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Keliu
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Mon May 23, 2011 5:50 pm      Reply with quote
rileygirl wrote:
LoriA wrote:
I think we're just saying that the body can be more receptive or not to the possibilities, kinda like leaning into a stretch or massage, if you know what I mean.

YOU need to participate, i.e. allow, otherwise whatever potential is there will be lost due to the resistance.


I understand what you are saying. I definitely believe the mind is very powerful. But, I think there are limits in my mind. I don't believe someone who has terminal cancer is going to cure themselves of the cancer just because they believe they will/are cured. Or, relating to skin care here, just because someone doesn't believe in tretinoin doesn't mean that this won't work for them, as it is proven to work, whether you choose to believe or not. Am I thinking this out too much? Laughing


I think people have cured themselves of terminal cancer - and have defied medical explanation. It's what people refer to as "miracles".

I've told the story of my ovarian cyst numerous times here - my gynecologist was convinced I'd "wished" it away!

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rileygirl
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Mon May 23, 2011 6:36 pm      Reply with quote
Keliu wrote:

I think people have cured themselves of terminal cancer - and have defied medical explanation. It's what people refer to as "miracles".

I've told the story of my ovarian cyst numerous times here - my gynecologist was convinced I'd "wished" it away!


Hmm, maybe I need to rethink my thinking! Very Happy
Keliu
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Mon May 23, 2011 6:41 pm      Reply with quote
rileygirl wrote:
Keliu wrote:

I think people have cured themselves of terminal cancer - and have defied medical explanation. It's what people refer to as "miracles".

I've told the story of my ovarian cyst numerous times here - my gynecologist was convinced I'd "wished" it away!


Hmm, maybe I need to rethink my thinking! Very Happy


Yes!! We need to think ourselves young and beautiful!!

But seriously, the Placebo Effect is well documented so there is definitely a relationship between mind and body - just look at the havoc on the body stress can reap.

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rileygirl
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Mon May 23, 2011 7:00 pm      Reply with quote
Keliu wrote:


Yes!! We need to think ourselves young and beautiful!!

But seriously, the Placebo Effect is well documented so there is definitely a relationship between mind and body - just look at the havoc on the body stress can reap.


LOL. If only I could, I definitely would! Laughing

I did read that link on the placebo effect and found it very interesting. (And, yes, agree, stress is really bad for the body.)
Antonia
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Tue May 24, 2011 10:30 am      Reply with quote
The pharmacist to which I referred (his name is Harlan Lahti) believes that when you believe that something will work, the brain secretes chemicals that alter the physiology of the cells. This, combined with the product itself, produces a stronger effect than if you just "pop a pill" and never consider what it will actually do for you. Makes sense to me.

That said, I'm puzzled as to why the product Kassy is trying to replicate didn't make me look like a goddess, as I believed in it. The only explanation for that I guess is that the ingredients weren't there to be enhanced (?) Who knows? Perhaps they were and my own body felt it didn't need to improve in any way, despite what my brain would have liked.

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circus
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Tue May 24, 2011 11:26 am      Reply with quote
Antonia wrote:
That said, I'm puzzled as to why the product Kassy is trying to replicate didn't make me look like a goddess, as I believed in it. The only explanation for that I guess is that the ingredients weren't there to be enhanced (?) Who knows? Perhaps they were and my own body felt it didn't need to improve in any way, despite what my brain would have liked.


That's it! You must be a goddess already Antonia! Very Happy Keliu, DarkMoon, rileygirl too! Very Happy

Anyway, as much as I like to keep an open mind, the unwillingness to come forward with (scientific) explanations makes it look like it has *none*. At least that's how it looks like to me. Confused
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Tue May 24, 2011 11:48 am      Reply with quote
circus wrote:


That's it! You must be a goddess already Antonia! Very Happy Keliu, DarkMoon, rileygirl too! Very Happy



Uhhhhhh, Nope, count me out on that one, circus! Laughing
rileygirl
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Tue May 24, 2011 11:51 am      Reply with quote
Antonia wrote:
The pharmacist to which I referred (his name is Harlan Lahti) believes that when you believe that something will work, the brain secretes chemicals that alter the physiology of the cells. This, combined with the product itself, produces a stronger effect than if you just "pop a pill" and never consider what it will actually do for you. Makes sense to me.



Ok. This does make sense to me. I think the key words in it are "produces a stronger effect". In my mind, this means that the Pill (or the skin care product, etc) has to be effective in the first place, but the mind believing in it makes the effects "more" pronounced.
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Tue May 24, 2011 12:00 pm      Reply with quote
Yes, that is how he explained it, RG. That the whole cascade of positive chemical reactions somehow enhances the end result.

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Kassy_A
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Tue May 24, 2011 3:55 pm      Reply with quote
Antonia wrote:


That said, I'm puzzled as to why the product Kassy is trying to replicate didn't make me look like a goddess, as I believed in it. The only explanation for that I guess is that the ingredients weren't there to be enhanced (?) Who knows? Perhaps they were and my own body felt it didn't need to improve in any way, despite what my brain would have liked.


?????

Did I miss something? Have you tried making your own energized miracle water?

Just an FYI; I'm dousing myself in this stuff, and nothing but a tight, irritating feeling so far... (I don't look tighter, but my skin feels tight.. Quite confusing.)

Just made another batch, and this time I increased the aloe, and used a DIY half assed Willards water.. Laughing

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♥I'm flattered by all the lovely PM's, but I don't get here much these days. Please don't be afraid to post your quearies to other DIY members who will be glad to help you (or sell you their wares..lol) Still happy with LED, dermarolling and a DIY antioxidant regime. Peace & Hugs to all.♥
Antonia
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Tue May 24, 2011 4:03 pm      Reply with quote
Lol. I said that the product Kassy is trying to replicate (i.e. ASG) didn't make me look like a goddess, not the product you are making.

Here's the whole post: The pharmacist to which I referred (his name is Harlan Lahti) believes that when you believe that something will work, the brain secretes chemicals that alter the physiology of the cells. This, combined with the product itself, produces a stronger effect than if you just "pop a pill" and never consider what it will actually do for you. Makes sense to me.

That said, I'm puzzled as to why the product Kassy is trying to replicate didn't make me look like a goddess, as I believed in it. The only explanation for that I guess is that the ingredients weren't there to be enhanced (?) Who knows? Perhaps they were and my own body felt it didn't need to improve in any way, despite what my brain would have liked.

Hmm...that is actually ambiguous, isn't it? Confused

Kassy_A wrote:
Antonia wrote:


That said, I'm puzzled as to why the product Kassy is trying to replicate didn't make me look like a goddess, as I believed in it. The only explanation for that I guess is that the ingredients weren't there to be enhanced (?) Who knows? Perhaps they were and my own body felt it didn't need to improve in any way, despite what my brain would have liked.


?????

Did I miss something? Have you tried making your own energized miracle water?

Just an FYI; I'm dousing myself in this stuff, and nothing but a tight, irritating feeling so far... (I don't look tighter, but my skin feels tight.. Quite confusing.)

Just made another batch, and this time I increased the aloe, and used a DIY half assed Willards water.. Laughing

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Kassy_A
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Tue May 24, 2011 4:05 pm      Reply with quote
Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing

Oy vey!

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♥I'm flattered by all the lovely PM's, but I don't get here much these days. Please don't be afraid to post your quearies to other DIY members who will be glad to help you (or sell you their wares..lol) Still happy with LED, dermarolling and a DIY antioxidant regime. Peace & Hugs to all.♥
Kassy_A
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Tue May 24, 2011 4:10 pm      Reply with quote
In the mean time, is anybody but me curious to what the "other substances" are, as reflected in the video?

No sweat if not, but I don't need to post what I find if you guys aren't interested.. (I'm in enough trouble with my *friends* here.)

Image Laughing


I'm the one getting the boot with the pitchfork..
Shock

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♥I'm flattered by all the lovely PM's, but I don't get here much these days. Please don't be afraid to post your quearies to other DIY members who will be glad to help you (or sell you their wares..lol) Still happy with LED, dermarolling and a DIY antioxidant regime. Peace & Hugs to all.♥
rileygirl
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Tue May 24, 2011 4:21 pm      Reply with quote
Kassy_A wrote:
In the mean time, is anybody but me curious to what the "other substances" are, as reflected in the video?



Sure. I would love to know what you find out regarding other substances in the product.
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Tue May 24, 2011 4:28 pm      Reply with quote
I have to call my associate who does lab analysis. Not sure he could do it in the immediate future though. Or can you do this? Of course we want to know...

Kassy_A wrote:
In the mean time, is anybody but me curious to what the "other substances" are, as reflected in the video?

No sweat if not, but I don't need to post what I find if you guys aren't interested.. (I'm in enough trouble with my *friends* here.)

Image Laughing


I'm the one getting the boot with the pitchfork..
Shock

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Tue May 24, 2011 4:52 pm      Reply with quote
Kassy_A wrote:
Antonia wrote:


That said, I'm puzzled as to why the product Kassy is trying to replicate didn't make me look like a goddess, as I believed in it. The only explanation for that I guess is that the ingredients weren't there to be enhanced (?) Who knows? Perhaps they were and my own body felt it didn't need to improve in any way, despite what my brain would have liked.


?????

Did I miss something? Have you tried making your own energized miracle water?

Just an FYI; I'm dousing myself in this stuff, and nothing but a tight, irritating feeling so far... (I don't look tighter, but my skin feels tight.. Quite confusing.)

Just made another batch, and this time I increased the aloe, and used a DIY half assed Willards water.. Laughing


The portion I put in bold of your statement is how the ASG/AS felt to me when I first used it, visibly nothing, then after a while it stopped having even the effect of feeling like anything at all, well water.

Yes anything you find out about the magic ingredients is of interest too me also. Laughing

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Keliu
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Wed May 25, 2011 5:02 am      Reply with quote
rileygirl wrote:
circus wrote:


That's it! You must be a goddess already Antonia! Very Happy Keliu, DarkMoon, rileygirl too! Very Happy



Uhhhhhh, Nope, count me out on that one, circus! Laughing


I'm a goddess on the inside but unfortunately you'd never know by looking at the outside!

With regard to energising water - why aren't all energised waters equal? Considering that it is the energy that is the crucial component - wouldn't all energised waters be the same providing they contain the same energy or amount of energy?

According to the ASG blurb, ASG is made by using a catalyst - the catalyst being Niacin, Cayenne Pepper, etc. The catalyst speeds up the process and creates the energy (I think) but is not contained in the finished product. The actual ingredients in the product are only there in minuscule amounts - so what role they're supposed to play, I'm not sure.

But it would be interesting to understand why it's not possible to duplicate ASG by simply adding the Aloe, MSM and minerals to Willards Water. Unless the catalyst Jim uses does create a different energy than the Willards energy. Although, Willards Water is also made using a catalyst.

And if anyone can understand what I've just written - please explain it to me!

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Wed May 25, 2011 9:56 am      Reply with quote
Wow, what a cool thread! I feel a little hesitant posting since I haven't read through all the related material, but that's really interesting to me about the catalysts being niacin & cayenne. Both are "heaty" (you can tell by their effect on you - niacin giving you that flush, and cayenne burning). So, like a homeopathic (I guess) strategy, a miniscule amount triggers a energetic reaction throughout the water so the original triggers are not even needed in the end product. Just like irritating skin - the irritant is removed and no longer contained in the vessel (body), but the effect remains.
And maybe certain triggers only fire up certain components of the vessel... seems to me that water may be just that sophisticated as to be the case. Giving them varying levels/types of energy.
Sorry if I may not be adding anything that isn't obvious here... I guess I'm just thinking out loud. Fascinating! Gives me a lot to consider w/regard to how energy moves.

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Wed May 25, 2011 10:20 am      Reply with quote
And getting back to the subject of results being real or imagined based on your belief, I think what happens is that initially, whether real (& perhaps virtually imperceptible) or imagined, if you focus on those positive changes, you're drawing more attention/energy to them... motivating the body to help fuel those changes. So it doesn't matter if they're real or not, you're using your inner reserves (which we ALL have in GREAT abundance) to create change. Actually outer as well, but that's a more extensive discussion, isn't it? Smile

This is why it IS helpful to think of yourself as a youthful looking goddess, or clear-skinned, based on just the barest of evidence pointing in that direction. That focus amplifies in seemingly magical ways!

I'm really pleased (& relieved!) to see there are so many of you who're open to having these kinds of discussions on eds.

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Wed May 25, 2011 12:25 pm      Reply with quote
LoriA wrote:


This is why it IS helpful to think of yourself as a youthful looking goddess, or clear-skinned, based on just the barest of evidence pointing in that direction. That focus amplifies in seemingly magical ways!




Yet on the flip side (playing devil's advocate here!), if you think of yourself that way, of course you are going to be much more positive and happy with yourself, which draws attention from people. So there may not really be any visible change, but people are more positive with you because you are most positive about yourself. Does that make sense? I think of it as self confidence. Very Happy
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Wed May 25, 2011 3:58 pm      Reply with quote
Just popping in to clarify why I posted regarding "other substances"..

I'm afraid I am as much in the *dark* about it as all of you... I simply thought it warranted further discussion, in the hopes that perhaps we could figure it out (or not.)

When I heard him say "other substances", it gave me an *ah ha* moment, which translated to; Now I understand why he (and others) are so confident it can't be duplicated..

Anything can be duplicated, IF all the facts are known.

@LoriA.. So glad you joined this discussion.. You bring much to ponder, and I thank you.. Very Happy

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Wed May 25, 2011 4:56 pm      Reply with quote
I just dropped in for my evenings entertainment. What I find so fascinating is how all of you are being vilified for asking a question that makes perfect sense. But no one will give you a straight answer and now even the inventor of the product has a bodyguard who will not allow him to speak for himself! What is wrong with that product? If one is not supposed to use it before bed for fear it may disrupt the sleep cycle maybe it is altering one's personality also. Here, spray this "dark energy" on your face it will make you beautiful. Bad Grin

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Wed May 25, 2011 5:05 pm      Reply with quote
rm7 - I wish you would post that on the Diamond thread.

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Wed May 25, 2011 5:19 pm      Reply with quote
Keliu wrote:
rm7 - I wish you would post that on the Diamond thread.
I'm sure they will see it. Right Now I am not posting anything on that thread, nor would I ever try that product. Keliu, the very fact that a statement about a cosmetic having the ability to enter your blood stream and get into your nervous system to affect it in such a way as to disturb your sleep?! I would DEMAND to know what is in it that would cause such a reaction. I have grandchildren who come to my home , what would I tell the poison control center if one got into this? Oh it is just water, msm, aloe, oh yes, dark energy, yea, it's energized, some kind of stimulant, well he said it can disrupt and adults sleep and little Timmy only weighs 34lbs.!!! How crazy is that!

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Wed May 25, 2011 5:26 pm      Reply with quote
What I find is bizarre is that I've been told that I'm holding the product up to ridicule by repeating and asking questions about the manufacturers claims!!! I'm not the one making the claims that are open for ridicule - the manufacturer is!

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