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lauvene
New Member
 
Joined: 26 Aug 2016
Posts: 9
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Fri Aug 26, 2016 7:08 am  |
Hello lovely people,
I've been reading this forum for quite a while now and found tons of useful information here. Now I decided to finally ask for your opinion/advice.
I'm 33 and have a very expressive face, especially in the eye area. Couple years ago I noticed the first signs of a frown wrinkle/11s, which I didn't take enough care of and now it's much more pronounced. I really don't like how it makes my face look - you surely know, tired and angry, older than I am. I've been doing some research about the facial exercises and facial massage, but ultimately ended up confused as there seem to be two opinions about frown wrinkle causes:
1. The corrugator supercilii muscle, responsible for frowning, is becoming too short with time and can't lay flat anymore, but in order for it to lay flat it actually needs to get stronger so it can come back to its relaxed position. I found these exercises where you put resistance in the area and try to frown, they seem to follow this logic. Been doing them for a while (couple of weeks) but I didn't seem any improvement, nor the things got worse. I guess that was not long enough to see any results.
2. Same (muscle too short), but the reason is not that the muscle is too weak, but it's overtrained from constant frowning and too strong, so I'd need to let it atrophy and rather massage than train the forehead/eye area. This somehow seems to be more true for me, because 1. botox treatment is based on this logic and 2. when I use frownies and night and facial massage, the area does appear more smooth, even in the evening. But the effect is not quite satisfying and I'd love to do more/get better results.
Should I combine exercises and massage, or one will actually negate the other? I don't mind buying and following any program that is out there, but while they do wonders for the jaw, cheeks and eyelids, I founds very little to no proofs that they help reduce frown wrinkles as well. Maybe some of you actually have the experience in exactly this matter?
P.S. I wanted to share some pictures of my wrinkle here but unfortunately, I'm a new member and the system doesn't allow me to. |
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lauvene
New Member
Joined: 26 Aug 2016
Posts: 9
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Sat Aug 27, 2016 8:25 am |
Anyone?
Basically my question is - will exercising the muscles that are responsible for frowning make things better or worse? |
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Sun Aug 28, 2016 1:51 am |
You need to monitor how your face responds to exercises. You probably would find you can exercise it but need to be careful about pumping the muscle up too much.
I think massage and eercises are a good idea as the massage should help relax the muscle and smooth it out.
| lauvene wrote: |
Anyone?
Basically my question is - will exercising the muscles that are responsible for frowning make things better or worse? |
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Sun Aug 28, 2016 1:56 am |
Here are some answers to your other points:
1. Massage helps to relax the face. Be careful about overdoing that exercise. How may reps and what count? Also a few weeks isnt long enough to see major results.
2. Very possible that it is strong but botox is not the way to go. It usually is a muscle stressed and over worked. Your everyday expresion isn't done using resistance.
Deb Crowley says she is a frowner and her face shows no sign of it. |
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lauvene
New Member
Joined: 26 Aug 2016
Posts: 9
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Sun Aug 28, 2016 6:55 am |
TheresaMary, I've been doing this exercise, to be found on youtube (sorry, can't post links):
How To Get Rid of Frown Lines Naturally - Part 2 Face Yoga Method
10 times, 3 series, once a day, exactly how Fumiko is doing them in the video.
Massage is definitely good (I'm doing facial massage by oxfordjasmine, also from youtube, one 1 or 2 times a day). I'm not sure about exercising these certain muscles.
It's pretty hard to monitor the progress short term, because my frown is more like a furrowed area than fixed lines and it constantly changes. It gets worse with lack of sleep and stress, better (up to 50%) with massage and night use of frownies. I could do the exercise long term, but I'm afraid that this certain exercise will negate the effects of massage (which definitely helps, but not in 100%). Do you think it's a possible thing to happen, that massage will relax the muscle and exercises will stress it again (because it's already overworked) and in effect I will have no progress at all? |
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Sun Aug 28, 2016 2:00 pm |
As you are young 10 reps 3x a day is way too much and will overwork the muscle. You need to do maybe 3-5 reps max.
You need to do a complete programme as otherwise your face will change and then you will have more issues. Why not work out smarter - dont do it twice but once a day. Massage works things too and the face needs rest too! |
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Wed Aug 31, 2016 4:35 pm |
Hi Lauvene,
welcome 
In my opinion, with or without exercises, facial massage is extremely helpful, specially for frown wrinkles that are caused by stiff muscles and loss of fat pad.
For one reason or another, our faces tend to keep the expression that we repeat, like frowning. It is really similar to behavior of any other muscle on the body that does one activity for a long time.
There are several recommendations for massage of the frown area here on EDS.
I can also recommend:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cfar5dMAaxs
With massages, I find it quite easy to gauge if they are helpful, changes can be seen immediately after.
Best of luck,
Maggie. |
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lauvene
New Member
Joined: 26 Aug 2016
Posts: 9
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Thu Sep 01, 2016 4:43 am |
| TheresaMary wrote: |
As you are young 10 reps 3x a day is way too much and will overwork the muscle. You need to do maybe 3-5 reps max.
You need to do a complete programme as otherwise your face will change and then you will have more issues. Why not work out smarter - dont do it twice but once a day. Massage works things too and the face needs rest too!
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I was simply following the instructions given by the Facial Yoga lady, but you may be right that it's more suitable for someone older and I was overworking the muscle. By the way, it wasn't 2 or 3 times a day, but 30 repetitions with 2 short breaks (30 seconds) in between, once a day. I'll stick to massage for now.
| maggie_p wrote: |
For one reason or another, our faces tend to keep the expression that we repeat, like frowning. It is really similar to behavior of any other muscle on the body that does one activity for a long time.
With massages, I find it quite easy to gauge if they are helpful, changes can be seen immediately after.
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Hello It sounds very logical and indeed this may be my problem. I've been doing the massage you linked for 3 days now (was advised to do it by other people as well) and while the forehead does feel relaxed, I can't see any instant improvement immediately after. Moreover, I have an impression that the area looks slightly worse right after. Is that even possible? My logic tells me it SHOULD work so I'll stick to it for a while. Maybe it looks worse because the area is swollen? I should add that my 11s are more like furrowed tissue than actual deep lines. Right after the massage the furrows look slightly more pronounced. |
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Thu Sep 01, 2016 8:00 am |
| lauvene wrote: |
| I was simply following the instructions given by the Facial Yoga lady, but you may be right that it's more suitable for someone older and I was overworking the muscle. By the way, it wasn't 2 or 3 times a day, but 30 repetitions with 2 short breaks (30 seconds) in between, once a day. I'll stick to massage for now. |
The instructions may be for people older - depends who her average audience is. 30 reps is definitely going to overwork the muscle and you probably need to rest it and not do it for a while to allow the muscle to flatten out. |
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lauvene
New Member
Joined: 26 Aug 2016
Posts: 9
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Thu Sep 01, 2016 9:05 am |
| maggie_p wrote: |
Hmmm, sounds you have very sensitive skin and that is why it looks worse temporarily... Blood does come to the area.
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Maybe, it's not like extremely sensitive but also not used to all this stretching, squeezing and pulling. I'll keep observing, wouldn't want to jump to something else before making sure this one is not serving me well. But if it doesn't, I'll definitely try your other suggestions (although facial detox looks scary)
| maggie_p wrote: |
And, while doing massages to decrease 11s, preventative steps should be taken as well. For me they were glasses and sunglasses
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Definitely, SPF 30/50 & PA all year round + sunglasses + control over mimics at work + frownies every night here 
By the way, if you ladies want to see what we're talking about here, I uploaded a picture od my forehead here goo[dot]gl[slash]AGpCrH |
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