Cellese AnteAGE System: general discussion
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free skin care · Fri Apr 06, 2012 11:35 am

Several people asked me about what essential oils are in the accelerator. Turns out the answer is none. The label contains a mistake, traced back to the factory. We will be correcting that shortly. Meanwhile, sorry for the confusion.

free skin care · Fri Apr 06, 2012 11:41 am

DrJ wrote:

Several people asked me about what essential oils are in the accelerator. Turns out the answer is none. The label contains a mistake, traced back to the factory. We will be correcting that shortly. Meanwhile, sorry for the confusion.

Thanks for the update...and you are forgiven! Laughing

You know I am joking about that last part, your correction is very much appreciated!

free skin care · Fri Apr 06, 2012 11:45 am

DrJ wrote:

Several people asked me about what essential oils are in the accelerator. Turns out the answer is none. The label contains a mistake, traced back to the factory. We will be correcting that shortly. Meanwhile, sorry for the confusion.

Actually Dr. J the ingredients list says there are essential oils in the serum as well as the accelerator. Are you saying that there are not any EOs in the serum too?

free skin care · Fri Apr 06, 2012 12:18 pm

jom wrote:

DrJ wrote:

Several people asked me about what essential oils are in the accelerator. Turns out the answer is none. The label contains a mistake, traced back to the factory. We will be correcting that shortly. Meanwhile, sorry for the confusion.

Actually Dr. J the ingredients list says there are essential oils in the serum as well as the accelerator. Are you saying that there are not any EOs in the serum too?

Yes - not present in either one. (you can always add your own if you want some).

free skin care · Fri Apr 06, 2012 12:44 pm

I think I am all caught up on questions, except this one from Kassy .. What definitive skin improvements could the average 40, 50 & 60 year old expect to see after say, 1 year of committed use? I ask this so I can make a comparison to whether or not it can do more for me than the Vitamin C serum & Retin-A have continually done for me. (I spend about $50. per year on these products.)

Good question. I think you should have a look at the AnteAGE clinical trial results.

http://anteage.com/anteage-clinical-trial/

Additional info: The age distribution of the population in the study was primarily 40's, 50's, and 60's. The benefits were really the same across the age spectrum, in terms of the 12 parameters measured. In terms of the degree of improvement,

0 worse with AnteAGE
1 no improvement
2 minor improvement
3 moderate improvement
4 considerable improvement
5 remarkable improvement

if we look across an age spectrum and take an average across parameters, we see average scores of 4.4 in the 40's, 4.0 in the 50's, and 3.5 in the 60's. I think this means there is more work for any product to do the older the person is at the start.

It's always hard to compare one product to another unless you do a test with a large number of people. And of course each person is a bit different. I would point out that we provide not just a retinoid and Vit C, but a host of other proven actives, plus the superhero ingredient stem cytokines.

Hope this helps.

free skin care · Fri Apr 06, 2012 12:58 pm

Well that makes it 'clinically proven' doesn't it?

free skin care · Fri Apr 06, 2012 1:27 pm

Lotusesther wrote:

Well that makes it 'clinically proven' doesn't it?

Funny. An artist made a banner ad for us that had "clinically proven" on it. I said "no, I have been advised that is the wrong thing to say". See, you folks do make a difference.

free skin care · Fri Apr 06, 2012 4:32 pm

DrJ wrote:

Lotusesther wrote:

Well that makes it 'clinically proven' doesn't it?

Funny. An artist made a banner ad for us that had "clinically proven" on it. I said "no, I have been advised that is the wrong thing to say". See, you folks do make a difference.

Where do we send the invoice for all the free advice we've been giving? Laughing

free skin care · Fri Apr 06, 2012 4:56 pm

jom wrote:

Where do we send the invoice for all the free advice we've been giving? Laughing

Heavens!! Don't give DrJ any more ideas!

free skin care · Fri Apr 06, 2012 5:00 pm

DrJ wrote:

I think I am all caught up on questions, except this one from Kassy .. What definitive skin improvements could the average 40, 50 & 60 year old expect to see after say, 1 year of committed use? I ask this so I can make a comparison to whether or not it can do more for me than the Vitamin C serum & Retin-A have continually done for me. (I spend about $50. per year on these products.)

Good question. I think you should have a look at the AnteAGE clinical trial results.

http://anteage.com/anteage-clinical-trial/

Thanks so much Dr J for answering my questions... Will you indulge me just once more.. Laughing

Consistent use of Vitamin C Serum, Retin-A and AHA's have my 62 year old skin in really great, glowing and plump condition. Albeit a little lower face sag, I really have no complaints. In fact, my skin turnover seems better now than it was 20 years ago when I didn't use any products whatsoever....

Soooo, could you please tell me what additional improvements I could expect to achieve by adding your serums to my regime? I'm particularly interested in it's ability (or lack there of) in skin firming.

I thank you for the link to the reviews, but after 5 years at EDS, I've learned NOT to put much weight in them. (I've jumped on too many disappointing bandwagons based on reviews + clinical trials Embarassed

) I will definitely look forward to the input here at EDS 3 months from now though!

Thanks again DrJ.

free skin care · Fri Apr 06, 2012 5:09 pm

Did anyone catch the pie charts on Cellese? (link Dr J provided above)

For the "self" rated improvement 24% gave themselves extraordinary results and and 15% gave themselves remarkable results.

In the professional assessment pie chart, 36% (the majority) had moderate improvement.

free skin care · Fri Apr 06, 2012 5:24 pm

rileygirl wrote:

Did anyone catch the pie charts on Cellese? (link Dr J provided above)

For the "self" rated improvement 24% gave themselves extraordinary results and and 15% gave themselves remarkable results.

In the professional assessment pie chart, 36% (the majority) had moderate improvement.

Looked at another way, the professional reviewers found that 53% of the participants had moderate or better results while 57% percent of the participants said they had moderate or better results. And the professionals found that only 3% of the participants showed no improvement compared to 5% of the participants who said they showed no improvement.

I think this is going to be like all products. It works for some people but not for everyone.

free skin care · Fri Apr 06, 2012 5:30 pm

I just had a thought while reading about pie charts, improvements and such.

If 100 people with dry skin applied Vaseline, 100 people would be claiming improvement the next day...

So what? Confused

free skin care · Fri Apr 06, 2012 5:43 pm

jom wrote:

I think this is going to be like all products. It works for some people but not for everyone.

Agree!

Also, one thing that was a little disappointing to see was the bar graph with the fine and deep lines showing the lowest % of improvement (on the professional assessment side).

free skin care · Fri Apr 06, 2012 5:43 pm

I just realized that the pie charts do not add up to 100%. Dr. J what is that about? The profesional chart adds up to 74% and the user chart adds up to 77% yet they are made to look like they add up to 100%.

free skin care · Fri Apr 06, 2012 5:45 pm

Kassy_A wrote:

I just had a thought while reading about pie charts, improvements and such.

If 100 people with dry skin applied Vaseline, 100 people would be claiming improvement the next day...

So what? Confused

LOL. I have learned to take the personal assessment claims with a huge grain of salt. Rose colored glasses (and positive attitudes) play a major role when assessing ourselves! Laughing

free skin care · Fri Apr 06, 2012 5:48 pm

Kassy_A wrote:

I just had a thought while reading about pie charts, improvements and such.

If 100 people with dry skin applied Vaseline, 100 people would be claiming improvement the next day...

So what? Confused

You would be proving that Vaseline improves dry skin. I think it's possible that not everyone would experience an improvement in their dry skin from using Vaseline.

Same thing with Dr. J's product. Some people experienced an improvement in age spots so it proves that it helps reduce age spots in SOME people.

free skin care · Fri Apr 06, 2012 6:27 pm

With regard to the clinical trial results and the subjective results from users - why aren't there definitive, objective, medical results that can be measured in a scientific, biological manner rather than people noticed minor improvement/remarkable improvement?

Given that this product uses cytokines which are supposed to cause a biological reaction in the body - I would like to see a measurement of those biological reactions.

For example, if this was a trial on how stem cell therapy improved spinal injuries - subjective results would be of no interest to the scientific community. If the patient were to say after one month of therapy that there was an improvement in pain or movement that would be great. But surely the scientists concerned would be more interested in looking at what was happening to the body on a physiological/biological basis.

Can't this analogy be applied to stem cell face serums?

free skin care · Fri Apr 06, 2012 6:53 pm

Keliu wrote:

With regard to the clinical trial results and the subjective results from users - why aren't there definitive, objective, medical results that can be measured in a scientific, biological manner rather than people noticed minor improvement/remarkable improvement?

Given that this product uses cytokines which are supposed to cause a biological reaction in the body - I would like to see a measurement of those biological reactions.

For example, if this was a trial on how stem cell therapy improved spinal injuries - subjective results would be of no interest to the scientific community. If the patient were to say after one month of therapy that there was an improvement in pain or movement that would be great. But surely the scientists concerned would be more interested in looking at what was happening to the body on a physiological/biological basis.

Can't this analogy be applied to stem cell face serums?

We have lots more data. Scientific publications often restrict what you can report before it gets published. They want it copyrighted exclusively to them (so they can make money selling publications with exclusive stuff in it). So I am restricted ion what I can share. Although what has been shared is both objective and subjective data.

I can however point you to published data relating to stem cells, cytokines, their effects, how they work. We didn't invent cytokines, we just figured out better ways to get them in the right patterns.

free skin care · Fri Apr 06, 2012 6:55 pm

jom wrote:

I just realized that the pie charts do not add up to 100%. Dr. J what is that about? The profesional chart adds up to 74% and the user chart adds up to 77% yet they are made to look like they add up to 100%.

Artist mess up. I'll get them to put the real ones up there. Good math skills!

free skin care · Fri Apr 06, 2012 7:01 pm

rileygirl wrote:

jom wrote:

I think this is going to be like all products. It works for some people but not for everyone.

Agree!

Also, one thing that was a little disappointing to see was the bar graph with the fine and deep lines showing the lowest % of improvement (on the professional assessment side).

Keep in mind the study lasted 6-8 weeks. maximal effects shouldn't really take place for 4-6 months. It takes time to build new collagen fibers & break up bad cross links.

If anyone reports fantastic results in eliminating wrinkles (rhytids) after a few weeks of any product don't believe it. Physiologically just not in the cards. We were surprised the results were as good as they were.

free skin care · Fri Apr 06, 2012 7:02 pm

jom wrote:

Kassy_A wrote:

I just had a thought while reading about pie charts, improvements and such.

If 100 people with dry skin applied Vaseline, 100 people would be claiming improvement the next day...

So what? Confused

You would be proving that Vaseline improves dry skin. I think it's possible that not everyone would experience an improvement in their dry skin from using Vaseline.

Same thing with Dr. J's product. Some people experienced an improvement in age spots so it proves that it helps reduce age spots in SOME people.

Vaseline does hydrtae skin. Just before it clogs your pores and causes acne & inflammation.

free skin care · Fri Apr 06, 2012 7:35 pm

DrJ wrote:

jom wrote:

Kassy_A wrote:

I just had a thought while reading about pie charts, improvements and such.

If 100 people with dry skin applied Vaseline, 100 people would be claiming improvement the next day...

So what? Confused

You would be proving that Vaseline improves dry skin. I think it's possible that not everyone would experience an improvement in their dry skin from using Vaseline.

Same thing with Dr. J's product. Some people experienced an improvement in age spots so it proves that it helps reduce age spots in SOME people.

Vaseline does hydrtae skin. Just before it clogs your pores and causes acne & inflammation.

My point was clearly missed which was that even folks using the cheapest, crappiest products, could see some sort of improvements. Pie chart, shmie chart...

In any event, I'm sure you have your hands full now with both the "artist" and "factory" glitches, but I will look forward to the answer to my above question whenever you have a chance..

free skin care · Fri Apr 06, 2012 7:49 pm

DrJ wrote:

Vaseline does hydrtae skin. Just before it clogs your pores and causes acne & inflammation.

I believe mineral oil is one of those ingredients which is maligned without any real evidence.

Here is some myth busting info:
http://thebeautybrains.com/2006/11/28/the-top-5-myths-about-mineral-oil-part-1/

http://www.cosmeticscop.com/cosmetic-ingredient-dictionary/definition/963/mineral-oil.aspx

free skin care · Fri Apr 06, 2012 8:27 pm

DrJ wrote:

jom wrote:

I just realized that the pie charts do not add up to 100%. Dr. J what is that about? The profesional chart adds up to 74% and the user chart adds up to 77% yet they are made to look like they add up to 100%.

Artist mess up. I'll get them to put the real ones up there. Good math skills!

I hope you don't mind Dr. J but I have a couple of other suggestions. I'm a researcher too so I'm used to colloborating with people on data analysis and presentation so I just thought I'd give you some feedback on the other two graphs that you have on the website. The x-axis labels should be the same in both graphs and they should match the text you have in the boxes listing the 12 parameters. Just for consistency purposes. The y-axis values should be 0-100% in both graphs. This would allow more room for the x-axis labels in the "professional ratings" graph and would allow for a better comparison.

Just my 2 cents! Hope you don't mind. I've also launched a website before and maintain one so I know how nervewracking it can be.

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