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DIY Structured/Energized Waters
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DarkMoon
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Wed May 25, 2011 5:27 pm      Reply with quote
I also will say I spoke to Jim on several occasions and a few facts.

He declined to post on the forum at all when asked several months ago.

He told me he himself doesn't understand the process of making AS/ASG so how could he explain it to anyone else?

The product was originally just his spray for hair growth that led too his run in with the FDA, then he found it had an anti-aging effect on the facial skin when people got it on the face while spraying their hair.

@Kassey....his "trace minerals" are obtained from several sources and in his words are not exactly the same each time.

I assume the messenger shall be shot once again, but I am wearing my bullet proof vest now! Bad Grin

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rileygirl
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Wed May 25, 2011 8:22 pm      Reply with quote
rmc7 wrote:
I just dropped in for my evenings entertainment. What I find so fascinating is how all of you are being vilified for asking a question that makes perfect sense. But no one will give you a straight answer and now even the inventor of the product has a bodyguard who will not allow him to speak for himself!


This has been the crux of the problem all along. Questions are asked, and then we go round and round and end up back at square 1. Questions with no answers.
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Wed May 25, 2011 9:19 pm      Reply with quote
OOPS! sorry Kassy, getting used to real keyboard! Embarassed Embarassed

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Fri May 27, 2011 12:27 am      Reply with quote
Lacy has given me the link to this website on water:
http://www.lsbu.ac.uk/water/sitemap.html

There's everything you need to know about water - except how to make a cup of tea! There's allot of scientific info so it's a bit heavy going for me. I can't find a mention of energising water - but I'm going to write to the professor and ask for his opinion.

Kassy - maybe your magnet device has purified your water which is making it taste better:

Liquid water is affected by magnetic fields [1522, 1597] and such fields can assist its purification.
http://www.lsbu.ac.uk/water/magnetic.html#mag

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Fri May 27, 2011 6:08 am      Reply with quote
Here's some interesting reading by Paul Shin, Ph.D. in chemistry, on hexagonal water. He basically refutes the claims made in the book "The Water Puzzle and the Hexagonal Key" by Dr. Mu Shik Jhon, also a Ph.D. in chemistry.

http://www.csun.edu/~alchemy/Caveat_Emptor.pdf

I enjoyed reading the differences between science and pseudoscience on his powerpoint presentation.

http://www.alchemedu.org/docs/Pseudoscience.ppt

I suspect he might be willing to come and answer questions relating to this topic. In a footnote to his article, he says "If you are interested I will be happy to test your water samples as I can."

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DarkMoon
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Fri May 27, 2011 6:14 am      Reply with quote
Skippie wrote:
Here's some interesting reading by Paul Shin, Ph.D. in chemistry, on hexagonal water. He basically refutes the claims made in the book "The Water Puzzle and the Hexagonal Key" by Dr. Mu Shik Jhon, also a Ph.D. in chemistry.

http://www.csun.edu/~alchemy/Caveat_Emptor.pdf

I enjoyed reading the differences between science and pseudoscience on his powerpoint presentation.

http://www.alchemedu.org/docs/Pseudoscience.ppt

I suspect he might be willing to come and answer questions relating to this topic. In a footnote to his article, he says "If you are interested I will be happy to test your water samples as I can."


Very interesting Skippie, great find. That would be terrific if he did indeed come and answer some questions, and share his knowledge.

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Fri May 27, 2011 4:58 pm      Reply with quote
Skippie wrote:
Here's some interesting reading by Paul Shin, Ph.D. in chemistry, on hexagonal water. He basically refutes the claims made in the book "The Water Puzzle and the Hexagonal Key" by Dr. Mu Shik Jhon, also a Ph.D. in chemistry.

http://www.csun.edu/~alchemy/Caveat_Emptor.pdf

I enjoyed reading the differences between science and pseudoscience on his powerpoint presentation.

http://www.alchemedu.org/docs/Pseudoscience.ppt

I suspect he might be willing to come and answer questions relating to this topic. In a footnote to his article, he says "If you are interested I will be happy to test your water samples as I can."


I actually provided the link to Dr. Shin on the original ASG thread. I also wrote to him asking if water could be energised and provided him the link to the ASG website. Unfortunately, I didn't receive a reply. But if someone else would like to contact him, that would be great - Skippie, go for it!

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Fri May 27, 2011 6:48 pm      Reply with quote
I've just shot off another email to Dr. Shin - lets hope I get a reply this time.

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Sat May 28, 2011 4:42 pm      Reply with quote
DarkMoon wrote:
Reading Jim suggested on the special attributes of water that has been affected by outside forces such as writing nice or mean words and placing under the container, playing types of music, praying ect.:

Dr. Emoto

http://www.masaru-emoto.net/english/e_ome_home.html


A researcher who wanted to investigate what Dr. Emoto claims were:

There are innumerable companies today that make their livelihoods selling information and products that are supposed to be beneficial to human health. Ranging from miracle cures to last-ditch efforts, they are at best based on unsubstantiated ideas, and are at worst complete falsehoods. Unfortunately for his credibility with the scientific community, Dr. Emoto sells products based on his claims. For example, the products page of Emoto’s Hado website is currently offering “geometrically perfect” “Indigo water” that is “highly charged hexagonally structured concentrate,” and supposedly creates “structured water” that is “is more easily assimilated at the cellular level” for $35 for an eight-ounce bottle. Without providing scientific research references for the allegedly amazing qualities of his Indigo Water, Emoto’s commercial venture calls to mind ethical concerns regarding his intent and motivation—questions that would not be present if any scientist had published research supporting his claims.

Since Dr. Emoto is going it alone he receives much criticism for being a quack selling quackery. For example, the James Randi Educational foundation, an organization that offers a “one-million-dollar prize to anyone who can show, under proper observing conditions, evidence of any paranormal, supernatural, or occult power or event” (Randi, Challenge) has offered to give Dr. Emoto the prize if he will agree “to perform his tests in a double-blind fashion” (Randi, Water), yet Dr. Emoto has not responded.

Kristopher Setchfield, BA, Health Science
Natural Science Department
Castleton State College, Vermont

http://www.is-masaru-emoto-for-real.com/


Very interesting, K. Kangen (hexagonal water) is going for a few $ a bottle at the local alternative pharmacy. They make it fresh for you from the Kangen machine, so this - and the "price of hope" pricing sounds like a load of codswallop.

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Mon May 30, 2011 10:38 am      Reply with quote
^ Laughing

Kassy_A wrote:
@LoriA.. So glad you joined this discussion.. You bring much to ponder, and I thank you.. Very Happy

Very Happy That's so nice of you to say!

I like how so many came spilling out onto this thread at once like desperate refugees from the other, lol!
It prompted me to take a look over there, and wow, I applaud all of you for taking up the challenge to contend with everyone so passionate about their beliefs on this one. But I guess EDS is my happy place, and I don't want to deal with frustration - I've had enough resistance to deal with in other areas of my life. I feel like I may be more inclined to believe in some of the "unproven" stuff (certainly not all) but I honestly appreciate your challenging these products' claims. Reading through it all might hit some of my triggers (not to mention be beyond me in terms of time, attention & understanding), so by not reading a thread so "charged" you can all stay my buds!

I'm sure its been said in the 74 pages(!) but if these things weren't so expensive, and if there weren't thousands sheisters out there having made us all so suspicious, we might all be able to believe (if that is actually part of the "formula"), see for ourselves and decide if they're effective. As it stands today, that's a tall order.

Thanks everyone - entertaining reading!

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Mon May 30, 2011 10:57 am      Reply with quote
LoriA wrote:
^ Laughing

Kassy_A wrote:
@LoriA.. So glad you joined this discussion.. You bring much to ponder, and I thank you.. Very Happy

Very Happy That's so nice of you to say!

I like how so many came spilling out onto this thread at once like desperate refugees from the other, lol!
It prompted me to take a look over there, and wow, I applaud all of you for taking up the challenge to contend with everyone so passionate about their beliefs on this one. But I guess EDS is my happy place, and I don't want to deal with frustration - I've had enough resistance to deal with in other areas of my life. I feel like I may be more inclined to believe in some of the "unproven" stuff (certainly not all) but I honestly appreciate your challenging these products' claims. Reading through it all might hit some of my triggers (not to mention be beyond me in terms of time, attention & understanding), so by not reading a thread so "charged" you can all stay my buds!

I'm sure its been said in the 74 pages(!) but if these things weren't so expensive, and if there weren't thousands sheisters out there having made us all so suspicious, we might all be able to believe (if that is actually part of the "formula"), see for ourselves and decide if they're effective. As it stands today, that's a tall order.

Thanks everyone - entertaining reading!


You have echoed many of our sentiments I am sure. For me personally, it's beyond disappointing being "challenged" for passing opinion after that opinion is sought several times previously. Tall order it is!

That said, I'm intrigued as to what the lovely and always beautiful of heart Kassy will come up with. Also, I would like to try her version with my "Spirits White Gold" supplement Smile which is supposed to increase one's level of vibration and integration with the universe about us...

I just discovered after all these years, that those little hearts are thanks and that we can thank others. How dumb is that? I must be blind.

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DarkMoon
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Mon May 30, 2011 12:15 pm      Reply with quote
Lori,
I heartily agree as well, if we chose to post on "the thread" we needed our flack jackets on, and I bet you missed some of the fun.

I have always been willing to explore the alternative and use many such products, but some just push the envelope with outrageous claims and prices. Really 38$ for 8 oz. of water you will flush down the potty a few hours later? NO TOO MUCH IMHO!

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Mon May 30, 2011 1:16 pm      Reply with quote
oooooh, hearts! Thanks!
I forget about these too. However, I'm always afraid that if I start using them I'll start abusing them - and tagging every other one of YOUR posts, for instance.
Anyway, hope you guys recover from the thread traumas soon. I can sense you're all still twitching. Laughing

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Mon May 30, 2011 4:41 pm      Reply with quote
Image

Who'd a thunk it was possible to enjoy a *laugh* in a structured water thread? How nice!

I'm plowing ahead, with a little tweaking each time, but will hold off reporting anything here till next week..(Reason being, I'm not quite sure if what I'm seeing is because of the new routine, or if in fact the *energy & vibration* is the result of 3 days with my 4 and 9 year old grandsons...Laughing ) No miracles mind you, more akin to *refreshed* perhaps.

Oh, before I forget again.. For those who have also experienced drying of their skin with either the DIY energized water or ASG (as reflected in private correspondence), this simple DIY cream will straighten you out;

Dry Skin Cream (3oz)

1/2oz CeraVe Cream
1oz CeraVe Lotion
1/2oz Aloe Vera Gel (I used fresh, but if you can find a good bottled gel, go for it)
1 tsp Niacinamide
1/2 tsp Glycerin
2 tsp Virgin Coconut Oil
2 tsp Distilled Water

Mix the CV products together
Mix the niacinamide into the water, then add to the base
Now add and stir in the remaining ingredients.

***For those who opt for fresh aloe***

- Cut a leave from the bottom of the plant
- Stand in sink, cut side down, so the nasty liquid runs out
- Slice leave lengthwise, and scoop out the 'gel' only with a spoon

Fair warning, fresh aloe gel will (and should) look quite snotty (Laughing) If you have a little DIY mixer, it will come in handy to incorporate it into your cream.. If not, just do the best you can to mix thoroughly..

If you use fresh aloe, you might want to add a few drops of preservative.

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Mon May 30, 2011 7:53 pm      Reply with quote
I've received a reply from Professor Chaplin. Unfortunately, it's not very expansive - but I suppose I've got to consider myself lucky that he bothered to reply at all. Here's my initial email and his reply:

Quote:
Dear Professor Chaplin,

I came across your website whilst trying to find out some information on energised water. I'm endeavouring to find out if water CAN actually be energised and if the various gadgets sold to energise water actually work.

As you probably realise there are so many energised/harmonised/structured waters on the market today, all making claims to heal and beautify the body - but the general view seems to be that these products are scams. I would particularly like your take on this product: www.agelesssecret.com

I would be so grateful for your opinion.



Professor Chaplin wrote:
Quote:
Hi

Certainly they do not give any information proving to me that it is a useful product and not a scam.

My view is that I am not impressed enough to try it.

Best wishes

martin

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Mon May 30, 2011 9:44 pm      Reply with quote
Hi ladies!

Not trying to perpetuate drama, but I've been watching all of these threads and afraid to post or question info anywhere but here!

With regards to "other ingredients" not listed, well isn't that just flat out illegal? To sell a cosmetic product without a full list of ingredients?

just wondering!

xo

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Tue May 31, 2011 3:27 am      Reply with quote
snowymtn wrote:
With regards to "other ingredients" not listed, well isn't that just flat out illegal? To sell a cosmetic product without a full list of ingredients?


I'm sure it is. But in the case of ASG the "other ingredients" may not be actually present in the end product. Willard Green (who sells ASG under a different brand name) claims that if the product is analysed in a lab only traces of the primary ingredients will be present - so the product is basically water. The other ingredients which were used as a catalyst will not be present.

At the moment my thoughts are this: According to the reading that I've been doing, cells can definitely benefit from being energised. So doesn't it make more sense to energise them using electrical stimulation (which can be measured and quantified) rather than by using energised water which is a somewhat iffy process. In addition, you only have to make one initial purchase of the device you're going to use (eg. LED or Soft Laser etc.)

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Tue May 31, 2011 11:11 am      Reply with quote
snowymtn wrote:
Hi ladies!

Not trying to perpetuate drama, but I've been watching all of these threads and afraid to post or question info anywhere but here!

With regards to "other ingredients" not listed, well isn't that just flat out illegal? To sell a cosmetic product without a full list of ingredients?

just wondering!

xo


In Canada it is.

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Tue May 31, 2011 11:16 am      Reply with quote
If our bodies are 70% or thereabouts water, why can't we just visualize ourselves becoming beautiful and well, stick post-its all over saying how fabulous we are, and so on? I'm not being funny here but if water can be changed through simple words, then positivity should affect us profoundly (and similarly negatively).
Food for thought Smile

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Tue May 31, 2011 3:20 pm      Reply with quote
Kassy_A wrote:
Anyway, since some on this forum are quite inquisitive by nature, and enjoy figuring out the why's and how's of what makes things *tick*, perhaps some others will pay attention to and hear, exactly what I heard when I viewed the following video on Jim's website;

Scroll down to the "As Seen On PBS" video, and go to minute 13.00 to 13.23

When he tells about the "ingredients" in the product, he finishes with; "and other substances"..

http://www.agelesssecret.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=category&layout=blog&id=47&Itemid=208

So the point of my post I suppose is twofold I suppose;

1. Why is Jim *admittedly* not fully disclosing all ingredients?

2. And if that is the case, and he's hiding "other substances", of course he (and the product lovers who repeatedly say now that it can't be duplicated), would of course be confident, and rightly so..

Wouldn't hiding something be the ONLY way to be sure it couldn't be duplicated? (Any cooks among us that hold back a little somethin' somethin when sharing a favorite recipe? Bad Grin I know that I've been guilty of that a time or five... Laughing



I have finally had time to listen to the PBS video clip. I believe this is what Jim said in response to the question "What are the ingredients in the Ageless Secret Formula"?

The product is a mixture of super-purified water, MSM, Aloe, and trace minerals that have been energized with a special process that I created and that I call "Catalyst Chemistry" (to keep if simple) using Cayenne Pepper, Niacin, Ho Shou Wu, and Helichrysum as catalysts and other substances.

My interpretation of that statement is the Cayenne Pepper, Niacin, Ho Shou Wu, and Helichrysum are the other substances added to the base mixture (water, MSM aloe and trace minerals) and function as catalysts. In other words, no unlisted, secret ingredients are added to the product(s).

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Tue May 31, 2011 5:19 pm      Reply with quote
Tomorrow, my associate who runs a huge QC and testing lab for the natural supplement industry will be back from China. I am going to see if he can test this for me. I want to know what I have been spraying on myself. It's a little late in the day but Kassy's experimentation has me intrigued.

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Tue May 31, 2011 6:04 pm      Reply with quote
Antonia wrote:
If our bodies are 70% or thereabouts water, why can't we just visualize ourselves becoming beautiful and well, stick post-its all over saying how fabulous we are, and so on? I'm not being funny here but if water can be changed through simple words, then positivity should affect us profoundly (and similarly negatively).
Food for thought Smile


I'm sure that positive thoughts are beneficial. There's that Australian woman who wrote the book "The Secret" which has a huge following - I haven't read the book but I think it's primarily based on the power of visualization and positive thoughts.

Antonia, I'll be very interested in the lab results for ASG - because as I stated earlier, it's supposed to be primarily H2O with only traces of the Aloe, MSM and minerals. Could you also ask your contact his view on the question of energising water too.

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Tue May 31, 2011 7:25 pm      Reply with quote
Keliu wrote:

Antonia, I'll be very interested in the lab results for ASG - because as I stated earlier, it's supposed to be primarily H2O with only traces of the Aloe, MSM and minerals. Could you also ask your contact his view on the question of energising water too.


I also will be interested regarding the results. And, ditto on Keliu's request to get his view on energized water.
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Wed Jun 01, 2011 2:25 pm      Reply with quote
Keliu wrote:
Antonia wrote:
If our bodies are 70% or thereabouts water, why can't we just visualize ourselves becoming beautiful and well, stick post-its all over saying how fabulous we are, and so on? I'm not being funny here but if water can be changed through simple words, then positivity should affect us profoundly (and similarly negatively).
Food for thought Smile


I'm sure that positive thoughts are beneficial. There's that Australian woman who wrote the book "The Secret" which has a huge following - I haven't read the book but I think it's primarily based on the power of visualization and positive thoughts.

Antonia, I'll be very interested in the lab results for ASG - because as I stated earlier, it's supposed to be primarily H2O with only traces of the Aloe, MSM and minerals. Could you also ask your contact his view on the question of energising water too.


It will be fantastic to hear both what the lab results are and his take on energizing water, hoping you will post whatever you find out Antonia!

Great idea Keliu. Smile

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Wed Jun 01, 2011 2:41 pm      Reply with quote
I'm not sure that the finding out the contents will explain the unexplainable but it will at least give Kassy something more to go on. My contact is a very level headed gentleman with varied interests, and an open mind. I hope he can do it for me. I was a little concerned about the not spraying before bedtime claim as this suggests it can have an effect on the pituitary. That said, I used to fall off to sleep after spraying ASG and using my LightStim. (Perhaps it's only the "Diamond" version that is supposed to affect sleep.)

Also, I guess we can go on asking various people's opinions on structured and energized water until we are blue in the face but it will remain a matter of individual opinion and personal belief. Back to the "Whatever you believe in, is..." line of thought.

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