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Tue Jan 26, 2010 7:19 am  |
Also ask your doctor if he has the Juvederm Plus with the built-in anesthetic. If you have this, you don't have to have the initial anesthetic injections. I've had it and thought it was very good - it didn't hurt as much as when I had the Restalane.
I know exactly what you mean about the fat loss and the lower half of the face getting heavy - that's my problem exactly. I try to go around smiling all the time, because when my face is relaxed I look like a sad old hound-dog! That's why I love having the cheeks done so much - it gives you back that perkiness. |
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Born 1950. There's a new cream on the market that gets rid of wrinkles - you smear it on the mirror!! |
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Tue Jan 26, 2010 7:39 am |
Ha ha ha yes!! That is exactly what I do!! I have mastered the half-smirk but grow tired of having to do it all the time just to give the look of having cheeks  ....I too look tired and saggy when my face is relaxed so I smile or half smirk all the time, which in turn causes smile lines and the like  If it ain't one thing it's another...
Will be sure to ask about the Plus when I go...I appreciate all your advice! |
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Female: 42...Fair/Dry...Brown Hair/Green Eyes...Using: Born Again MSM Cream...Country Divine Emu Serum...Juvederm...Botox...Retin-A .05%...Easy Eye Solutions...Started 2/9/12 with Skin Bio Skin Signals Cream and TTT, Spot treating with TriRed |
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Tue Jan 26, 2010 2:33 pm |
| bren21 wrote: |
Ha ha ha yes!! That is exactly what I do!! I have mastered the half-smirk but grow tired of having to do it all the time just to give the look of having cheeks ....I too look tired and saggy when my face is relaxed so I smile or half smirk all the time, which in turn causes smile lines and the like If it ain't one thing it's another...
Will be sure to ask about the Plus when I go...I appreciate all your advice! |
I am wondering for the ladies in the US that don't have voluma yet (thicker, injected deeper) whether it is an option to ask if there PS/derm will inject the Juvederm plus in the same way. I have read on other boards that many PS believe in injecting the undereyes with a cannula.
I just find this to be a far better method of injection. Only one injection site, so only one possible bruise. A deeper injection of product, so better shape of product (IMO) and less movement and disruption of product? I am just wondering how much of this is the reason that the voluma lasts longer (supposedly, I know it didn't for you Keliu)..
I am going to ask my derm if he can put a little more under my eyes using this technique. It will have to be regular Juvederm Plus as I think the voluma only comes in 2ml.
Just some thoughts... |
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47 years old. Battling aging and pigmentation. Using Tria and Pico and Dermapen. |
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Tue Jan 26, 2010 5:18 pm |
| bren21 wrote: |
| I too look tired and saggy when my face is relaxed so I smile or half smirk all the time, which in turn causes smile lines and the like If it ain't one thing it's another... |
Not to mention the reaction you get from complete strangers who thing that you're smiling at them !! |
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Born 1950. There's a new cream on the market that gets rid of wrinkles - you smear it on the mirror!! |
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Wed Jan 27, 2010 8:32 am |
[quote="Keliu"]Dr Rose - In the past I've looked into having Sculptra but have always been put off by the enormous amount of horror stories that are on the net. So many people complain of having lumps, and some say that their faces have been deformed by the product. I've read that the skill of the injector has allot to do with attaining successful results.
What's your opinion on all of this? TIA[/quote]
I personally love Sculptra.
There was a big difference between the way it was released in Canada and the US.
In Canada, the manufacturer tightly controlled the training for the product and only sold it to doctors who had been trained properly. They confined the product to specialists to be sure of the quality of the injectors.
In the US, the product was available for AIDS patients first and many clinics started using it for cosmetic use off-label. My understanding was that anyone with a Sanofi-Aventis account could order the product and use it without proper training.
The thing about Sculptra is that it is different from any other product and has to be injected differently.
The horror stories are from cases where the product was injected incorrectly.
Correctly used, Sculptra is a wonderful product. I really like it for faces that need volume in several places.
If you just need volume under your eyes, filler is much easier but if you need volume in your temples and cheeks and lower face and around your mouth, etc., Sculptra is great. |
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I blog at Dr. Rose's blog |
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Wed Jan 27, 2010 8:45 am |
[quote="bren21"]I also have a question for Dr Rose in regards to cheek fillers....
I am planning on having filler put in my cheeks next month by a local plastic surgeon. I have problems with volume loss and also have NL's and slight marionettes from said volume loss. I am a Juvederm user in my NL's with my last injection being almost a year ago...I see as of late, my NL's are starting to get more prominent which means the Juve is wearing off....
My question is, I cannot afford to have both the cheeks and NL's done...I see you mention that getting the cheeks done "relieves" the look of the NL's to a certain degree. Would I be better off trying my luck spending money on the cheeks and not the NL's? I am hoping the cheeks would alleviate the NL's enough that I wouldn't need anything in there....[/quote]
Hi Bren,
I definitely agree with Keliu and suggest you go for the cheeks.
Restoring volume to the cheeks helps the cheeks and lower lids and lifts NL folds, marionettes, and jowls.
The other great thing about the cheeks is that people see you are looking great but don't see what you have done.
I hope this helps.
Dr. Rose |
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I blog at Dr. Rose's blog |
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Wed Jan 27, 2010 2:19 pm |
i was looking at testing results for sculptura...because like most woman i want to look 'ageless' ...even though i have greatly mxed feelings about synthetically adding volume to my face (concerns that have nothing to do with safety)...
however, i also have grave concerns about the side effects..and other safety issues of this injected substance....
so i was looking online..and found a pdf file i can't relocate just now..and am not sure i will revisit this thread..so felt it worthwhile, anyway, to bring these issues up ..as any of you can research this further.
the company that manufactures scupltura had the statistics from 3 cinical trials that were done to explore the results/safety, etc of this product....in a 2 year follow-up (i'm not sure if this was a 2 year follow up of all 3 clinical trials or only just one of the three) 26 of the subjects (52%) HAD 'BUMPS' (not the scientific term)in their skin tissue (i believe they were not visible on the surface though)..
i would imagine that well-trained doctors/etal were used in these clinical trials....so i guess i am (with god will, politely, in the name of scientific investigation) challenging Dr. Roses's assertion that the bumps only occur when non-trained doctors inject sculptura (although i'm sure this also would play an even greater role in the outcome)
also...at the time of this pdf file i was reading (which perhaps may have been very outdated) clinical investigation of the side effects/safety of scuptura were only conducted up to 2 years..although the company said it was involved in conducting more clincal follow-up.
i h |
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71 years, primarily raw living food 35 years(vegan 45 years) herbal tea decoctions, homeopathy, TCM, facial massage, facial exercises, vacu-lifting, gua aha, shiatsu/acupressure, intention, home microcurrrent |
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Wed Jan 27, 2010 2:23 pm |
| oh my! I meant I was challenging Dr Rose's statement with 'good' will, not 'god' will! |
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71 years, primarily raw living food 35 years(vegan 45 years) herbal tea decoctions, homeopathy, TCM, facial massage, facial exercises, vacu-lifting, gua aha, shiatsu/acupressure, intention, home microcurrrent |
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Wed Jan 27, 2010 2:41 pm |
[quote="jasminerosey"]i was looking at testing results for sculptura...because like most woman i want to look 'ageless' ...even though i have greatly mxed feelings about synthetically adding volume to my face (concerns that have nothing to do with safety)...
however, i also have grave concerns about the side effects..and other safety issues of this injected substance....
so i was looking online..and found a pdf file i can't relocate just now..and am not sure i will revisit this thread..so felt it worthwhile, anyway, to bring these issues up ..as any of you can research this further.
the company that manufactures scupltura had the statistics from 3 cinical trials that were done to explore the results/safety, etc of this product....in a 2 year follow-up (i'm not sure if this was a 2 year follow up of all 3 clinical trials or only just one of the three) 26 of the subjects (52%) HAD 'BUMPS' (not the scientific term)in their skin tissue (i believe they were not visible on the surface though)..
i would imagine that well-trained doctors/etal were used in these clinical trials....so i guess i am (with god will, politely, in the name of scientific investigation) challenging Dr. Roses's assertion that the bumps only occur when non-trained doctors inject sculptura (although i'm sure this also would play an even greater role in the outcome)
also...at the time of this pdf file i was reading (which perhaps may have been very outdated) clinical investigation of the side effects/safety of scuptura were only conducted up to 2 years..although the company said it was involved in conducting more clincal follow-up.
i h[/quote]
Hi jasminerosey,
I wasn't trying to imply that nodules do not occur with Sculptra. I don't consider a nodule a "horror story."
The horror stories that I have heard of with Sculptra involve firm spikes all over the face and that is definitely a result of poor injection technique.
I myself have a nodule from Sculptra. It is not outwardly visible, only palpable. I have an excellent treatment here for nodules with my Accent radiofrequency machine and don't find the nodule enough of a problem to bother treating it.
I have seen some amazing transformations with Sculptra. I have not had any safety concerns with it. My clients have been very happy with their results.
One of the reasons I love Sculptra is because it stimulates your own tissues to do the work of making new collagen. It really restores the youthful volume and shape of your face.
Do I recommend Sculptra for everyone I see? No.
But for the right person, it is a wonderful treatment.
All the best,
Dr. Rose |
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I blog at Dr. Rose's blog |
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Wed Jan 27, 2010 2:47 pm |
| jasminerosey wrote: |
i was looking at testing results for sculptura...because like most woman i want to look 'ageless' ...even though i have greatly mxed feelings about synthetically adding volume to my face (concerns that have nothing to do with safety)...
however, i also have grave concerns about the side effects..and other safety issues of this injected substance....
so i was looking online..and found a pdf file i can't relocate just now..and am not sure i will revisit this thread..so felt it worthwhile, anyway, to bring these issues up ..as any of you can research this further.
the company that manufactures scupltura had the statistics from 3 cinical trials that were done to explore the results/safety, etc of this product....in a 2 year follow-up (i'm not sure if this was a 2 year follow up of all 3 clinical trials or only just one of the three) 26 of the subjects (52%) HAD 'BUMPS' (not the scientific term)in their skin tissue (i believe they were not visible on the surface though)..
i would imagine that well-trained doctors/etal were used in these clinical trials....so i guess i am (with god will, politely, in the name of scientific investigation) challenging Dr. Roses's assertion that the bumps only occur when non-trained doctors inject sculptura (although i'm sure this also would play an even greater role in the outcome)
also...at the time of this pdf file i was reading (which perhaps may have been very outdated) clinical investigation of the side effects/safety of scuptura were only conducted up to 2 years..although the company said it was involved in conducting more clincal follow-up.
i h |
Jasminerosey...I have had sculptra injected maybe 10-15 times over the past 8 years by a doctor who specialises in it somewhat here. He uses a technique where he dilutes it more than is specified by the manufacturer.
However my early rounds almost all produced these "nodules" or bumps. B/c the product is designed for the body to make collagen around it...if you get a bit of sculptra that isn't well dispersed for whatever reason, you will get a nodule. In theory it can be avoided by better dilution, and strict adherence to the massage protocol.
These nodules were never visible for me and never caused me a problem and all now all gone.
My more recent rounds did not produce nodules but sadly the sculptra did not give me enough result this time either. So I switched to voluma for my cheeks.
HTH |
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47 years old. Battling aging and pigmentation. Using Tria and Pico and Dermapen. |
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Wed Jan 27, 2010 3:08 pm |
thanks so much for your responses, Dr. Rose...and snowqueen (love your name)....good to know that the nodules can dissipate. ( and i am absolutely intriqued by your radio frequency machine, Dr. Rose)
one of the reasons a nodule that didn't dissove would be problematic for me is that (i believe, but would have to check into it for sure)that it would block the energy flow in the energetic meridians (associated with whatever area the nodules appeared in ala TCM...and other energetic systems)that when stimulated also, imo, add to facial beauty/regeneration..and connect to internal organs that when not functioning fully also lead to the deterioration of facial tissues.
Anyway, at some point, as i age, and if sag becomes too overwhelming, even with all my holistic rejuvenation techniques, i may be guided to opt for this procedure, too (i'll pm you Dr. Rose...for your whereabouts....may be worth the trip to Cananda..'just in case') |
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71 years, primarily raw living food 35 years(vegan 45 years) herbal tea decoctions, homeopathy, TCM, facial massage, facial exercises, vacu-lifting, gua aha, shiatsu/acupressure, intention, home microcurrrent |
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Wed Jan 27, 2010 3:09 pm |
thanks so much for your responses, Dr. Rose...and snowqueen (love your name)....good to know that the nodules can dissipate. ( and i am absolutely intriqued by your radio frequency machine, Dr. Rose)
one of the reasons a nodule that didn't dissove would be problematic for me is that (i believe, but would have to check into it for sure)that it would block the energy flow in the energetic meridians (associated with whatever area the nodules appeared in ala TCM...and other energetic systems)that when stimulated also, imo, add to facial beauty/regeneration..and connect to internal organs that when not functioning fully also lead to the deterioration of facial tissues.
Anyway, at some point, as i age, and if sag becomes too overwhelming, even with all my holistic rejuvenation techniques, i may be guided to opt for this procedure, too (i'll pm you Dr. Rose...for your whereabouts....may be worth the trip to Cananda..'just in case') |
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71 years, primarily raw living food 35 years(vegan 45 years) herbal tea decoctions, homeopathy, TCM, facial massage, facial exercises, vacu-lifting, gua aha, shiatsu/acupressure, intention, home microcurrrent |
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Wed Jan 27, 2010 5:54 pm |
Dr Rose - thanks so much for your responses. It's very helpful to hear from someone who has experience in this field.
I would also like to hear your opinion of fat transfer to the cheeks. As I posted earlier, I don't have a very good history with fillers, I love the results but they don't last. How do you think I would go with fat transfer?
Also, do you know if the Vaculifter could be used for massaging the cheeks after Sculptra is injected? Thanks!
....and, God help you Jasminerosey!! |
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Born 1950. There's a new cream on the market that gets rid of wrinkles - you smear it on the mirror!! |
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Wed Jan 27, 2010 7:56 pm |
| Does anyone know if restylane or perlane can be injected and used to increase volume in the cheeks? Which product will yield the best results? Thanks! |
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50 Is definitely NOT nifty!! |
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Thu Jan 28, 2010 1:42 am |
| kims wrote: |
| Does anyone know if restylane or perlane can be injected and used to increase volume in the cheeks? Which product will yield the best results? Thanks! |
All the top manufacturers of fillers are now producing thicker versions of their fillers especially to be used in the cheeks - they include Juvederm Plus and Voluma. However, not all clinics use the same products, so this is something that must be discussed with the doctor or nurse of your choice. |
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Born 1950. There's a new cream on the market that gets rid of wrinkles - you smear it on the mirror!! |
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Thu Jan 28, 2010 3:00 am |
Thanks every one for your helpful information. In regards to these nodules, is this a valid concern for all fillers or merely something that happens most often with Sculptra?
To me, if it happened less often with say Radiesse, I would likely opt for the Radiesse more frequently than having the Sculptra on a less frequent basis.
Not saying I would never try the Sculptra though or a more permanent like filler...but I too have heard of these lumps and bumps from Sculptra, but it seems to me I've heard lumps and bumps on occasion for most fillers....and as mentioned, these can occur due to injection technique.
In any case, I will definitely heed the advice and give the cheeks a go around this time and see what results I achieve. |
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Female: 42...Fair/Dry...Brown Hair/Green Eyes...Using: Born Again MSM Cream...Country Divine Emu Serum...Juvederm...Botox...Retin-A .05%...Easy Eye Solutions...Started 2/9/12 with Skin Bio Skin Signals Cream and TTT, Spot treating with TriRed |
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Thu Jan 28, 2010 3:47 am |
From all my reading, lumps are a major issue with Sculptra - but Dr Rose has explained the situation there very well I think. Sculptra is not a filler as such, it binds with your own collagen to "grow". Restalane, Juverderm etc. are just instant fillers. It is possible to have small lumps form if the filler hasn't been injected evenly, but the issue is not as problematic as that with Sculptra.
However, when the cheeks are injected, the filler is placed very deeply, near the bone - therefore, small lumps aren't noticeable. Let's face it, what you're after is two big lumps!
Good luck with it all - let us know how you get on. I'm sure you'll love it. Just start saving for all the upkeep! |
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Born 1950. There's a new cream on the market that gets rid of wrinkles - you smear it on the mirror!! |
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Thu Jan 28, 2010 3:49 am |
| Snowqueen - where did you get your Sculptra done? |
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Born 1950. There's a new cream on the market that gets rid of wrinkles - you smear it on the mirror!! |
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Thu Jan 28, 2010 8:58 am |
| i realized i didn't articulate that the 'nodules' didn't form (they were called something else in the clinical trial stats...that started with a 'p'...but i believe both words refer to little bumps) until the 7th or so month after being injected with the Sculptura...and they were not something that showed up immediately. The trials indicated that in some people these 'nodules' dissipated on there own and in some they didn't. |
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71 years, primarily raw living food 35 years(vegan 45 years) herbal tea decoctions, homeopathy, TCM, facial massage, facial exercises, vacu-lifting, gua aha, shiatsu/acupressure, intention, home microcurrrent |
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Thu Jan 28, 2010 9:06 am |
Keliu, i'm also interested in fat transfer...because i can see myself actually/ potentially having that done in the future (depending on the stats/and an experienced PS)..whereas i know...in contemplating this issue more since studying this thread..i just don't have the kind of impressions that would feel ok having a lab created substance injected into my face (this is not to say anything regarding anyone else's impressions/choices)...but can potnetially tolerate the idea of having my own fat injected into my face.
I would also be interested in Dr. Rose's input about fat transfer/injections |
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71 years, primarily raw living food 35 years(vegan 45 years) herbal tea decoctions, homeopathy, TCM, facial massage, facial exercises, vacu-lifting, gua aha, shiatsu/acupressure, intention, home microcurrrent |
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Thu Jan 28, 2010 9:11 am |
Keliu, i'm also interested in fat transfer...because i can see myself actually/ potentially having that done in the future (depending on the stats/and an experienced PS)..whereas i know...in contemplating this issue more since studying this thread..i just don't have the kind of impressions that would feel ok having a lab created substance injected into my face (this is not to say anything regarding anyone else's impressions/choices)...but can potnetially tolerate the idea of having my own fat injected into my face.
I would also be interested in Dr. Rose's input about fat transfer/injections |
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71 years, primarily raw living food 35 years(vegan 45 years) herbal tea decoctions, homeopathy, TCM, facial massage, facial exercises, vacu-lifting, gua aha, shiatsu/acupressure, intention, home microcurrrent |
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Thu Jan 28, 2010 9:32 am |
Fat transfer can give you very nice results.
Here are some considerations to think about. It [i]is [/i]surgery, with all the risks associated with an anesthetic, etc. Generally, the surgeon will overfill your face, knowing that a proportion of the fat transferred will not be viable. The number I hear is a 50% loss of fat.
This procedure is very operator-dependent. I know of some surgeons who stopped doing fat transfers because they didn't get good results. Make sure your surgeon is experienced and has excellent results. Talk to his other patients.
A slightly different procedure that I am very interested in is the stem cell transfer. This is done by isolating stem cells from your own blood and injecting them into your face. They differentiate into fat and collagen producing cells.
Kylie Minogue is reported to have had stem cell injections into her face twice last year and she looks beautiful and natural.
Only a small number of doctors are doing this procedure as yet so I haven't heard any data on downsides or success rates.
Hope this helps.
Dr. Rose |
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I blog at Dr. Rose's blog |
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Thu Jan 28, 2010 10:04 am |
Thanks Dr. Rose,
Keliu in a past thread has posted about this kind of stem cell procedure, ( at least i believe it was similar), and it really caught my eye at the time.... it's something for me to seriously consider.
Thanks also for your experienced information about fat transfer injections. |
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71 years, primarily raw living food 35 years(vegan 45 years) herbal tea decoctions, homeopathy, TCM, facial massage, facial exercises, vacu-lifting, gua aha, shiatsu/acupressure, intention, home microcurrrent |
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Thu Jan 28, 2010 11:02 am |
[quote="Keliu"]Dr Rose - thanks so much for your responses. It's very helpful to hear from someone who has experience in this field.
I would also like to hear your opinion of fat transfer to the cheeks. As I posted earlier, I don't have a very good history with fillers, I love the results but they don't last. How do you think I would go with fat transfer?
Also, do you know if the Vaculifter could be used for massaging the cheeks after Sculptra is injected? Thanks!
....and, God help you Jasminerosey!! [/quote]
Hi Keliu,
I'm afraid I don't have any experience with the Vaculifter. In general, anything that massages the tissue should be beneficial after Sculptra. I give my clients a treatment with Accent RF about a week after Sculptra injections. Accent heats the tissues deeply, stimulating blood flow and lymphatic drainage. I use it to relieve any remaining tenderness or swelling from the injections. It also helps to accelerate healing of bruises.
As I alluded to above, Accent also reduces the size of nodules associated with Sculptra.
Sorry to get off topic about the Vaculifter but I wanted to give some context on the massage and what works well for me.
You asked me earlier about some other home-use appliances and I don't have experience with them either.
I have looked at research on whether spa treatments accelerate breakdown of fillers or make botox wear off quicker and the evidence suggests that they do not. I have actually tried to break down filler with Accent and it didn't work. So I don't understand why home treatments would affect the longevity of fillers. That is an interesting observation.
I had a client that I did large volumes of HA in the cheeks and it all disappeared within a few months. Devastating results. It turned out that her rheumatoid arthritis, which we thought had burnt out, was causing her to break down the HA rapidly. I have since treated her with Sculptra and she is getting amazing results. I think that, because she has a tendency to inflammation, she responds more avidly to Sculptra than average and makes more collagen. It is too soon to know how long it will last for her but she looks great now.
I think fat transfer could work for you. Also consider Radiesse (calcium hydroxylapatite).
I hope this helps.
Dr. Rose |
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I blog at Dr. Rose's blog |
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Thu Jan 28, 2010 6:44 pm |
That's a very interesting observation about the dissipation of fillers and inflammation. I wonder if that's my problem - I do have arthritis.
Yes, Jasminerosey, I did start a thread on Platelet-rich Plasma Rejuvenation - I'd forgotten about that. It's the latest thing here (Australia). The nurse that does my Botox had it done - when I spoke to her she was still waiting for results to show. I must look into this again.
I really believe that it is fat loss, loss of facial volume that is the most aging factor. Wrinkles can add character to a face, but it's that droopy sad look that is the most aging. That's why women with good bone structure always look better as they age. |
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Born 1950. There's a new cream on the market that gets rid of wrinkles - you smear it on the mirror!! |
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