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Tue Dec 01, 2009 7:33 pm  |
Hey ya'll,
I'm about to place an order with Alldaychemist, and have piled my cart with the gels, the micros and a cream or two, all different strengths. I went to the FAQ section and read the post about the AHAs, BHAs, and retinoids, and there's a link there leading to a notepad in makeupAlley with a reference to
some studies that have suggested that a strength of 0.1 is no more effective than .025, just more irritating, and that the skin will not use more than is needed and the rest is either wasted or causes irritation. So, I was thinking...if I just order the .025, couldn't I just increase by eventually using every night instead of increasing strength and using every other night? Should I really be using a higher strength if my skin can handle it (it's not really sensitive...I can rub it down with a lemon slice for 5 minutes before a shower without experiencing any redness), or could I just use the lower strength more often? The .025 is cheaper, too...about 50 cents more to bump up to a .05.
Also, does anyone have opinions on the cream vs. the gel?
Thanks to all....any and all thoughts appreciated. |
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Tue Dec 01, 2009 7:50 pm |
| Maybe someone who's an expert on Retin-A can confirm whether this is true, but I just read that the 0.05% cream is designed for wrinkles and the 0.1% cream is designed for acne. If that's the case, I guess it would depend on what you're treating. |
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Tue Dec 01, 2009 8:03 pm |
| Yeah, sorry, I didn't specify. Sags. Gettin' worse every day. Mostly around my mouth. I'm sure when I quit smoking I'll have better luck, but I know that just quitting won't be enough to undo all the damage I did to my face with 30 years of those nasty Tools of Darkness! I had not read of a difference between the strengths as some being for acne and some for wrinkles, except for Differin Gel, supposed to be for acne only. Where had you read that, do you remember? |
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Tue Dec 01, 2009 8:16 pm |
| Well I thought I read that the .05 was good from wrinkles, but I don't remember where I read it. I can tell you that my derm started me on .05, and when I could tolerated moved me up to .1 (renova) and I don't have acne. |
_________________
I am from LI, New York, and enjoy reading and sometimes posting on beauty boards |
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Tue Dec 01, 2009 10:52 pm |
| MarieIG wrote: |
| Well I thought I read that the .05 was good from wrinkles, but I don't remember where I read it. I can tell you that my derm started me on .05, and when I could tolerated moved me up to .1 (renova) and I don't have acne. |
This is what I was lead to believe and my experience with retin a also.
If you are happy with the results with what your using I dont seem any harm in continuing with that for a while and then if you feel you need something extra increase to the .05.
Maybe a more experienced user will have better advise or info though. |
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Tue Dec 01, 2009 10:55 pm |
Not an expert by any means but I don't think a higher strength is always needed unless you have deeper wrinkles or bad acne. It's more of finding out what works best for your skin & issues, but starting out lower strength is better to avoid unnecessary irritation.
The cream is better for drier or more mature skin & the gel for oily skin and those with acne. |
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Wed Dec 02, 2009 12:57 am |
| I know Obagi has said that for older skin no less than the 0.05 is needed. There have been studies done showing that the .05% is as effective as the 0.1%. I think you should use what your skin will tolerate. The cream is usually recommended for older and/or dryer skin, where the gel is usually recommended for oily/acne prone skin. |
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Wed Dec 02, 2009 4:59 pm |
| Personally, I'm going to try and build up from 0.025% I am super super sensitive and I want to start slow. You can do a google search and some people say that 0.025% does have the same results as higher strength. |
_________________
23, fair, EDS newbie, taking Diane 35. |
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Thu Dec 03, 2009 8:43 am |
| I used the retin A gel 0.025% and then upgraded to Tazorac gel 0.05%. I thought it was going to give me major red and peeling skin but I was surprised that it was no worse than with the retin A gel. Even though it stung initially when I was starting on it and I had a bit of peeling but my skin adjusted to it and it actually gave better results than retin A in my case. I must add that I have resistant (non-sensitive) skin. |
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Thu Dec 03, 2009 9:30 am |
I asked my friend in the know about this and this is what he said:
The microgels are different than the regular gels because although its 0.1% its time released, so a little bit travels from the surface deep into the derma every couple of hours so you don’t hit your skin with the 0.1% all at once like you would do with the ordinary gel or cream (and that may cause irritation initially and peeling).
In the beginning I think 0.025 is a good strength to start with, and then gradually work your way up.
I disagree with the statement that 0.1 is no more effective than 0.025, but I think it takes a while to get up to the stage where you can tolerate and benefit from 0.1% as it packs quite a punch. It is of course more expensive but your hitting your skin with a much stronger source as a result.
Theresa
| bluugrass wrote: |
Hey ya'll,
I'm about to place an order with Alldaychemist, and have piled my cart with the gels, the micros and a cream or two, all different strengths. I went to the FAQ section and read the post about the AHAs, BHAs, and retinoids, and there's a link there leading to a notepad in makeupAlley with a reference to
some studies that have suggested that a strength of 0.1 is no more effective than .025, just more irritating, and that the skin will not use more than is needed and the rest is either wasted or causes irritation. So, I was thinking...if I just order the .025, couldn't I just increase by eventually using every night instead of increasing strength and using every other night? Should I really be using a higher strength if my skin can handle it (it's not really sensitive...I can rub it down with a lemon slice for 5 minutes before a shower without experiencing any redness), or could I just use the lower strength more often? The .025 is cheaper, too...about 50 cents more to bump up to a .05.
Also, does anyone have opinions on the cream vs. the gel?
Thanks to all....any and all thoughts appreciated. |
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Thu Dec 03, 2009 1:25 pm |
| TheresaMary wrote: |
In the beginning I think 0.025 is a good strength to start with, and then gradually work your way up.
I disagree with the statement that 0.1 is no more effective than 0.025 ........
Theresa
| bluugrass wrote: |
Hey ya'll,
I'm about to place an order with Alldaychemist, and have piled my cart with the gels, the micros and a cream or two, all different strengths. I went to the FAQ section and read the post about the AHAs, BHAs, and retinoids, and there's a link there leading to a notepad in makeupAlley with a reference to
some studies that have suggested that a strength of 0.1 is no more effective than .025, just more irritating, and that the skin will not use more than is needed and the rest is either wasted or causes irritation. So, I was thinking...if I just order the .025, couldn't I just increase by eventually using every night instead of increasing strength and using every other night? Should I really be using a higher strength if my skin can handle it (it's not really sensitive...I can rub it down with a lemon slice for 5 minutes before a shower without experiencing any redness), or could I just use the lower strength more often? The .025 is cheaper, too...about 50 cents more to bump up to a .05.
Also, does anyone have opinions on the cream vs. the gel?
Thanks to all....any and all thoughts appreciated. |
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Regarding the concentration of tretinoin, there was a 48-week medical study that compared 0.1% and 0.025% tretinoin creams. The results of the study showed "After 48 weeks, 0.1% and 0.025% tretinoin produced similar statistically significant epidermal thickening (by 30% and 28%, respectively) and increased vascularity (by 100% and 89%, respectively). By various analyses, irritant side effects (erythema and scaling) were statistically significantly greater with 0.1% tretinoin than with 0.025% tretinoin."
You can read about the study here:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7544967 |
_________________
Born 1953; Blonde-Blue; Normal skin |
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Thu Dec 03, 2009 2:54 pm |
| Thanks for posting that, Lacy. Interesting that there was only a 2% difference in the epidermal thickening with the 0.1 and 0.025%. I thought a similar study had been done between the 0.1 and 0.05. Did you come across anything like that? I just may have been remembering the study you posted, but for some reason the 0.05 stuck in my head. |
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Thu Dec 03, 2009 4:12 pm |
| rileygirl wrote: |
| Thanks for posting that, Lacy. Interesting that there was only a 2% difference in the epidermal thickening with the 0.1 and 0.025%. I thought a similar study had been done between the 0.1 and 0.05. Did you come across anything like that? I just may have been remembering the study you posted, but for some reason the 0.05 stuck in my head. |
The only study I can recall which compared those concentrations involved Tazarotene 0.1% cream and tretinoin 0.05% emollient cream. I am still hunting for any studies which compare those concentrations using just tretinoin. You can read about the Taz study here:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15203997
As you may recall this study was regarded by some as biased and therefore controversial when it was published. |
_________________
Born 1953; Blonde-Blue; Normal skin |
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Thu Dec 03, 2009 4:39 pm |
| Thanks, Lacy. I do remember that study, but maybe that is where the 0.1 and 0.05 stuck in my mind from! |
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Thu Dec 03, 2009 10:35 pm |
| I have used .1 in gel form in the past and had some peeling so kicked it back to the .05 cream and no problem. I have never used .025 as my skin is oily and pretty tough. |
_________________
Enjoying dermalogica with my ASG and Pico toner ** Disclosure: I was a participant without remuneration in promotional videos for Ageless Secret Gold and the Neurotris Pico Emmy event. |
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Fri Dec 04, 2009 7:47 am |
| I would think that all strengths of retin-a are beneficial and as you increase in strength so would the results, that is of course if no significant irritation is present. |
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Fri Dec 04, 2009 8:01 am |
The microgel is different though, so although this study is probably correct in its assumptions against the cream, I think its incorrect with reference to its application to the microgel. Also its a relatively short study of only 48 weeks - many of the Retin A studies were done for over a year (52 weeks isn't it). So I'm also wondering if thats a factor too?
| Lacy53 wrote: |
| TheresaMary wrote: |
In the beginning I think 0.025 is a good strength to start with, and then gradually work your way up.
I disagree with the statement that 0.1 is no more effective than 0.025 ........
Theresa
| bluugrass wrote: |
Hey ya'll,
I'm about to place an order with Alldaychemist, and have piled my cart with the gels, the micros and a cream or two, all different strengths. I went to the FAQ section and read the post about the AHAs, BHAs, and retinoids, and there's a link there leading to a notepad in makeupAlley with a reference to
some studies that have suggested that a strength of 0.1 is no more effective than .025, just more irritating, and that the skin will not use more than is needed and the rest is either wasted or causes irritation. So, I was thinking...if I just order the .025, couldn't I just increase by eventually using every night instead of increasing strength and using every other night? Should I really be using a higher strength if my skin can handle it (it's not really sensitive...I can rub it down with a lemon slice for 5 minutes before a shower without experiencing any redness), or could I just use the lower strength more often? The .025 is cheaper, too...about 50 cents more to bump up to a .05.
Also, does anyone have opinions on the cream vs. the gel?
Thanks to all....any and all thoughts appreciated. |
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Regarding the concentration of tretinoin, there was a 48-week medical study that compared 0.1% and 0.025% tretinoin creams. The results of the study showed "After 48 weeks, 0.1% and 0.025% tretinoin produced similar statistically significant epidermal thickening (by 30% and 28%, respectively) and increased vascularity (by 100% and 89%, respectively). By various analyses, irritant side effects (erythema and scaling) were statistically significantly greater with 0.1% tretinoin than with 0.025% tretinoin."
You can read about the study here:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7544967 |
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_________________
FlexEffect Trainer |
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Fri Dec 04, 2009 11:25 am |
| SeanySeanUK wrote: |
| The microgel is different though, so although this study is probably correct in its assumptions against the cream, I think its incorrect with reference to its application to the microgel. Also its a relatively short study of only 48 weeks - many of the Retin A studies were done for over a year (52 weeks isn't it). So I'm also wondering if thats a factor too? |
Sean, are you talking about irritation or efficacy with the microgel? |
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Fri Dec 04, 2009 12:07 pm |
| rileygirl wrote: |
| SeanySeanUK wrote: |
| The microgel is different though, so although this study is probably correct in its assumptions against the cream, I think its incorrect with reference to its application to the microgel. Also its a relatively short study of only 48 weeks - many of the Retin A studies were done for over a year (52 weeks isn't it). So I'm also wondering if thats a factor too? |
Sean, are you talking about irritation or efficacy with the microgel? |
The microgel contains the same active ingredient ... tretinoin. I doubt the delivery system and base matter much, other than the irritation factor as mentioned by Riley. As far as I know, there are two formulations of microgels; 0.04% and 0.1% (there may be others that I am not aware of). To the best of my knowledge there are only a handful of long-term studies that exceed one year/52 weeks. I am not sure any long-term studies have been done using the microgel; are you aware of any Sean? |
_________________
Born 1953; Blonde-Blue; Normal skin |
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Sat Dec 05, 2009 2:54 am |
I think it helps in both iritiation and efficiency, as your not whacking your skin with either strength straight off, the delivery method of the microgel kind of protects against the iritiation you would experience using the regular gel or cream (and interestingly the regular gel burns me every time I try it), but I get none of that with the micro gel.
Not aware of any studies detailing solely the microgel - but I do know from all my clients who have used the cream/gel and then gone on to microgel seem to love it and never move from it back to the regular cream/gel which speaks volumes to me of its efficiency.
Many derms can make any strength of the microgel you want (or write you a prescription for your chemist to make it).
Sean
| Lacy53 wrote: |
| rileygirl wrote: |
| SeanySeanUK wrote: |
| The microgel is different though, so although this study is probably correct in its assumptions against the cream, I think its incorrect with reference to its application to the microgel. Also its a relatively short study of only 48 weeks - many of the Retin A studies were done for over a year (52 weeks isn't it). So I'm also wondering if thats a factor too? |
Sean, are you talking about irritation or efficacy with the microgel? |
The microgel contains the same active ingredient ... tretinoin. I doubt the delivery system and base matter much, other than the irritation factor as mentioned by Riley. As far as I know, there are two formulations of microgels; 0.04% and 0.1% (there may be others that I am not aware of). To the best of my knowledge there are only a handful of long-term studies that exceed one year/52 weeks. I am not sure any long-term studies have been done using the microgel; are you aware of any Sean? |
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_________________
FlexEffect Trainer |
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Tue Jan 30, 2018 1:24 am |
Hi all and sorry for bump this thread. Definitely recommend Retin-A Tretinoin cream, firstly recommend to use low-tretinoin consistency 0.025% and after go deeper with 0.05% and 0.1% creams and gels. My skin became great, more youthful, without pigmentation, brighter, wrinkles and fine lines became less visible and its only within first 2 months of usage, i'm pretty impressed!
I don't have insurance. So I get mine from http://lookuptothebest.net/go/Tretinoin  (I use 10% discount code "SA10LE"). I would recommend it to everyone who have signs of aging, wrinkles, color fading, discoloration etc problems. |
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