Anyone has heard of Bone facial exercise?
EDS Skin Care Forums Forum Index » Skincare Tools & Do-It-Yourself Skincare

free skin care · Thu Oct 22, 2009 1:51 am

Many of you are trying or have tried facial exercises, including myself. Have you heard of bone facial exercise? It is very popular in Korea, Japan and Taiwan. I bought a book (with DVD) in Japan recently. I don't read Japanese, just guess from the photo and DVD.

Here is the link, you can click on the demo video:
http://www.amazon.co.jp/DVD%E3%81%A7%E3%83%9E%E3%82%B9%E3%82%BF%E3%83%BC%E3%81%99%E3%82%8B-%E5%8D%B3%E5%8A%B9%E5%B0%8F%E9%A1%94-%E9%AA%A8%E6%B0%97%E3%83%A1%E3%82%BD%E3%83%83%E3%83%89-%E6%9E%97%E5%B9%B8%E5%8D%83%E4%BB%A3/dp/4309271138/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1256201268&sr=8-1

free skin care · Thu Oct 22, 2009 1:57 am

This is the program I have used for 6+ months, I do it daily as it takes less than 10 minutes. I really like it and the result is obvious (I personally think it is much better than Lulu one):

http://www.amazon.co.jp/%E7%94%B0%E4%B8%AD%E5%AE%A5%E4%B9%85%E5%AD%90%E3%81%AE%E9%80%A0%E9%A1%94%E3%83%9E%E3%83%83%E3%82%B5%E3%83%BC%E3%82%B8-DVD%E4%BB%98-%E7%94%B0%E4%B8%AD-%E5%AE%A5%E4%B9%85%E5%AD%90/dp/406213795X/ref=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1256201553&sr=1-7

And this is the one for body, I have just started, it takes 5 mins/day:

http://www.amazon.co.jp/%E7%94%B0%E4%B8%AD%E5%AE%A5%E4%B9%85%E5%AD%90%E3%81%AE%E4%BD%93%E6%95%B4%E5%BD%A2%E3%83%9E%E3%83%83%E3%82%B5%E3%83%BC%E3%82%B8-DVD%E3%83%96%E3%83%83%E3%82%AF-%E5%BF%9C%E7%94%A8%E3%82%B9%E3%83%9A%E3%82%B7%E3%83%A3%E3%83%AB%E7%B7%A8-%E7%94%B0%E4%B8%AD-%E5%AE%A5%E4%B9%85%E5%AD%90/dp/4062140837/ref=pd_bxgy_b_img_b

free skin care · Thu Oct 22, 2009 5:10 am

how did you hear about it?

free skin care · Thu Oct 22, 2009 6:31 pm

Critic, what is bone facial exercise? I've never heard of it before. Is it exercise or massage? I couldn't quite tell by looking at the demo.

Thanks so much! Smile

free skin care · Thu Oct 22, 2009 6:46 pm

I could not tell either. Thanks for filling us in.

free skin care · Sun Oct 25, 2009 6:27 pm

The facial exercise that most of us have tried in EDS (Ageless etc.) are focusing on muscle, but bone facial exercise is targeting on bones. You use your fingers to push the bones up and down, to sharpen the face etc. This is getting 'hot' in Korea and Japan, I found tons and tons of books about bone exercises in Japan.

free skin care · Sun Oct 25, 2009 9:38 pm

Sorry, I would love to be able to, but my computer seems to say... no. It seems to be something to do with my Home Windows HP system... I can't get to 'see' (haven't got Japanese language) the bone method. I shall go on trying.

Would love to hear more on the Traditional Chinese Method... though...about massage, breathing, ...

Thanks.

free skin care · Sun Oct 25, 2009 11:49 pm

That's interesting! I did ageless for a while and it made my jowls look deep.

Do they have the book translated in english? I dont think I can usually pick up just by looking at the pictures.

free skin care · Tue Oct 27, 2009 6:38 am

critic wrote:

The facial exercise that most of us have tried in EDS (Ageless etc.) are focusing on muscle, but bone facial exercise is targeting on bones. You use your fingers to push the bones up and down, to sharpen the face etc. This is getting 'hot' in Korea and Japan, I found tons and tons of books about bone exercises in Japan.

Hi Critic!

Interesting...It seems like it is form of massage that is done over the bones. I'm skeptical that this could reshape or sharpen the bones as bones are very hard and inflexible...it seems like pushing on the bones is more likely to massage the skin and muscle and make one look better from the massaging action, rather than shape bones. Critic, what is your take on this? What are the claims behind it--e.g., on what timeline and how much of a result can one get? Do you know of any befores and afters we could see, or of any scientific study on this? Do you have any further reading on this that you can point us to?

Thanks so much! Smile

free skin care · Tue Oct 27, 2009 8:10 am

"The facial exercise that most of us have tried in EDS (Ageless etc.) are focusing on muscle, but bone facial exercise is targeting on bones. You use your fingers to push the bones up and down, to sharpen the face etc."

CM,
I think Critic was saying that pushing the bones up and down sharpen (the features of) the face ..not that the bones themselves become sharper.

This is really interesting to me...I wish there was some way this info could be translated into English..

free skin care · Tue Oct 27, 2009 8:24 am

Whoops, I'm trying to use words correctly...I mean sharpen 'contours' of the face, which would impact, it seems to me on 'features' of the face,like wider opening of eyes, etc.

I saw something like this, although not exactly, online in English last year...where the manipulation of the face went a lot deeper than the muscles. I don't know if i can rediscover it now...but it has a lot more potential meaning to me this year after a year of doing face ex's.

free skin care · Tue Oct 27, 2009 3:27 pm

jasminerosey wrote:

Whoops, I'm trying to use words correctly...I mean sharpen 'contours' of the face, which would impact, it seems to me on 'features' of the face,like wider opening of eyes, etc.

I saw something like this, although not exactly, online in English last year...where the manipulation of the face went a lot deeper than the muscles. I don't know if i can rediscover it now...but it has a lot more potential meaning to me this year after a year of doing face ex's.

Hey Jasminerosey! Thanks so much for chiming in! I thought that critic was specifically saying that the exercises were for the bones and to help re-shape them...maybe I misunderstood? If instead what you are saying is correct, I guess I am still confused what is meant by sharpening the contours of the face? In other words, what is being changed/re-shaped here: is it muscle, connective tissue, bone, cartilage, etc.? Question

Thanks in advance!

free skin care · Tue Oct 27, 2009 4:36 pm

I think the bone exercise is to make the face smaller and sharper? lol.

But it seems really popular. Im just concerned I wont be able to follow the pictures without readign the words

free skin care · Tue Oct 27, 2009 5:11 pm

CM,
I don't reaally know about the bone exercises..only what critic has written..but my gut feeling is that it must be that our facial bones shift as we age causing our skin, muscles, etc tolay differently on our face..causing skin to to sag, eyes to look smaller,etc....and that this technique is presumeably finding a way to re-shift them back to a more youthful position.

I googled 'do our facial bones shift with age'..and found a number or entries including this one:(i'll send the address in another post)

2007 -- When faces sag with age, there may be an architectural reason for it -- and possibly an architectural fix, too.

It's all about the bones, according to Michael Richard, MD, and Julie Woodward, MD, of Duke University Medical Center.

They studied head scans of 100 patients treated at Duke University Medical Center over the past three years.

The patients fell into four groups:

25 women aged 18-30
25 men aged 18-30
25 women aged 55-65
25 men aged 55-65
Foreheads were more prominent and cheekbones were less prominent in the older patients.

"The facial bones also appear to tilt forward as we get older, which causes them to lose support for the overlying soft tissues," Richard says in a news release. "That results in more sagging and drooping."

Those changes appear to be more dramatic in women, the study shows.

Richard suggests that cosmetic surgery to lift sagging skin may be more about the face's bony framework than the skin itself.

"Our focus has always been on tightening and lifting the soft tissues, skin, and muscle in an attempt to cosmetically restore patients' youthful appearance. ... It might actually be better to restore the underlying bony framework of the face to its youthful proportions," says Richard.

But it's not just about looks.

"One of the big risks of facial surgery is the potential for hitting the facial nerve, which could cause paralysis," says Richard. "If we can move the focus to the bone surface, away from that nerve, we may create an even safer, less extensive surgical procedure than the ones we perform today."

Richard presented the findings today in New Orleans at the American Society of Ophthalmic Plastic and Reconstructive Surgeons' fall scientific symposium.

free skin care · Tue Oct 27, 2009 5:15 pm

thhttp://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=85169

this is the address of the info about facial bones shifting due to the aging process

but you can find other info by googling the subject matter

anyway..it would be interesting to see of this technique can really shift facial bones even slightly (they must be somewhat maleable, i would think, in order to shift in the first plac.

free skin care · Tue Oct 27, 2009 5:35 pm

I think it makes sense. Like as we grow older, our face changes because of the bones structure.

I've heard that some Asian parents shape their babies nose when they're younger to make it sharper because their bones are still soft.

This bone technique sounds medical and complex, is that why it's uncommon? I would think someone had to be trained in that field to come up with something like that.

free skin care · Tue Oct 27, 2009 9:12 pm

Hi Critic,
Do you know what this method is called in Chinese? I'm having trouble finding it on Google. Thanks

free skin care · Tue Oct 27, 2009 10:24 pm

I dunno...I still remain skeptical that you can re-shape your bones. I have seen several studies on facial bone, and even that Duke study before, and this is the only one that suggests that the shifting bone changes are due to bone growth continuing...I've seen several studies on facial bones atrophying and I've seen a couple studies on facial bones appearing to shift positions as we age, but the scientists said that this apparent shift in facial bones is due to the different facial bones atrophying at different rates, with the cheek area atrophying faster than the forehead area.

But even assuming the Duke study is correct in its conclusions--it may or may not be--not one of these studies says that this implies that something non-invasive can be done to re-shape bone (though a couple say that you can prevent them from atrophying by applying stress to the bone and/or exercising the surrounding muscles, which in turn put stress on the bone).

Sure, bones are not 100% fixed, but they are hard and extremely inflexible. The analogy to me is like seeing the Earth's mantle being re-shaped by earthquakes over time. Yes, it changes even though it is super-hard and inflexible, but there's nothing you can do to re-shape it. My earthquake analogy isn't the perfect here and has some flaws, but I hope it gets across what I mean.

The thing here that makes the most sense to me is if the point of the bone exercises is to put stress on the bone in order to prevent it from atrophying and therefore to *maintain* youthful contours--that would make the most sense to me, but not re-shaping bone from simply pressing along facial contours.

(Btw, about the nose being re-shaped, the end of the nose is cartilage, not bone, which is why it can be reshaped.)

Just my 2 cents Smile

free skin care · Tue Oct 27, 2009 11:11 pm

jasminerosey wrote:

thhttp://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=85169

this is the address of the info about facial bones shifting due to the aging process

but you can find other info by googling the subject matter

anyway..it would be interesting to see of this technique can really shift facial bones even slightly (they must be somewhat maleable, i would think, in order to shift in the first plac.

Just correcting your link for the article you sited:

http://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=85169

I checked around and found a couple of similar articles which include a bit more information which you might find interesting. It seems that the MedicineNet article that jasminerosey provided is slightly abbreviated.

http://www.physorg.com/news114104878.html

http://www.emaxhealth.com/8/18053.html

Both of these new links state the following:

Since growth plates found in most of the body's bones stop growing after puberty, experts assumed the human skull stopped growing then too. However, the bones that comprise the human skull have no growth plates.

Using CT scans of 100 men and women, the researchers discovered that the bones in the human skull continue to grow as people age. The forehead moves forward while the cheek bones move backward. As the bones move, the overlying muscle and skin moves as well and that subtly changes the shape of the face. "The facial bones also appear to tilt forward as we get older," explains Richard, "which causes them to lose support for the overlying soft tissues. That results in more sagging and drooping."

Something new to consider in this discussion. HTH

free skin care · Wed Oct 28, 2009 2:05 am

Oh, I am glad that many of you are interested in this topic. You know I am not expert at all, just happen got a few books about this bone fixing techniques.

The Chinese term is called "Fixed bone". I have heard that Korea and Japan have many well-trained doctors in this area. Many of them are helping super models, actress and celebrities to shapen their face and body without surgery. I have seen from TV that a Taiwanese Dr. fixed the face and sharpen the nose of a female singer. He only use his both hands to move up and down on that singer's face (She looks very painful and did yell). It took 5 mins and she did look better.

Korean are more focusing on changing the way you walk and sit etc can sharpen your body. They do have a special belt to wrap around your hip, and do exercises (like yoga) and claim can help in re-shape your body, specialy if you have given birth.

free skin care · Wed Oct 28, 2009 2:08 am

The Taiwan Dr. that I have mentioned has written a book, with all exercises but the book is no longer available in the market. I just got a very poor quality PDF copy from friend's friend. You can PM me if you are interested, but all the description is in Chinese. You might not able to open it, as I have tried 3 computers.

Wed Oct 28, 2009 5:29 am

I checked out the links you posted and I thought the lady in the black fedora looked familiar and I remembered that I came across a video of her on a talk show while I was looking for videos on Chizu Saeki. Unfortunately, since I'm new, I'm unable to embed any videos or give you links. Search for "zzzfusionzzz" channel on youtube and click on one of the uploaded videos that has a pale-faced woman with her fingertips on her chin. That channel also has two videos on Chizu Saeki's techniques.

The other video I found you need to search for "shitomi88" channel on youtube. The video is the only one there. The results look pretty amazing but I'm not sure if it's the same principle (using bone) or if it is real.

free skin care · Wed Oct 28, 2009 7:25 am

Lacy53 wrote:

jasminerosey wrote:

thhttp://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=85169

this is the address of the info about facial bones shifting due to the aging process

but you can find other info by googling the subject matter

anyway..it would be interesting to see of this technique can really shift facial bones even slightly (they must be somewhat maleable, i would think, in order to shift in the first plac.

Just correcting your link for the article you sited:

http://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=85169

I checked around and found a couple of similar articles which include a bit more information which you might find interesting. It seems that the MedicineNet article that jasminerosey provided is slightly abbreviated.

http://www.physorg.com/news114104878.html

http://www.emaxhealth.com/8/18053.html

Both of these new links state the following:

Since growth plates found in most of the body's bones stop growing after puberty, experts assumed the human skull stopped growing then too. However, the bones that comprise the human skull have no growth plates.

Using CT scans of 100 men and women, the researchers discovered that the bones in the human skull continue to grow as people age. The forehead moves forward while the cheek bones move backward. As the bones move, the overlying muscle and skin moves as well and that subtly changes the shape of the face. "The facial bones also appear to tilt forward as we get older," explains Richard, "which causes them to lose support for the overlying soft tissues. That results in more sagging and drooping."

Something new to consider in this discussion. HTH

Yes, that was what Jasminerosy pointed to, and it is extremely interesting! I would love to hear more about this.

But all three of the links are based on the same study--in fact the same press release from the communications office at Duke--so it's still only one set of authors/scientists who have made that claim that the facial bones grow with age. So far, most other articles I've come across say only that facial bone atrophies with age:

For examples....

* http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9655429

This study says that what happens is that the mid-face bone region atrophies faster and retrudes faster than the forehead bone region, which gives the appearance of the forehead bones shifting forward with age, even though the forehead does not shift forward per se. The retrusion of the cheek area explains why the Duke study concluded that the forehead appears to shift forward relative to the cheeks. From the handful of studies I've seen out there, this is the preferred theory for why the forehead appears to shift forward, and the alternative, minority theory that this is due to continuing bone growth has been put forth only by one set of authors.

* http://www.aaps1921.org/abstracts/2009/21.cgi

This study specifically says that they tested the idea that the jaw bone continues to grow with age, as some other scientists suggested, and they found not only is that theory false, but the jaw bone shrinks with age.

So the weight of evidence so far appears to be that facial bones atrophy with age, not grow with age. But even if some of the facial bones can/do grow (which it doesn't look like this can conclusively be proved yet one way or the other), I would think that you can prevent or delay the loss of bone by pressing/putting stress on them, but not change the shape or position of your bones. The latter seems really doubtful to me.

free skin care · Wed Oct 28, 2009 7:34 am

critic wrote:

Oh, I am glad that many of you are interested in this topic. You know I am not expert at all, just happen got a few books about this bone fixing techniques.

The Chinese term is called "Fixed bone". I have heard that Korea and Japan have many well-trained doctors in this area. Many of them are helping super models, actress and celebrities to shapen their face and body without surgery. I have seen from TV that a Taiwanese Dr. fixed the face and sharpen the nose of a female singer. He only use his both hands to move up and down on that singer's face (She looks very painful and did yell). It took 5 mins and she did look better.

Korean are more focusing on changing the way you walk and sit etc can sharpen your body. They do have a special belt to wrap around your hip, and do exercises (like yoga) and claim can help in re-shape your body, specialy if you have given birth.

Critic--I really appreciate you bringing ths up! It is a very interesting topic to consider, and I would like to hear more about it. I hope you don't mind me being somewhat skeptical--of course, I'm still here on this thread and very curious Smile

--I am just wondering if results people are getting are more from (1) pressing the bone reducing bone atrophy, and/or (2) massaging the skin, massage, and other soft tissues, which improves their look. Can you give us a run down of what it feels like to you and/or point us to other demos/info?

Thanks! Smile

free skin care · Wed Oct 28, 2009 8:19 am

Exactly cm!! My point was either Dr Richard's study was flawed simply because his premise (ie that bone continues to grow during adulthood) is incorrect ... or the press release of his findings is poorly worded. The original press release was for a speech he had given at the annual meeting of the American Society of Ophthalmic Plastic and Reconstructive Surgeons in New Orleans, but I didn't see a published journal article related to his findings.

I have now found a recently published abstract entitled Analysis of the Anatomic Changes of the Aging Facial Skeleton Using Computer-Assisted Tomography by Dr Richard et al. You may see it here:

http://journals.lww.com/op-rs/Abstract/2009/09000/Analysis_of_the_Anatomic_Changes_of_the_Aging.11.aspx

Note the authors' revised conclusion: "The facial skeleton appears to remodel throughout adulthood. Relative to the globe, the facial skeleton appears to rotate such that the frontal bone moves anteriorly and inferiorly while the maxilla moves posteriorly and superiorly. This rotation causes bony angles to become more acute and likely has an effect on the position of overlying soft tissues. These changes appear to be more dramatic in women."

This seems to be more in line with the established medical understanding of changes in facial structure due to aging IMO

Automatic Message

If this is your first visit to the EDS Forums please take the time to register. Registration is required for you to post on the forums. Registration will also give you the ability to track messages of interest, send private messages to other users, participate in Gift Certificates draws and enjoy automatic discounts for shopping at our online store. Registration is free and takes just a few seconds to complete.

Click Here to join our community.

If you are already a registered member on the forums, please login to gain full access to the site.