Skin Biology's Copper Peptides
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free skin care · Sun Mar 28, 2010 8:33 am

sister sweets wrote:

Let me know if I'm following you right Foxe - Do you use the retin a followed by CP's one night and then an exfoliator but no CP's the next?I don't stick to the same routine, unfortunately. Usually I do use CPs nightly, though. I also tend to use Retin A nightly, but *want* to alternate it with exfoliatives. Right now I just use a BHA if my skin looks like it needs it, which is not often - yeah!

At this point I'm wondering is it best to use every night if you can for best results? Yes - for faster results, do so.

Do you always put Emu oil over the CP's? Does it have to be the one Dr. Pickart sells? I don't always use Emu oil - I find it a bit too oily for my oily skin. It doesn't have to be the SB one either. But, I did try out 3 different types and like theirs the best.

Regarding C serum - does the C negate the CP's or do the CP's negate the C?
I know it's supposed to be 12 hours between so what do you mean by ...you do 8 with no problem? By 8 hours, I mean I've put CPs on at night and the Vitamin C in the morning - with 8 hours of sleep. The CPs get washed off in the morning if they haven't been absorbed, so there shouldn't be a problem. Then there is at least 12 hours during the day to separate the two.

Do you have a specific cleanser that you like? I searched high and low for a low pH one years ago when I was using a BHA on a regular basis [I think that is overkill now], but have come to really like the Gentle Clean that SB offers- it has a neutral pH. NCN also has a nice Rhassoule Cleanser that I can recommend.

The nail peptide - What does this seem to do for you? I had terrible nails that would not grow. I had psoriasis in them when I was a kid and the nail bed became damaged from that. They always split, peeled and broke easily. The Tin Peptide really improved the health of them and they did not split or peel as much. I also found out that the psoriasis that was in them in my youth might have had some fungus in them and recently tried a product that is anti-fungal. That product (Manuka Oil) and the Tin Peptide has really given me some pretty looking nails. I am always getting compliments on them now and asked if they're real. But, I think for most ppl (who haven't had the fungus/psoriasis) the Nail Peptide would be just right. It stengthened my nails and gives a lovely shine.

I guess that's enough for now. Thanks for your help.

HTH!!

free skin care · Sun Mar 28, 2010 8:56 am

m1rox wrote:

foxe: I wonder if I've been using the Neutrogena Visibly Firm serum for some time with no problems (alternate days), should I be able to use the CP serum or should I proceed via the GHK? I'm not sure if the Neutrogena has the same amount of 1st generation copper peptides as the GHK or not.

Thanks for your time and patience in answering questions on this thread.

Hi mlrox - moving from the Neutrogena to CP Serum is do-able. Just dilute the CP Serum. If you have sensitive skin - use the Super GHK.

I've seen Dr Pickart say the Super GHK has a lot more CP in them than anything on the market (Neutrogena, Neova, Osmotics).

Keep in mind that GHK is fragile and is unstable when used with hydroxy acids. You have to separate GHK with acids by 12 hours. Dr Pickart developed the 2nd generation CPs (GHK is a first gen) so that they'd be less fragile. He even includes a BHA in a couple of the formulas (for penetration enhancement only, not for exfoliation). The GHK is still a lovely CP to use - esp for sensitive skin or for the eye area.

free skin care · Sun Mar 28, 2010 9:13 am

Thanks for your reply, foxe.

I don't have sensitive skin. I do use Tazorac gel unbuffered (I am using retinoids primarily for controlling sebaceous hyperplasia).

I think I will try the CP serum with dilution and see how it goes.

free skin care · Sun Mar 28, 2010 9:20 am

m1rox wrote:

Thanks for your reply, foxe.

I don't have sensitive skin. I do use Tazorac gel unbuffered (I am using retinoids primarily for controlling sebaceous hyperplasia).

I think I will try the CP serum with dilution and see how it goes.

Do you think the taz help keep your SH under control?

I have a couple of those myself. Use to use the taz for years but switched to Retin A Micro late last year. Unfortunately, I saw the SH become more prominent when I abandoned all acids during my 302 experiment early last year. Getting back on a retinoid AND also using the Dermawand has helped. I think I'm going to try to single needle one of them and apply a 5% BHA and SC2X and see if that will finally flatten that one. Will report back if it does!

free skin care · Sun Mar 28, 2010 10:08 am

foxe wrote:

Star Model wrote:

Skippie wrote:

Dr. Pickart told someone on the skin biology forum to use the Trireduction cream as a moisturizer, so I've been thinking about getting it to put over Skin Signals (which I use every other night). Do you think that's overkill? I really don't care for the emu oil or in fact any oil, so I've been looking for a moisturizer to use with it.

Skippie, Using Tri-Reduction Cream over Skin Signals is too strong. If you don't want to use a BHO then one of the Protect & Restore products like DayCover on top would be ideal. Or alternate Tri-Reduction with your SS.

I agree w/ StarModel - and do think the combo would be over kill (but I do spot treat over weaker CPs with the SC2X, so I shouldn't talk!) I'm hitting scars when I do that tho.

For a moisturizer - NCN Skincare has a new one that I got a sample of and it's a nice light one. I asked Nanci(she's been a CP fan for much longer than me) if it could be used over CPs and she said YES. It's called Lemon Mousse Moisturizer . NCN also carries CPs.

Thanks foxe and SM. I figured it would be too much, especially given the fact that my skin freaked out with Super CP and I haven't used it since.

Funny you mentioned the lemon moisturizer from Nanci, foxe. I got a sample in my last order but haven't tried it yet. I need to place an order for Skin Signals since she's having a sale on it (I hope) through the end of March.

I'm actually mixing Skin Signals and the regular CP serum, because I had almost a full bottle of the CP serum.

free skin care · Sun Mar 28, 2010 10:52 am

That's a thought - mixing them up.

free skin care · Sun Mar 28, 2010 4:36 pm

foxe wrote:

Do you think the taz help keep your SH under control?

I have a couple of those myself. Use to use the taz for years but switched to Retin A Micro late last year. Unfortunately, I saw the SH become more prominent when I abandoned all acids during my 302 experiment early last year. Getting back on a retinoid AND also using the Dermawand has helped. I think I'm going to try to single needle one of them and apply a 5% BHA and SC2X and see if that will finally flatten that one. Will report back if it does!

Yes please report on your experience with the BHA/SC2x.

The Taz produces quite an aggressive peeling effect if I use it a few days in a row and that flattens the SH quite a bit. Of course I don't expect the bigger ones to flatten completely.

Currently, I have an alternating 6 weeks cycle with AHA products because I read somewhere that Daniel Yarosh (ex-Remergent) advocates cycling retinoids and AHAs. I would only use Taz or AHA on alternate days and the Neutrogena on the "off" day. If I use Taz or other retinoids every day, my skin gets red easily.

I did notice my 11s have "faded" recently but I thought it was due to a healthier diet (my gynaecologist advised me to adopt a vegan diet). Maybe it's also the skincare regime. But my skin seems healthier on the regime. I can't use the Neutrogena every night. It seems to make my pores enlarge (?maybe some manifestation of "uglies").

free skin care · Sun Mar 28, 2010 7:16 pm

This is quite a happening thread. Thanks everyone for the great input.

And now (ahem) for a few more questions:

Foxe - What did you use on your eyelids to get them to firm up the way you wrote in one of your first posts?
And another question: What did you mean with regards to the body lotion - not a great smell? Does it have a bad smell? I'm thinking of getting this for the summer - use with the sunscreen. Is it better to get one of the scented ones?
I love patchouli but was thinking of jasmine or the ylanglyang.

Now for Star Model:

What is your skin care regime with CP's including Day cover, etc ? How long have you been using them?
What are the results you have achieved with your use?

Sorry for asking so much Rolling Eyes

I'm excited to be using SRCP again after a long time away.... thanks for helping with these things. I want to maximize CP usage - so far am using skin signals only and want to be prepared when I put the next skin bio order in.

free skin care · Sun Mar 28, 2010 10:31 pm

sister sweets wrote:

And another question: What did you mean with regards to the body lotion - not a great smell? Does it have a bad smell? I'm thinking of getting this for the summer - use with the sunscreen. Is it better to get one of the scented ones?
I love patchouli but was thinking of jasmine or the ylanglyang.

The scented versions are not for those that like subtle scents...I got the ylang ylang (I think) and it was soooo scented that I had to get up and take another shower because the smell was keeping me awake. Shock

I ended up giving it away since I am sensitive to strong smells.

free skin care · Sun Mar 28, 2010 10:36 pm

foxe wrote:

The nail peptide - What does this seem to do for you? I had terrible nails that would not grow. I had psoriasis in them when I was a kid and the nail bed became damaged from that. They always split, peeled and broke easily. The Tin Peptide really improved the health of them and they did not split or peel as much. I also found out that the psoriasis that was in them in my youth might have had some fungus in them and recently tried a product that is anti-fungal. That product (Manuka Oil) and the Tin Peptide has really given me some pretty looking nails. I am always getting compliments on them now and asked if they're real. But, I think for most ppl (who haven't had the fungus/psoriasis) the Nail Peptide would be just right. It stengthened my nails and gives a lovely shine.

The Tin Peptide used in the nail product is the same as the one in Folligen For Blondes which I LOVE. You get a free nail treatment when you apply the hair product and massage in with your fingers! Very Happy

free skin care · Sun Mar 28, 2010 10:54 pm

bethany wrote:

sister sweets wrote:

And another question: What did you mean with regards to the body lotion - not a great smell? Does it have a bad smell? I'm thinking of getting this for the summer - use with the sunscreen. Is it better to get one of the scented ones?
I love patchouli but was thinking of jasmine or the ylanglyang.

The scented versions are not for those that like subtle scents...I got the ylang ylang (I think) and it was soooo scented that I had to get up and take another shower because the smell was keeping me awake. Shock

I ended up giving it away since I am sensitive to strong smells.

I wonder if one could add your own essential oils to the unscented body lotion? Then you could tailor the strength of the scent to your own tastes.

free skin care · Mon Mar 29, 2010 5:27 am

In another thread, we've been talking about how to restore color to gray hair and the possibility that copper will help. Does anyone know if using the CP hair products will help in that area?

free skin care · Mon Mar 29, 2010 5:39 am

sister sweets wrote:

Now for Star Model:
What is your skin care regime with CP's including Day cover, etc ? How long have you been using them?
What are the results you have achieved with your use?

Sweets, I have been using CPs for close to 5 yrs. My routine has changed over the course as my skin changed and I introduced or eliminated different products. The same rule applies though even to this day, that "less is more". So many, even here want to jump in too quickly. One of the main problems by going too fast is that when CPs stimulate new collagen production, they begin to push old damaged skin and blemishes up. "Out with the old – In with the new". This is "true skin remodeling". So go slow!

Overall, I would say that the biggest improvement for me has been "overall tightening, texture and tone" of my skin and with my eyes. Very Happy

I used to use all kinds of different eye products and no longer use or need anything special. But I suppose since the skin thickens and tightens from CPs that the change is more of a "real change" rather than a temporary one from ingredients like Hyaluronic Acid found in so many products. I know this is the darling of the beauty world these days, but I would not touch it. Over time HA, actually damages the skin by wetting the skin barrier. It temporarily puffs the skin for a quick fix- look, but slowly damages the skin with each application.

I use DayCover as my last step before MMUP. It contains Titanium Dioxide natural UV reflector.

free skin care · Mon Mar 29, 2010 5:43 am

sister sweets wrote:

Foxe - And another question: What did you mean with regards to the body lotion - not a great smell? Does it have a bad smell? I'm thinking of getting this for the summer - use with the sunscreen. Is it better to get one of the scented ones?
I love patchouli but was thinking of jasmine or the ylanglyang.

I find the body lotions to be divine smelling. Very Happy

They come in all the different pheromone scents. It the sun tanning lotion that doesn't smell so great tough. I actually add some Calypso's Oil to mine to improve it.

Do you use the Body Lotion Foxe?

free skin care · Mon Mar 29, 2010 5:46 am

Thanks Star - What have you used around your eyes to get your results?
Do you use CP's twice per day? (did I ask that already Rolling Eyes

)

What body lotion do you use? Is the basic unscented - meaning it won't interact with other scented products.

What other skin products do you use? Do you use exfol? retin a?
I know you said you like Skin Signals but do you use others on your face, neck aside from this?

TIA.

Bethany - the folligen sounds very interesting.

free skin care · Mon Mar 29, 2010 5:48 am

m1rox wrote:

bethany wrote:

sister sweets wrote:

And another question: What did you mean with regards to the body lotion - not a great smell? Does it have a bad smell? I'm thinking of getting this for the summer - use with the sunscreen. Is it better to get one of the scented ones?
I love patchouli but was thinking of jasmine or the ylanglyang.

The scented versions are not for those that like subtle scents...I got the ylang ylang (I think) and it was soooo scented that I had to get up and take another shower because the smell was keeping me awake. Shock

I ended up giving it away since I am sensitive to strong smells.

I wonder if one could add your own essential oils to the unscented body lotion? Then you could tailor the strength of the scent to your own tastes.

That's a good question mlrox. I wonder the same thing?

free skin care · Mon Mar 29, 2010 5:50 am

Skippie wrote:

In another thread, we've been talking about how to restore color to gray hair and the possibility that copper will help. Does anyone know if using the CP hair products will help in that area?

Hi Skippie, I don't have any gray hair, but I do use Folligen Spray a couple of times week on my hairline and scalp to promote growth.

It is often the lack of copper in the body that causes hair to turn gray. I think many use Folligen to help restore hair color, but I don't have personal experience in that dept.

free skin care · Mon Mar 29, 2010 5:50 am

Star Model wrote:

sister sweets wrote:

Foxe - And another question: What did you mean with regards to the body lotion - not a great smell? Does it have a bad smell? I'm thinking of getting this for the summer - use with the sunscreen. Is it better to get one of the scented ones?
I love patchouli but was thinking of jasmine or the ylanglyang.

I find the body lotions to be divine smelling. Very Happy

They come in all the different pheromone scents. It the sun tanning lotion that doesn't smell so great tough. I actually add some Calypso's Oil to mine to improve it.

Do you use the Body Lotion Foxe?

Not foxe but I think she said she did in one of her first posts.
What is your favorite scented body lotion?

free skin care · Mon Mar 29, 2010 6:03 am

sister sweets wrote:

Thanks Star - What have you used around your eyes to get your results?
Do you use CP's twice per day? (did I ask that already Rolling Eyes

)

What body lotion do you use? Is the basic unscented - meaning it won't interact with other scented products.

What other skin products do you use? Do you use exfol? retin a?
I know you said you like Skin Signals but do you use others on your face, neck aside from this?

TIA.

Bethany - the folligen sounds very interesting.

Sweets, you are the inquisitive one.

I like the Lavender Scent Body lotion the best. I have not tried the unscented, but I am sure it would be nice too.

I introduced Retin-A (.025 - .05) a few yrs back. Only use it every 3rd night. I like to use Exfol in the AM followed by SS/Emu/DayCover, then LacSal in the eve on the nights I don't use Retin-A.

On the eyes, I started with Super GHK/ then Night Eyes Premier/ CP Serum/ then Super CP Serum over a course of time. Emu as my moisturizer. It took about a year for any real noticeable change to take place. Now I use SS/Emu lightly in the AM only. That's it!

I also like to REST my skin at least once a week by using P&R Cream only. I have found a nice balance for myself. Very Happy

free skin care · Mon Mar 29, 2010 6:08 am

Just interested to ask. For those of you who had good results, are you in the more mature age range? ie over 40. Because I read in another thread that perhaps the results are not so good for those who are younger and also those who do not have much in the way of skin problems. Those seem to be the ones who have less improvements and importantly more side effects. I must say I have had a good experience so far with the Neutrogena CP (although it is supposedly mild) but I am in the (ahem) more mature age range so perhaps not so prone to having bad "uglies" (lol maybe I already have "uglies" so there's no more "uglies" to show up Laughing

free skin care · Mon Mar 29, 2010 6:08 am

sister sweets wrote:

m1rox wrote:

bethany wrote:

sister sweets wrote:

And another question: What did you mean with regards to the body lotion - not a great smell? Does it have a bad smell? I'm thinking of getting this for the summer - use with the sunscreen. Is it better to get one of the scented ones?
I love patchouli but was thinking of jasmine or the ylanglyang.

The scented versions are not for those that like subtle scents...I got the ylang ylang (I think) and it was soooo scented that I had to get up and take another shower because the smell was keeping me awake. Shock

I ended up giving it away since I am sensitive to strong smells.

I wonder if one could add your own essential oils to the unscented body lotion? Then you could tailor the strength of the scent to your own tastes.

That's a good question mlrox. I wonder the same thing?

Sure you can add any of your favorite essential oils to the suntanning lotion. Cool

The body lotion is thicker so it may be harder to blend.

free skin care · Mon Mar 29, 2010 6:22 am

Star Model wrote:

Hyaluronic Acid found in so many products. I know this is the darling of the beauty world these days, but I would not touch it. Over time HA, actually damages the skin by wetting the skin barrier. It temporarily puffs the skin for a quick fix- look, but slowly damages the skin with each application.

Starmodel, do you have any studies that back that statement up? I have been using hyaluronic acid in a product every morning, so I would be curious to read information on your claim that is damages the skin.

free skin care · Mon Mar 29, 2010 6:46 am

rileygirl wrote:

Star Model wrote:

Hyaluronic Acid found in so many products. I know this is the darling of the beauty world these days, but I would not touch it. Over time HA, actually damages the skin by wetting the skin barrier. It temporarily puffs the skin for a quick fix- look, but slowly damages the skin with each application.

Starmodel, do you have any studies that back that statement up? I have been using hyaluronic acid in a product every morning, so I would be curious to read information on your claim that is damages the skin.

Hi Rileygirl, This is something that I have learned from Dr. Pickart. He does have info on HA posted somewhere on the SB site as well as his forum. Have you joined the SB forums yet? I believe he talks of HA extensively there.

free skin care · Mon Mar 29, 2010 6:54 am

Star Model wrote:

Hi Rileygirl, This is something that I have learned from Dr. Pickart. He does have info on HA posted somewhere on the SB site as well as his forum. Have you joined the SB forums yet? I believe he talks of HA extensively there.

I have joined that forum, StarModel. I'll try to dig around over there for any information on this topic.

free skin care · Mon Mar 29, 2010 7:01 am

I remember reading the same thing about HA and have been hesitant to use ever since. I think Dr. Pickart explains in great depth.

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