Skin Biology's Copper Peptides
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free skin care · Fri Apr 09, 2010 5:52 pm

Twinkle66 wrote:

Oh I'm so happy to have found this forum. You guys seem really knowledgeable and I've been trying to get help with this for a while. So thanks for being here!

I've been using a CP serum for a couple of weeks. I'm going to be starting Retin-A micro soon as well. I've been able to find info on advice of using regular retin-a with CPs, but I couldn't find anything regarding the micro gel, as I know that it is slow released and would therefore probably have a longer half life and need to be allowed to absorb longer before you put the CPs on top.

So you put the CPs on first then, do you know if this works with all CP serums, would they all be the same pH? I use a 2nd generation one from a really good Doctor here in Sydney, Australia (though next time I'm going to look into the Skin Biology range you guys are talking about as it seems way better value for money) The ingredients are pretty similar to the Skin Biology CP serum.

So would you recommend I apply this first and as long as it has fully dried then I can apply the retin-a micro. I really don't want the CPs to interfere with the retin-a micro as I'm going to be using it as a maintanence to keep acne away after I finish my accutane course, but I also really want to use use CPs for my pigmentation and scarring.

Also after I use what I have of my CP serum would you reccomend going up to the higher strength Skin Biology's Super CP serum.
Oh dear, I've written so much and feel like I'm demanding a whole lot of info from you. I do appologize! Any help you can give will be greatly appreciated, thanks so much Smile

Hi Twinkle66 – sorry I didn’t see this earlier. I recently switched to Retin A Micro and can tell you it’s a great retinoid to use. For one, it is not as irritating as other retinoids and that is due to its micro-encapsulation and slow release. Second, it has a neutral pH (around 6.0) and with the pH of CPs also being around 6.0, there will be no need for a ‘wait’ time like the other, lower pH products that need to sit alone to work while the pH slowly rises. You will need to follow some simple rules for product penetration, though. These can be applied to just about any product you use based on the thickness or consistency of it. Of course, using a product with a lowe pH would supercede these rules (low pH products first!)

When applying or layering any skin care product, apply in the following order to ensure good penetration of your active ingredients.
1. serums
2. gels
3. biological oils
4. creams
5. sun screen

With most products, you will need to let the first one absorb before applying the second one. With the CP Serum and the Retin A Micro – give the serum about 10 minutes or so to sink in before applying the retinoid. Using Retin A Micro simplifies the routine a bit! If you use a cream based CP, you can apply it after the retinoid.

I apply the Micro after my CP Serum or Skin Signals (serum) and I’m beginning to think that applying the Micro on top of the CPs has an effect of pushing the CP into the skin better due to the micro-encapsulation of the Micro. My skin really likes using it like that.

Moving up to Super CP Serum is the next step up in strength and would be a good choice for treating acne scars. You might also want to consider the Skin Signals (in between CP Serum and Super CP Serum), but that one might be more for firming of skin with the added elastin and collagen. FYI – I spot treat acne scars with the SC2X. It’s very strong stuff and should be reserved for spot treating. I just use a sample size and it lasts me for months.

I wonder if that doctor in Sydney you referred to is Dr Phillipa McCaffery? She is the one that wrote about using CPs with rollers for the Skin Biology website. SB must be letting her sell a 2nd gen CP of her own. Considering that SB still has a patent on the 2nd generation CPs, that’s saying a lot.

free skin care · Fri Apr 09, 2010 5:57 pm

sister sweets wrote:

I divide both the MSM and the C into at least two different times of day = half of C is from a powdered source and the other half is from grapefruit, smoothies, lemons, etc - trying to separate these out throughout the day. I love C sources of foods so I know I get lots of this.

I *should* divide my MSM, but don't (I get lazy). Since I've been lazy on this, I've forgotten that the MSM should be divided. Thanks for the reminder.

Wish I could love multiple sources of C like you sis.

free skin care · Fri Apr 09, 2010 6:29 pm

Has anyone tried the Folligen cream on their lashes or brows? It is indicated on the SB website but was wondering if anyone on here has actually used it? TIA!

Fri Apr 09, 2010 6:32 pm

foxe wrote:

Hi Twinkle66 – sorry I didn’t see this earlier. I recently switched to Retin A Micro and can tell you it’s a great retinoid to use. For one, it is not as irritating as other retinoids and that is due to its micro-encapsulation and slow release. Second, it has a neutral pH (around 6.0) and with the pH of CPs also being around 6.0, there will be no need for a ‘wait’ time like the other, lower pH products that need to sit alone to work while the pH slowly rises. You will need to follow some simple rules for product penetration, though. These can be applied to just about any product you use based on the thickness or consistency of it. Of course, using a product with a lowe pH would supercede these rules (low pH products first!)

When applying or layering any skin care product, apply in the following order to ensure good penetration of your active ingredients.
1. serums
2. gels
3. biological oils
4. creams
5. sun screen

With most products, you will need to let the first one absorb before applying the second one. With the CP Serum and the Retin A Micro – give the serum about 10 minutes or so to sink in before applying the retinoid. Using Retin A Micro simplifies the routine a bit! If you use a cream based CP, you can apply it after the retinoid.

I apply the Micro after my CP Serum or Skin Signals (serum) and I’m beginning to think that applying the Micro on top of the CPs has an effect of pushing the CP into the skin better due to the micro-encapsulation of the Micro. My skin really likes using it like that.

Moving up to Super CP Serum is the next step up in strength and would be a good choice for treating acne scars. You might also want to consider the Skin Signals (in between CP Serum and Super CP Serum), but that one might be more for firming of skin with the added elastin and collagen. FYI – I spot treat acne scars with the SC2X. It’s very strong stuff and should be reserved for spot treating. I just use a sample size and it lasts me for months.

I wonder if that doctor in Sydney you referred to is Dr Phillipa McCaffery? She is the one that wrote about using CPs with rollers for the Skin Biology website. SB must be letting her sell a 2nd gen CP of her own. Considering that SB still has a patent on the 2nd generation CPs, that’s saying a lot.

Thank you so much for your response, the info you've given me is majorly helpful! Smile

I'll definitely be saving your post on to my computer.

Yes it is Dr Phillipa McCaffery! She has a clinic in Sydney and a line of her own branded products called Clear Skincare, I had read an article of hers on the internet that just made me trust her so much in terms of treating acne scars that when I heard good things about CPs and saw that she sold one I thought it would be the best place to get it. I hadn't researched CPs at all so I hadn't heard about Skin Biology at that point, but if SB still has the patent and is letting her sell her own then that makes me very happy knowing that I have a quality product. Like I said earlier though I'll probably have to buy it from SB next time as it much much cheaper even with shipping it to Australia. Do you use your CPs with a roller ever? I can't wait to try it with her rollers but I have to give it 6 months after I finish my accutane before I can do anything like that.

Am I applying to much CPs if it doesn't feel like it's completely gone from my face after 10 minutes? I started off with one drop for my forehead and one drop for each side of my face but it really didn't feel like it was spreading far enough so now I do 2 and a half to 3 drops for each side.

Thanks again!

free skin care · Fri Apr 09, 2010 7:05 pm

Twinkle66 wrote:

Do you use your CPs with a roller ever? I can't wait to try it with her rollers but I have to give it 6 months after I finish my accutane before I can do anything like that.

I do use them with a roller. CPs are THE product I want to get down to the deeper layers for their skin remodeling abilities-and they do work excellent for remodeling acne scars. You might want to try a single needle for individual deeper scars. A roller has a hard time getting down inside depressed scars like boxcar types or ice pick ones. Check out the roller threads here on EDS for more info on those. (DIY and skincare tools subforum)

Quote:

Am I applying to much CPs if it doesn't feel like it's completely gone from my face after 10 minutes? I started off with one drop for my forehead and one drop for each side of my face but it really didn't feel like it was spreading far enough so now I do 2 and a half to 3 drops for each side.

Thanks again!

I definitely think one needs more than just a couple of drops to spread - it's just not enough. Try 4 drops CP diluted with 4 drops water(for your whole face). Try that for a week or 2 until your skin is use to it and then increase the Cps and decrease the water.

Fri Apr 09, 2010 11:58 pm

foxe wrote:

I do use them with a roller. CPs are THE product I want to get down to the deeper layers for their skin remodeling abilities-and they do work excellent for remodeling acne scars. You might want to try a single needle for individual deeper scars. A roller has a hard time getting down inside depressed scars like boxcar types or ice pick ones. Check out the roller threads here on EDS for more info on those. (DIY and skincare tools subforum)

I'll be sure to check out the roller threads once my skin is strong enough again after the accutane. Can't wait, I've heard many good things.

Quote:

I definitely think one needs more than just a couple of drops to spread - it's just not enough. Try 4 drops CP diluted with 4 drops water(for your whole face). Try that for a week or 2 until your skin is use to it and then increase the Cps and decrease the water.

Good to know I wasn't going over board then. My skin is pretty used to three drops neat on each side of my face at the moment so I think I could get away with not diluting.

I hope you don't mind but I passed on part of the reply you sent me in regards to using Retin A micro and CPs together on another forum (oops I tried posting the link but I'm not allowed to yet) I had posted a thread asking the same question there so when I posted again saying that someone had answered me on a different forum I was asked to share what I had learned. I gave you full credit though Smile

free skin care · Sat Apr 10, 2010 4:44 am

moosejavian wrote:

Has anyone tried the Folligen cream on their lashes or brows? It is indicated on the SB website but was wondering if anyone on here has actually used it? TIA!

I think Kassy was using this on her lashes. Thanks for reminding me - I wanted to give this a try as a conditioner and possible growth promotion!

free skin care · Sat Apr 10, 2010 5:00 am

foxe wrote:

Nanci - thank you, thank you so much for sharing your wealth of info on this thread - it's contributed so much to it.

I take 1 gr (1000mg) each of Vitamin C and MSM due to hearing about it from all my research on CPs (and most certainly, from Dr P always stressing it). You, my dear, have explained it way better though.

And, this might also be why I have experienced such great results with CPs Smile

.

BTW - it is better to take your vitamin C divided into 2 doses of 500mg each twice per day rather than one 1gr dose. What your body does not need will be eliminated through your urine. I take a slow release version myself.

sister sweets wrote:

brierrose - As far as I can recollect it is recommended 2:1 MSM to Vitamin C. Example: 2000 MSM to 1000 C. I probably take higher amounts of both.

sis - I thought the amt was 1 gr each, but Dr P often gives differing advice, so I can't be certain. I am sure I've read that the minimum should be 1 gr each at least. But, if you included some C in your diet as Nanci mentioned, then a 500mg dose of C should do it.

Thank you foxe - I appreciate it! Ideally you want 1 gr (1,000 mg) daily of both Vit. C and MSM. I take 500 mg. in the am and 500 again in the pm. A time released Vit. C is best since it doesn't stay in our bodies (water soluble). You're doing it the right way foxe!

free skin care · Sat Apr 10, 2010 5:45 am

Hi Foxe and all the other CP experts. I went back this morning and read the very first page of this thread, and I have questions/concerns. I had a really bad experience with a laser treatment last December (you may have read about it in other threads), and it left me with damaged skin. The most serious of the damage in my eyes is the fact that the skin on my neck now sags a lot. (I’m only 40.) The skin along my jowl area also sags a little and is very "stretchy" now. Before this treatment, my skin was as tight as a drum. As you can imagine, I have been very depressed for the last four months and trying desperately to find something to help. Two months ago I started Obagi NuDerm. I have seen some improvement to the lines and large pores on my face (the other damage from the laser), and I'm very sure that is because of the Retin-A. I have decided to give up on the other products, because although I know they work, they're not what I need right now. I'm not concerned that much with the little bit of pigmentation that I have. I am keeping the 0.1% Retin-A in my regime (at night) and have also added Vit C serum (in the morning) as well. Last week I started Flex Effect facial exercises. I actually already have improvement to my eye lids!. I couldn't believe it when I noticed it yesterday. However, my eyes aren’t my concern right now, and I have my doubts on whether the exercises will help my neck. I'm going to keep plugging away for at least 6 months to see if it works though. Flex Effect recommends using CP, so I also started that a couple days ago. I purchased the CP Serum and Emu Oil. I'm using the rest of my Obagi Exfoderm Forte (6% glycolic acid, 4% lactic acid) to exfoliate and then I plan to purchase the exfoliator from SB. I am also taking all the vitamins recommended by Flex Effect. And hopefully I purchased the best CP for my issue, the CP Serum. My concern at this time is doing more damage to my skin. Foxe, you mentioned that CPs are not for everybody and have caused damage to some people. I realize that I may get “the uglies” and am willing to work through that (I already had to do that with the Retin-A), but how will I know if it is the uglies or damage? If negative effects occur, are they permanent? How much time should I give the CPs before I know whether I’m right for the product? I know that CPs probably work differently for every body, but any information you could give me is greatly appreciated. I’m very grateful to have found this site and a couple others as they have given me hope that things might get better, even if it’s just a little bit. Sorry to sound like such a downer, but this whole experience has really been hard. (I’m having one of my bad days.) Crying or Very sad

I try to stay positive, but it’s hard when I see the damage every time I see my reflection. Thanks girls.

free skin care · Sat Apr 10, 2010 8:36 am

beann - you poor thing. I'm sorry you're feeling so bad about yourself right now and don't blame you at all.

I do think the CPs are the right product for you to help turn your damaged skin around. You didn’t happen to use a cortisone after the laser did you?

Skin Bio has a section dealing with damage from Post Procedures (peels, lasers, etc) and this is what they say:

"After chemical peels use Copper Peptides and Emu Oil to rebuild and heal skin which helps skin recover from cosmetic treatments and procedures. Cosmetic procedures can cause scars, burns, hyperpigmentation and irritate skin. Copper peptides rebuild the skin and promote a better reaction to trauma caused by lasers, dermabrasion, and chemical peels (such as tca chemical peels, salicylic acid peels, and glycolic peels) as well as other cosmetic treatments. Emu Oil is gentle and non-irritating. It improves scar healing by reducing inflammation while soothing skin."

Quote:

Improved Post Procedure Skin Recovery After Chemical Peels and Cosmetic Treatments
Normal chemical peels can produce severe irritation that leads to scars and prolonged redness. Simple coverings such as petrolatum do not stop the development of redness and reduce inflammation.

Peels followed by cortisone used as an anti-inflammatory often defeat their purpose since the cortisone inhibits skin repair. So while the peels remove blemishes and dead skin, the subsequent skin rebuilding is inhibited. This can produce very thin skin. And the need for scar healing.

SRCPs have powerful anti-inflammatory actions. But unlike cortisone which inhibits skin repair, the copper peptides stimulate skin repair. Copper peptides also inhibit the action of interleukin-1, (a hormone that increases skin damage after injury), and TGF-beta-1, (the scar-forming protein).

The products they recommend are either GHK or CP Serum AND Emu Oil, so it sounds like you got the right products.

As far as the uglies go, just go slow in the beginning. They don’t usually last very long – just until your skin is use to the CPs. If you see some, just back off a bit (use Emu only for a day or so)

And for the other products you have – I would not use the Exfoderm or Retin A at the moment. I’d keep with the Vitamin C in the morning, but that is another that is ‘not’ necessary. I think just the CP Serum and Emu oil to get your skin turned around since it is so damaged. The laser must’ve thinned your skin a bunch and that’s why it’s sagging so badly. I would think you’d start to see some improvement in a couple of months but realize it could take many more months to really see some action (CPs work very slowly). At least with the repairs they make on your damaged skin will be permanent (do expect normal aging). You’ve got to get your normal skin back – CPs should help.

Also – you need to take the vitamins we’ve been discussing here to help get the most out of the CPs: 1 gr each of Vitamin C and MSM (divided 500 mg each 2X/day).

Maybe later – after a few months (even sooner – depends on how things go), you can reintroduce the exfoliants to speed renewal up. It just sounds like you have too much damage and have really fragile skin right now to have all that going on with product usage. Rebuild a little first.

I also hope you are using a gentle cleanser – pH around neutral (6 or 7). Skin Bio’s Gentle Cleanse is awesome! Cetaphil would be another one. Gentle Cleanse does a good job of removing my makeup –better than the Cetaphil.
Good luck with everything and keep up up-to-date on your progress.

free skin care · Sat Apr 10, 2010 9:30 am

I am so confused.

I wanted to incorporate CP's into my skincare, but from what I have been reading it seems CP's are more suited to oily, acne scarred skin?

I have really dry skin, very few wrinkles, but sagging and sun damage are my major concern.

should I use CP's? thanks so much for all this info, you guys are amazing.. Very Happy

free skin care · Sat Apr 10, 2010 9:34 am

Cross-posting from "The Uglies Thread". Thought this would be beneficial:
................................................................................................

Yes, what exactly are The Uglies? Confused

To help out a little, I would like to dispel some of the myths associated with CPs. CPs do NOT cause new damage to the skin.

It is recommended to go slow starting with the mildest products *lightly* to acclimate the skin. That is the hardest part for many of us since we want our results now. I am guilty of that too. Embarassed

Going too fast or too strong can cause some initial looseness to the elastics in the skin before it begins to tighten. The looseness is temporary and backing off for a few days allows the skin to rebound. This is originally where the term *uglies* came from. Usually this occurs when moving up in CP strength.

The other kind of *uglies* that you can experience is from hidden layers of damage slowly pushing up. Everyone will be different depending on your age and the amount of your own personal damage. This can be in the form of *buried scars* or *fine lines and wrinkles* like under the eyes or deep expression lines.

CPs are strong remodeling agents and do NOT cause damage to the skin. The damage already exists Shock

and that is why it is recommended to *go slow* in order to acclimate your skin to CPs. Every skin type is different as well, so if you have thin skin to begin with, you want to be particularly cautious not to move too fast. The mildest CPs & GHK will thicken your skin so that you can move up to the next level. It may take a while though because thin skin is damaged skin.

I used GHK around my eyes for over a year before moving up to CP Serum. There is no need to rush the eyes that is for sure. For those who just aren't sure, it is a good idea to 1st apply a thin layer of Emu Oil or Squalane then your GHK or CPs on top. Then slowly reverse the method.

CPs are not like other skincare products that temporarily plump the skin to look good just for the day. Not only is that effect temporary, it is damaging. CPs are *remodeling agents* and can reverse skin damage so your skin can be youthful, beautiful and natural looking. Very Happy

So these are some of things you need to understand before getting started.

Hope that helps! Smile

free skin care · Sat Apr 10, 2010 10:27 am

Bermie wrote:

I am so confused.

I wanted to incorporate CP's into my skincare, but from what I have been reading it seems CP's are more suited to oily, acne scarred skin?

I have really dry skin, very few wrinkles, but sagging and sun damage are my major concern.

should I use CP's? thanks so much for all this info, you guys are amazing.. Very Happy

bermie - sorry if we've confused you. Hope we can straighten that out.

CPs are NOT just for oily, scarred skin. I just so happen to have that is all. What they are great for is some scarring issues and damaged skin (sun, peels, etc) They would help you with your concerns for sure, so that's a YES for your answer.

What is good for oily skin are the serums (Super GHK Serum, CP Serum, Super CP Serum & the new Skin signals). They also have creams which are good for dry skin (Super GHK Cream, & the extensive P & R line up). That doesn't mean dry skin can't use the serums - it's up to you. The serums have no lipids in them at all - so they are best topped with one like emu oil or squalane oil(BHO's). The BHO's also will push the CPs in better.

For scarred skin or very damaged skin they have stronger CPs(BioHeal, Super CP Serum, Super Cop or Super Cop 2X). The best place for most to start is the weaker ones though (GHK, P & R's, CP Serum). It takes the skin a while to get use to them since they're such strong remodeling agents.

free skin care · Sat Apr 10, 2010 10:34 am

Star Model - I didn't even realize that an 'uglies' thread had been started. Thanks for cross posting here.

free skin care · Sat Apr 10, 2010 11:06 am

beann1210 wrote:

Foxe, you mentioned that CPs are not for everybody and have caused damage to some people.

Foxe, can you explain more of this? Why would CP's cause damage in some people and is there a particular type of skin that shouldn't use the CPs due to this?

free skin care · Sat Apr 10, 2010 12:25 pm

rileygirl wrote:

beann1210 wrote:

Foxe, you mentioned that CPs are not for everybody and have caused damage to some people.

Foxe, can you explain more of this? Why would CP's cause damage in some people and is there a particular type of skin that shouldn't use the CPs due to this?

riley- from all the reading on forums that I have done on CPs there are a few people that have claimed some long term damage - bethany being one of them. I personally think most of that damage they saw was some buried stuff being brought up and not having a chance to go thru the remodeling process completely. bethany also seems to have some pretty sensitive skin (am I right bethany??), so that might have something to do with the long term part too.

I'm sure CPs are not meant for everyone - esp those who don't have the patience to see the process through. It is a long one for most

free skin care · Sat Apr 10, 2010 12:56 pm

Ok, gotcha. Thanks, Foxe. I thought maybe you had meant there was a particular skin type that should avoid the CP's!

free skin care · Sat Apr 10, 2010 3:55 pm

Bermie wrote:

I am so confused.

I wanted to incorporate CP's into my skincare, but from what I have been reading it seems CP's are more suited to oily, acne scarred skin?

I have really dry skin, very few wrinkles, but sagging and sun damage are my major concern.

should I use CP's? thanks so much for all this info, you guys are amazing.. Very Happy

Bermie, what I found was CP's improve your skin's ability to retain moisture as it thickens and heals your skin barrier.

free skin care · Sat Apr 10, 2010 5:38 pm

sister sweets wrote:

I think Kassy was using this on her lashes. Thanks for reminding me - I wanted to give this a try as a conditioner and possible growth promotion!

Sis, do you think there would be a concern with using the Folligen on the eyelid area for someone new to CP? I am assuming not if SB is indicating it. I wonder what the effects will be if you accidentally get it in the eyes?

free skin care · Sat Apr 10, 2010 5:44 pm

Thanks for clarifying that CPs don't cause damage!

free skin care · Sat Apr 10, 2010 5:46 pm

moosejavian wrote:

sister sweets wrote:

I think Kassy was using this on her lashes. Thanks for reminding me - I wanted to give this a try as a conditioner and possible growth promotion!

Sis, do you think there would be a concern with using the Folligen on the eyelid area for someone new to CP? I am assuming not if SB is indicating it. I wonder what the effects will be if you accidentally get it in the eyes?

Hi MJ,

You can see what Marta at truth in aging says about using folligen on lashes, she experimented herself. There is a full ingredient listing there as well. Smile

http://truthinaging.com/eyes/folligen-works-for-eyelash-and-eyebrow-growth/

free skin care · Sat Apr 10, 2010 6:40 pm

Dark Moon - that's a pretty good review of the Folligen from Marta. Thanks for that link.

I have used Folligen for my eyebrows - but not on a consistent basis. I did see some regrowth in thin areas, so it does work. I think the hair comes in finer, though. (Better than nothin'!)

free skin care · Sat Apr 10, 2010 6:44 pm

moosejavian - I have accidentally gotten CPs or Folligen into the eye (must've been Folligen - would've been experimenting applying to lash line w/ eyeliner brush) and it did sting. That was the only negative, though.

You would probably have to ask Dr Pickart if there would be any other consequences of getting CPs into the eyes - he is the expert!

free skin care · Sat Apr 10, 2010 6:46 pm

foxe wrote:

beann - you poor thing. I'm sorry you're feeling so bad about yourself right now and don't blame you at all.

I do think the CPs are the right product for you to help turn your damaged skin around. You didn’t happen to use a cortisone after the laser did you?

Skin Bio has a section dealing with damage from Post Procedures (peels, lasers, etc) and this is what they say:

"After chemical peels use Copper Peptides and Emu Oil to rebuild and heal skin which helps skin recover from cosmetic treatments and procedures. Cosmetic procedures can cause scars, burns, hyperpigmentation and irritate skin. Copper peptides rebuild the skin and promote a better reaction to trauma caused by lasers, dermabrasion, and chemical peels (such as tca chemical peels, salicylic acid peels, and glycolic peels) as well as other cosmetic treatments. Emu Oil is gentle and non-irritating. It improves scar healing by reducing inflammation while soothing skin."

Quote:

Improved Post Procedure Skin Recovery After Chemical Peels and Cosmetic Treatments
Normal chemical peels can produce severe irritation that leads to scars and prolonged redness. Simple coverings such as petrolatum do not stop the development of redness and reduce inflammation.

Peels followed by cortisone used as an anti-inflammatory often defeat their purpose since the cortisone inhibits skin repair. So while the peels remove blemishes and dead skin, the subsequent skin rebuilding is inhibited. This can produce very thin skin. And the need for scar healing.

SRCPs have powerful anti-inflammatory actions. But unlike cortisone which inhibits skin repair, the copper peptides stimulate skin repair. Copper peptides also inhibit the action of interleukin-1, (a hormone that increases skin damage after injury), and TGF-beta-1, (the scar-forming protein).

The products they recommend are either GHK or CP Serum AND Emu Oil, so it sounds like you got the right products.

As far as the uglies go, just go slow in the beginning. They don’t usually last very long – just until your skin is use to the CPs. If you see some, just back off a bit (use Emu only for a day or so)

And for the other products you have – I would not use the Exfoderm or Retin A at the moment. I’d keep with the Vitamin C in the morning, but that is another that is ‘not’ necessary. I think just the CP Serum and Emu oil to get your skin turned around since it is so damaged. The laser must’ve thinned your skin a bunch and that’s why it’s sagging so badly. I would think you’d start to see some improvement in a couple of months but realize it could take many more months to really see some action (CPs work very slowly). At least with the repairs they make on your damaged skin will be permanent (do expect normal aging). You’ve got to get your normal skin back – CPs should help.

Also – you need to take the vitamins we’ve been discussing here to help get the most out of the CPs: 1 gr each of Vitamin C and MSM (divided 500 mg each 2X/day).

Maybe later – after a few months (even sooner – depends on how things go), you can reintroduce the exfoliants to speed renewal up. It just sounds like you have too much damage and have really fragile skin right now to have all that going on with product usage. Rebuild a little first.

I also hope you are using a gentle cleanser – pH around neutral (6 or 7). Skin Bio’s Gentle Cleanse is awesome! Cetaphil would be another one. Gentle Cleanse does a good job of removing my makeup –better than the Cetaphil.
Good luck with everything and keep up up-to-date on your progress.

Foxe - Thanks so much for all the information. I promise to work slow and do it right. I will be patient. One question: You said that I probably shouldn't use the Exforderm, but on the SB web site they recommend to use an exfoliator with the CP. Do you think it's too much for my skin right now? I have an email into Dr. Picket and am waiting for his reply. I'm interested in hearing what he has to say.
One more question (I lied about the "one more question" last iime): Laughing

Can someone tell me how to post using just part of a quote and not the whole darn thing? Confused

Star ~ Thanks for all the great info.

free skin care · Sat Apr 10, 2010 6:54 pm

beann1210 wrote:

Foxe - Thanks so much for all the information. I promise to work slow and do it right. I will be patient. One question: You said that I probably shouldn't use the Exforderm, but on the SB web site they recommend to use an exfoliator with the CP. Do you think it's too much for my skin right now?

Yes, I do think it's too much. Your skin seems to be pretty fragile. You might get *faster* results with the exfoliator, but you also might have more irritation. I'd hold off on the red look.

Quote:

One more question (I lied about the "one more question" last iime): Laughing

Can someone tell me how to post using just part of a quote and not the whole darn thing? Confused

Star ~ Thanks for all the great info.

Hit the quote button and delete what you don't need between the [quote] [/ quote] brackets (make note of them when you look at the quote). I usually copy the whole bunch and put it into a word doc and redo it, though because (for some strange reason) the darn program here at EDS does such weird things like jumping around when I type that I can't do anything properly. I then copy it to the 'reply' page and post it.

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