For Vitamin C Serum DIYers
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free skin care · Wed Mar 18, 2009 7:16 am

mountaingirl wrote:

I am always curious about adding the Vit E to any of these water based Vit C forumla's. Doesn't it just bead up and float on the surface?? That has been my experience. I prefer to just put a couple of drops in my palm and add it to the serum as I put it on my face.

I think that might be the problem with mine. I didn't know at first if it was the propylene glycol or the vitamin e. (I used the one called Vitamin E Acetate from TPF). The E was so much thicker though, so it probably is the culprit.

I mixed my LAA and H2O together first, seperately, and then I added the propylene glycol and E and shook the bottle for several minutes. It all seemed fine at that point. Then I stuck it in the fridge and when I went to use it for the first time a few hours later, there was this goopy stuff coating the dropper and the sides the neck of the bottle. So, I try to scrape that all back down into the mix and then I shake, shake, shake. I open it up and the dropper is coated again! Stuck it back in fridge overnight.

Same thing this morning, although it didn't appear as bad. I didn't know if perhaps I stuck it in the fridge too early? So, after I used it this morning, I shook it well, then wedged the bottle upside down so that all of the liquid would be around the dropper and neck of the bottle, and I left it out at room temperature. I'll check this afternoon when I get home from work to see if that had any effect.

BTW, my container was a 1oz cobalt glass dropper bottle.

Recipe used:
1 tsp LAA
3 tps Distilled H2)
(Mixed seperately until almost all LAA had dissolved, then squirted into cobalt bottle.)
1 tsp propylene glycol
a few drops of Vitamin E Acetate
(Added to cobalt bottle)
Bottle was then topped off with more distilled H2O (probably amounted to about a tsp or so).

I know this probably messed up any chance of figuring out the Vit. C %, but I wanted to start off a bit weaker than my original recipe. Also, no telling what the pH is. My test strips haven't arrived yet.

So, offhand, does it seem like there is anything else I need to add to avoid the goop, or is that just part of the deal when you have Vitamin E in there?

Also, I have a few more questions. Any idea of how long this will keep? I planned on mainly keeping it in the fridge, but I know I am bound to leave it out occasionally. 2 weeks? 1 month? Until it develops color?

How much are you supposed to use? I just used the dropper to scatter a few drops around on my face and neck and then rubbed them in with my fingers, adding a few more drops to areas that I didn't feel like got any product.

And, finally, I think, as far as application order, does anyone see anything wrong with this:

1. OCM (Coconut + Castor) or Cetaphil cleanser to remove makeup. If makeup removed prior, skip this step and begin with toner.
2. ACV Toner (1/3 ACV, 2/3 Distilled H2O)
3. If any really dry areas, a drop or two of coconut oil for moisture.
4. Let oil absorb or face dry completely.
5. Vitamin C or Retin A (will be alternating)
6. If going out, allow Vitamin C to dry as long as possible, then apply mineral makeup.

free skin care · Wed Mar 18, 2009 7:45 am

Actually, looking at that, I probably need to apply the Vitamin C before any added oils.

free skin care · Wed Mar 18, 2009 1:21 pm

Hi mountaingirl...definitely use your vit c first and let it sink in at least 20 minutes if you are able. I use generous amounts on my face, neck and if I have any left over slather it on my arms as well:-)

Did you consider adding ferulic acid? I use Kassy's formula with the vodka and am still working on a batch I made almost 2 months ago. I do not refrigerate mine however do keep it in a airless pump dispenser.

bat

free skin care · Wed Mar 18, 2009 2:57 pm

I agree with everything 'batwhirl' said. I also slather mine on likewise, and a 1oz serum usually lasts about 10 weeks or so..

I have yet to have one go off whether it's in the fridge or room temp.. The vitamin E and Ferulic Acid help to keep it very stable. Also, combining those anti-oxidants gives you a synergistic effect as well. (Anti-oxidants work much better as a team!)

As for mixing in the vitamin E, you need to have an emulsifier, or at the very least the bit of vodka helps.. SKB is a wonderful emulsifier, and a tiny bit goes a long way, so no worries about throwing the ph off. (You would mix the E into the SKB, and then incorporate both phases together.) For those who want to really copy the Skinceutical's C, E + Ferulic, you can put a bit of HA in with the E + SKB in that emulsifying phase.. (I don't recommend it though, because the ph of HA is to high....(It does make the serum a wonderful texture, but what good is that if it doesn't absorb well?)

Patience is a virtue when making a DIY C serum, and the most important thing is that you allow whatever time is needed, for the LAA to dissolve in the water.. (It can take up to an hour, but believe me, it's worth the wait!)

The way you tell if your vitamin C has oxidized is if it turns amber to brown...(I guarantee you, that this will not happen with any of my recipe's, if you follow them explicitly, and keep them protected from heat and sunshine!)... Very Happy

I hope I covered everybody's questions, but if not, please post again.. (My grandkids are tearing my house apart as I write this.. Shock

...)

free skin care · Wed Mar 18, 2009 10:30 pm

Hi Kassy, I did have two questions. Thank you for taking the time when you are going crazy with the grandkids!

Here they are again:
1. I am going to order some LAA to make 15% serum. I have some LLA that is about 4 years old from the Personal Formulators, so I'm sure that's expired. I also have glycerin and propylene glycol from that order. Do those things expire?

2. I have a great cream by Derma E. It is the DMAE - Alpha Lipoic - C-Ester Retexturizing Crème. I'd like to add niacinamide to it. Do you think this would work? Would I have to dissolve the niacinamide first? How much should I add per oz. of cream?

Here are the ingredients of the cream: Water (Aqua), Dimethyl MEA (DMAE), Stearic Acid, Thioctic (Alpha Lipoic) Acid, Allantoin, Panthenol, Caprylic/Capric Triglyceride, Organic Simmondsia Chinensis (Jojoba) Seed Oil*, Cetyl Alcohol, Polysorbate 20, Glyceryl Stearate and Peg-100 Stearate, Tocopheryl Acetate (Vitamin E), Ascorbyl Palmitate (C-Ester), Dimethicone, Citric Acid, Retinyl Palmitate (Vitamin A), Sodium Hydroxide, Phenoxyethanol, Ethylhexylglycerin, Potassium Sorbate, Natural and Fragrant Oils.

Thanks!

free skin care · Thu Mar 19, 2009 3:51 pm

seabliss wrote:

Hi Kassy, I did have two questions. Thank you for taking the time when you are going crazy with the grandkids!

Here they are again:
1. I am going to order some LAA to make 15% serum. I have some LLA that is about 4 years old from the Personal Formulators, so I'm sure that's expired. I also have glycerin and propylene glycol from that order. Do those things expire?

2. I have a great cream by Derma E. It is the DMAE - Alpha Lipoic - C-Ester Retexturizing Crème. I'd like to add niacinamide to it. Do you think this would work? Would I have to dissolve the niacinamide first? How much should I add per oz. of cream?

Here are the ingredients of the cream: Water (Aqua), Dimethyl MEA (DMAE), Stearic Acid, Thioctic (Alpha Lipoic) Acid, Allantoin, Panthenol, Caprylic/Capric Triglyceride, Organic Simmondsia Chinensis (Jojoba) Seed Oil*, Cetyl Alcohol, Polysorbate 20, Glyceryl Stearate and Peg-100 Stearate, Tocopheryl Acetate (Vitamin E), Ascorbyl Palmitate (C-Ester), Dimethicone, Citric Acid, Retinyl Palmitate (Vitamin A), Sodium Hydroxide, Phenoxyethanol, Ethylhexylglycerin, Potassium Sorbate, Natural and Fragrant Oils.

Thanks!

#1.. It's only my opinion, but I would pitch out anything that's more than 18 months old and still unopened.. For vitamin C, I buy the smallest quantiy (usually 4oz), and whatever I haven't used in a year goes out.. (It would be crazy to pinch pennies here and use old stuff, when it's so ridiculously affordable to buy new potent actives.

#2.. Niacinamide would be lovely added to that cream, and should mix right into a decanted TBS, then add back in.. You want to use it at A concentration of 0.5%, so for 1oz it would only be a pinch, if you have the 5gm tube from Skinactives.. (5 gms into 32oz ='s an 0.5% concentration)

You could also increase the 'retinly palmitate' in that cream to .5 to 1% which would make that nicely effective..

free skin care · Thu Mar 19, 2009 8:05 pm

Hello!
After lurking for several weeks... I think I'm ready to try doing my first Vit.C serum!

So I was thinking I want to do a 15-20% one with Ferulic Acid and Vitamin E.

I don't want to put Vitamin A since I use Retin-A at night.

So I've been looking at this "recipe" by Kassy:

What you need for 1oz C,E, Ferulic 15%;
- 2 glass shot glasses
- 1oz cobalt or amber dropper or pump bottle
- 1 tsp L-Ascorbic Acid
- 1/4 tsp (1 ml) Vitamin E (equals 1%)
- .5% of Ferulic Acid (1 good pinch)
- 2 tsp SKB (Sea Kelp Bioferment)
- 3 + 1/2 tsp of distilled water
- 1/2 tsp of vodka

And I was wondering...

a. Is there anything else I can use besides the vodka? (I don't want to use viterol)
b. Will the SKB really help, does it make a different in people's opinion?

Thanks in advance... I'm already excited!

free skin care · Thu Mar 19, 2009 10:32 pm

Kassy, thank you! How do you decant niacinamide?

Would it be more powerful if I use glucosamine too? Trying to keep things as cheap but effective as possible in this current economy.

I don't want to add any retinyl palmitrate because I am trying to get pregnant. I think there is so little in the cream currently that it won't hurt anything.

I will place an order tomorrow. Thank you again!

free skin care · Fri Mar 20, 2009 10:59 am

Josee; You can skip the 'vodka' altogether if you aren't the impatient type! (It just really helps the LAA + FA dissolve quicker)

The SKB is a must for me, and acts as not only a great active on it's own, but is a wonderful way to emulsify pesky ingredients into a water/oil formulation.. (It's perfect for getting that 'E' into your 'C') And for anybody who wants to use DMAE in a formulation, mixing it into a little SKB first, will keep your formulation from liquifying.

seabliss; You will 'decant' (scoop out) 1 TBS of your ready made cream, mix your additional actives into that, and then incorporate it back into your ready made cream.

According to where the 'retinly' is listed on your cream, I'd agree it isn't worth worrying about... I'd be more concerned with the 'sodium hydroxide' (lye).. (Although I'm sure such a tiny bit is safe as well.)

free skin care · Fri Mar 20, 2009 3:49 pm

I got my testing strips in. My vitamin C is showing a 2.0 pH and my ACV toner is 3.0. Is this too low? No irritation so far at 2 x per day.

free skin care · Fri Mar 20, 2009 3:51 pm

Hi Kassy.

Have you read that silicone may impede vitamin c from effectively penetrating the skin barrier? I have googled and scoured the dyi threads here and can not find what I thought I read%-)sometime ago; I used barely half a drop of either gelmaker emu or serum se in my last batch of c serum and loved the consistency. It does still sting a bit upon application with would indicate efficacy however I still have an itty bitty teeny tiny concern that it may not be a good idea. Any thoughts? I’ve pasted the info regarding gelmaker and serum se below if that helps. Anybody else, feel free to weigh in as well if you know something I need to know!

Gelmaker EMU: A Preneutralized polymer (ph5-6.5) [INCI: Sodium acrylate / acryloyldimethyl taurate copolymer / isohexadecane/ polysorbate 80]

Lotioncrafter Serum SE: Self emulsifying silicone fluids [INCI: Dimethicone (and) Cyclopentasiloxane (and) Dimethicone/Vinyl Dimethicone Crosspolymer (and) Dimethicone/PEG-10/15 Dimethicone Crosspolymer]

free skin care · Sat Mar 21, 2009 5:16 am

Josee wrote:

Hello!
After lurking for several weeks... I think I'm ready to try doing my first Vit.C serum!

So I was thinking I want to do a 15-20% one with Ferulic Acid and Vitamin E.

I don't want to put Vitamin A since I use Retin-A at night.

So I've been looking at this "recipe" by Kassy:

What you need for 1oz C,E, Ferulic 15%;
- 2 glass shot glasses
- 1oz cobalt or amber dropper or pump bottle
- 1 tsp L-Ascorbic Acid
- 1/4 tsp (1 ml) Vitamin E (equals 1%)
- .5% of Ferulic Acid (1 good pinch)
- 2 tsp SKB (Sea Kelp Bioferment)
- 3 + 1/2 tsp of distilled water
- 1/2 tsp of vodka

And I was wondering...

a. Is there anything else I can use besides the vodka? (I don't want to use viterol)
b. Will the SKB really help, does it make a different in people's opinion?

Thanks in advance... I'm already excited!

Hi
I'm ready to try making my own vit c as well. If I am using retin-a at night should I not add it to vit c?
Out of curiosity, have you ordered your ingredients yet? where have you ordered them from? I know there is a list of sites here but I am just curious.
I am going to skip the vodka as well, I'm a red wine drinker Very Happy

thanks, Lou

free skin care · Sat Mar 21, 2009 8:42 am

I need some help formulating my eye cream.

I have added 5% of DMAE to the CVS eye serum. I also have the Illuminating Eye Care from Easy-Eye Solution that does not do much for me. The light reflecting particles seem to emphasize the crepey under eye skin. I'm wondering if I should add some of it to the CVS/DMAE serum and in what % ?

The ingredients of the Illuminating cream are:

INGREDIENTS: Water (Aqua), Propylene Glycol, Sodium Magnesium Silicate, Sodium lactate, Glycerin, Hydrolyzed Collagen, Camellia Sinensis Leaf Extract (Green Tea), Xanthan Gum, Cucumis Sativus (Cucumber) Fruit Extract, Ruscus Aculeatus Root Extract, Centella Asiatica Extract, Panthenol, Calendula Officinalis Flower Extract, Hydrolyzed Yeast Protein, Aesculus Hippocastanum (Horse Chesnut) Bark Extract, Ammonium Glycyrrhizate, Salix Alba (Willow) Bark Extract, Butylene Glycol, Caprylyl Glycol, Phenoxyethanol, Potassium Sorbate, Hexylene Glycol.

Any help would be immensely appreciated.

free skin care · Sat Mar 21, 2009 11:28 am

batwhirl wrote:

Hi Kassy.

Have you read that silicone may impede vitamin c from effectively penetrating the skin barrier? I have googled and scoured the dyi threads here and can not find what I thought I read%-)sometime ago; I used barely half a drop of either gelmaker emu or serum se in my last batch of c serum and loved the consistency. It does still sting a bit upon application with would indicate efficacy however I still have an itty bitty teeny tiny concern that it may not be a good idea. Any thoughts? I’ve pasted the info regarding gelmaker and serum se below if that helps. Anybody else, feel free to weigh in as well if you know something I need to know!

Gelmaker EMU: A Preneutralized polymer (ph5-6.5) [INCI: Sodium acrylate / acryloyldimethyl taurate copolymer / isohexadecane/ polysorbate 80]

Lotioncrafter Serum SE: Self emulsifying silicone fluids [INCI: Dimethicone (and) Cyclopentasiloxane (and) Dimethicone/Vinyl Dimethicone Crosspolymer (and) Dimethicone/PEG-10/15 Dimethicone Crosspolymer]

Argh! I have a love hate relationship with 'silicones', and it's one of the reasons I got into DIY. That, and to avoid all the crappy filler and preservative ingredients..

The 'love'; they just feel so darn good gliding over the skin, and the velvety feel they leave behind..

The 'hate'; they just don't penetrate the epidermis in MHO... Here's a test to try: wash your face and pat dry, now apply a nice layer of your silicone laden cream or lotion... About 5 hours later, or next morning if you applied at night, pay strict attention to what you feel, when you rinse your face with warm water (no cleanser, just water!)... In my experience, as soon as the water gets on my face and I begin to rub, I feel that slippery silicone feeling, that indicates even though it 'appeared' to have absorbed, it really didn't after all..

I hope you can make sense of that, and I didn't confuse you altogether .. Rolling Eyes

Long story short, is I would not incorporate any silicone into an LAA serum.. But for THDA, it's frequently used.

I'd love to hear your thoughts, if you try my little test!

free skin care · Sat Mar 21, 2009 11:41 am

Bellezza wrote:

I need some help formulating my eye cream.

I have added 5% of DMAE to the CVS eye serum. I also have the Illuminating Eye Care from Easy-Eye Solution that does not do much for me. The light reflecting particles seem to emphasize the crepey under eye skin. I'm wondering if I should add some of it to the CVS/DMAE serum and in what % ?

The ingredients of the Illuminating cream are:

INGREDIENTS: Water (Aqua), Propylene Glycol, Sodium Magnesium Silicate, Sodium lactate, Glycerin, Hydrolyzed Collagen, Camellia Sinensis Leaf Extract (Green Tea), Xanthan Gum, Cucumis Sativus (Cucumber) Fruit Extract, Ruscus Aculeatus Root Extract, Centella Asiatica Extract, Panthenol, Calendula Officinalis Flower Extract, Hydrolyzed Yeast Protein, Aesculus Hippocastanum (Horse Chesnut) Bark Extract, Ammonium Glycyrrhizate, Salix Alba (Willow) Bark Extract, Butylene Glycol, Caprylyl Glycol, Phenoxyethanol, Potassium Sorbate, Hexylene Glycol.

Any help would be immensely appreciated.

I'm a bit dense today, and not quite sure what you are asking.. Laughing

Just a thought on your "Illuminating Cream", if I understood you right, it's this that's causing the crepy bit????

From looking at the ingredients, I see glycerin right near the top, which could be actually drying out that delicate area.. (Too much glycerin or HA will absorb water from the skin, when enough water isn't provided in the formula.)

For starters I would add a couple of TBS of distilled water into your cream, and see if that helps.. If it does, than the scenario I gave you above is the culprit, and the glycerin is in to high a concentration.. (Watering down any eye cream or serum is always a good thing IMHO)

Please post again, if I completely misunderstood you.. Confused

free skin care · Sat Mar 21, 2009 11:50 am

Loumomofthree wrote:

Hi
I'm ready to try making my own vit c as well. If I am using retin-a at night should I not add it to vit c?
Out of curiosity, have you ordered your ingredients yet? where have you ordered them from? I know there is a list of sites here but I am just curious.
I am going to skip the vodka as well, I'm a red wine drinker Very Happy

thanks, Lou

Welcome to DIY land Lou!

Never add anything to Retin-A.. Shock

Use your C serum in the a.m. and RA before beddy-bye on it's own..

Keep your first C serum nice and simple with C, E, FA, distilled water and a little SKB to emulsify.. You'll love it!

Bulkactives + thepersonalformulator are great places for one stop shopping... I also love skinactives, but they don't have dropper bottles. (At least I've never seen them there.)

ETA: I'm a red wine girl too.... Cheer's!

free skin care · Sat Mar 21, 2009 2:23 pm

Kassy_A wrote:

Loumomofthree wrote:

Hi
I'm ready to try making my own vit c as well. If I am using retin-a at night should I not add it to vit c?
Out of curiosity, have you ordered your ingredients yet? where have you ordered them from? I know there is a list of sites here but I am just curious.
I am going to skip the vodka as well, I'm a red wine drinker Very Happy

thanks, Lou

Welcome to DIY land Lou!

Never add anything to Retin-A.. Shock

Use your C serum in the a.m. and RA before beddy-bye on it's own..

Keep your first C serum nice and simple with C, E, FA, distilled water and a little SKB to emulsify.. You'll love it!

Bulkactives + thepersonalformulator are great places for one stop shopping... I also love skinactives, but they don't have dropper bottles. (At least I've never seen them there.)

ETA: I'm a red wine girl too.... Cheer's!

Thank-you, Thank-you, Thank-you for the quick reply. I am going to place an order asap. I love one stop shopping. Smile

It's very exciting!!! I will make your C serum and will let you know how I like it. Sorry for shocking you Very Happy

it was a typo..my questions should have read...should I not add vitamin A to C serum if I am using Retin A?

thanks again, Lou

free skin care · Sat Mar 21, 2009 2:54 pm

"Just a thought on your "Illuminating Cream", if I understood you right, it's this that's causing the crepy bit???? "

No Kassy, the crepy bit is caused by my age!! The Illuminating cream, by itself, emphasizes the crepy skin. This cream is not absorbed, I think it just lays there on top and makes me look worst. How can I use it? I was asking if it would help adding a bit of it to my DIY eye cream.

Sat Mar 21, 2009 4:58 pm

Hi everyone, i have managed to find all the ingredients for the vit c serum and am very excited to get started but am finding it hard to find amber/colbalt bottles. Im in the UK so when i tried an american site for a $14 order it would cost $53 shipping Shock

Can anyone help?? Thanks in advance

Esther

free skin care · Sat Mar 21, 2009 5:08 pm

Ester, I would not spend that much money for an empty amber bottle. Can you recycle a container? If it's clear glass you could wrap it in foil paper to keep light out and keep it in the fridge. Just an idea. Good luck!

free skin care · Sat Mar 21, 2009 5:21 pm

Yep Mummy, any 1oz glass dropper bottle will do.. Just wrap in reynolds wrap as Bellezza suggested..

Bellezza, add the little extra distilled water to the eye cream and see if it helps.. The ingredients are rather nice for the most part.

Sat Mar 21, 2009 11:59 pm

Thanks Bellezza and Kassy im sure those will be easier to find and save me a few pennies Very Happy

I cant wait to get started, all these recipies are amazing! Thanks everyone for sharing x

Esther

Sun Mar 22, 2009 6:17 am

catsull wrote:

Can anyone give me ratios/amounts to use if I want to try the anhydrous serum using Monistat Chafing Gel & LAA? And what about if I want to add a little Vitamin E? My skin generally does well with silicones, so that's why I want to try this one first.

I found one recipe using grams, which isn't helpful to me since I own nothing that will weigh in grams.

I've read about the difficulty in getting the LAA to "dissolve" or suspend in the gel without being grainy, so I plan to order the LAA from bulkactives since that seems to be the most powdery in general consensus.

Anyone able to help?

free skin care · Sun Mar 22, 2009 1:30 pm

Hello I was wondering... what would be considered a "good" quantiy of Vitamin E in an oil...

By this I mean... "how many Vitamin E IU per ml should it have"?

Secondly... what is a good oil for the oil to have? For e.g. I saw one Vitamin E oil where the Vitamin E was diluted in Soybean oil I think.

Third.... any bran/place to buy people here would recommend??

And finally... what do you think about adding Matrixyl to a Vit C serum?

Mon Mar 23, 2009 1:07 am

Hi just another quick question, are amber and blue plastic bottles as effecive at keeping out light as the glass amber/cobalt ones?

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