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Sat May 31, 2008 4:32 pm  |
| rileygirl wrote: |
Well, I just did my first roll tonight with the .5 mm. I did not use anything to numb the area, as when I saw the needles, they didn't look like anything to me! I may not have pressed very hard, as it is hard to know what pressure to use. I am a little red and a tad itchy feeling, but otherwise just fine. I am ready to get the 1 mm already for my lip lines!  |
You go, girl!
I am really starting to wonder if it is just me from a pain standpoint. I'll be interested to hear what you say about the 1.0mm!
Have you considered just going for the 1.5mm? |
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Sat May 31, 2008 4:46 pm |
I forgot to mention that I asked the Dr. Roller guy if he could get me one of the 3-line rollers in 1.0mm...he said that he would look into ordering some.
Hopefully that would help around the eyes a bit.
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Sat May 31, 2008 4:50 pm |
Bethany, I don't think it is just you regarding the pain factor. I have been using the leaf and rusher one for quite a while, just was not too regular with it, but I did press hard with that. Maybe I built up a little bit of tolerance? Also, I did not press excessively hard with the .5.
I don't think I would be ready for the 1.5 just yet! I am not sure, though.  |
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Sat May 31, 2008 4:56 pm |
| rileygirl wrote: |
Bethany, I don't think it is just you regarding the pain factor. I have been using the leaf and rusher one for quite a while, just was not too regular with it, but I did press hard with that. Maybe I built up a little bit of tolerance? Also, I did not press excessively hard with the .5.
I don't think I would be ready for the 1.5 just yet! I am not sure, though. |
Scally said that the pain lessens over time, so maybe you are right about using the L&R roller. |
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No longer answering PM's due to numerous weird messages. |
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Sat May 31, 2008 6:16 pm |
Hi,
As I said in my previous post/s I have ordered a 1.5mm derma roller from dermarollers .com (Nova Clinic).
But I just came across this site: derma-rollers .com It looks like they are situated in the UK, so I now wish I had seen this site before I ordered from the Australian one!
Has anyone ordered a derma roller from derma-rollers .com? Are they the same kind as the ones from nova clinic?
Edit: I have just noticed that there isn't an option to buy different sizes on there? It just gives you the option to order 1 Unit (Lasts approximately 3 months each) @ £55 (GBP), 2 Units (Lasts approximately 3 months each) @ £99 (GBP), 3 Units (Lasts approximately 3 months each) @ £139 (GBP).
I also can't find the site saying anywhere what size the derma roller needles will be? |
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Sat May 31, 2008 6:17 pm |
i was looking up the tretinol stuff that i read in the last post & i found this, sounds really interesting, i cant understand all the doctor terms but if you scroll down it gets easier lol
w w w. nature. com/jid/ journal/v128/n1/full/ 5700968a.html
Effects of Topically Applied Acitretin in Reconstructed Human Epidermis and the Rhino Mouse
oh and on female first we are talking a lot about Acell, its supposed to have awesome healing capabilities, so far its only sold by vets for animal use,but it is fda approved for humans & they say human products will be available late 2008
w w w .Acell. com
Bethany- thank you so much for posting that stuff for me, i posted some questions on female first & sometimes i think im invisible cause no one responds |
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FloridaUSA
New Member
 
Joined: 27 May 2008
Posts: 8
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Sat May 31, 2008 6:24 pm |
Tonight before I rolled my arms and hands with the 1.0 (still waiting for my 1.5 to arrive from Australia), I was prepared - I had my lidocaine (5%) and this topical OTC stuff called Corticool for itching with 1% hydrocortisone, its supposed to work fast (but I suppose there are many brands that will work as well).
The lidocaine didnt work so well (maybe that stuff from india will work better!) but the Corticool is working GREAT for the itching and swelling! I have to keep applying every once in a while in certain spots but I am basically itch-free, plus I dont have any swelling like I did last time.
I did wait 30 minutes before applying the Corticool so that the wounds had some time to close up a bit. I used cool water for the first 30 minutes to control the itching.
I think I may try this on my thighs and maybe my jowls and upper lip tonight. Just the success of controlling the itching makes such a difference, Im motivated to continue with other areas!! |
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Sat May 31, 2008 7:08 pm |
| bethany wrote: |
I forgot to mention that I asked the Dr. Roller guy if he could get me one of the 3-line rollers in 1.0mm...he said that he would look into ordering some.
Hopefully that would help around the eyes a bit.
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Bethany, can you let me know if you find out any more about this...as I am targeting my eyes a bit more now. Although I have to say that I am getting better and better at doing them with the big one.
If only they would make a bigger roller for body areas.
cheers
rebecca |
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47 years old. Battling aging and pigmentation. Using Tria and Pico and Dermapen. |
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Sat May 31, 2008 7:33 pm |
| snowqueen67 wrote: |
If only they would make a bigger roller for body areas.
cheers
rebecca |
There used to be a roller that was specifically made for the body. It was shaped like a computer mouse and the roller was bigger. I think it was sold by the original Dermaroller people. It's a little confusing with the name now - there appears to be a Dermaroller and Dermarollers - the Dermarollers being the ones from the Nova Clinic - not very good marketing. Anyway, I'm sorry I can't be more helpful - but I know there's a link somewhere on this thread. |
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Sat May 31, 2008 8:14 pm |
| snowqueen67 wrote: |
| bethany wrote: |
I forgot to mention that I asked the Dr. Roller guy if he could get me one of the 3-line rollers in 1.0mm...he said that he would look into ordering some.
Hopefully that would help around the eyes a bit.
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Bethany, can you let me know if you find out any more about this...as I am targeting my eyes a bit more now. Although I have to say that I am getting better and better at doing them with the big one.
If only they would make a bigger roller for body areas.
cheers
rebecca |
Rebecca, I'll let you know when I hear back from him. I do know that they come in 1.0mm, 1.5mm, and 2.0mm.
I thought the Clearskincare narrow model actually looks better because the entire unit is smaller, but the needles look like they only come in .3 and .75mm. (link below) (Plus I figured Jack would be cheaper)
http://cgi.ebay.com/Acne-scar-burn-surgical-stretch-mark-derma-skin-roller_W0QQitemZ140236814993QQihZ004QQcategoryZ29618QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1713.m153.l1262 |
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Sat May 31, 2008 8:15 pm |
Thanks Keliu...looks interesting...can't see how long the needles are...they look small??? I want it for pigmentation, so I think I need at least 1.5mm.
rebecca |
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47 years old. Battling aging and pigmentation. Using Tria and Pico and Dermapen. |
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Sat May 31, 2008 8:23 pm |
| FloridaUSA wrote: |
| The lidocaine didnt work so well (maybe that stuff from india will work better!) but the Corticool is working GREAT for the itching and swelling! I have to keep applying every once in a while in certain spots but I am basically itch-free, plus I dont have any swelling like I did last time. |
Very interesting! The swelling is definitely an issue for me, and I am sure the itching would drive one crazy.
I do remember Dr. Pickart saying that cortisone inhibits something within skin, but I can't remember what it was...if I find it, I'll post it here. |
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No longer answering PM's due to numerous weird messages. |
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Sat May 31, 2008 8:45 pm |
| ace243 wrote: |
i was looking up the tretinol stuff that i read in the last post & i found this, sounds really interesting, i cant understand all the doctor terms but if you scroll down it gets easier lol
w w w. nature. com/jid/ journal/v128/n1/full/ 5700968a.html
Effects of Topically Applied Acitretin in Reconstructed Human Epidermis and the Rhino Mouse
oh and on female first we are talking a lot about Acell, its supposed to have awesome healing capabilities, so far its only sold by vets for animal use,but it is fda approved for humans & they say human products will be available late 2008
w w w .Acell. com
Bethany- thank you so much for posting that stuff for me, i posted some questions on female first & sometimes i think im invisible cause no one responds |
You are very welcome. 
The Acitretin looks promising...
| Quote: |
Effects of Topically Applied Acitretin in Reconstructed Human Epidermis and the Rhino Mouse
The main objective of this study was to investigate the potential of acitretin as a topical therapy. Therefore, acitretin activity was benchmarked against commercially available, clinically proven, topical retinoid products. Where possible, direct comparisons between acitretin and other retinoids were made using the same vehicle.
In the RHE model, the acitretin solution appears to be less irritating than the two commercially available products tested (tretinoin and tazarotene creams), suggesting that a topical acitretin product, in a non-irritating vehicle, may strike a more optimal balance between efficacy and irritation in treating disorders of keratinization, while minimizing the risk of systemic adverse effects.
http://www.nature.com/jid/journal/v128/n1/full/5700968a.html |
Regarding the Acell...it sounds like they are using this for reconstructive efforts right now, but is not something I would dare use on my face yet.  I think I will stick with the copper peptides for wound healing at the moment, until we hear more about this. But you never know...it could very show up in some future skincare products!
| Quote: |
ACell’s UBM is the next generation of ECM technology due to its unique characteristics featuring a basement membrane surface which is ideal for epithelial cell growth in many applications.
Naturally derived, non-crosslinked ECMs, like UBM, are unique among scaffold technologies which fundamentally change healing by triggering abundant new blood vessel formation and recruitment of numerous cell types to the wound site. These cells, including progenitor cells, have the potential to differentiate into numerous types of site specific tissues. During the healing process, the scaffold is rapidly degraded and completely resorbed leaving new tissue where scar tissue would normally be expected. ACell technology is not limited to one market segment (e.g., wound care), but instead can serve as a core technology for treatments across a broad range of human medical conditions.
Core technology for regenerative medicine.
ACell technology is strongly centered on the scaffold based approach to regenerative medicine. UBM is a graft material that can be implanted at the site of an injury or damaged has the ability to attract tissue in order to stimulate a unique healing response. UBM the body’s own progenitor cells to the site of the injury and serve as a scaffold for these cells. The progenitor cells attracted to the UBM scaffold have the ability to differentiate into site specific tissues such as muscle, skin, tendon or bone. Consequently, instead of the body’s default healing mechanism of scar tissue formation, the body heals by remodeling with new tissue that resembles the original tissue in both structure and function. ACell core technology can be developed into a broad range medical applications such as gastroenterology, orthopaedics, cardiovascular and neurological surgery in addition to our current focus in the areas of wound care, reconstructive surgery, urogynecology and general surgery.
Five FDA 510(k) Clearances for Multiple Clinical Applications. ACell has five 510(k) premarket notifications for multiple product configurations (sheet, multi-laminate and powder) in wound care and general surgical applications.
http://www.acell.com/med.php |
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Sat May 31, 2008 8:55 pm |
| snowqueen67 wrote: |
Thanks Keliu...looks interesting...can't see how long the needles are...they look small??? I want it for pigmentation, so I think I need at least 1.5mm.
rebecca |
Rebecca,
I am pretty sure that the Beauty Mouse is made up of 3 of the HomeCare dermarollers, which use .13mm needles. |
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Sat May 31, 2008 9:11 pm |
| bethany wrote: |
| FloridaUSA wrote: |
| The lidocaine didnt work so well (maybe that stuff from india will work better!) but the Corticool is working GREAT for the itching and swelling! I have to keep applying every once in a while in certain spots but I am basically itch-free, plus I dont have any swelling like I did last time. |
Very interesting! The swelling is definitely an issue for me, and I am sure the itching would drive one crazy.
I do remember Dr. Pickart saying that cortisone inhibits something within skin, but I can't remember what it was...if I find it, I'll post it here. |
Ok, I found it...
These quotes are from Dr. Pickart, the guy who invented copper peptides...
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Sun Jun 01, 2008 5:14 am |
Well I am an official roller girl. Yesterday was my first roll with my 5 mm. Not a problem at all with my face. My chest was one bumpy lobster when I was finished with the rolling and the products.
Thanks to Bethany for all her help............ |
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Sun Jun 01, 2008 5:44 am |
"I have to correct myself. My Dermarollers arrived from Australia today, "
Hello Septembergirl,
Did Nova email you order and/or shipping confirmation?
I ordered two rollers on May 21st and haven't heard anything from them, not even an order confirmation. The only thing I have is the payment confirmation from Paypal
Thank you |
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FloridaUSA
New Member
Joined: 27 May 2008
Posts: 8
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Sun Jun 01, 2008 5:47 am |
Well bummer, it looks like the hydrocortisone that helps with the itching may actually be INHIBITING what Im trying to do in the first place, which is repair and rebuild new tissue (thanks for the posts above). Any other suggestions what can help with the itching and swelling? Its so bad it keeps me from rolling!
Also, has anyone had the experience where they itched and swelled the first few times and then their skin stopped doing that? I might be able to tolerate it a few times if I know its going to stop. |
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FloridaUSA
New Member
Joined: 27 May 2008
Posts: 8
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Sun Jun 01, 2008 8:22 am |
| I called my pharmacist friend and since I dont want to use the topical cortison, he said try Clariton (or generic) non-drowsy 3-4 hours before I roll. Just went to the drugstore and got some and took one, will let you know if it helps because its itching again (does for a few days after rolling) |
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Sun Jun 01, 2008 8:34 am |
| platinumrose wrote: |
Well I am an official roller girl. Yesterday was my first roll with my 5 mm. Not a problem at all with my face. My chest was one bumpy lobster when I was finished with the rolling and the products.
Thanks to Bethany for all her help............ |
Platinum, hopefully the bumps will go away quickly! What products did you use after your roll?
BTW, it took 3 days after my neck/chest roll for it took return to the usual color!  Today is the first day that it looks normal...too bad that my face is still a giant puff blob!!  |
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Sun Jun 01, 2008 9:40 am |
| Cini wrote: |
"I have to correct myself. My Dermarollers arrived from Australia today, "
Hello Septembergirl,
Did Nova email you order and/or shipping confirmation?
I ordered two rollers on May 21st and haven't heard anything from them, not even an order confirmation. The only thing I have is the payment confirmation from Paypal
Thank you |
Hi, Cini.
Just checked my inbox and found that I ordered the rollers and got the Pay Pal-confirmation on May 22. The next day I got a quick note from Nova Clinic that my payment had been received, and the parcel was in the mail the same day. They told me to expect two weeks delivery time, but the package arrived after one week. Maybe you should email the clinic... |
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Female, 40, Norway. Normal/dry skin, starting to see signs of aging. Staples: Glycolic acid cleanser, SkinCeuticals Phloretin CF, Revaleskin, NIA24. |
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Sun Jun 01, 2008 10:39 am |
| Septembergirl wrote: |
| Cini wrote: |
"I have to correct myself. My Dermarollers arrived from Australia today, "
Hello Septembergirl,
Did Nova email you order and/or shipping confirmation?
I ordered two rollers on May 21st and haven't heard anything from them, not even an order confirmation. The only thing I have is the payment confirmation from Paypal
Thank you |
Hi, Cini.
Just checked my inbox and found that I ordered the rollers and got the Pay Pal-confirmation on May 22. The next day I got a quick note from Nova Clinic that my payment had been received, and the parcel was in the mail the same day. They told me to expect two weeks delivery time, but the package arrived after one week. Maybe you should email the clinic... |
I too ordered my dermaroller from the nova clinic website. I ordered it early morning on Friday 30th May, I got my payment confirmation from PayPal instantly, which is normal. Then about 4 hours later I received an email from Nova Clinic letting me know that they had received my payment and that my parcel was posted out that day.
I agree, you should contact them just to see what's happening. |
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Sun Jun 01, 2008 11:41 am |
For those who like to read up on dermarolling, here is the the product guide for MTS rollers...it contains some interesting facts, as well as some info on topicals that the sell to accompany the rollers.
Here is one of the factoids, though I couldn't find the needle length for this:
| Quote: |
Clinical studies from Europe, U.S. and South Korea have proven that serum absorption is increased by as much as 1,000 times when applied with MTS Roller(1). Clinical
studies have also shown that treatment with MTS Roller is more consistent in increasing the thickness of the skin than IPL and other resurfacing treatments(2).
http://www.zotyscorp.com/dermaroller.pdf |
Her is another website with some pictures I have not seen before...note the big change in forehead wrinkles after 1 week and 4 weeks!
Also note how VERY abraded the areas look right after the treatments!
http://www.microneedle.com/main/examples.html |
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Sun Jun 01, 2008 11:52 am |
This next one has recommended protocols for using the MTS Roller...the domain expired so I am including the info from the cached page here. (I also included the needle lengths for the various models mentioned)
MTS-Roller Model: CR2 (0.2mm)
MTS-Roller Model: CR3 (0.3mm)
MTS-Roller Model: CR10 (1mm)
MTS-Roller Model: CR20 (2mm)
| Quote: |
PROTOCOLS For MTS Roller™
MEDICAL and PERSONAL USE
Summary
The common goal of most skin treatment modalities is the reduction of wrinkles and scars and depressions of the skin. MTS Roller™ is a low-cost/high results skin treatment alternative for ablatives like laser resurfacing, derma/microbrasion, and chemical peeling.
Description
MTS Roller™ uses 200 very fine needles to pierce the epidermis thereby stimulating collagen formation. The resulting ‘micro-channel effect’ also helps to infuse vitamin creams, serums, and other topical applications thereby increasing their effectiveness.
The recommended program: once a month for a total of six months using a wash, one treatment roller (MTS Roller model CR5 and up), a topical anesthetic (e.g., benzocaine, lidocaine, tetracaine, pramoxine HCI), two topical esthetics (e.g., peptide, retinol, collagen), a soothing mask, moisturizer, sun block (SPF 30). Clinicians may also use MTS Roller model CR2 for application of the anesthetic. Other treatment options include ultrasound, Ionto, topical skin nutrients, with follow up treatment of microdermabrasion to help smooth the surface and enhance treatment program.
CLINICAL CARE PROTOCOL
Average MTS Roller application will take approximately 20-30 minutes.
Step 1) Cleaning
Thoroughly cleanse the application area.
Step 2) Apply Anesthetic
Apply local anesthetic as needed – recommended for CR5, CR10, CR20, and CR30. You may use a CR2 to deepen and quicken penetration of anesthetic. Cleanse treated area with a sponge after checking anesthesia. CRL suggests a topical anesthetic that contains benzocaine (20%), lidocaine (4%), teracaine (2%), pramoxine HCI (1%).
Step 3) Apply Solution #1
Clinical studies by Dr. B.J. Kim show that ‘double’ applications increases efficacy of the treatment modality. Apply a sufficient amount of Solution #1 per protocol directly to the treatment area.
Step 4) Treatment Roller
Divide the treatment area(s) into sub-divisions per illustration. Apply the treatment roller (CR5, CR10, CR20 and/or CR30) with the same amount of pressure on the skin throughout. Roll the same areas vertically and horizontally. Prevent lateral (sideways) movement while rolling, do not over apply pressure.
Step 5) Apply Solution #2
Apply Solution #2 liberally to the treated area. You may also apply ultrasound or Ionto to the treated areas to aid serum absorption.
Step 6) Relaxation
Apply a mask pack or other soothing application for relaxation.
Step 7) Completion
Nutrition and moisturizing management is recommended. Preventative sun-screens are also indicated.
PERSONAL CARE PROTOCOL
For greater and faster efficacy, it is recommended that the patient be prescribed a personal use MTS Roller™ (models CR2 or CR3) with topical applications such as a vitamin solution and moisturizer with sun block properties. Take a moment to instruct your patient on the proper use of their personal use roller. Personal treatment time can range from 5 to 10 minutes depending on the size of the area to be treated. The patient may repeat treatment two to three times a week. Advise the patient to stop and call you if they experience sudden and prolonged irritation in the treatment area.
Step 1) Cleansing
Clean skin, rinse thoroughly and towel dry.
Step 2) First Application
Apply first topical solution to the treatment area.
Step 3) Treatment Roller
Divide the treatment area(s) into sub-divisions, for instance the forehead, nose, cheeks, mouth area, and neck area. Apply the treatment roller with the same amount of pressure on the skin throughout. Roll the same areas vertically and horizontally.
Step 4) Second application
Massage in the second application (moisturizer or other topical).
Step 5) Finish
Allow a few minutes for the applications to be absorbed to firm and tone your skin.
Step 6) Clean Roller
Clean roller per instructions and return roller to protective case.
Cleaning the MTS Roller™
PERSONAL USE MODELS CR2, CR3: You may use denture tablets (in water) to clean the MTS Roller™. Denture tables are enzyme cleansers and enzymes take off fat as well as reduce bacteria. While not as effective, you may also use alcohol (isopropyl). Consult a pharmacist for the best advice for a sterilization solution. Open the cleaning tray and place the white cleaning pad in the larger half of the tray. Fill the cleaning tray with sterilization solution and roll the roller into the pad with medium pressure. Leave the MTS Roller in the cleaning solution for about 15 to 30 minutes – ensure that the roller drum is constantly wet with the cleaning solution. After cleaning, rinse with tap water and return the roller to the protective case and allow it to air dry. Replace the case lid until the next use.
PROFESSIONAL USE MODELS CR5, CR10, CR20, and CR30: MTS Roller™ can withstand repeated immersion in “cold sterilization” agents such as germicides (phenol, ethyl alcohol) and Cidex™ (glutaraldehyde), and common ultra-sound cleaning devices. Rinse rollers thoroughly before using and return to its protective case after drying.
Storing MTS Roller™The MTS Roller is delivered in a protective case and sealed in a sterilized pouch. Tear open the pouch at the notch and discard. After each use (and cleaning) return the MTS Roller back to the protective case. NOTE: Always treat the MTS Roller gently and avoid any contact with hard objects or surfaces. Replace all rollers that have been dropped. Keep rollers out of the reach of children.
Important Reminders
Do not use MTS Roller™ on irritated skin, infected skin, fungal skin infections, active acne, rosacea, eczema, psoriasis, severe solar keratosis, raised moles and/or warts, and/or any open wounds or sores. Patients who are not sure about their skin condition should consult a dermatologist before using the MTS Roller™.
Clinical tests have not shown any side effects from using MTS Roller™ when used as directed under the advice or supervision of a trained skin care professional. Use serums, creams and/or any other cosmeceutical or herbal topical only with the advice or supervision of a trained skin care professional.
MTS Roller™ should be stored in the supplied protective plastic box for maximum hygiene and safety after use. The instrument must be kept out of reach of children.
Using MTS Roller™ with cosmetics/cosmeceuticals.MTS Roller™ is a skin care tool that partially and temporarily pierces the topmost protective layer of skin. We advise that patients/clients apply serums, creams or other ‘topicals’ only under the direction of a qualified skin care professional. The reason is simple. Most skin care topicals (cosmetics, cosmeceuticals) are designed to be harmless while they are on the surface of the skin, however the skin may react differently when such products are infiltrated through the epidermal barrier, such as what occurs with MTS Roller™. We recommend that patients/clients speak to a qualified skin care professional if there is any doubt about the ingredients in any products and whether they are suitable for infiltration.
Sensitivity and Redness when using MTS Roller™
Patients will experience mild sensitivity and redness after treatment; signs that the fine micro points have penetrated the epidermis. The perforated stratum corneum will close within minutes and the sensitivity should abate quickly. The general redness will disappear within one or two hours of treatment. Intensity and duration of any discomfort may increase if the MTS Roller is used in combination with skin care products (cosmetics, cosmeceuticals).
GUARANTEE: 100% Contaminant-Free
MTS Rollers are sterilized with gamma radiation and sealed in a hermetic pouch and are guaranteed to be 100% contaminate-free upon delivery.
http://209.85.215.104/search?q=cache:urOL1zqJtPYJ:dermroller.com/mts-protocols.html+protocols+for+mts+roller&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=us |
PROTOCOLS For MTS Roller™
MEDICAL and PERSONAL USE |
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