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Mon Oct 05, 2009 9:28 am  |
Does anyone know if some products work on collagen stimulation while others work on elastin stimulation. I often see how a product stimulates both collagen and elastin but just wondered if some do more for one than the other.
TIA
Dee |
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Mon Oct 05, 2009 2:14 pm |
| There are only a few that I know that claim to improve elastin - Relastin, Elastiderm, and Ethocyn. There may be others, but these are the only ones that I am aware of. |
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Mon Oct 05, 2009 4:04 pm |
Thanks Rileygirl, was thinking of trying the obagi elastiderm although did not hear such great reviews.
Dee |
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Mon Oct 05, 2009 4:22 pm |
| Which ingredients (not products containing them)are known to stimulate elastin production? |
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Mon Oct 05, 2009 6:08 pm |
| I believe it's some sort of zinc complex in the Relastin. |
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Mon Oct 05, 2009 7:19 pm |
The Elastiderm creams main ingredients are copper–zinc malonate. And, it says this about Ethocyn: "Ethocyn is a non-steroidal DHT receptor blocker".
Here is information from the Ethocyn site regarding elastin: "As confirmed by eminent M.D. and skin physiologist Dr. Peter T. Pugliese, “ The single most important cause of age related skin wrinkles and sagging is the loss of skin elastin fibers. Everyone, whether female or male, will begin to lose skin elastin fibers at age 25. Elastin fibers are the restorative force in the skin.”
Medical research findings confirm that our skin produces/synthesizes less and less elastin fibers as we chronologically age. This is recognized as Intrinsic Skin Aging and completely independent of Photo (sun) Damage Skin Aging. Using sunscreens and sun blocks protect skin from Photo Aging, but not Intrinsic Aging.
Elastin fibers give skin its ‘rubber bands’, – its ‘snap-back quality’. Sagging skin is lacking youthful levels of elastin fibers . Wrinkles form because there is elastin fiber deficient (sagging) skin lying over the moving muscles of your face."
http://www.ethocyn.com/md/skinphysi.php |
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Tue Oct 06, 2009 9:58 am |
| rileygirl wrote: |
| The Elastiderm creams main ingredients are copper–zinc malonate. And, it says this about Ethocyn: "Ethocyn is a non-steroidal DHT receptor blocker". |
So a copper-zinc combo can encourage elastin production. That's interesting and got me thinking about something. Vit c is known to block absorption of copper and for someone (like me) who uses a bucket load of vit c both topically and orally perhaps my body is not getting the necessary minerals like copper it needs to produce proper emounts of elastin.
| rileygirl wrote: |
Here is information from the Ethocyn site regarding elastin: "As confirmed by eminent M.D. and skin physiologist Dr. Peter T. Pugliese, “ The single most important cause of age related skin wrinkles and sagging is the loss of skin elastin fibers. Everyone, whether female or male, will begin to lose skin elastin fibers at age 25. Elastin fibers are the restorative force in the skin.”
Medical research findings confirm that our skin produces/synthesizes less and less elastin fibers as we chronologically age. This is recognized as Intrinsic Skin Aging and completely independent of Photo (sun) Damage Skin Aging. Using sunscreens and sun blocks protect skin from Photo Aging, but not Intrinsic Aging.
Elastin fibers give skin its ‘rubber bands’, – its ‘snap-back quality’. Sagging skin is lacking youthful levels of elastin fibers . Wrinkles form because there is elastin fiber deficient (sagging) skin lying over the moving muscles of your face". |
Gosh, how depressing lol. And they say 90% of skin ageing is caused by extrinsic factors like uv radiation...perhaps that is a bit of an overestimate after all. |
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havana8
Moderator
 
Joined: 09 Sep 2005
Posts: 3451
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Tue Oct 06, 2009 11:19 am |
| rileygirl wrote: |
| There are only a few that I know that claim to improve elastin - Relastin, Elastiderm, and Ethocyn. There may be others, but these are the only ones that I am aware of. |
Alasta® is another one that supposedly has been shown to improve elasticity through both oral supplementation and topical application.
http://www.sustainableyouthproducts.com/clinical-trials |
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Tue Oct 06, 2009 12:10 pm |
Lutein is supposed to increase elastin in the skin:
Topline results of the study, presented by Dr. Pierfrancesco Morganti, professor of applied cosmetic dermatology at the University of Naples, on behalf of the research team, indicated that lutein and its associated molecule zeaxanthin, when taken daily as a 10 mg oral lutein supplement, increased skin hydration by 38 percent, skin elasticity by 8 percent and the level of superficial lipids present in the skin by 33 percent after adjustments for placebo. Results also showed that lutein decreased oxidation of those beneficial lipids by 55 percent after adjustment for placebo.
The study further demonstrated that the combination of oral and topical administration of lutein/zeaxanthin provided even more powerful improvements, increasing skin hydration by 60 percent, skin elasticity by 20 percent and the amount of superficial lipids present in the skin by 50 percent after adjustment for placebo, all while decreasing the oxidation of those beneficial lipids by 64 percent (from http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/51711.php#) |
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Tue Oct 06, 2009 2:16 pm |
Thanks txgirl and havana for the helpful links and info, much appreciated.  |
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Tue Oct 06, 2009 2:22 pm |
| Thanks for sharing! Very interested in it. |
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Tue Oct 06, 2009 2:41 pm |
Thanks for that link, Havana8. That looks interesting. I would love to hear from anyone who has used these products.
In looking at the clinical trial page, it appears one would have better results with the topicals than the supplement. I wish the trial had included a greater number of people, rather than 20 or 30. Nevertheless, it is something to check into! |
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Tue Oct 06, 2009 4:02 pm |
| I believe in Dr Baumann's dermatology text book it mentions that elastin's role in ageing in undertain. I think that as one ages there is an accumulation of disorganized elastin in the skin. Vitamin C in ascorbic acid form is an example of something that works to increase collagen but not elastin. |
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Tue Oct 06, 2009 4:22 pm |
| rileygirl wrote: |
Thanks for that link, Havana8. That looks interesting. I would love to hear from anyone who has used these products.
In looking at the clinical trial page, it appears one would have better results with the topicals than the supplement. I wish the trial had included a greater number of people, rather than 20 or 30. Nevertheless, it is something to check into! |
I looked at this product line some time ago and rejected it for myself since it is based on Aloe Vera (which my skin does not like at all); having said that, it may be something which is suitable for you Riley. I did note this statement on their Scientific Studies page of the website:
"Tests with human cell lines located the source of Aloe Vera’s immune system stimulation, and discovered that Aloeride®, with a high molecular weight between 2 to 7 million daltons, provides macrophage activation in excess of any of Aloe Vera’s polysaccharides."
I thought molecules this large were unable to penetrate the stratum corneum?
You may want to also take at look at the Before and After pictures; in my opinion some are positive but some are less so.
Finally, here is a link for the patent (I don't think the website provides this link)
http://www.freepatentsonline.com/7196072.html
HTH |
_________________
Born 1953; Blonde-Blue; Normal skin |
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Tue Oct 06, 2009 4:49 pm |
| Lacy53 wrote: |
"Tests with human cell lines located the source of Aloe Vera’s immune system stimulation, and discovered that Aloeride®, with a high molecular weight between 2 to 7 million daltons, provides macrophage activation in excess of any of Aloe Vera’s polysaccharides."
I thought molecules this large were unable to penetrate the stratum corneum?
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I think you are correct. I thought it was 500 daltons or less being able to easily penetrate the stratum corneum?
Thanks for the link to the patent! |
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Tue Oct 06, 2009 5:50 pm |
The microneedling studies claim both collagen and elastion production and provide histology data and photos to prove it.
BF |
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Wed Oct 07, 2009 4:33 am |
| Barefootgirl wrote: |
The microneedling studies claim both collagen and elastion production and provide histology data and photos to prove it.
BF |
Yes, I forgot about that one, too! |
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Wed Oct 07, 2009 12:21 pm |
| Barefootgirl wrote: |
The microneedling studies claim both collagen and elastion production and provide histology data and photos to prove it.
BF |
Yeah, seen some impressive before/after photos with micro-needling (esp. for scarring). I have a dermaroller but not used it in a while...maybe time to get rolling again! |
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Wed Oct 07, 2009 12:24 pm |
| amonavis wrote: |
| I believe in Dr Baumann's dermatology text book it mentions that elastin's role in ageing in undertain. I think that as one ages there is an accumulation of disorganized elastin in the skin. Vitamin C in ascorbic acid form is an example of something that works to increase collagen but not elastin. |
Yeah the disorganised elastin (and collagen) is called crosslinking I think? Thanks for confirming that vit c only works on collagen synthesis. |
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Wed Oct 07, 2009 1:28 pm |
How about Retin A? Does that work on both collagen and elastin?
I found the story on lutein very interesting and ordered some 20mg lutein caps already |
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Thu Oct 08, 2009 3:06 pm |
Another one is CPs (Copper Peptides)
Dr Pickart of Skin Biology has said this about them:
GHK-Cu remodels skin (Out-with the old, In with the new) by increasing the synthesis of metalloproteinases and anti-proteases that remove damaged proteins and increasing the new production of collagen, elastin, and the water-holding proteoglycans and glycosoaminoglycans, and subcutaneous fat cells.
This mentions the GHK-Cu CP, but he always says the newer (2nd generation) ones do better in studies. (SB never seems to provide studies for the 2nd gen CPs - just the GHK one). They work for me. Been using them for 18 mos. Took some time off while trying a new skin care line, but have snuck CPs back in. They're great. |
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early 60's, fair skin, combo skin, very few fine lines, vertical lip lines, crows feet & 11's, fighting aging! Using Palancia HF, dermarollers, CPs, Retin A Micro, Safetox, AALS, Clairsonic |
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Thu Oct 08, 2009 3:12 pm |
| Monica34 wrote: |
How about Retin A? Does that work on both collagen and elastin?
I found the story on lutein very interesting and ordered some 20mg lutein caps already |
Monica - I have heard that Retin A also works on collagen and elastin. The problem w/ that, tho is the irritation that retiniods like Retin A can give. Retin A Micro was developed to get rid of that (it's encapsulated). CPs used in conjunction w/ Retin A will also get rid of the irritation. |
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early 60's, fair skin, combo skin, very few fine lines, vertical lip lines, crows feet & 11's, fighting aging! Using Palancia HF, dermarollers, CPs, Retin A Micro, Safetox, AALS, Clairsonic |
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Sat Oct 17, 2009 10:27 am |
| Hi everyone, I just ordered a couple of the Sustainable Youth products - the gel caps and the serum. The cream is way to heavy for my acne/very oily skin. I will update in a couple of months and will take before and after pics. I'm also going to try lutein supplements if I can find them at my health food store. Wish me luck! |
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