Skin Biology's Copper Peptides
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free skin care · Sat Apr 10, 2010 7:55 pm

DM - not that the brows grew in thinner, but the hair itself is thinner - like baby fine hair (I have pretty thick, course hair) This was an early observation after using it for only a short while. Perhaps the hair follicle would promote thicker hair after a while. Dr P has said it makes the follicle healthier.

free skin care · Sun Apr 11, 2010 4:50 am

foxe wrote:

I usually copy the whole bunch and put it into a word doc and redo it, though because (for some strange reason) the darn program here at EDS does such weird things like jumping around when I type that I can't do anything properly. I then copy it to the 'reply' page and post it.

Drives you crazy, right? Hit the compatibility button on the internet bar (on mine it's under 'page'). That'll fix it.

free skin care · Sun Apr 11, 2010 7:05 pm

beann1210 wrote:

Calling all CP experts!

What are CP Uglies symtoms? Is it only the sagging? Or is it a whole sloo of ugliness? How soon can the uglies start after you add CP into your remine?

Why is it that I ask, you say? Well, let me tell you . . . I have been using SB CP Serum for the last two nights; yes, only two nights, and my skin looks horrible today. Looks like it maybe sagging a bit, but I'm not sure. What I do know is that the texture is yuck! My pores are huge and very visible. More wrinkles too, but mostly the pores. I used it Friday and Saturday night; 4 drops of water with 4 drops of serum for my face and the same for my neck. Can this happen after only two days of use? Or am I just having a really really really bad skin day?

I'm certainly not an expert but I used CP serum in the past and recently started CP's again, albeit very slowly.
Sounds like the "uglies" to me but don't panic, your skin will spring back by not using the serum for a couple of days. I know it's scary when it first happens though!
When you start back try diluting more, maybe 2 drops CP/6drops water and only use 3X a week for a couple of weeks and very gradually work up. You can also buffer the CP's by applying emu oil first and then the serum for awhile.

free skin care · Thu Apr 15, 2010 5:45 am

Also, It all depends how damaged your skin is underneath as to how long it will take to get through various phases.

Many people start off with mild CPs using them only for a week or 2 thinking they will get better results if they jump right into the strong stuff.

Unfortunately, that is where many go wrong, not realizing that their skin hasn't adjusted yet to CPs. As a matter of fact, I know of a few who have claimed severe damage from mild CPs when in fact they where using the most powerful product 2X sometimes twice a day. No wonder they had problems. Shock

This is what you do NOT want to do.

Super Cop 2X was designed for spot treating & scar removal, not as a "Rush Job - Beauty Treatment".

So no matter what your objective may be, going slow with CPs will allow you to monitor your skin so you can build your own routine. It is best to keep in mind that just like with Retin-A, "less is more" when it comes to CPs until your skin adjusts to your own personal level.

free skin care · Thu Apr 15, 2010 6:09 am

As Starmodel says, it might not be CPs but Retin A doing its purging thing, so I think I would hold off until your skin is used to the Retin A, and give that time to work before throwing CPs in.

beann1210 wrote:

Thanks again Theresa ~ I'm think I'm going to give it a whole month before I try again. I just started Retin-A a little over two months ago. Maybe I should wait until I'm completely used to this before I start something new. Also, I think my skin may be just so messed up that I got the uglies very easily.

free skin care · Fri Apr 16, 2010 9:23 am

Hermosa wrote:

Does anyone who sells CPs claim they have anti-aging properties? I'm not even sure what that means. CPs help regenerate collagen when skin is not in its optimal state.

Seems to me that anti-aging is more about protecting the skin and maintaining its condition. You wouldn't use CP on skin that's in great condition, any more than you'd use super glue on a dish that hasn't been broken.

I've always considered CP not only anti-aging but also an age reversal product. The only other product that can make such a huge difference in your skin other than CP, is a tretinoin product. CP most definitely protects skin - it's a strong anti-oxidant for one and another thing that people may or may not know about it is that it inhibits UV rays... I'm living proof of that. While floating around in the Glenwood Colorado Hot Springs Drool

I got good and sunburned despite the sun protection I kept slathering on.... expect for my face & neck. Absolutely no color on my face and neck at all. Guess I should have been bathing in it so the rest of my body didn't get burned! Here is a partial list of what CP does (I hope this list gets on here since I copied it from a word doc):

Increase the production of stem cells.
Tighten loose skin and improve elasticity.
Reduce spots, photodamage and hyperpigmentation.
Reduce fine lines.
Improve skin firmness.
Are a strong antioxidant.
Reduce the depth of deep wrinkles.
Reverse "smoker's" lines.
Improve skin clarity and “glow”.
Smooth rough skin.
Improve overall appearance.
Accelerate wound healing.
Thicken skin.
Act as powerful anti-inflammatories on skin.
Calm irritated and reddened skin.
Normalize the skin.
Tighten the protective skin barrier proteins.
Reduce stretch marks.
Reduce scars.
Protect skin keratinocytes from UV damage by inactivating reactive carbonyl species.

I've been using CP for about 11 years now. It has to be the reason my skin is in the condition that it is. At 56 years old, I often get my age guessed at mid thirties. I like to tell people that I'm 68 years old! Tee He! Then I tell them the truth and they still don't believe me. But preventative yes and anti-aging yes!

free skin care · Fri Apr 16, 2010 10:15 am

I've always thought of Copper peptides as being anti-aging since they are supposed to promote collagen/elastin production, remove damaged proteins and rebuild skin's protective barrier.
I would consider the increase of stem cell production to be definitely anti-aging.

free skin care · Mon Apr 26, 2010 6:52 am

Regarding buried damage & CP usage:

CPs are remodeling agents that repair skin damage by restoring the skin barrier & strengthening the collagen & elastins in the skin. They do not cause NEW damage to skin, but will trigger the remodeling process by slowly bringing up layers of "buried damage". Even young skin can have buried damage, but is not noticeable on the outside because young skin is thicker skin. Damage of "all sorts" is covered over by an outer layer of relatively good looking skin.

As we age & the skin naturally thins - buried damage becomes more noticeable. The damage (as with acne scars) actually looks worse when you get older, since it was covered over & disguised by "plumper more youthful skin".

So, while some freak out (and understandably so) when their skin begins to change when 1st starting CPs, it is all about what kind & how much damage has actually accumulated under the skin over the decades. Also damage does not necessarily mean acne scars. Use of moisturizers, makeup, sunscreens, etc. over time slowly damage the elastins in the skin & some will have more looseness than others when starting CPs. Those who experience looseness right away would do best by backing off using the mildest P&R products. Then slowly add CP Serum if needed. Many can get superior results by using only P&R not ever needing to push beyond.

Those who will have the hardest time of all are the *past acne suffers* because they have the most buried damage which is in the form of buried scar tissue. This takes a contentious effort to slowly break down the damage so CPs can rebuild. They will need (if they choose to eradicate the scars) stronger Hydroxys & CPs to attack scar tissue along with demarolling and/or needling techniques to help break up & loosen the scar tissue.

So all in all, CPs are safe, anti-inflammatory, non-irritating skin remodelers and you can safely use the products without necessarily going through all of the remodeling phases by keeping it MILD. This will give you all the benefits of CPs without bringing up too much of the hidden damage. Many people are not willing to go through the change, so MILD is the way to go for them.

It is difficult for people to comprehend *buried damage* in the skin because we can't see it. Many derms can't even understand it. They misdiagnose buried acne scars (which become more noticeable as we age) as certain disorders of the skin. The only way to have truly unblemished, bump-free beautiful skin is to slowly bring the existing damage up so that it can be degraded using various exfoliating methods. By doing this & going through the various stages, you can renew & remodel your skin to a youthful state using CPs.

Understanding the process is KEY.

free skin care · Thu May 06, 2010 3:09 pm

Sunshinetreasure wrote:

What is the best way to use the folligen for blonds? Has anyone ever had and immediate headache after applying it?

I never had a headache when using this product.

Some tips for usage:
- Do NOT use more frequently than every other day, per Dr. P. (I use like 3x a week)
- I squeeze a thin line out vertically down a center part, then move over a couple inches to one side, part the hair and repeat (do both sides the same way)
- A little goes a long way...if you find it is too thick, you can dilute a small amount with water right before applying, per Dr. P. But do not mix water in with the whole bottle!
- Using your fingers, massage the FFB lines across the section of your scalp that you want to cover...don't use gloves, and your nails will benefit as well.
- Top that off with a very small amount of emu oil to help it penetrate into the scalp (emu also has hair regenerative properties on its own)

HTH!

free skin care · Thu May 06, 2010 3:23 pm

Sunshinetreasure,
As for the Tanning Lotion - it is meant to be used as a light protection for the sun, while still allowing the body to get a little tan which can provide some natural protection. Dr Pickart sites studies showing that melanin in the skin does provide us with sun protection. The thing everyone wants to avoid is the burn - red, irritated skin. Inflammation is a No-No.

I have used it for 2 summers and on a Carribean vacation. I do not tan well - very light skinned and tend to burn and get sun poisoning(when south of the Mason-Dixon line).

This past summer I used it more, and I did develop a fairly *good* tan (for me). It was light, but even. I would always apply the Body Lotion after being in the sun - I think the 2 products are best used together. If I did ever get a little pink (sun was too intense or I was out too long) - topping my body w/ the Body Lotion at the end of the day would calm my skin down by morning. By the next day - no pinkness, and no peeling either. I managed to develop a base tan slowly this way. This is the best way to get color - slowly. The color will protect you and it will last the longest if done slowest too.

I do have to say that I will use a stronger sun screen on days when I'm in the sun all day (I'm a boater and can be out with NO shade for 8 hours or more). I still start w/ the SB Tanning Lotion and later, start topping it w/ stronger, biodegradable ones.

free skin care · Thu Jun 10, 2010 7:12 am

Mélusine wrote:

Thanks Algona and Foxe for your reply.

I think I just have to get used to the smell Smile

. I now also use the GHK cream on the hands at night. I plan to move to CP serum when I am done with GHK, or do you think I can move directly to TriReduction ?

If your skin is not sensitive and also seems to be reacting favorably to the GHK, moving up the the TriRed should be fine. Just keep a lookout for reactions - it is a much stronger CP. If you do see some, then try using it everyother day or so until you're use to it.

free skin care · Sun Jul 11, 2010 5:55 pm

loribar wrote:

Thanks Foxe...was this a once per day regimen w/exfoliant and scX2? And, when you say strong exfoliant...are we talking stronger than lactic power 10?

Yes, most likely. Most of SB's exfoliants are gentle enough to use on a daily basis without causing much irritation. They are a good combo to use w/ the CPs for that since they will help remove a little bit of what needs to go and allow the peptides to go in deeper and do their thing.

Most of the SB exfoliants have a pH of around 3.2-3.5. That is gentle enough to use daily. There are other acids out there that have lower pH's and a lower pH will have a stronger exfolianting power. Look at some of the acids that Diana Yvonne offers on her website - she has some that go down to 1.5pH. You can also get one w/ a higher percentage of acid in it, like Compound W or similiar. These are best used cautiously. Spot treat only and follow directions.

free skin care · Fri Sep 10, 2010 3:34 pm

sis - I'll have to look into that oil you mention. I've never heard of that one. I rarely use an oil myself since I have such oily skin, this one might be an alternative.

Actually - to push the CPs in, lately I've been using the Lactic 10. If you put that on top of the CPs, you can really feel the CPs go in. That's been a better alternative for me instead of emu oil. This method has been mentioned by Dr Pickart and his staff on their forum.

free skin care · Fri Oct 22, 2010 8:56 pm

It won't cause any kind of reaction, the CP's
just make the Vit.C serum ineffective but if I remember correctly that might not even be true.

I try to seperate them by approx. 12 hrs. just to be sure. It would be a shame to be applying the C serum for nothing.

free skin care · Fri Oct 22, 2010 9:27 pm

C serums and CP's should be separated by 12 hours. The CP's inactivate the C serum. I love C serums and believe in them but taking a break for a month or two to use VK2 consistantly with CPs and see what happens. The last time I used VK2 I was using C serums and had great results with the combo.
A few times a week I'll continue with retin A also - not sure how I'm going to do that just yet.

free skin care · Sat Oct 23, 2010 5:39 am

sis - I'm glad you could answer the question about KH - I've never used that line.

The thing about CPs and Vit C is that the 2nd generation CPs can make the Vit C ineffective. BUT, using a Vit C serum and a 1st generation CP (one that has GHK in it) will cause the GHK to be ineffective. The GHK is more delicate than the 2nd gen CPs. At Skin Bio, the 1st gen CPs are the Super GHK serum and Super GHK cream. All the others are 2nd gens, but GHK(along with a 2nd CP) is found in the Skin Signals Cream and the Suntanning Lotion.

Kinda confusing, so just separate them by 12 hours or so and you'll be good to go.

free skin care · Mon Nov 01, 2010 5:50 pm

Thanks Time2BeMe for Marta's link. I hardly get over to her website very often(need to bookmark that one), but love to read her stuff!

I've applied the Folligen lotion a few times to my own lashes w/ an eyeliner brush. The lotion is a good consistency for application. But, I've only done it inconsistently, so I was wondering if anyone else had done it and what kind of results they've had. In spots on my eyebrows where I've applied it it has filled in a bit. Again - I've been inconsistent there as well.

free skin care · Sun Nov 28, 2010 1:32 pm

erg wrote:

Hello -
thanks to everyone who has contributed to this thread - I have learned a lot!

I am thinking about purchasing the skin signals cream - I like the fact that it has 1st and 2nd generation peptides. I really want to start slowly to avoid the "uglies". I have a few questions:

1) How much do you apply to the face - would it be similar to retin-a (pea-size amt)?

2) I would use only 2-3 days per week to start. Does this sound about right - to start only a few days and then work my way up? Is applying oil to the skin first the best way to dilute a cream? I don't like emu - is avocado ok?

3) Any feedback on Skin Signals? My main concern is slight sagging. A few wrinkles around the eyes.

thanks for any feedback,
Smile

I would think the Skin Signals Cream is one of the gentler CPs and there shouldn't be too much worry of it causing the loose skin from a rapid skin remodeling. Your application of just 2 to 3 times per week is a good way to start slowly. You can also adjust how much product you apply and a pea size amount would probably be about right for the face and neck. If you have extra, put it on the back of your hands.

I've used the SSC occasionally and it's a very nice cream. Its color is an intense blue/green and it has a nice creamy texture. Typical of CP creams, the scent is not all that great- but that doesn't bother me knowing what the product can do!

I agree that the combo of 1st gen and 2nd gen CPs is brilliant! This one also has the added collegen and elastin - a win, win situation.

Wed Dec 01, 2010 6:17 am

I have been using CP's for 7 years now starting with Exfol cream-CP serum ,CP Premier Night eyes & squalane oil ,was a rocky road I had terrible trouble with the exfol cream breakout after breakout & I have dry sensitive skin.
My routine was AM-Rosehip seed cleanser-exfol serum *I switched to which was better* Premier eye cream & spf 30.

PM
Rosehip Cleanser of Diana Yvonne's
CP Serum 4 drops on a damp face
Squalane oil.

To be honest I didn't notice tightening at all so I emailed skin-biology & started this routine 3 years ago;

AM Use:
AM - After cleansing the skin, apply a light amount of Protect & Restore with High Retinol (a copper-peptide cream fortified with added moisturizers).A very light amount of Two Timing Tightener (DMAE serum) on top. Only use the Two Timing Tightener on areas where I have puffiness & am trying to gain more elasticity.

PM Use:
PM - After cleansing the skin, apply a very light amount of LacSal I love love love this stuff! After 15-30min, i than apply a light amount of Super CP Serum. You can finish with a light amount of Squalane on top & more than likely I apply my moisturizer as your last step in any regimen.

Around the eye area:
CP Night Eyes, Two Timing Tightener, Emu Oil or Squalane in this area.I mix these about & use only one of these only once a day. For example: Use Two Timing Tightener in the morning around the eye area and or CP Night Eyes in the evening.

I have noticed quite a difference & also sometimes alternate using Super Cop Cream 2X on the lines I hate again being honest not an amazing difference but I do get taken for at least 10 years younger than my real age so I'm a happy gal .

free skin care · Sat Dec 04, 2010 11:07 am

Erg - that's great. I hope all goes well for you (I'm sure it will Wink

)

Just make sure to separate the SSC from your Vit C serum by about 12 hours. You don't want them to interfer with each other. Even less than that is probably fine, like if you applied one at night and then washed your face in the morning and applied another one. I'm sure washing would remove any residue of what was put on in the evening.

free skin care · Sun Dec 12, 2010 4:07 pm

erg..

when I first got my cp serum I actually put it on twice a day..at night and in the morning. I did that for a few weeks because I wasn't feeling anything and thought.."hey" twice as much is twice as good." ..until I started reading about the "uglies." I was freaked out..thinking omg! I wrote Nanci at NCN where I bought the cp serum. She told me that she uses it twice a day and that the uglies are not very common...not to worry.
Still..I started to just use it just at night..every night. Then about a week and a half ago..I read a post from a long time cp user who says she uses cp's aggressively then stops for two days and sees great results.
So last week..I gave myself a 50% glycolic peel and used cp's for a few days after..then took two days off. And this week...I see the difference. So I plan to do another 50% peel Tuesday night and repeat the same process.
I also wrote Skin Biology and asked them if I should move in in product strength. They said that I could now start using my cp serum twice a day and also suggested if I wanted a new product to use skin signals cream or serum. There is a page on the SB website that shows the line-up of the products in order of strength. I found that so helpful. The skin signals cream is a bit stronger than cp serum..but the skin signals serum is stronger than super cp serum.
Also...look on the SB site in the chat forum under ??? I think "results"..and see the pictures of the 40+ woman who has been using skin signals cream...exfol and two time tightening for just a month! It has me wanting to buy that line up.

free skin care · Mon Dec 13, 2010 6:36 pm

hotdocgirl wrote:

sister sweets wrote:

hotdocgirl - you might want to try CP's with a .5 dermaroller for better penetration - once a week makes a great difference. Hands too.

S.S. I have a dermaroller..but I think I got the wrong size 1.5...it is too much. Where can I get the .5 for a good price..I want quality too though.

Thanks..

www.owndoc.com has some rollers at a good price. Save the 1.5 for CIT rolling - every 6 wks or so.

free skin care · Tue Dec 21, 2010 1:49 pm

erg wrote:

HI!
How much time do you have to wait (after applying CP) to moisturize the skin if you DO NOT want to push the CPs in deeper? My Skin is super dry in the winter and I can't skip that step.

I am on my second week of Skin Signals CREAM. Using twice per week. Going slow... Smile

...and thanks hotdocgirl for your help on an earlier post.

erg - you're probably fine having a short wait time with the Skin Signals Cream, especially after having used it for a few weeks (even though it's just a few times per week). Skin Signals cream is one of the gentler/weaker CPs. Maybe wait until the SSC is absorbed before using your moisturizer? 10 minutes or so?

How are things going w/ the SSC?

free skin care · Tue Dec 21, 2010 9:16 pm

erg wrote:

thanks foxe, good to know! My skin is so dry I need a moisturizer at night.

Things are going good. I haven't seen any results yet - but really don't expect to see anything for at least a month or so.

Next week, I am going to move up to 3 times per week - still applying emu oil first.

Thanks for all the advice! I'll post any updates. Smile

I wouldn't expect to see much in results until you've graduated to using CPs full strength for a while. If you're doing 2 different methods of diluting, it will take a long time. (emu first plus only a few times per week is pretty cautious - esp for a gentle CP).

free skin care · Wed Dec 22, 2010 12:51 pm

erg..

just to let you know..I used cp's (cp serum) almost everyday now for two months..and have used skin signals cream for the past two nights.

You could be waiting forever for results if you keep going that slow. But...I understand not wanting to overdo it..that is when people get into trouble.

btw..I am loving that skin signals cream!

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