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jonh200
New Member
 
Joined: 11 Oct 2003
Posts: 7
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Sat Oct 11, 2003 9:31 am  |
Has anyone tried products such as these that proport to be a natural alternative to botox:-
www.biotoc.com
Is this stuff a scam, has anyone tried it ?
Ive previously used products as advocated by nick perricone, such as DMAE & Alpha lipoic acid, vit c ester, but believe they may even have caused wrinkles !
Alll replies are welcome. |
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jonh200
New Member
Joined: 11 Oct 2003
Posts: 7
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Sat Oct 11, 2003 9:32 am |
heres another site too:-
www.bioque.com |
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Mon Oct 13, 2003 7:19 am |
Hello John200,
Here is my opinion on this subject - and yes, it is only my opinion.
Since botox injections are so popular, you will surely find many companies trying to cash in on this profitable area by coming out with bogus products that will try to duplicate the injections. I don't think that anything applied topically can duplicate a botox injection. Besides, the leading cause of wrinkles is sun damage and not over using the facial muscles. I have nothing against botox injections. They do seem to work. But one must be careful of products that try to duplicate this process when applied topically. The two are very different processes.
As for N.V. Perricone, I think it is possible for some of his products to actually cause wrinkles if one has very sensitive skin - too sensitive for some of his poducts that may be too harsh for sensitive skins. I, myself, cannot use any form of AHA's or topically applied vitamin C products because my skin is very sensitive. If I use these products I tend to get fine lines because they dehydrate my skin. But, everyone is different and many people can use these products with great results. Again, everyone is different.
I don't know if I'm answering your question, but I hope this helps a little. |
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jonh200
New Member
Joined: 11 Oct 2003
Posts: 7
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Mon Oct 13, 2003 2:55 pm |
Thanks for your repsonse, i think youre probably correct in what you say.
I am unsure about nick perricone though, despite his supposedly good reputation. Whilst i think there may be someting in alpha lipoic as an antioxidant/free radical scavenger in pill form, im not convinced its as good as he makes out when used in his facial products.
His book the 'wrinkle cure' was an interesting read, if not a little over the top 
BTW, Ive actually read of late that those AHA's are actually bad for the skin in the long run. I certainly wouldnt use them. |
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Mon Oct 13, 2003 7:06 pm |
leeleedeedee,
Slightly off topic from Botox, but... I had a question about something you stated that really seemed to make sense.
You wrote:
"I, myself, cannot use any form of AHA's or topically applied vitamin C products because my skin is very sensitive. If I use these products I tend to get fine lines because they dehydrate my skin."
I am in my late 20's with sensitive combination skin which did not react well to skinceuticals brand. Now I am using MD formulations vit-a-plus eye cream and Dermalogica's total eye care which have alpha hydroxy acids, and I feel that they are slightly drying and actually accentuating fine lines around the eye area. I was wondering if this was possible or if I was imagining it. 
What do AHA's do exactly? And for my age group should I not be using AHA's or topical vitamin C? Is glycolic acid considered an AHA?
thanks leeleedeedee or anyone who can clarify this for me. |
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Tue Oct 14, 2003 6:43 am |
Hello Jonh200 and Thoughtcrime,
Nice to hear from the both of you. I am not an expert in skin care. I just speak from my own personal experiences and from articles I have read.
Thoughtcrime, Glycolic acid is considered an AHA. So is Citric Acid, Malic Acid among other things. AHA's come in different forms. What they are supposed to do is exfoliate the skin by peeling off the outer layer of dead skin cells, therefore smoothing fine lines and surface wrinkles by revealing a newer layer of skin. Jonh 200 is correct in saying that there is now evidence that AHA's may cause skin damage, mostly in people with sensitive skin, like myself, because I have been reading many articles written by dermatologists who are now saying this. I read an article (I forget where) that stated something like improper use, too frequent use and AHA's used by people with sensitive skin is where you are more likely to see the damage. Speaking only for myself, I have used alot of AHA's and I have never had good results. They always made my skin worse, drier and lines appeared where I never had any before. However, my sister, who has oily skin, uses products with AHA's and just loves them. So, go figure. All I can say is if AHA's make the skin worse, don't use them. In some people they appear to make the skin worse and in others they appear to make the skin great.
Jonh 200, I tend to agree with you about N.V. Perricone. As I said, I'm not an expert like Magda and Casper's Mum, but I have a hard time believing that wrinkles are caused by inflammation which is Dr. Perricone's whole premise. Also, I know what you mean about applying the Alpha Lipoic Acid topically. I have my doubts too. I haven't used his products and don't know anyone who has so I can't say how other people feel about his products.
Hope this has helped. I wish I knew more about the skin to say something of great importance, but maybe others on this forum can have an input.
Bye for now. |
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Tue Oct 14, 2003 2:46 pm |
| thanks leeleedeedee, for the information! That was very helpful! Interestingly enough I can use retin-a with no problem, but I don't have good results with products that have AHA's. Although, SOME products with fruit extracts don't seem to be problematic. The problem for me is using products with AHA's near the eye area. |
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