Retin A's effect on fine lines?
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free skin care · Tue May 30, 2006 7:40 am

Can anyone talk about whether they've seen definite results with Retin A as far as reducing/improving the appearance of fine lines?

The most noticeable effect I get from Retin A is an improvement in skin texture overall. I would never complain about that, I think it's great, but I've never seen much effect on fine lines (and mine aren't even that bad).

free skin care · Tue May 30, 2006 6:31 pm

I have definitely seen a difference lately in my fine lines.
I have increased my fluid intake by double, and I've been using retinol 3x per week, and these changes have helped immensely--they are really unnoticeable now.

Please try drinking lots of water, I think this is key.

I'm only using retinol (PSF) and I notice a difference, so it must be the combo.

Hope that helps!
avalange

free skin care · Tue May 30, 2006 11:42 pm

What % retinol do you use avalange? Is it over the counter? Is it just a serum of pure retinol or something? I've seen it as an ingredient in many things along with many other ingredients but not on it's own like C serums. Is it synthetic?

free skin care · Tue May 30, 2006 11:58 pm

BYRG wrote:

What % retinol do you use avalange? Is it over the counter? Is it just a serum of pure retinol or something? I've seen it as an ingredient in many things along with many other ingredients but not on it's own like C serums. Is it synthetic?

PBI: I believe avalange posted that she uses PSF retinol product. You can check it out on EDS.

free skin care · Wed May 31, 2006 5:29 am

I've been using Tazorac for over a year for adult acne. I also spot treat my one remaining line and it is likely helping somewhat. The line now is only 1/2" long and it used to go from my nose down along the side of my mouth. I do use many other products though so who knows. PSF retinol is a good product you need to experiment to find the reinoid product that is best for you but do try because it is one product with plenty of good research. Like glycolics the only downside is that some people show sensitivity at too high doses and this can be counter-productive. This does not mean you should be cautious of retinoids just that you should find a dose and product that works for your personal skin and no not continue to use something that gives you problems.

free skin care · Wed May 31, 2006 8:13 am

Hi,

I do use PSF retinol night cream 0.05%, it is the only retinol I have ever put on my face.

Of course, different things work for different people, though--I heard Skinceuticals is also a good one.

--avalange

Wed May 31, 2006 7:29 pm

Janis,

I saw an impressive improvement in my fine lines in only one month of retin A, however the rest of my face couldn't tolerate it. It's funny really, because my eye area wasn't sensitive at all. I looked like the inverse of a raccoon, red face, white eyes!

Now having said that, it has done nothing for my expression lines. I am a happy person by nature, I smile a lot and laugh heartily. And it is beginning to show up around my eyes. My lines are no longer noticeable when I am expressionless, but when I laugh, there they are. It makes me a little self conscious, but I laugh anyway. Oh well, there's always Botox!

free skin care · Tue Sep 19, 2006 6:29 am

I wanted to revive this thread and get some more opinions on the topic.

I've been using Retin A now for about nine months, and I am finding it hard to swallow that doctors would actually prescribe this for fine line improvement. I've been using it very consistently and have seen only negligible improvement on fine lines -- if any.

Like I said, I am happy with Retin A's effects on acne and overall skin tone, but the anti-aging results leave something to be desired.

I'm just wondering, do you all find yourselves having the same lack of noticeable results with Retin A? Was I expecting too much? Is Renova a better anti-aging product? Etc. Would love to hear opinions!

free skin care · Tue Sep 19, 2006 7:00 am

Hi Janis
I used Retin A for over a year and I saw some improvement, but it didn't *eliminate* any lines. If it had I'd probably still be using it now. My skin was definitely plumper and firmer especially in problem areas like around my eyes, which looked better quite quickly, but then improvements plateaued out after 3 months or so.

free skin care · Tue Sep 19, 2006 7:23 am

Hi Janis - I've tried both Retin-A and Renova and found very little difference between the two. Renova is touted as being gentler because it's more emollient. I share your experience that prescription retinoids didn't eliminate or even improve lines, but they apparently work for some people.

My skin only benefits from weaker retinoids, used sparingly. But if acne is an issue, weaker ones may not be potent enough to keep it in check.

free skin care · Tue Sep 19, 2006 7:48 am

Oh, I'm definitely sticking with Retin A -- it's the only thing that's ever eliminated my acne, and it makes my skin feel nice and soft -- but I just think it would be unwise for a doctor to tout this as a treatment for fine lines/wrinkles.

I know it got a lot of press back in the day when its anti-aging properties were discovered, but honestly, I can't see the hype. Yet, still, some verifiable scientific evidence must have backed up this hype, so why aren't we seeing results?

free skin care · Tue Sep 19, 2006 7:55 am

I think this often happens with skin improvements that are measured scientifically. You can get some nice skin sections which show definite structural improvements, but it shows very little in reality or on the surface.

So when a lot of products are touted as anti-aging it's quite often not hype, but the improvements are not very visible.

Take those Immuderm (or whatever it's called) skin tablets - they do have those kind of sections showing dramatic improvements, yet almost no-one continues taking them because they can't see it in action.

free skin care · Tue Sep 19, 2006 9:51 am

Also, prescription retinoids have shown in tests to correct some photoaging and pre-cancerous conditions on a cellular level, so some physicians believe this makes them beneficial. But of course the qualifier is that effective and fastidious sun protection is also part of the regimen.

Janis, it could just be that the most dramatic improvements are experienced by those with the most skin damage to begin with. Maybe your age and the fact that you don't have extensive skin issues is the reason you haven't noticed much diminishment of your fine lines.

I found glycolic acid products to help me more with fine lines when I was in my late 30s. Maybe you should try this or some other type of AHA and see what happens.

free skin care · Tue Sep 19, 2006 9:59 am

i was in the same boat ... using Retin-a for my acne and early signs of aging. I had fine lines, acne, acne scars, blackheads, rough, broken out skin. Retin-a got much of my acne under control and improved skin appearance but didn't do anything big to my fine lines and depressed acne scars. I got much better results out of at-home microdermarbasion treatments - Epidermx and then apply camellia oil, and also glycolic peels. My skin has had a 100% turnaround.

free skin care · Tue Sep 19, 2006 10:13 am

Quote:

Janis, it could just be that the most dramatic improvements are experienced by those with the most skin damage to begin with. Maybe your age and the fact that you don't have extensive skin issues is the reason you haven't noticed much diminishment of your fine lines.

M. April, I do see your point... but I guess I wonder the opposite: if my fine lines aren't that advanced yet and Retin-A has had no effect on them, how could someone with deeper or more advanced lines possibly expect to see any effect?

Quote:

My skin has had a 100% turnaround.

Hendricks, have you even seen a turnaround on the aging/lines side of things?

free skin care · Tue Sep 19, 2006 10:36 am

yep my fine lines are really teeny tiny now, i can only see traces of them when i look them real close in the mirror.

free skin care · Tue Sep 19, 2006 10:51 am

And Hendricks, you've achieved that through this routine?:

Quote:

I got much better results out of at-home microdermarbasion treatments - Epidermx and then apply camellia oil, and also glycolic peels. My skin has had a 100% turnaround.

Can I ask how often you're doing the microdermabrasion and glycolics? And do you use these in conjunction with Retin A?

free skin care · Tue Sep 19, 2006 11:12 am

As I've said before the only thing that really noticably got rid of fine lines for me were acid peels (primarily glycolic but with lactic and citric also).

free skin care · Tue Sep 19, 2006 11:36 am

sharky wrote:

As I've said before the only thing that really noticably got rid of fine lines for me were acid peels (primarily glycolic but with lactic and citric also).

How often do you all use acid peels?

Once I started using Retin A regularly, I cut down on my glycolic usage a lot. I'll use a glycolic product once every 2 wks or so, on a night when I'm not using Retin A.

A steady schedule of Retin A/acids seems like overkill -- I feel like the two in combination with each other is just too much.

free skin care · Tue Sep 19, 2006 11:44 am

I can't say for sure but I know my skin looks so much better because of Retin-A. Specifically the fine lines? I just can't say. I feel it has been better for plumping/thickening my skin overall so it looks more pliant/elastic - plumper in a younger-looking way. For me, the teeny, tiny lines I see are usually from dryness/dehydration. More omega-3 oil, topical C/rosehip oil and lots of water internally seem to make these fade away.

I'd have to say that Retin=A has beaten back sagginess but peels like papaya enzyme, lactic/glycolic do more for surface appearance.

free skin care · Tue Sep 19, 2006 12:24 pm

Janis wrote:

And Hendricks, you've achieved that through this routine?:

Quote:

I got much better results out of at-home microdermarbasion treatments - Epidermx and then apply camellia oil, and also glycolic peels. My skin has had a 100% turnaround.

Can I ask how often you're doing the microdermabrasion and glycolics? And do you use these in conjunction with Retin A?

yep thats the routine. I stopped using Retin-A since starting the routine. I do microdermabrasion 2x a week, glycolics once a week, sometimes once 10 - 14 days, and the oil everyday. I had oily skin as long as i could remember and nothing i had used had helped much but this routine has normalized my skin.

free skin care · Tue Sep 19, 2006 1:02 pm

My dad got adult acne in the 70's & started using Retin A. Now he's 70 & has no wrinkles. His doctor wouldn't believe him that he was over 50. My dad has also kept out of the sun (we're very fair-skinned and burn easily.) i do think his using the Retin A made a big difference.

free skin care · Tue Sep 19, 2006 4:58 pm

I'm 51 and have almost no lines now. It took several years. I use a low dose 12.5%-15% glycolic nearly every day. Every week or two I spot treat very small areas with 35% or higher glycolic sometimes mixed with other acids. This peels the spots and over time the lines have filled in. I only have one line that does not fill in with hydration and that is getting better (about 1/2" long.

I also use Tazorac every day on most of my face with spot treating twicw a day in some areas. This was mostly for adult acne but may have helped with other things.

I use PSF O2 serums and CPs tp heal areas I peel and also supplement creams with green tea,
EGF and Matrixyl. I call it a peel and heal routine.

Good luck.

free skin care · Tue Sep 19, 2006 5:35 pm

Janis wrote:

M. April, I do see your point... but I guess I wonder the opposite: if my fine lines aren't that advanced yet and Retin-A has had no effect on them, how could someone with deeper or more advanced lines possibly expect to see any effect?

Janis,

What strength of retin-a are you using? Maybe you need to use a stronger one?

Have you seen this picture on MUA?

http://www.makeupalley.com/account/pics.asp?id=215619&picture=487173

It seemed that retinoid has worked very well for her forehead wrinkles.

free skin care · Tue Sep 19, 2006 6:33 pm

I was told by a nurse that you have to use RA for 1 year or longer for it to have an effect on lines/wrinkles. She also believes you must use other products in conjunction with the RA (AHA's, sunscreen, etc).

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