Skin Biology's Copper Peptides
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free skin care · Wed Jun 01, 2011 4:45 am

erg wrote:

Bermie,
Tightening was my main goal too. I am really shocked at how well CPs have worked (using since Dec) The other day, I was in my car driving just touching my skin... and I realized I could no longer "pinch" any loose skin on my neck or cheeks. It was a wow moment.

BTW, I use SS cream and CP serum.

Now... has anyone had success with getting rid of neck or forehead lines??
Question

thanks for the suggestions, I am definitely going to get the ss cream next.

you say you use cp serum and ss cream? how do you do this? do you use both together?

I have been using Tri on my neck, lines are alittle faded but nothing spectacular!

I find Botox wonderful for forehead!!

free skin care · Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:31 pm

There's another source to buy CPs from. I just recieved an email from Plantinum Skin Care that "Copper is back!".

It appears they're carrying the CP Serum, Super CP Serum and SC2X. From the headline, they must've carried them in the past as well.

If you like to buy from Plantinum Skin Care, this will be a nice way to make one purchase at one place. They've got a nice selection of peels that go along w/ the CPs for scar reduction.

free skin care · Thu Jul 07, 2011 6:52 pm

I will stick with cp's and add clear and retin a or green cream into my routine. With the cp's..I am using them more sparingly. I take weekends off.. I use SS cream in the a.m.. and ss serum at night..tri reduction on my body.
My face is tighter..but ..again..my skin doesn't have that luminescent look like it did when I did Obaji Nuderm.

free skin care · Fri Jul 08, 2011 6:42 am

sister sweets wrote:

Hi Riley - do you still use any obagi?

Nope, I don't need it any more. After 3 cycles (once a year for 3 years at 18 weeks each) my hyperigmentation is all gone. I can maintain that with just retin A and sunscreen now.

free skin care · Tue Jul 12, 2011 4:05 pm

JaeBlue wrote:

If SkinBiology was that amazing - trust me women would be knocking down their doors - and they're not.
Please everyone really study up, don't just believe a website. I have age spots all over my skin that I never had before.

Hi JaeBlue - I'm in the camp of CP lovers - having used both 1st and 2nd gens. I feel your frustration and I feel bad for your situation. As foxe has said CP's aren't for everyone. I absolutely believe you started out too high on the CP strength scale, thus causing your problems. Your best bet may have been with GHK.

I need to comment on your first statement above. First of all NO PRODUCT is that amazing - I have never known of one product working for everyone. Have you? and I've never known women to be knocking down doors for a product (although I have a favorite that I WOULD knock down doors for - but not everyone would). Laughing

Basically - what you are doing is reporting that CP's weren't for you or at least at the strength you've used. Clearly they were doing something - not just sitting there.

I hope Obagi will work for you. Good luck. There are some good Obagi threads on here.

~Sis

free skin care · Wed Jul 13, 2011 3:59 pm

SkinCareJunkie wrote:

Sorry to chime in here. I was wondering if Cp's can cause hair growth on one's face? I thought someone had mentioned this. Or maybe I'm just crazy! Razz

Not grow like a man's beard. But, they do make the hair follicle healthier which in turn helps hair (that's suppose to grow - like on the head or eyebrows/lashes) grow.

I do not see extra growth of the peach fuzz on my face from using CPs and I didn't see a decrease when I stopped using them during a trial run of another product either.

I have seen growth of thinning areas in my brows and outer corners of my forehead- which use to have baby fine hairs that disappeared these last few years. I started hitting those areas w/ CPs (different ones - but mostly the folligen lotion) and they have filled back in.

free skin care · Thu Jul 14, 2011 9:04 pm

sister sweets wrote:

Although I suspect if hair all of sudden becomes noticeable after starting CP's it becomes suspect that it's from the CP's.

Yes, exactly. My peach fuzz only started after I started the GHK. Too much of a coincidence to attribute it strictly to age/menopause.

free skin care · Fri Dec 09, 2011 9:18 pm

I think that announcement was a bad move on Nanci's part.. goodness..she's been going on forever about how copper peptides are the reason her skin looks so young. Her testimonial is why I started on them. Now that her products are over selling copper peptides she is discontinuing them?
I think it could be just that she makes a higher profit margin off her own products..which stands to reason.
She might have just continued carrying the copper peptides and cut the line down as well as not talking about them much.

I do like some of Nanci's products.. Yet.. I've purchased some duds. I've only found her egf capsules to be of great value to me. She is very nice though and has good customer service.

Copper peptides have tightened my face...they do work.

free skin care · Thu Feb 23, 2012 2:42 pm

Thank you rileygirl and foxe. I appreciate your help. Smile

free skin care · Fri Feb 24, 2012 3:19 pm

Hi erg, I alternate SS Cream and GHK every other day. I definitely would use the GHK, if I were you. I really like the 2nd Gen CPS. But, I feel more confident when I use the GHK because of all the published studies proving it's many benefits. I think there is very little research that supports the 2nd Gen CPs. Although, many people remodeling their skin (scar reduction) have great results with them. This may be proof enough for some. I don't need this kind of help, so I try to stay on the milder end of the CP spectrum. GHK is perfect for this. The GHK cream is very nice. I am using the SS Cream to try and achieve some skin firming.

Yes, many people on the Skin Bio boards take breaks from using the 2nd Gen CPs and only use the GHK for a while. I have also read many posts from people saying that GHK alone has improved their skin.

free skin care · Mon Feb 27, 2012 9:36 pm

I've backed off on CP usage - used to be everday and sometimes twice per. Now, I'm primarily using GHK copper instead of second gens and 3 - 4 nights a week with other products. I'm a strong believer in the benefits of copper peptides and enjoy GHK - the smell and feel of the cream really appeals to me. I also have skin signals but use little of that product at the moment. I believe in Dr. Pickart's mission and I believe his line is derived in the best interest of his customers. He has a devotion to the product and is intent on his research mission. I like that so much better than buying from some big corporation who skimps on an overpriced product.

free skin care · Tue Feb 28, 2012 8:33 am

LoriA wrote:

My skin seems to like the cp's too! I've been doing one night super ghk serum, one night tretinoin, and one night off or vit c, plus vit c 1 of the mornings after the cp's or t.

I bought a single needle from owndoc last year but never used it much. Now that I have the cp's, I'm hoping to start using it more often, at least on the 11's.

But I'm wondering whether it'd be necessary to use (just a surface pinprick) on all the small indentations on my cheeks left from past acne, or if an aha (used at an opposite time of day, of course), or even cp's alone w/microfibre exfoliation might be enough to correct them? I'm not sure what to expect from the cp's. I don't have too much hyperpigmentation anymore, and I guess parts of my cheeks might be described as having a somewhat uneven orange-peel type appearance, with indentations being only that deep.

Thanks everyone... sooo grateful to have y'all here for me!

LoriA - I've tackled several icepick scars w/ single needles and CPs and have successfully filled them in with that method. It's a slow process, though, so be patient and consistent.

You need to needle the bottom and the sides of a deep scar like that to break up the scar tissue. Then apply the CPs (or you could put CPs on first and then needle them in). I would also use my CPs daily on those spots along w/ an acid on them to help the process along.

Scar tissue is stubborn and has a memory, but the CPs will help to rebuild the skin without the scar tissue. The acids help to clear out the bad tissue. The needle breaks up the tissue so the other products can do their jobs.

Oh - and I've smoothed out my 11's using the single needle and CPs, too. Not completely gone, but then I don't use the needles too often (I abhor them!)

Edited to add: In re-reading your post, I wanted to mention that in dealing with a lot of acne scars, some method of exfoliation will help the process along. Any one of the ones you mentioned could help along with CPs. The CPs work best with some form of exfoliation, be it the acids, a micro-fibre cloth, needling, etc. If you have a lot of scars, though, you might want to think about a dermaroller for large areas and the single needle for the really deep ones (which the roller might have trouble accessing).

I would use a roller (like a .75 on the face) about once a month or every 6 weeks followed by CPs. You should prep the skin with a vitamin A product and possibly even a vit. C one before a roll, too. Then you should also use one of the acids and CPs on a daily basis between the rolls.

free skin care · Sat Mar 03, 2012 8:58 pm

Dark Moon, welcome back! I hope you're doing well and your absence wasn't due to anything unfortunate going on.

I just started on cp's, and get the same kind of glow the next day that I get from tretinoin. I've been working too hard & had an event today, so I layered the two last night, and my skin looks AMAZING today! I know this doesn't prove anything, and a superficial glow is not really what its about, but maybe some people just respond to it better than others?

And yes, I agree, those who post positive opinions in the cp threads are often people who've proven to be knowledgeable and whose opinions I've come to trust.
So I'm giving 'em a shot in good faith!

free skin care · Sun Mar 04, 2012 4:05 am

We all know what we use in our skin care routines is pretty much a crapshoot. But just because a product works for some people and not myself, I do not discredit those that have proclaimed results from its use...I merely chalk it up to "It's not for me, live and learn" and move on.

CP's have well documented results, especially here on EDS...there have been the good, bad and (no pun intended) the ugly. But those that have benefited from the use of CP's seem to outnumber the ones that it either did nothing to or caused damamge in some way. For those that it either did nothing to or did something adverse, they knew the risks and shared their experiences here without bias towards those that have had good results.

All opinions are welcome as this is how we form our own in regards to what products we use...but, to discredit each and every one those that have achieved excellent results with the use of CP's and the extensive research that is out there in regards to the subject just because they did nothing for yourself is extremely one sided and quite frankly, a slap in the face, to those that have shared their positive experiences here.

Sun Mar 04, 2012 9:14 am

Sorry if I sound a little jaded, but I have been through the ringer with all this hype surrounding most of the over-the-counter miracle skin creams, lotions and potions.

Several years ago, the "nanotechnology" field was born and that name of course, found its way into the latest fad skin cream. The same with "stem cell" treatments. Even Skin Bio started using "stem cell" in some of their advertising from what I remember.

I dont have any problem whatever with what someone wants to use on their skin, but I have seen time and time again where someone posts glaring reviews for a product, then everyone gets excited about it - at least until the next so-called miracle product comes out.

Remember all the Janson Beckett posts on this website a few years ago? You dont hear much about them anymore once people saw it was no miracle product.

Ok, look, I used to be a big believer in copper peptides from skin bio, especially after reading Diane Yvonne's story and all the DebbieNIR posts a few years ago from their web site. Yeah, for those of you that remember all that, I was there to.

In the end, I finally realized that most of these non-perscription creams are either just hype and wishful thinking, or something that marginally helps.

When I suggest a plastic surgeon and a derm who specializes in laser technology for aging skin and wrinkles, I do it after realizing how little these OTC products really do. Of course, seeing a professional aint cheap and I will fully admit that it isnt for everyone, and if you cant afford it then by all means do what you can if you want on your own.

My opinion is that copper peptides might have some benefit for you skin, but if you truly have wrinkles and aging skin, you might be very disappointed in this product.

free skin care · Tue Mar 06, 2012 2:01 pm

I'm not sure whom exactly he is referring to but I can't help but feel it is directed at NCN and she did stop offering his products recently. Perhaps there was a falling out of some sort between them but that would only be speculation on my part.

I just find it ironic that NCN stops selling Skin Bio products, NCN comes out with their own CP w/EFG and Dr Pickart posts those 2 threads over on the Skin Bio forum. I personally have never come across any other form of CP Activator/Accelerator from other websites.

I could always post a reply over on the Skin Bio forum and ask him directly if he is referring to NCN, but not sure Dr Pickart would finger point directly at NCN even if it was exactly who he was talking about.

free skin care · Tue Mar 06, 2012 2:12 pm

bren21 wrote:

I'm not sure whom exactly he is referring to but I can't help but feel it is directed at NCN and she did stop offering his products recently. Perhaps there was a falling out of some sort between them but that would only be speculation on my part.

I just find it ironic that NCN stops selling Skin Bio products, NCN comes out with their own CP w/EFG and Dr Pickart posts those 2 threads over on the Skin Bio forum. I personally have never come across any other form of CP Activator/Accelerator from other websites.

I could always post a reply over on the Skin Bio forum and ask him directly if he is referring to NCN, but not sure Dr Pickart would finger point directly at NCN even if it was exactly who he was talking about.

I do agree with the irony of the events and time frame.
I would let sleeping dogs lie, when it comes to "their" products I think most sellers/formulators naturally become protective and at times defensive. Not the best scenario for obtaining facts! Rolling Eyes

free skin care · Tue Mar 06, 2012 3:06 pm

Oh for sure DM, I agree! I wouldn't want to wake the dog...I may be a pistol sometimes, but I do have a bit of common sense to know when not to stick my nose in certain business Wink

I've pointed out those 2 threads over at SB and I will leave it at that Cool

free skin care · Wed Mar 07, 2012 4:33 am

packratmack wrote:

Is Dr. Pickart referring to CP Accelerator when he says CP activator? Or is he referring to her new product which contains GHK cu and EGF? It seems he objects to mixing other peptides with CPs because some of them act like TGF beta 1, a scar forming protein. I'm kind of glad I never really used my CP Acc, if what he says is true.

He mentions them in two seperate posts, one post is about mixing CP and EFG together and the other is about "CP Activator"....I am assuming, in this case, he is talking about 2 seperate products. And I am one of those that was also confused/mislead about NCN's CP Accelerator. From the name, it seems that it's a product formulated to make CP's work faster as you stated...I have since learned that is not the case. CP's are confusing/intimidating enough on their own! Laughing

free skin care · Wed Mar 07, 2012 12:00 pm

Amen Riley. It is the problem with many things... Everyone has their own belief system and we, as consumers, are left to decide who we think is more believable or who we think makes more sense to us. It's such a gamble really...we, the simple consumer, are not scientist. We are common sense derived, intelligent beings...but we are NOT scientists.

I have a degree in Nuclear Medicine so talk radioactive, decay equations, the difference between fission and fusion, etc and I'd comprehend...but talk skin care on the molecular level and I'm a bit lost and try and rely on reasoning and a wee bit of logic to lead me where I need to go Laughing

free skin care · Wed Mar 07, 2012 12:04 pm

I find it odd that Skin Bio states retin-a and CP's work well together yet DrP has made reference to retin-a causing the same reaction he complains about with these so called "CP Activators"....

So frustrating!!! Mad

free skin care · Wed Mar 07, 2012 7:05 pm

That's interesting DrJ. I didn't realize TGF-b could be further divided into b1, b2 and b3.

Dr Pickart has said in the past you could use CPs with matrixyl, but cautions that matrixyl actually can 'cause' scar tissue formation, while the CPs turn that action down. It sounds like the CPs would offset any bad action of the matrixyl.

Quote:

Matrixyl is somewhat like TGF-beta-1, the scar forming protein. It will put protein into the skin but does not remove the old protein. The CPs are remodeling signals that remove old protein while producing the new protein.

But can use Matrixyl and CPs together

and...

Quote:

You can use it with our products - there is no harm.

Matrixyl works like TGF-beta-1, the scar forming protein. It will put protein in the skin but also may harden skin. It is not a skin remodeling signal

Something must've happened recently for him to change his tune on this. hmm

free skin care · Sat Mar 10, 2012 5:39 pm

ketchup wrote:

So I does anyone know if cp's affect hyperkeratinization /cell proliferation. I know AHA's do, now,(in a positive way) thanks to a random stranger lol. I ran into someone at work and of course they had to ask about what i was doing to my skin (i broke out recently, again grr!). So i told them i was using retin a. She said to stop using it because its kicking my cell growth (she said proliferation) into "overdrive" causing clogged pores-cystic kind. I was shocked because i thought it was from other things like me working out (i run about every night).

So, i have to ask since im stopping retin a, will cp's do the same thing? I know that i will have to use AHA's more often now because what she said all makes since and explains why i could never totally get it under control. This would be great because retin a is expensive (no prescription) and also i've used it for a long time and im finding it more irritating now then i was then.

Your friend has it wrong - Retin A doesn't cause 'cell proliferation', rather it works as an excellent cell 'communicator' and helps the pores to shed it's contents rather than allowing the contents to clog up a pore. It will help your skin to shed the lining of the pores faster. Look at it this way:

Quote:

Retinol is the entire vitamin A molecule that can be broken down into thousands of smaller components, of which one is retinoic acid (also called tretinoin, the active ingredient in Renova and Retin-A). Skin cells have a receptor site that is very accepting of retinoic acid. This relationship between retinoic acid and a skin cell allows a type of communication in which the cell is told to function normally (that is, not like a damaged or older cell), and it can conform to that request.

I thought you were going through a bad breakout due to the acids you've been using the last 7 months or so? If your breakouts have been lasting that long, something else might be going on (like those workouts). Or, it could be hormones (something to think about).

Hyperkeritization is a buildup of skin cells - as if your skin cannot remove them on a timely basis. I have hyperkeratosis on my feet and am prescribed a topical cream to help remove the thick, dry skin. Acne can be cause by pores not shedding properly and Retin A can help the pores to behave more normally, by turning the cells over better and by shedding them as they are suppose to. I believe this person you ran into at work had it backwards. Rolling Eyes

free skin care · Mon Mar 12, 2012 12:17 am

packratmack wrote:

rileygirl wrote:

Speaking of TGF Beta 1 reaction, doesn't Dr. Pickart say something like this about Retin A, also, or am I thinking about something else? Would you know anything about that, Bren?

Hi Riley,
I just asked the same question on the Skin Bio Forum. I think they were saying that using Retin A during the scar removal process was not a good idea because of the TGF Beta 1 proteins forming. I use Retin A with my CPs. I hope this is ok. I'll let everyone know the answer.

Dr. Pickart answered my question regarding this. Here is the link http://healthyskin.infopop.cc/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/4570023352/m/7661080436. So, I guess it's ok to use Retin A with CPs. As usual, I am still not sure. The Retin A does form the TGF-beta-1 proteins. The CPs suppress TGF-beta-1. This may be adequate if you use CPs and Retin A together. Adequate, doesn't sound too good to me. It's hard to get a clear explanation over there. For example, in some threads Skin Bio says don't use Vitamin C at the same time as CPs. Then in other threads Skin Bio says they have many customers that use them together and have great results. I really don't like ambiguous answers. I don't want to play around with my skin and see damage in the future.

free skin care · Thu Apr 26, 2012 3:12 am

I personally use my CP's at night (which is Skin Signals and spot treating with TriRed) and use my LacSal in the AM. I found it to be a much easier regime as I also use retin-a at night and I can use that along with the CP's. Also, there seems to be a conflict with CP's and certain sunscreen ingredients...the PM CP use also means you don't have to worry about that either.

If you're new to CP's, Super CP serum is a stronger CP to be starting with, so I would take it slow....and I would definitely not use Emu over top out of the gate as that intensifies the action of the CP's. When I first used CP's, I started with the regular CP serum. I'm sure if you take it slow though and dilute your CP with a few drops of water (slowly weaning off the water), you should be ok.

If you use a C serum in the AM, my morning routine is: Wash, C serum followed by a 20/30 minute wait, LacSal followed by a 20/30 minute wait, then the rest of my stuff.

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