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Fri Dec 18, 2009 12:30 pm  |
TheresaMary,
I am so sorry for your ordeal and happy that it is finally over.
I have not started the Bone Program, I only used Tanaka Massage and I am not using full force.
I hope you will have a complete and fast recovery.
Perhaps, something more mild like dry skin brushing would work for you in the future?
Good luck! |
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Early 50s, Skin: combin.,semi-sensitive, fair with occasional breakouts, some old acne scars, freckles, under-eye wrinkles; Redhead with hazel eyes |
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Fri Dec 18, 2009 1:59 pm |
When I saw an English translation of the Bone Massage I saw that the directions warn us not to press on the bone itself (for example, don't press on the cheek bone)but do press on what was translated as the 'carpal bone' (in the example of the cheek bone what was called the 'carpal cheek bone' was located just under the cheek bone itself)
I have interpreted via intution and common sense (so i don't know if this is correct or not) that the translated phrase 'carpal bone' means 'cartilage.
So in the example of the cheek area, the direction is telling us NOT to press on the cheekbone itself, but press upwards on the cartilage located directly under the cheekbone so that the cheek bone is being pressed firmly upward but from 'within' the cartilage just under it (instead of from the center of the cheekbone itself).
My undertanding from the translation of the 4 exercises shown, is that, since all of them tell us not to press on the related bone itself, but on the 'carpal bone' near by.... that pressing firmly against the bone via the cartilage right next to the bone, is the way to perform them. Anyway i've been doing them like this.
(Just to clarify, Iam speaking of the 4 exercises that are currently available online for the Bone Massage not the Tanaka massage.)
Does anyone have any feedback on this? Critic what do you think? |
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71 years, primarily raw living food 35 years(vegan 45 years) herbal tea decoctions, homeopathy, TCM, facial massage, facial exercises, vacu-lifting, gua aha, shiatsu/acupressure, intention, home microcurrrent |
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Fri Dec 18, 2009 3:04 pm |
| And just to add to Jasminerosey's post, the English translation of the Tanaka massage says you should never massage to the point of pain. |
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Fri Dec 18, 2009 3:07 pm |
Well, I don't know about this... carpal bones are bones - not the cartilage. I wish that my older son is now here. He is good in anatomy.
I found that carpal bones are placed in hand - maybe to look at this link http://anatomy.med.umich.edu/surface/upper_limb/wrist.html
In that context, I don't know is there any carpal bones on head. I found that there are carpal bones on the legs also, and that those bones are short bones (like those on the pictures on upper link). I wish my son is here  |
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trying to stay young and to learn English a little bit better  so if it make you laugh - don't LOL  |
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Fri Dec 18, 2009 3:10 pm |
Hi everyone,
I was thinking by carpal, it meant the 'carpal' point of the hand is what should be touching the face ??
Jackie xx |
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Fri Dec 18, 2009 4:18 pm |
TheresaMary, I'm so sorry to hear about your ruptured ligament. Wow that is quite something. And I'm so glad that the inflammation has gone down.
I don't quite understand how it happened, were you pressing very hard on your jaw as well as pushing it at the same time?
Anyway, wishing you all the best. |
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Fri Dec 18, 2009 4:37 pm |
| Tonia wrote: |
| OK, now I feel really silly. I have been using jojoba oil. It has not occurred to me that I should try something different. Do you have any suggestions as to what I should try next? Maybe I should try a castor oil and jojoba mix. Or an olive oil and castor oil mix. |
Jojoba should be fine - it's not really an oil but a wax ester and is very close to our own skin sebum. Still, if you're having problems then certainly try something else. But I wouldn't use Castor Oil. Castor Oil is used in the Oil Cleansing Method because it has a purging effect on the skin. It might exacerbate your problems.
Apricot Oil is good as is Avocado or Macadamia. |
_________________
Born 1950. There's a new cream on the market that gets rid of wrinkles - you smear it on the mirror!! |
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Fri Dec 18, 2009 4:49 pm |
Theresa - I can't believe you have "beaten yourself up" by doing the massage. How hard were you pressing? You must have been very aggressive. Of course, we're all guilty of going at it too hard. I took a piece of skin off my face with my microdermabrasian machine the other day!
I guess it's a case of everything in moderation - I would continue with the massage but be very gentle. |
_________________
Born 1950. There's a new cream on the market that gets rid of wrinkles - you smear it on the mirror!! |
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Fri Dec 18, 2009 5:33 pm |
| Keliu wrote: |
| Tonia wrote: |
| OK, now I feel really silly. I have been using jojoba oil. It has not occurred to me that I should try something different. Do you have any suggestions as to what I should try next? Maybe I should try a castor oil and jojoba mix. Or an olive oil and castor oil mix. |
Jojoba should be fine - it's not really an oil but a wax ester and is very close to our own skin sebum. Still, if you're having problems then certainly try something else. But I wouldn't use Castor Oil. Castor Oil is used in the Oil Cleansing Method because it has a purging effect on the skin. It might exacerbate your problems.
Apricot Oil is good as is Avocado or Macadamia. |
Hi tonia
just my 2 cents to complicate things....
i have experienced cystic acne and i break out very easily. To my astonishment i have found that the Oil Cleansing Method with Castor Oil actually clears up my acne (i've been doing it for a month +). Castor oil does have a purging effect on the skin, and it also has a drying effect -- in my experience the castor seems to bring out the blockages and then clears them faster than anything i've ever used for my acne (i do about 70 castor 15 evening primrose and 15 rose hip seed). I had a cyst on my chin that had been around for 2 weeks and showd NO sign of leaving when i dared to try Oil Cleansing - the cyst was half the size in 2 days and soon dissappeared) Between OCM and this massage my skin is finally coming back into balance and clarity and dare i say beauty.... |
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Fri Dec 18, 2009 5:41 pm |
Moongoddess - I absolutely agree. I too am a long term user of OCM (with Castor Oil) and have never had a break out since I started cleansing with this method. Plus it completely cleared my daughter's acne. But the Castor Oil is intended to be thoroughly washed off the skin after the massage.
For a lymph drainage massage in which the oil remains on the skin, I wouldn't use Castor Oil. |
_________________
Born 1950. There's a new cream on the market that gets rid of wrinkles - you smear it on the mirror!! |
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Fri Dec 18, 2009 7:29 pm |
oh, i see what you're saying, keliu. i didn't connect that because i combine the lymph massage and the oil cleansing both am and pm. I take my oc oils slather on my face and do the massage/drainage when i finish that i take a small bit more of oil and do (actually i consider it continuing) the oil cleansing...do you think that's okay? comments insights welcome
ps...it really is amazing what the oc/castor does for acne -- what is it about that oil specifically, just the purging and drying combo? |
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Fri Dec 18, 2009 8:29 pm |
| moongoddess wrote: |
oh, i see what you're saying, keliu. i didn't connect that because i combine the lymph massage and the oil cleansing both am and pm. I take my oc oils slather on my face and do the massage/drainage when i finish that i take a small bit more of oil and do (actually i consider it continuing) the oil cleansing...do you think that's okay? comments insights welcome
ps...it really is amazing what the oc/castor does for acne -- what is it about that oil specifically, just the purging and drying combo? |
If it's working out for you, I wouldn't change a thing. Since I started slathering oil on my face I have completely stopped breaking out - but unfortunately, everyone's different. |
_________________
Born 1950. There's a new cream on the market that gets rid of wrinkles - you smear it on the mirror!! |
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Fri Dec 18, 2009 8:42 pm |
carpal bones are small bones in hands( everyone knows about carpal tunnel syndrome right?) bones in the feet are tarsal bones ....what I understood from translation abt it was that carpal bones should be used in the sense that bone touching bone not the ligaments or other soft tissues of the hands or cheeks. Jackie mentioned when she said "carpal point" meaning carpal bones of the hands touching the cheek bones (bone-bone contact)makes sense?   |
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Fri Dec 18, 2009 9:44 pm |
Tonya,
you should try to find a combination that would work for you.
I tried several - Castor oil, Castor oil+ some other oils, argan oil, avocado oil, rosehip seed oil, etc.
The ones that worked best for me were argan oil, hemp oil and rosehip seed oil. However, I also know people who react to them yet can tolerate others that my skin does not like.
Argan, macadamia and hemp would be my 1st choice to try, since they seem to help with inflamed skin and thus should not cause more problems.
I am not an expert, so it is based on a very little knowledge and a few experiments.
Good luck! |
_________________
Early 50s, Skin: combin.,semi-sensitive, fair with occasional breakouts, some old acne scars, freckles, under-eye wrinkles; Redhead with hazel eyes |
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Sat Dec 19, 2009 1:42 am |
| Keliu wrote: |
Theresa - I can't believe you have "beaten yourself up" by doing the massage. How hard were you pressing? You must have been very aggressive. Of course, we're all guilty of going at it too hard. I took a piece of skin off my face with my microdermabrasian machine the other day!
I guess it's a case of everything in moderation - I would continue with the massage but be very gentle. |
Keliu, Theresa hurt herself with "bone exercises" not with Tanaka massage which we all practicing.
There is no way to hurt yourself like that with Tanaka massage, so don't worry |
_________________
trying to stay young and to learn English a little bit better so if it make you laugh - don't LOL |
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Sat Dec 19, 2009 1:51 am |
| sigma wrote: |
Tonya,
you should try to find a combination that would work for you.
I tried several - Castor oil, Castor oil+ some other oils, argan oil, avocado oil, rosehip seed oil, etc.
The ones that worked best for me were argan oil, hemp oil and rosehip seed oil. However, I also know people who react to them yet can tolerate others that my skin does not like.
Argan, macadamia and hemp would be my 1st choice to try, since they seem to help with inflamed skin and thus should not cause more problems.
I am not an expert, so it is based on a very little knowledge and a few experiments.
Good luck! |
I personally don't like oil because found too greasy, and takes forever to clean my face after massage. I wonder will it cause breakout if some of you are using the oil for am and pm massage? Do you wash your face with cleanser after massaging? |
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Sat Dec 19, 2009 2:33 am |
| critic wrote: |
| I personally don't like oil because found too greasy, and takes forever to clean my face after massage. I wonder will it cause breakout if some of you are using the oil for am and pm massage? Do you wash your face with cleanser after massaging? |
I'm a huge oil fan - it's saved my skin. I cleanse using OCM then apply serums and finally oil. So no, I don't wash the oil off after the massage. I actually find the massage aids in the absorption of the oil. But you only need a few drops - don't go using a tablespoon or anything like that. And yes, I use a facial oil am and pm. |
_________________
Born 1950. There's a new cream on the market that gets rid of wrinkles - you smear it on the mirror!! |
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Sat Dec 19, 2009 3:25 am |
Personally I think both Tonia's and my (and a few others) outbreaks are down to the massage.
Niether of us have had a problem with spots before. I've been using hempseed oil for the massage and I've never had a problem with HSO before. Once I started breaking out I tried macadamia oil but I'm still getting the same problem.
The clustering of my spots (it's not acne) are following the line of massage for ex. 3 & 4 or ex 5. The clustering is moving upwards with time, first they were round my chin and upper lip then my nostrils and now they're beginning to creep along the edges of my nose.
I also suffered spots when I first started doing the massage along the edges of my face but put that down to not doing the final lymph line clearing move.
I think this massage when done correctly is powerful. The results I'm getting from my face shape tells me this. The spots are an annoying side-effect but worth it! |
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Sat Dec 19, 2009 7:10 am |
| critic wrote: |
| I personally don't like oil because found too greasy, and takes forever to clean my face after massage. I wonder will it cause breakout if some of you are using the oil for am and pm massage? Do you wash your face with cleanser after massaging? |
I never wash my face after morning massage, just wipe face a little with a dry towel. Face stays so soft. After that I put moisturizer on top and wait until my skin absorb it to use make up foundation. It works great for me right now. My skin is extra dry because of RA and because is extremely cold (brrr), windy, snowy.. and this two layers protects me really good. In the evening, I also wipe oil from face and than wash it with Rogj Sap no Sap cleanser. After that a little toner and RA.
So I use oil twice a day, and my skin is clear like sun, pores are not clogged at all, and not so much flakes of RA as could be expected. |
_________________
trying to stay young and to learn English a little bit better so if it make you laugh - don't LOL |
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Sat Dec 19, 2009 7:17 am |
| simpleMD wrote: |
| carpal bones are small bones in hands( everyone knows about carpal tunnel syndrome right?) bones in the feet are tarsal bones ....what I understood from translation abt it was that carpal bones should be used in the sense that bone touching bone not the ligaments or other soft tissues of the hands or cheeks. Jackie mentioned when she said "carpal point" meaning carpal bones of the hands touching the cheek bones (bone-bone contact)makes sense? |
Yes that makes sense to me. And I think that is shown on the example of two forefingers. Bone to bone. |
_________________
trying to stay young and to learn English a little bit better so if it make you laugh - don't LOL |
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Sat Dec 19, 2009 7:46 am |
| moongoddess wrote: |
Hi tonia
just my 2 cents to complicate things....
i have experienced cystic acne and i break out very easily. To my astonishment i have found that the Oil Cleansing Method with Castor Oil actually clears up my acne (i've been doing it for a month +). Castor oil does have a purging effect on the skin, and it also has a drying effect -- in my experience the castor seems to bring out the blockages and then clears them faster than anything i've ever used for my acne (i do about 70 castor 15 evening primrose and 15 rose hip seed). I had a cyst on my chin that had been around for 2 weeks and showd NO sign of leaving when i dared to try Oil Cleansing - the cyst was half the size in 2 days and soon dissappeared) Between OCM and this massage my skin is finally coming back into balance and clarity and dare i say beauty.... |
This is right. I got pimples when I added jojoba in majority in my oil, but when it was in balance with castor it worked well. |
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Sat Dec 19, 2009 8:27 am |
| moongoddess wrote: |
oh, i see what you're saying, keliu. i didn't connect that because i combine the lymph massage and the oil cleansing both am and pm. I take my oc oils slather on my face and do the massage/drainage when i finish that i take a small bit more of oil and do (actually i consider it continuing) the oil cleansing...do you think that's okay? comments insights welcome
ps...it really is amazing what the oc/castor does for acne -- what is it about that oil specifically, just the purging and drying combo? |
I did this last night almost exactly the way you describe it. The only difference is, I used 50% castor oil, 25% olive oil, and 25% kukui oil. To my amazement, my spots were much improved this morning. I'm not sure if it's possible to see that big of a difference over night or if was something else. Time will tell. I will check back in in a few days to let you know how it's going.
Thank you for everyone's input. |
_________________
I always lie about my age. I tell everyone I'm 10 years older than I really am. Everyone thinks I look great! |
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Sat Dec 19, 2009 8:47 am |
| Vor wrote: |
| moongoddess wrote: |
Hi tonia
just my 2 cents to complicate things....
i have experienced cystic acne and i break out very easily. To my astonishment i have found that the Oil Cleansing Method with Castor Oil actually clears up my acne (i've been doing it for a month +). Castor oil does have a purging effect on the skin, and it also has a drying effect -- in my experience the castor seems to bring out the blockages and then clears them faster than anything i've ever used for my acne (i do about 70 castor 15 evening primrose and 15 rose hip seed). I had a cyst on my chin that had been around for 2 weeks and showd NO sign of leaving when i dared to try Oil Cleansing - the cyst was half the size in 2 days and soon dissappeared) Between OCM and this massage my skin is finally coming back into balance and clarity and dare i say beauty.... |
This is right. I got pimples when I added jojoba in majority in my oil, but when it was in balance with castor it worked well. |
This makes sense to me. The massage purges the lower layers and the castor oil purges the top layer of the skin. At least, that's my assumption. Without purging the top layer as well, it can cause cystic acne. That's what improved so much last night. The deep swelling you get from cystic acne disappeared and now I have regular spots that should clear up quickly.
I hope this isn't a fluke. I am getting positive face shaping and lifting results from the massage and would like to continue. |
_________________
I always lie about my age. I tell everyone I'm 10 years older than I really am. Everyone thinks I look great! |
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Sat Dec 19, 2009 4:21 pm |
OMG TheresaMary that is unbelievable!!!! I am glad you went to the doctor this could have gotten much worse!
Well I can be added to the list of people breaking out since starting the Tanaka Massage. I have little spots and a large cystic bump on my chin.
I have been using avocado oil for the massage and then I wash off in the shower. Not understanding the OCM I am wondering if I should try a caster oil mixture for the massage and whether washing it off is counter productive:?  |
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mid 40's, blonde, blue eyes, normal skin, DIY skin regime, AALS - biggest problem undereye - getting much better with AALS & DIY serums. |
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Sat Dec 19, 2009 4:57 pm |
Alley,
I break out from avocado oil, so even though it is a fantastic oil, it does not suit my combination skin.
HTH |
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Early 50s, Skin: combin.,semi-sensitive, fair with occasional breakouts, some old acne scars, freckles, under-eye wrinkles; Redhead with hazel eyes |
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