Replacing Obagi Nu Derm with ZO Medical products?
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free skin care · Sat Mar 16, 2013 2:07 am

Hi, was on Obagi Nu Derm for 6 months and have been on maintenance since November. For maintenance, I use Nu Derm 3 x a week [half gram each Clear (Clear 2 x a day), Blender and 0.1% tretinoin] and adequate sunscreen. My melasma is slowly coming back - can see faint brown patches coming through and a few freckles have reappeared. I was told I have built up a tolerance to hydroquinone and need to try another lightening agent.

Also use Skinceuticals C & E Ferulic every other day. Had started back on azelaic acid (Skinoren) on non Nu Derm days but my skin just gets too dry.

Would love to hear the experiences of anyone using the ZO Medical line for melasma.

Did your melasma subside on ZO Medical?

Do you use it everyday like on Nu Derm or do you use ZO Medical every other day like on Nu Derm maintenance?

Which products are you using?

free skin care · Sat Mar 16, 2013 8:16 pm

Do a search for ZO on EDS and you will find that we discovered most of the ZO products were private label products manufactured by Young Pharmacuticals and available elsewhere for a fraction of what ZO was charging. Very disappointing.

free skin care · Sat Mar 16, 2013 9:58 pm

bethany wrote:

Do a search for ZO on EDS and you will find that we discovered most of the ZO products were private label products manufactured by Young Pharmacuticals and available elsewhere for a fraction of what ZO was charging. Very disappointing.

Hi Bethany,

Yeah, I went off of ZO Skin products after reading your posts. But now they have a new line called ZO Medical and it is supposed to replace Nu Derm. I am looking for an alternative to hydroquinone because it is not as effective for my melasma anymore.

Specifically, ZO Medical has a new product called Brightenex which is 1% retinol in a special moisturizing delayed release delivery system. I don't see how retinol can replace hydroquinone but that is what ZO Medical is asserting.

I am already using the highest strength tretinoin 0.1% and still have some bounce back melasma issues.

And if you find any less expensive dupe for Brightenex, I would love to know where to get it. You are THE superstar of research, I always scan the sidebar on threads and if I see your name, I'll check out what you have to say!

Wed Mar 20, 2013 12:25 pm

denisiel wrote:

bethany wrote:

Do a search for ZO on EDS and you will find that we discovered most of the ZO products were private label products manufactured by Young Pharmacuticals and available elsewhere for a fraction of what ZO was charging. Very disappointing.

Hi Bethany,

Yeah, I went off of ZO Skin products after reading your posts. But now they have a new line called ZO Medical and it is supposed to replace Nu Derm. I am looking for an alternative to hydroquinone because it is not as effective for my melasma anymore.

Specifically, ZO Medical has a new product called Brightenex which is 1% retinol in a special moisturizing delayed release delivery system. I don't see how retinol can replace hydroquinone but that is what ZO Medical is asserting.

I am already using the highest strength tretinoin 0.1% and still have some bounce back melasma issues.

And if you find any less expensive dupe for Brightenex, I would love to know where to get it. You are THE superstar of research, I always scan the sidebar on threads and if I see your name, I'll check out what you have to say!

Hi denisiel,

A few months back we exchanged notes on our experiences on Nu Derm for melasma. I have now been on maintenance for about 3 months. At the time I went on maintenance my melasma was 85% resolved, and my results have continued to improve while on maintenance. My maintenance is extremely scaled down because I really want to use as little hydroquinone as possible. I have been able to get away with using just blender 3 times a week. I also use retin a nightly, along with a 20% vit c serum and a product by Peter Thomas Roth called De-Spot during the day. Of course, I practice extreme sun avoidance and am obsessive when it comes to sunscreen. I do live with this nagging fear that the melasma is going to return. Some days I am convinced that I can see faint outlines of old spots resurfacing.

I have done some research on Brightenex, and have come up with little information. I, like you, find it hard to imagine that this product can eliminate usuage of hydroquinone products altogether. On the Zo Medical website they compare their product line up to Nu Derm and it looks nearly identical to Nu Derm, including two hydroquinone products, Melamix and Melaquin. I would be very curious what protocol Dr. Obagi now recommends to patients for melasma maintenance. If you google Brightenex, a blog comes up where a woman shares her experiences with Brightenex with before/after photos, and I have to say, her results look pretty impressive.

Regardless, I do plan to incorporate Brightenex. On his website, Melamin (4% hydroquinone) is suggested to be used "following use of Brighenex." I imagine the function of that is similar to blender/retin a ??

For any Canadians interested, I contacted Zo Medical regarding how a Canadian can go about aquiring Zo Medical products and was told that they are not currently available in Canada but will be availabe by mid-April to various Dr's offices.

free skin care · Wed Mar 20, 2013 4:20 pm

denisiel wrote:

Hi, was on Obagi Nu Derm for 6 months and have been on maintenance since November. For maintenance, I use Nu Derm 3 x a week [half gram each Clear (Clear 2 x a day), Blender and 0.1% tretinoin] and adequate sunscreen. My melasma is slowly coming back - can see faint brown patches coming through and a few freckles have reappeared. I was told I have built up a tolerance to hydroquinone and need to try another lightening agent.

Also use Skinceuticals C & E Ferulic every other day. Had started back on azelaic acid (Skinoren) on non Nu Derm days but my skin just gets too dry.

Would love to hear the experiences of anyone using the ZO Medical line for melasma.

Did your melasma subside on ZO Medical?

Do you use it everyday like on Nu Derm or do you use ZO Medical every other day like on Nu Derm maintenance?

Which products are you using?

I can't comment on this system other than a concern about sunscreen. Unfortunately, some sunscreens are not as well formulated as others.

What sunscreen are you using? I am assuming you are using it daily and a full application.

free skin care · Wed Mar 20, 2013 10:34 pm

blanchedubois wrote:

Hi denisiel,

A few months back we exchanged notes on our experiences on Nu Derm for melasma. I have now been on maintenance for about 3 months. At the time I went on maintenance my melasma was 85% resolved, and my results have continued to improve while on maintenance. My maintenance is extremely scaled down because I really want to use as little hydroquinone as possible. I have been able to get away with using just blender 3 times a week. I also use retin a nightly, along with a 20% vit c serum and a product by Peter Thomas Roth called De-Spot during the day. Of course, I practice extreme sun avoidance and am obsessive when it comes to sunscreen. I do live with this nagging fear that the melasma is going to return. Some days I am convinced that I can see faint outlines of old spots resurfacing.

I have done some research on Brightenex, and have come up with little information. I, like you, find it hard to imagine that this product can eliminate usuage of hydroquinone products altogether. On the Zo Medical website they compare their product line up to Nu Derm and it looks nearly identical to Nu Derm, including two hydroquinone products, Melamix and Melaquin. I would be very curious what protocol Dr. Obagi now recommends to patients for melasma maintenance. If you google Brightenex, a blog comes up where a woman shares her experiences with Brightenex with before/after photos, and I have to say, her results look pretty impressive.

Regardless, I do plan to incorporate Brightenex. On his website, Melamin (4% hydroquinone) is suggested to be used "following use of Brighenex." I imagine the function of that is similar to blender/retin a ??

Hi blanchedubois - good to hear from you and glad that your melasma has not returned! I have been talking with the ZO Medical rep and they recommended going completely off Nu Derm and onto ZO Medical regime because they said I am experiencing a "bounce back effect" from hydroquinone, which means I have built up a tolerance. Yet the ZO Medical is also hydroquinone based so I really do not see the point in transitioning over. Their products are much more expensive than Nu Derm. Of course, Dr. Obagi probably owns more of ZO so he prefers to recommend that line over Obagi Medical where he probably owns fewer shares. Seems like he is replicating Nu Derm with ZO Medical.

I am using 0.1% tretinoin at night (just cut down from nightly usage to 3 x a week because my skin was always flakey). Also use the Ommerse Day & Night creams 2 x a week to have more Vit A on maintenance days. Started back using Skinoren (20% azelaic acid) again for the past few weeks as that wiped out 50% of the melasma before Nu Derm. I would think that these applications would be somewhat equivalent to the Brightenex.

I also started using glycolic acid instead of the Exfoderm (either PTR Peel Pads 2 x a week or Paula’s Choice Weekly Resurfacing Treatment 10 minutes 1 x a week). Use Vitamin C serum every other day - either Obagi Clarifying Serum, which has 4% hydroquinone and 10% Vit C and use in place of Clear in the AM on Nu Derm days or Skinceuticals C & E Ferulic if I know I will be outside. And using the PMD 1 x a week, which has been incredible in wiping out flakiness. The quality of my skin is much better than pre-Nu Derm but the melasma s slowly returning.

After three months, I did a three week shock regime – full Nu Derm – and that didn’t seem to do much but I read about it on the ZO site. I have freckles peeking out now and some light brown outlines where the darker patches were before. I am pretty frustrated and am thinking of just going for an Obagi Blue Peel but am a little worried of scarring (Asian skin so I scar easily).

Besides company sponsored testimonials, I have not heard of many melasma patients reviewing the ZO Medical line. I am scared to go off Nu Derm and all the melasma comes roaring back and having to suffer another 6 months of aggressive Nu Derm to get back to where I am today.

Please let us know how the Brightenex works out for you. I may go ahead and try it too, what the heck – we have already come this far, right?!

free skin care · Wed Mar 20, 2013 10:44 pm

Autumn1995 wrote:

I can't comment on this system other than a concern about sunscreen. Unfortunately, some sunscreens are not as well formulated as others.

What sunscreen are you using? I am assuming you are using it daily and a full application.

Hi, I use Skinceuticals UV Defense SPF 30 and let is absorb for 20-30 minutes. Then I layer on Devita Solar Body Block SPF 30. I use Rachel K BB Cream SPF 35 for foundation and layer it with Laura Mercier Mineral Powder SPF 15. Throughout the day, I top off with Peter Thomas Roth Powder Sunscreen or Physicians Formula Mineral Powder, both SPF 30.

I never go out without a wide brimmed hat and never am in full sun or between the hours of 10 and 4.

Thu Mar 21, 2013 10:44 am

denisiel wrote:

blanchedubois wrote:

Hi denisiel,

A few months back we exchanged notes on our experiences on Nu Derm for melasma. I have now been on maintenance for about 3 months. At the time I went on maintenance my melasma was 85% resolved, and my results have continued to improve while on maintenance. My maintenance is extremely scaled down because I really want to use as little hydroquinone as possible. I have been able to get away with using just blender 3 times a week. I also use retin a nightly, along with a 20% vit c serum and a product by Peter Thomas Roth called De-Spot during the day. Of course, I practice extreme sun avoidance and am obsessive when it comes to sunscreen. I do live with this nagging fear that the melasma is going to return. Some days I am convinced that I can see faint outlines of old spots resurfacing.

I have done some research on Brightenex, and have come up with little information. I, like you, find it hard to imagine that this product can eliminate usuage of hydroquinone products altogether. On the Zo Medical website they compare their product line up to Nu Derm and it looks nearly identical to Nu Derm, including two hydroquinone products, Melamix and Melaquin. I would be very curious what protocol Dr. Obagi now recommends to patients for melasma maintenance. If you google Brightenex, a blog comes up where a woman shares her experiences with Brightenex with before/after photos, and I have to say, her results look pretty impressive.

Regardless, I do plan to incorporate Brightenex. On his website, Melamin (4% hydroquinone) is suggested to be used "following use of Brighenex." I imagine the function of that is similar to blender/retin a ??

Hi blanchedubois - good to hear from you and glad that your melasma has not returned! I have been talking with the ZO Medical rep and they recommended going completely off Nu Derm and onto ZO Medical regime because they said I am experiencing a "bounce back effect" from hydroquinone, which means I have built up a tolerance. Yet the ZO Medical is also hydroquinone based so I really do not see the point in transitioning over. Their products are much more expensive than Nu Derm. Of course, Dr. Obagi probably owns more of ZO so he prefers to recommend that line over Obagi Medical where he probably owns fewer shares. Seems like he is replicating Nu Derm with ZO Medical.

I am using 0.1% tretinoin at night (just cut down from nightly usage to 3 x a week because my skin was always flakey). Also use the Ommerse Day & Night creams 2 x a week to have more Vit A on maintenance days. Started back using Skinoren (20% azelaic acid) again for the past few weeks as that wiped out 50% of the melasma before Nu Derm. I would think that these applications would be somewhat equivalent to the Brightenex.

I also started using glycolic acid instead of the Exfoderm (either PTR Peel Pads 2 x a week or Paula’s Choice Weekly Resurfacing Treatment 10 minutes 1 x a week). Use Vitamin C serum every other day - either Obagi Clarifying Serum, which has 4% hydroquinone and 10% Vit C and use in place of Clear in the AM on Nu Derm days or Skinceuticals C & E Ferulic if I know I will be outside. And using the PMD 1 x a week, which has been incredible in wiping out flakiness. The quality of my skin is much better than pre-Nu Derm but the melasma s slowly returning.

After three months, I did a three week shock regime – full Nu Derm – and that didn’t seem to do much but I read about it on the ZO site. I have freckles peeking out now and some light brown outlines where the darker patches were before. I am pretty frustrated and am thinking of just going for an Obagi Blue Peel but am a little worried of scarring (Asian skin so I scar easily).

Besides company sponsored testimonials, I have not heard of many melasma patients reviewing the ZO Medical line. I am scared to go off Nu Derm and all the melasma comes roaring back and having to suffer another 6 months of aggressive Nu Derm to get back to where I am today.

Please let us know how the Brightenex works out for you. I may go ahead and try it too, what the heck – we have already come this far, right?!

Hi again,

Based on your post below, lack of sunscreen diligence is clearly NOT your problem! I also layer physical sunscreens. Whenever you finish your PTR Sunscreen powder, look into Colorscience Sunforgettable spf 50. It has 24% micronized zinc oxide and 24% titanium dioxide. I love the stuff, and with such high levels of physical blockers, I really feel like it offers me solid extra protection.

I believe Dr. Obagi no longer has any affiliation with Obagi Medical Products (aside from the fact that he, of course, was the creator of the line back in 1988) In fact, from what I can discern it looks like there may be some bad blood between the two companies, as there has been litigation between Zo Skin Health & Obagi Medical over the past few years.

I have noticed on SkinCare MD's website has recently changed their Nu Derm maintenance protocol to clear 2-3 times a week and blender/retin a every single night (whereas they used to suggest 2-3 times a week.) I was going to suggest you increase your usage, but now that you have mentioned that you did three weeks on the full system and noticed no improvement, maybe that won't help.

I can't seem to find a lot of information regarding tolerance to hydroquinone. Seems totally counter productive to go through 6 months of torture only to achieve results that can't be maintained.

I will definitely update you with my progress with Brightenex. You should consider checking out PTR de-spot. I went into using it with very low expectations and have been pleasantly surprised Smile

-Robyn

Fri Mar 22, 2013 5:43 am

Hi Ladies! thought I'd give a review as I've been using the new Zo Medical line since Jan 2013.
I really, really like it!

-It works out cheaper for me

-It's more luxurious than Nu Derm, therefore less chance of pore clogging
-It's not meant to be; but this line for me is very aggressive. my skin barely reacted to Nu Derm. I find I can only use Zo Medical 2 or 3 times at most per week (spaced out)as my skin gets very tight and irritated, especially around the eyes. and I don't put it there!

Fri Mar 22, 2013 5:48 am

sorry ran out of space....overall, I think Zo Medical's better than Nu Derm. my skin looks and feels A LOT better on the days I'm able to tolerate it. I wish I could use it every day so as to benefit fully from it. BTW Denisiel, I'm a WOC,too (Black) ps.I also believe you don't need a lot for the whole face as with Nu Derm.

HTH Very Happy

free skin care · Sat Mar 23, 2013 10:41 pm

blanchedubois wrote:

Whenever you finish your PTR Sunscreen powder, look into Colorscience Sunforgettable spf 50. It has 24% micronized zinc oxide and 24% titanium dioxide. I love the stuff, and with such high levels of physical blockers, I really feel like it offers me solid extra protection

Hi Robyn,

I was just thinking about ordering the Colorscience so it's really good to know that you like it. I like the PTR but the caps on both tubes cracked and one opened in my purse and created a huge mess (good product but poor packaging).

blanchedubois wrote:

I have noticed on SkinCare MD's website has recently changed their Nu Derm maintenance protocol to clear 2-3 times a week and blender/retin a every single night (whereas they used to suggest 2-3 times a week.)

I saw that on the SkinCare MD site and was wondering how they can use HQ everyday. Up until a month ago I was doing one gram tretinoin 0.1% every night and mixed with half gram Blender on alternate nights (just trying to limit daily hydroquinone). But my face has been in a constant state of peeling and flaking on maintenance so decided to cut down to half gram of tretinoin every other night mixed with half gram of Blender.

I am still peeling slightly but not as red. May I ask what percentage tretinoin you are using now and what dosage of Blender and tretinoin?

Also, how much Clear, do you apply AM & PM, and how often? I was using 1 gram Clear AM & PM on Nu Derm but cut down to half gram AM & PM 3 x week on maintenance - maybe need to go back to a gram.

And are you peeling? I am kinda over being red and peeling and haven't found a good balance yet of maintenance with appropriate stimulation but no over-irritation.

blanchedubois wrote:

You should consider checking out PTR de-spot.

Thanks for introducing this product! I have never heard of it before and it seems like it has very good reviews. Will get it next time I am in the US.

I also saw in Hong Kong they have the Zein Obagi and Rohto line which uses different lighteners. It was originally made for the Japan market so it is HQ free. This is not the Japanese Nu Derm, it's an OTC line. All the literature is in Chinese or Japanese and I haven't found any reviews in English.

Last thought, don't you find it interesting that Dr. Obagi spent decades preaching the moisturizers are tranquilizers and oils are death to the skin but now his ZO Medical and the Asian lines are all using encapsulated oils? Either his philosophy has changed or technology has improved to the point he can incorporate moisturizers and oils to make the maintenance period more cosmetically elegant.

I may do one more 6 week Nu Derm and then go completely onto the ZO Medical or the Japan lines. Need to read some more reviews.

Good luck!

- Denise

free skin care · Sat Mar 23, 2013 10:46 pm

lushlala04 wrote:

Hi Ladies! thought I'd give a review as I've been using the new Zo Medical line since Jan 2013.
I really, really like it!

-It works out cheaper for me

-It's more luxurious than Nu Derm, therefore less chance of pore clogging
-It's not meant to be; but this line for me is very aggressive. my skin barely reacted to Nu Derm. I find I can only use Zo Medical 2 or 3 times at most per week (spaced out)as my skin gets very tight and irritated, especially around the eyes. and I don't put it there!

Hi lushlala04,

Thanks for the review! It's good to hear that ZO Medical is working for you, this is encouraging news. Did you have melasma and how has it been on ZO Medical?

Thanks!

free skin care · Sun Mar 24, 2013 3:35 am

lushlala04 wrote:

-It's not meant to be; but this line for me is very aggressive. my skin barely reacted to Nu Derm. I find I can only use Zo Medical 2 or 3 times at most per week (spaced out)as my skin gets very tight and irritated, especially around the eyes. and I don't put it there!

Seems Dr. Obagi feels Nu Derm is outdated in this article: http://www.zoskinhealth.com/dr-obagi/obagi-medical-products-inc

Sun Mar 24, 2013 11:05 am

Hi Denisiel

yes I was treating very uneven skin tone, Derm told me it was hyper pigmentation. Nu Derm worked fab but then when I went into maintenance, some of it returned. been on maintenance now for about 6mths, trying to "wean" myself off Nu Derm so as to go full time on Zo Medical and Vit C serum. really shocked Dr Obagi's not affiliated with Zo Medical; my Derm tells me he is! I'll have to check again. lemme know how you get on with the regime though!

Sun Mar 24, 2013 11:27 am

OMG Denisiel just read an extract of the interview you posted and found this:

To quote Dr Obagi:

"Today I have absolutely no relationship with Obagi Medical Products."

so frustrating as part of the reason I wanted to stop Nu Derm was coz he sold it, now this!!!!

thanks for the update Very Happy

Sun Mar 24, 2013 7:25 pm

lushlala04 wrote:

Hi Denisiel

yes I was treating very uneven skin tone, Derm told me it was hyper pigmentation. Nu Derm worked fab but then when I went into maintenance, some of it returned. been on maintenance now for about 6mths, trying to "wean" myself off Nu Derm so as to go full time on Zo Medical and Vit C serum. really shocked Dr Obagi's not affiliated with Zo Medical; my Derm tells me he is! I'll have to check again. lemme know how you get on with the regime though!

Hi there,

Dr.Obagi is no longer affiliated with Obagi Medical- not Zo Medical. Zo Medical/Zo Skin Health is fully owned/operated by Dr. Obagi. Smile

Sun Mar 24, 2013 8:16 pm

denisiel wrote:

blanchedubois wrote:

Whenever you finish your PTR Sunscreen powder, look into Colorscience Sunforgettable spf 50. It has 24% micronized zinc oxide and 24% titanium dioxide. I love the stuff, and with such high levels of physical blockers, I really feel like it offers me solid extra protection

Hi Robyn,

I was just thinking about ordering the Colorscience so it's really good to know that you like it. I like the PTR but the caps on both tubes cracked and one opened in my purse and created a huge mess (good product but poor packaging).

blanchedubois wrote:

I have noticed on SkinCare MD's website has recently changed their Nu Derm maintenance protocol to clear 2-3 times a week and blender/retin a every single night (whereas they used to suggest 2-3 times a week.)

I saw that on the SkinCare MD site and was wondering how they can use HQ everyday. Up until a month ago I was doing one gram tretinoin 0.1% every night and mixed with half gram Blender on alternate nights (just trying to limit daily hydroquinone). But my face has been in a constant state of peeling and flaking on maintenance so decided to cut down to half gram of tretinoin every other night mixed with half gram of Blender.

I am still peeling slightly but not as red. May I ask what percentage tretinoin you are using now and what dosage of Blender and tretinoin?

Also, how much Clear, do you apply AM & PM, and how often? I was using 1 gram Clear AM & PM on Nu Derm but cut down to half gram AM & PM 3 x week on maintenance - maybe need to go back to a gram.

And are you peeling? I am kinda over being red and peeling and haven't found a good balance yet of maintenance with appropriate stimulation but no over-irritation.

blanchedubois wrote:

You should consider checking out PTR de-spot.

Thanks for introducing this product! I have never heard of it before and it seems like it has very good reviews. Will get it next time I am in the US.

I also saw in Hong Kong they have the Zein Obagi and Rohto line which uses different lighteners. It was originally made for the Japan market so it is HQ free. This is not the Japanese Nu Derm, it's an OTC line. All the literature is in Chinese or Japanese and I haven't found any reviews in English.

Last thought, don't you find it interesting that Dr. Obagi spent decades preaching the moisturizers are tranquilizers and oils are death to the skin but now his ZO Medical and the Asian lines are all using encapsulated oils? Either his philosophy has changed or technology has improved to the point he can incorporate moisturizers and oils to make the maintenance period more cosmetically elegant.

I may do one more 6 week Nu Derm and then go completely onto the ZO Medical or the Japan lines. Need to read some more reviews.

Good luck!

- Denise

Hi Denise,

You will probably be annoyed by the Colorscience packaging as well. I find the powder dispensing brush totally useless, and wound up dumping the product into a generic powder sifter jar, and just apply with my favorite kabuki brush. When I reapply during the day, I just use my compact retractable kabuki with a handheld mirror. Not nearly as convenient, but I have yet to find a powder dispensing brush that really works well. That being said, I definitely recommend buying the refills w/o the brush. Better value, as I can almost guarantee you'll wind up ditching the brush.

I backed off with my tretinoin from .1% to .5%. I, like you, was just super tired of the whole redness/peeling. I did notice an improvement with the peeling, but I still feel like I have persistent redness, which really bothers me. I am beginning to wonder if it is actually tiny little broken blood capillaries that were either once masked by melasma or the result of using too many vigorous treatments prior to Obagi. I'm considering incorporating NIA24 Skin Strengthening Complex into my maintenance routine. A lot of people report a huge improvement in redness. I just placed an order for some, so I will report back Smile

Okay, for the past 3 months, this has been what I have been doing:

I have been using a gram of tretinoin every night, and combining it with a half gram of blender three times a week. Daily AM, I use Vivier 20% C serum, PTR De-Spot, and in the PM on nights when I'm not using blender, I use De-Spot again. I stopped using Clear altogether. Every two weeks I get a 40% lactic acid peel which may or may not be helping. This routine has been working at maintaining my results, but I *thought* I could see a resurgence in pigmentation, so I decided to do a 2 week full-program as of last Monday. I am right back to total redness and peeling. Following this 2 week treatment, I plan to return to my old schedule but alternate tretinoin with finacea (same thing as skinoren.)

Thank you so much for sending a link to that article. I was extremely surprised/confused to see that he also only recommends use of tretinoin for up to 5 months. That is completely new to me. You mentioned you have been in contact with Zo Medical regarding your melasma... have they suggested a protocol using Zo Medical products for melasma patients? I really wish it was more convenient for me to make a trip to one of his offices. I'm in Vancouver, and it's just not feasible at the moment.

By the way, I should mention that the suncreen I have been using while on maintenance is Chanel UV Essentiel 50+++. It has 18% zinc oxide and has a really cosmetically elegant finish- although it does seem to leave a bit of white cast if using the proper amount (1/4 tsp.)

I do feel like it is inevitable that sometime in the near future a more permanent and less controversial solution for pigmentary disorders will surface. Skin lightening is a huge, and rapidly growing part of the skin care industry, and there seems to be a big focus on product development. *wishful thinking* The truth is that I am just so tired of fighting the pigment on my skin, and living life like some kind of vampire, dodging sunlight and hiding beneath big hats and layers of sunscreen every single day!

Thanks again for all your feedback. I find it really helpful.

Robyn

free skin care · Sun Mar 24, 2013 9:55 pm

blanchedubois wrote:

Hi Denise,

You will probably be annoyed by the Colorscience packaging as well. I find the powder dispensing brush totally useless, and wound up dumping the product into a generic powder sifter jar, and just apply with my favorite kabuki brush. When I reapply during the day, I just use my compact retractable kabuki with a handheld mirror. Not nearly as convenient, but I have yet to find a powder dispensing brush that really works well. That being said, I definitely recommend buying the refills w/o the brush. Better value, as I can almost guarantee you'll wind up ditching the brush.

I backed off with my tretinoin from .1% to .5%. I, like you, was just super tired of the whole redness/peeling. I did notice an improvement with the peeling, but I still feel like I have persistent redness, which really bothers me. I am beginning to wonder if it is actually tiny little broken blood capillaries that were either once masked by melasma or the result of using too many vigorous treatments prior to Obagi. I'm considering incorporating NIA24 Skin Strengthening Complex into my maintenance routine. A lot of people report a huge improvement in redness. I just placed an order for some, so I will report back Smile

Okay, for the past 3 months, this has been what I have been doing:

I have been using a gram of tretinoin every night, and combining it with a half gram of blender three times a week. Daily AM, I use Vivier 20% C serum, PTR De-Spot, and in the PM on nights when I'm not using blender, I use De-Spot again. I stopped using Clear altogether. Every two weeks I get a 40% lactic acid peel which may or may not be helping. This routine has been working at maintaining my results, but I *thought* I could see a resurgence in pigmentation, so I decided to do a 2 week full-program as of last Monday. I am right back to total redness and peeling. Following this 2 week treatment, I plan to return to my old schedule but alternate tretinoin with finacea (same thing as skinoren.)

Thank you so much for sending a link to that article. I was extremely surprised/confused to see that he also only recommends use of tretinoin for up to 5 months. That is completely new to me. You mentioned you have been in contact with Zo Medical regarding your melasma... have they suggested a protocol using Zo Medical products for melasma patients? I really wish it was more convenient for me to make a trip to one of his offices. I'm in Vancouver, and it's just not feasible at the moment.

By the way, I should mention that the suncreen I have been using while on maintenance is Chanel UV Essentiel 50+++. It has 18% zinc oxide and has a really cosmetically elegant finish- although it does seem to leave a bit of white cast if using the proper amount (1/4 tsp.)

I do feel like it is inevitable that sometime in the near future a more permanent and less controversial solution for pigmentary disorders will surface. Skin lightening is a huge, and rapidly growing part of the skin care industry, and there seems to be a big focus on product development. *wishful thinking* The truth is that I am just so tired of fighting the pigment on my skin, and living life like some kind of vampire, dodging sunlight and hiding beneath big hats and layers of sunscreen every single day!

Thanks again for all your feedback. I find it really helpful.

Robyn

Hi Robyn,

You and I are definitely in the same mode and mood, cracked me up, my fellow vampire! I had the NIA 24 Intensive Recovery Complex (heard this is stronger than the SSC) on my list to buy but then got the DDF Advanced Firming Cream instead as it has niacinamide as a main ingredient like the NIA 24. NIA 24 has better anti inflammatory ingredients but the DDF is actually very good for firming - the first cream I ever used and saw a difference after application in terms of firming. Please let us know how you like the NIA 24 as I may switch over after the DDF is finished. Yeah, I am going to just go for the Colorscience refill – higher SPF and may as well just use this new portable powder brush I bought that you can fill with any powder.

On that link, Dr. Obagi states, "We’ve also recently learned that there are some circumstances when tretinoin should not be used...the skin may make use of only a portion of the tretinoin that is applied; the unused portion may, itself, cause irritation and inflammation. For that reason, patients should only use tretinoin for three to five months. After that, I advise patients to switch to retinol in proper formulation and concentration for maintenance and prevention"

I have searched all over the web trying to find out what he means by "some circumstances" or if ALL patients should cease tretinoin after five months max. I used retinol for a few years before tretinoin and never had significant results like being on tretinoin. Perhaps ZO Medical has found a way to make retinol as effective as tretinoin without the irritation so this is a good reason to try the line. I have been using the Ommerse Day & Night creams with the same idea of more frequent retinol exposure but I don’t see any difference at all except they do not moisturize well.

However I am only in California every few months and there is no way to get ZO Medical products online. The company did not detail a protocol and only said I am a good candidate to transition fully from Nu Derm as they consider the quick return of melasma as being bounce-back melasma so that Nu Derm is no longer effective. They said I have to consult with a doctor if want to use ZO Medical.

Because I can't get ZO Medical yet and am a little fed up with almost a year of being red and peeling, I am considering going off Obagi and trying the SKII Whitening Spots Specialist regimen. I just started using the SKII Essence and it is amazing for hydration and definitely keeps the peelies at bay during the daytime.

My neck was so red on 0.1% so I switched to 0.05%. I am trying to stick with the 0.1% on the face because read on several derm websites where they always try to get patients to that strength permanently. I can’t believe you are not using Clear, that PTR De Spot must be working! I was thinking of increasing Clear to 4 x week AM & PM and see if it helps (and to test if I really have HQ resistant melasma or just underuse of product) – besides I have another backup of Clear & Blender anyway. Getting back to the strength of tretinoin, I also read that patients sometime need to go lower because they were diluting it with Blender while on Nu Derm. Now if using tretinoin alone, then it is much stronger and irritating (and perhaps melasma is returning as a result of over-irritation is my thought).

Think the Skinoren is the reason I am particularly red this month, hate to admit it. This week I am going off it for a week and see if I can get back to a normal color. I do think it is effective against hyperpigmentation but just can’t stand being beet red anymore when getting the least bit hot. Will keep you updated.

Thanks for all your valuable input and sharing your experiences and product usage – I really appreciate it!

-Denise

free skin care · Fri May 10, 2013 1:11 pm

hmmmmm~~~ Useful information. I might switch to Zo products. But it has HQ too. HQ is the reason I want to get away from Nuderm since HQ is harmful for longterm users

free skin care · Sat May 10, 2014 4:07 am

Now in my 40's, I find that I'm getting spots from being in the sun during my childhood.

I will consider this line. I watched a couple of videos on his take on how the skin works and it does make sense. Dr. Obagi & Dr. Brown who originally started ReVive have somewhat similar theories and both stepped down with their original company after it went public and shareholders wanted more money from their investment.

I'm convinced that Dr. Obagi created something better with his new line. I want to give this a try in 2 or 3 months when I finished up with what I already have.

free skin care · Fri Jul 08, 2016 3:14 pm

Anyone is still using the ZO skin care line?

What are your favs?)

free skin care · Fri Jul 08, 2016 7:15 pm

RussianSunshine wrote:

Anyone is still using the ZO skin care line?

What are your favs?)

Hi!
I am still using it with no regrets. I think everybody will have their own favs depending on their skin issues/type.

Since I have cut back drastically from moisturizing, I noticed my skin look a lot firmer and the retinol is doing a better job.

The sun protections they offer is really good but very expensive if you reapply every hour or two.

Mon Jul 11, 2016 2:00 pm

I used Obagi Nu Derm back in 2008 with great results. However, with a trip to Africa my Melasma is back with a vengeance. My Derm gave me a script for HQ and Tretinoin, but i feel it's not working. I'm tempted to go back to Obagi for another round, but my Derm seems to push the ZO line and no longer the Nu Derm. It's all so overwhelming to me.

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