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CookieD
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Fri Sep 28, 2012 10:29 am      Reply with quote
I have to say some of these post about dermarolling are making me depressed. I have finally built up the courage to roll with a 1.5 roller and now I'm wondering whether I should bother. I also have an consultation appointment for a Dermapen with PRP with my dermatologist this Thursday. My face is in the best condition it has been in 2 years. The last thing I want to do is mess that up. Maybe I should just continue with the ReAura because I do think that makes a big difference.

Has anyone other then Bethany had good results from long term dermarolling with the bigger needles? If you have can you please chime in and let me know. I was going to do a roll this Sat. night but now I'm on the fence. Confused

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Fri Sep 28, 2012 10:33 am      Reply with quote
There's always going to be nay-sayers. Do your research, and if you choose to use any actives or do any procedures, give it time. People saying they have no results after a month, two months...

Give anything a year. If something doesn't work for you, please don't assume it is bogus and just doesn't work, or assume those who do have success are imagining it.

Dermarolling with needles of .5 or longer should not be done more frequently than once every 30 days. Longer needles once every 6 weeks.

It can take months for results.

Do all that, and if you don't have success, then at least you gave it a shot.

The same can be said for lasers. I have had several. I had fractional laser, body wide, 4 years ago. Seven sessions. I had very little improvement at all (but what I did have took many months before my skin tightened at all). Yet other people have had great success. I am not so short sighted to say the procecure doesn't work at for anyone! It just didn't work for me (and that was $8,000 and lots of pain down the toilet).

I read of people starting RA and saying they have no results in a month. Silly to expect it.

Patience!!
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Fri Sep 28, 2012 10:37 am      Reply with quote
Cookie my post not directed at you. I had not even seen your post. I was posting in general terms.

Personally I am sticking to my .5 and my 1.0, 6 weeks apart. I have done 5 weeks in the past, and I am moving it to 6.
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Fri Sep 28, 2012 11:04 am      Reply with quote
Cookie, I wanted to answer your question. I have already seen success with the rolling and it has only been 3 months. Not only that, I have used no actives. Now, I do use RA (have been for 26 years), and I use Vitamin C and CPs (only super GHK). I also use LA and SA lotions a couple of times a week. (peels here and there, but not since my DRing).

I have not used any of these actives with the rolling though. I have used nothing, and then 24 hours later I use the CPs. and then on to my normal schedule a couple days later.

My biggest successes so far is the severe lightening of age spots, and I know with a couple more rolls they will be gone. I have one now that has fragmented into four pieces, and is very light.

My most exciting success so far is that my upper arm skin that was so thin it was like tissue paper, has thickened up drastically. Not just a little, but drastic. I really started noticing at week 9, and I am at week 12 now and there is no doubt that skin is thickening up.

Also my forehead. I would normally be needing my botox Bad by now, as it has been 4 months. It usually lasts for me 3 months and then I make myself wait another month but I hate that month! Now I am almost at 4 months. Will be in less than a week. No need for botox at all. My skin is thicker, and when I scrunch and it will scrunch up, yes, but it goes back smooth, like younger skin does. (My ll lines I speak of). Now as the months go on we'll see, but for now I'm certainly not getting botox like I had originally scheduled for Tuesday! Smile

Some may say my results are too early, but I know my skin, I have been scrutinizing it in the mirror for 25 years. I know what has and has not worked for me. It is not micro swelling or inflammation at this point. I may be early for success, so another person may not have anything this early. But, so it is with me. We are all different. I have 100% confidence in rolling, if done right.

I am not doing product penetration rolls. One they were giving me too much inflammation I believe, and two, I want to know what is or what is not working. I don't want to start two separate procedures at the same time. The medical rolling is enough for now. That's why I use no actives with rolling. I don't want to later wonder if it is the actives or the rolling. I have continued to use my actives on other days like I always do.
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Fri Sep 28, 2012 3:45 pm      Reply with quote
CookieD wrote:
I have to say some of these post about dermarolling are making me depressed. I have finally built up the courage to roll with a 1.5 roller and now I'm wondering whether I should bother. I also have an consultation appointment for a Dermapen with PRP with my dermatologist this Thursday. My face is in the best condition it has been in 2 years. The last thing I want to do is mess that up. Maybe I should just continue with the ReAura because I do think that makes a big difference.

Has anyone other then Bethany had good results from long term dermarolling with the bigger needles? If you have can you please chime in and let me know. I was going to do a roll this Sat. night but now I'm on the fence. Confused


I'm not a "less is more" kind of person - but I am inclined to think that both dermarolling and the ReAura is overkill. IMO, the ReAura gives a similar treatment to needling. I've been dermarolling off and on for around five years - but now that I'm using the ReAura I'm giving it a rest. Both treatments work in a similar fashion (the dermaroller is just more primitive).

As for the effectiveness of dermarolling. Medically, it is a proven method for stimulating collagen - but results will always vary individually.

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bethany
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Fri Sep 28, 2012 3:59 pm      Reply with quote
CookieD wrote:
I have to say some of these post about dermarolling are making me depressed. I have finally built up the courage to roll with a 1.5 roller and now I'm wondering whether I should bother. I also have an consultation appointment for a Dermapen with PRP with my dermatologist this Thursday. My face is in the best condition it has been in 2 years. The last thing I want to do is mess that up. Maybe I should just continue with the ReAura because I do think that makes a big difference.

Has anyone other then Bethany had good results from long term dermarolling with the bigger needles? If you have can you please chime in and let me know. I was going to do a roll this Sat. night but now I'm on the fence. Confused



Cookie,if you are going for a consult next TH, I would not recommend rolling this weekend.

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CookieD
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Fri Sep 28, 2012 5:12 pm      Reply with quote
bethany wrote:
CookieD wrote:
I have to say some of these post about dermarolling are making me depressed. I have finally built up the courage to roll with a 1.5 roller and now I'm wondering whether I should bother. I also have an consultation appointment for a Dermapen with PRP with my dermatologist this Thursday. My face is in the best condition it has been in 2 years. The last thing I want to do is mess that up. Maybe I should just continue with the ReAura because I do think that makes a big difference.

Has anyone other then Bethany had good results from long term dermarolling with the bigger needles? If you have can you please chime in and let me know. I was going to do a roll this Sat. night but now I'm on the fence. Confused



Cookie,if you are going for a consult next TH, I would not recommend rolling this weekend.


Thanks Paige, Keliu and Bethany for your responses.

Bethany my dermatologist is usually booked out at least a month so I wouldn't do the Dermapen for 4 weeks if I did decide to go that route. The thing that really interest me there is the PRP part. I wouldn't consider it if it wasn't for that.

Keliu, I do really like the ReAura but there are some Doctors that think lasers are not as good as dermarolling so I thought I would do both (not at the same time of course) and cover both sides just in case.

Paige, thanks for the response about your dermarolling. Sounds like you are getting good results. I am not a patience person but I do understand and expect things to take a long time. (Unfortunately)

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Sat Sep 29, 2012 2:00 am      Reply with quote
PaigeD64 wrote:
Personally I am sticking to my .5 and my 1.0, 6 weeks apart. I have done 5 weeks in the past, and I am moving it to 6.


Hi Paige,

I am about to buy 0.2mm & 1.0mm and but not sure if I should order 0.5mm too.

How do you incorporate 0.5mm into 1.0mm rolling protocol?
bethany
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Sat Oct 06, 2012 5:28 pm      Reply with quote
I am giving the Emla a 2nd shot, and am now sitting here with Emla and pieces of freezer bags over my forehead, glabella, and under eye area.

Please cross your fingers and hope that I encounter fully numbed skin after 45 mins or so!! Very Happy

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Sat Oct 06, 2012 6:24 pm      Reply with quote
bethany wrote:
I am giving the Emla a 2nd shot, and am now sitting here with Emla and pieces of freezer bags over my forehead, glabella, and under eye area.

Please cross your fingers and hope that I encounter fully numbed skin after 45 mins or so!! Very Happy


The mini roll is over. The Emla with the plastic over it was definitely better than the Ink-Eeze, but still not as good as the custom compounded stuff my derm had given me. But since he moved to another state, I am going to stick with the Emla! However, next time I will apply it more thickly.

BTW, I ordered the Emla off Amazon believe it or not, and it shipped from the UK.

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Sat Oct 06, 2012 6:27 pm      Reply with quote
Glad everything went well bethany. When I use the Emla I feel nothing, just a bit of dread.
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Sat Oct 06, 2012 6:29 pm      Reply with quote
Congratulations, Bethany! What we do for vanity, huh? Hanging out for an hour with bits of freezer wrap stuck to the face, followed by poking thousands of holes in it with needles. A fun evening indeed!! Laughing

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Sat Oct 13, 2012 4:15 pm      Reply with quote
Hi roller girls!

I finally got the courage and just roller for the first time today (used a 1.5 mm owndoc roller). It hurt a fair bit and I heard some "popping" noises as I rolled over my forehead (I think that was needle piercing through my skin). I got red all over like a bad sunburn which faded in an hour or so. However, I didn't bleed...whenever I see it done on a TV show or educational youtube video people get pinpoint blood spots all over. Am I not pressing hard enough? I thought 1.5 mm would be long enough to cause a deeper roll. I'll need to numb myself up if I'm supposed to roll harder as I was pressing as much as I could tolerate. Should I be trying to bleed to get a good roll for collagen synthesis? TIA!

Eileen

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Sat Oct 13, 2012 7:52 pm      Reply with quote
bethany wrote:
bethany wrote:
bethany wrote:
Just weighing in on a couple of Environ products....

The Colostrum has possibly reduced some redness for me, but not enough to repurchase. Especially since it seems to cause products layered over it to ball up.

The Frown Serum is not effective on it's own...I am now trying it after using the Focus Cit, but unless you are willing to needle before you apply it, don't waste your $$$.


Just an FYI that I am seeing a smoother forehead after using the Frown Seum in combination with the Focus Cit. Hoever I wonder how much is due to the serum and how much may be inflammation from the daily needling. We'll see how things look a few months from now.


bethany wrote:
rileygirl wrote:
bethany wrote:

Riley, do you know how long the needles are on the Environ cosmetic roller? It didn't say on TOSC.


Bethany, this is the info I got on the Roll-CIT:

There are 108 needles 18 rowx 6 needles per row. The needles protrude 0,2mm, The needles are solid steel and are 0.3mm in length with a tapered point so that the section that goes into the skin is about 0.15 in diameter.


Thanks! Do the needles seem thinner than on the Dr. Roller models? The ones on the Focus Cit are practically invisible!


So I just received my Environ CIT cosmetic roller, and it is TOTALLY a different experience than rolling with a Dr. Roller or Owndoc penetration roller. The needles are practically invisible, and produce much less inflammation and redness for me...a very good thing since the typical .2mm rollers leave me red for more then a day. Shock I am cutting back to CQ2 and hoping for less redness than I was seeing with CQ3, though it seems like it might be the same with the addition of the roller.

I will keep everyone posted!

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Sat Oct 13, 2012 7:57 pm      Reply with quote
eileenkenney wrote:
Hi roller girls!

I finally got the courage and just roller for the first time today (used a 1.5 mm owndoc roller). It hurt a fair bit and I heard some "popping" noises as I rolled over my forehead (I think that was needle piercing through my skin). I got red all over like a bad sunburn which faded in an hour or so. However, I didn't bleed...whenever I see it done on a TV show or educational youtube video people get pinpoint blood spots all over. Am I not pressing hard enough? I thought 1.5 mm would be long enough to cause a deeper roll. I'll need to numb myself up if I'm supposed to roll harder as I was pressing as much as I could tolerate. Should I be trying to bleed to get a good roll for collagen synthesis? TIA!

Eileen


Eileen, I bleed like a stuck pig with a 1mm and Emla...blood literally splattered all over the t shirt I was wearing. Dr F said that histology studies showed that blood release is key to results, so I would be sure to numb up and roll until you see some blood. If you are not seeng blood, I would make sure you are using Retin A and building up the blood vessels in your skin. (do you smoke or have sun damage?)

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Sat Oct 13, 2012 9:32 pm      Reply with quote
bethany wrote:
eileenkenney wrote:
Hi roller girls!

I finally got the courage and just roller for the first time today (used a 1.5 mm owndoc roller). It hurt a fair bit and I heard some "popping" noises as I rolled over my forehead (I think that was needle piercing through my skin). I got red all over like a bad sunburn which faded in an hour or so. However, I didn't bleed...whenever I see it done on a TV show or educational youtube video people get pinpoint blood spots all over. Am I not pressing hard enough? I thought 1.5 mm would be long enough to cause a deeper roll. I'll need to numb myself up if I'm supposed to roll harder as I was pressing as much as I could tolerate. Should I be trying to bleed to get a good roll for collagen synthesis? TIA!

Eileen


Eileen, I bleed like a stuck pig with a 1mm and Emla...blood literally splattered all over the t shirt I was wearing. Dr F said that histology studies showed that blood release is key to results, so I would be sure to numb up and roll until you see some blood. If you are not seeng blood, I would make sure you are using Retin A and building up the blood vessels in your skin. (do you smoke or have sun damage?)


Thanks for the reply...I've been using Retin A Micro for the past 6 months or so (I alternate it every other night with a homemade vitamin C serum). I don't smoke and my skin is decent (just a little hyperpigmentation on my cheek bones). I've previously have a bunch of laser treatments done (fotofacials, ematrix, and affirm) - not sure if that would make it harder for me to roll deep? Maybe I'm just a wimp...I'll try numbing up and rolling harder Smile

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Sun Oct 14, 2012 1:19 am      Reply with quote
So I numbed myself up tonight and rolled again...still hurt like hell! I did get a few pinpoint bleeds here and there, but still couldn't get the blood bath I've seen in videos despite vigorous rolling. I'll do a treatment once a month and gain some practice (unless I break down at some point and purchase another laser treatment package).

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Sun Oct 14, 2012 8:46 am      Reply with quote
I dermarolled about 5 times about 5 weeks apart. I started in about Mar. I have stopped for now. I have not seen any improvement in that time. I have been using Retin A for about a year maybe longer also Vit C for longer.

Anyway I have never actually bleed, but there are sio many different reports on whether you need to draw blood nor not? I have rolled as hard as I could bear with numbing cream. Got spots but not blood.

I am giving up for now. I am going to have a lower face lift next year and am trying to get my skin in a strong position. Its not bad at the moment but I really want to build as much collegen as possible. I am thinking of having a few IPL treatments as I did have very good success with them a few years ago.

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Sun Oct 14, 2012 5:17 pm      Reply with quote
Bermie2 wrote:
I dermarolled about 5 times about 5 weeks apart. I started in about Mar. I have stopped for now. I have not seen any improvement in that time. I have been using Retin A for about a year maybe longer also Vit C for longer.

Anyway I have never actually bleed, but there are sio many different reports on whether you need to draw blood nor not? I have rolled as hard as I could bear with numbing cream. Got spots but not blood.

I am giving up for now. I am going to have a lower face lift next year and am trying to get my skin in a strong position. Its not bad at the moment but I really want to build as much collegen as possible. I am thinking of having a few IPL treatments as I did have very good success with them a few years ago.


Thanks for coming back with this info Bermie. That's a pretty consistent treatment program and to not see results would be grounds for you to claim disappointment.

I also wonder if not producing any significant bleeding would have contributed to your lack of results. Think

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Sun Oct 14, 2012 5:20 pm      Reply with quote
Bethany - does that new CIT roller cause any pain for you? My .2 roller from owndoc (not sure if it's a Dr Roller or hers) is still painful on my upper lip and causes me to sneeze a little still on my forehead. Not as much as the longer needle rollers, but still enough.

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Sun Oct 14, 2012 5:30 pm      Reply with quote
foxe wrote:
I also wonder if not producing any significant bleeding would have contributed to your lack of results. Think


I'm still confused about the bleeding issue. I have never managed to produce significant bleeding - only a few blood spots here and there. And it seems to me that this is the scenario with most people. To my knowledge, Bethany is the only one who bleeds profusely - but then, she's the only person who has published post-roll photos. So I wonder if Bethany is the only person who is doing this properly or that she just has exceptionally sensitive skin. I know that she has difficulty handling Retin-A - whereas I have no problem with it at all. I also don't have a problem with laser treatments but I think Bethany suffered quite allot of irritation from the one she had.

Also, would I be correct in saying that most of the photos of the very bloody rolls done by Dr. Fernandez were done with a 3mm roller?

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Sun Oct 14, 2012 6:19 pm      Reply with quote
Keliu wrote:
foxe wrote:
I also wonder if not producing any significant bleeding would have contributed to your lack of results. Think


I'm still confused about the bleeding issue. I have never managed to produce significant bleeding - only a few blood spots here and there. And it seems to me that this is the scenario with most people. To my knowledge, Bethany is the only one who bleeds profusely - but then, she's the only person who has published post-roll photos. So I wonder if Bethany is the only person who is doing this properly or that she just has exceptionally sensitive skin. I know that she has difficulty handling Retin-A - whereas I have no problem with it at all. I also don't have a problem with laser treatments but I think Bethany suffered quite allot of irritation from the one she had.

Also, would I be correct in saying that most of the photos of the very bloody rolls done by Dr. Fernandez were done with a 3mm roller?


I can't remember. Did anyone ever ask Dr. F or Dr. S if you had to draw blood to get results and if that is true how can we explain the increase to collagen/skin thickness etc. with smaller needles that can't draw blood? Confused

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Sun Oct 14, 2012 6:23 pm      Reply with quote
I also forgot to state that I think the extremely intensive, invasive rolls done by Dr. F are done under anaesthetic - not just a numbing cream.

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Mon Oct 15, 2012 6:10 am      Reply with quote
Random thoughts:

- I recall the same data about bleeding associated with results. My *unscientific* guess here is that it means you are reaching the appropriate depth of skin layer where both results are obtained and yet this same layer is where the capillaries reach. If you are not drawing blood, perhaps your upper layers of skin are sufficiently thickened with collagen or some other type of ECM scar tissue or more likely, *in my opinion* you are not pressing the needles in deeply enough? Remember there is a psychological component here that works against us - it is unnatural to self-inflict injury on the body. This is why I remain convinced more thorough results are obtained when treated by someone else and not ourselves.

BFG
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Mon Oct 15, 2012 6:59 am      Reply with quote
It's hard to know? If someone rolls with a .5mm and draws blood, and someone else rolls with a 1.5mm and does not draw blood? Has one just got thicker skin than the other.

All I know is I can't roll any deeper!! Unless I get hubby to do it! He might enjoy that..lol Its true that we find it hard to inflict pain on ourselves.

One of my issues is cappillaries, which IPL worked very well on a couple of years ago. I actually think rolling made new ones? I can't be positive about this, but they are back and they were 95% gone. Weather that is just normal ageing again or what I am not sure. Also I don't think rolling did anything for pigmentation. Just my 2 cents worth.

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