie284

Here you have some diagrams about location of lymph nodes on the face and neck.

Regardless the Tanaka or bone massage, all what I have heard and done about lymphatic drainage
is to first begin stimulating massaging the lymph nodes. Then massaging in a way you always direct the movements to end up on the nodes.

For an instance when using the vaculift I stimulated the nodes in front of the temples, ears and the ones on the neck. Then I massaged ramdonly but finish directing all the motion to the temples, ears and neck. Same with face brushing. If I use my Up5 for lymphatic purposes I will do it this way too.

BTW it is worth to use the lymphatic massage on your head and back of the neck. Awesome for your hair, de-stressing and excellent in all.

I had some detailed diagrams for the location of head glands but can't find them now.

Jackie284 wrote:

Hi Zentiy,

this looks ver interesting. I have the UP5, but stopped using it because I didn't like the way my face looked after it. However, if I could use it for lymphatic drainage on the body that would be great. Although it is indicated where the lymph nodes are on the body, I'm not sure how one would use it to encourage drainage,

any ideas?

Jackie xx

free skin care · Mon Dec 14, 2009 8:54 am

Hi Zenity,

thanks you so much for this detailed reply, it's really helpful. I'm so pleased i've found a use now for the UP5!

Jackie xx

free skin care · Mon Dec 14, 2009 2:15 pm

Just wanted to point out that the Russian website (which is, after all, aimed at Russians) detailing the Zogan Massage (or Tanaka) has multiple pictures of Westerners on its page. I'm sure this massage would be suitable for everyone.

free skin care · Mon Dec 14, 2009 2:42 pm

Kelliu,

this Russian website has many pictures, but they are not necessarily related to Zogan massage. They go over hundreds of various techniques (exercise, breathing, various massage techniques, etc.). I am not sure of the pictures are of the members, or models though.

However, all the users of it are indeed Russians and they seem to love it and do it daily and I have not seen one negative comment about it either there or on the related Russian forums.

Sorry for the clarification, it is hard to understand without fully understanding the language. I was just trying to help.

HTH

free skin care · Mon Dec 14, 2009 5:57 pm

I think we already have many non-Asian trying the Tanaka massage with good result.

Let me repeat again, I don't think there is ONE product/service/program will fit everyone in the world, and we are all grow-up, please judge it if it suits you before starting.

free skin care · Tue Dec 15, 2009 4:43 am

Critic can you tell us how you judged Ageless and the other American programs you tried if it produced such bad results (to help others from making that same mistake).

Also with the bone stuff, if you build bone in places, how do you stop the build or reverse it if you don't like the results - could you tell me please?

critic wrote:

I think we already have many non-Asian trying the Tanaka massage with good result.

Let me repeat again, I don't think there is ONE product/service/program will fit everyone in the world, and we are all grow-up, please judge it if it suits you before starting.

free skin care · Tue Dec 15, 2009 5:33 am

TheresaMary wrote:

Also with the bone stuff, if you build bone in places, how do you stop the build or reverse it if you don't like the results - could you tell me please?

Hi Teresa, I've just posted on the other thread but will copy it here.
********************************************
Not Critic, but as I have osteoporosis running in my family, I have gained a small amount of knowledge on bones which may help answer your question.

First as an adult, it is hard to 'build up' bones.
Our bone mass lessens as we age. There are two things we can do to help avoid this; taking care of what we eat (less acid, more alkali in our diet) and weight-bearing exercises (ie weight training).
It can be easier for some (myself included) to overbuild our facial muscles, which can be reversed by stopping or changing the facial exercises. The chances of you over-building your facial bones are next to none. As I'm no expert in Bone Massage, I cannot say for sure that BM cannot build up your facial bone structure but common sense tells me that this process would be a relatively slow one so before you ever got to the point of disturbing bone build-up, you would obviously stop.
Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the Bone Massage about maintaining (perhaps restoring?) your youthful bone density rather than changing it?

ps Let me know if you're interested in acid/alkali in our diet and how it affects our bones.

free skin care · Tue Dec 15, 2009 6:29 am

TheresaMary,

I don't think the bone exercise is to build up bone?! Why you will think so?

The link that I have posted about bone exercises only has 4 exercises, the complete program (book & DVD) has 10+ exercises for the face. I have repeated many many times that

1) I bought the program in Oct, only tried a few times and can't offer much recommendation. I recommend people to try the Tanaka massage, but I don't remember I encourage people to try it until I know what is all about.

2) if you go back to our early discussion, the bone exercise is common in Japan and Korea for people who wish to change the shape of the face. (remember the before/after masks photos?) I have a round face, I am interested to change it to oval. However, if you are not interested to change the shape of your face, just ignore the bone exercises.

3) After all, you can't rely the 4 exercises on the link because it is not a complete exercise.

free skin care · Tue Dec 15, 2009 6:53 am

TheresaMary wrote:

Critic can you tell us how you judged Ageless and the other American programs you tried if it produced such bad results (to help others from making that same mistake).

I am not an expert in this facial exercise business, I am just an end-user. And I already made my comparison in the earliest discussion and got cursed by people in the facial exercise business, I don't want to get another curse before 2010. My advice for everyone is - don't try anything that you don't feel comfortable to start with.

I am actually very interested to know why will take you so much consideration for a 5-minutes massage? Maybe it's cross culture difference?

Have you tried?

free skin care · Tue Dec 15, 2009 6:59 am

I have tried the exercises, and its change my face for sure, but I was not sure how it did so and not liking the results its giving me so far, and want to undo much of the damage that I have done using it. As you brought it to us here, I thought you new more about it. That’s all.

I have done the 5 minute massage for a couple of weeks now, but then it go t me thinking it must have the name bone exercises for a reason, and I thought that was because it changed the bones. Someone else have told me its not building the bone, just their positioning, otherwise how could it make round faces oval huh answer me that one.

You didn’t get cursed, you stated your opinion and questions and got answers - but you don’t want me to get answers to my questions - how comes?

Miranda definitely interested in learning more about the acid/alkali.

free skin care · Tue Dec 15, 2009 7:12 am

I thought you've been doing tanaka's massage these past weeks? tanaka's massage is not bone massage. It's just a lymphatic drainage massage.
I dont think critic knows the answers to your questions. Besides it's not like she invented the programme.
Does it matter if you know the science behind it?

free skin care · Tue Dec 15, 2009 7:14 am

Hi TheresaMary,

I think that there might be some miscommunication going here-- you might already be aware of this, but just to be perfectly clear, the Tanaka/ Zogan massage is *not* the same as the bone massage.

Critic introduced both of these different massage types in the original thread, which may have caused a bit of confusion.

As I understand it, the bone massage may be able to alter the shape of your face via bone structure.

The Tanaka/ Zogan massage does not claim to do this; however, it *does* claim to restore aging facial features.

Critic has been doing the Tanaka/ Zogan massage since April (I believe); she has only dabbled a bit in the bone massage & is currently investigating it further.

Hope this helps!

free skin care · Tue Dec 15, 2009 7:59 am

Hi JLM

I know from Critic's messages that she felt that the bone massage/Tanaka were very similar in many places except you exerted more pressure thats why I posted the question and I still think its a valid question.

The bone massage Critic said she read could alter the shape of the face, and Faeriedust clarified it by explaining that its not so much about changing the bone, but the positions of the bone.

Theresa

free skin care · Tue Dec 15, 2009 9:21 am

Please let's not have this thread go the same way as so many others do.

TheresaMary, can you tell us whether you have been doing the 4 bone massage exercises or the Tanaka lymph massage? And then we can try to unravel what has happened to you from there.
If you are experiencing something negative from doing the massage, then it will be good for us to understand and therefore avoid doing the same.

I will PM you the acid/alkali details.

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