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DIY Structured/Energized Waters
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havana8
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Fri May 06, 2011 5:38 pm      Reply with quote
While discussing the Ageless Secret Gold product, some started an interesting discussion which deserves its own thread: creating DIY versions of ASG and other structured/energized waters. I am copying some of those posts from that thread here to get things started.

Please share your research, experiments, thoughts and experiences. Smile

Kassy_A wrote:
For those (like myself) who wish to know more about 'how to energize water ourselves', and the structured/energized water connection, the following links should be a good start.

For myself, I'll be ordering the 'water energizing mug', as well as the "Vortex Magnetizer"...

From what I read, it sounds like this type of *water* would be beneficial to drink, which is of great interest to me personally.. And sure, I'll try it on my skin for the hell of it!

Perhaps someone could ask Jim exactly which tool he uses to energize his product??? Perhaps he has the gallon sized pitcher? (Wouldn't that make 16 4oz bottles at a time.. And it only takes minutes.) Oh, and somewhere in my searches, I read that a tiny bit of additives (like in the ASG products), does indeed work well in the energized water.

Here are a few links for now;

http://www.quantumbalancing.com/vortex_magnetizer.htm

http://www.quantumbalancing.com/energized_water_2.htm

**Keliu, this link has an Australian #, maybe you can ask a few questions;

http://www.energizewater.com/index_files/vorticiser.htm

Some interesting info on why 'energized water for drinking' is good for you (including anti-aging.)

http://life-enthusiast.com/usa/water-energized-drinking-c-215.html?pID=1076

There is tons of info out there for making energized/structurized waters, and it all looks fairly straight forward. What I was unable to find, was anything special enough to warrant the very high price that Jim charges for the products... Or for that matter, how to partially energize water, for the cheaper product he offers.. (Not as strong??? Why??)

I had a thought last night about why some folks have amazing results with ASG, and yet others are in the 'zilch' arena. Maybe it would be worth doing some type of poll to see what things the *zilch* users have in common regarding topical products, supplements and gadgets. Perhaps there's a negative interaction somewhere, that is producing more than your fare share of free radicals...Confused

Keliu wrote:
With regard to the "science" of energised waters, here's an amazing list of all the internet sites selling them which has been compiled by Stephen Lower B.A. Biochemistry, University of California, Berkeley Ph.D. Physical Chemistry, University of British Columbia (SFU Chemistry faculty: 1965-1999)

http://www.chem1.com/CQ/gallery.html

Hermosa wrote:
I was thinking about this whole water thing. We evolved from the water, and you don't have to search too hard to find all kinds of mystical and wonderful attributes ascribed to water. Religious rituals, like baptism. The healing waters of Lourdes. When I was a kid, we used to take vacations in a town that had become famous in the 30s and 40s for its incredible springs. Some people think you can cure just about anything by drinking enough water: http://www.karinya.com/waterhealing.htm

I guess it's surprising we don't see more of these water-based miracles.

Skippie wrote:
Sorry this is really long and maybe it's better posted in a new thread.

I’ve gotten interested in the “science” of structured/energized water too – those terms seem to be used interchangeably from everything I’ve read. I’ve probably been looking at the same websites as Keliu. The best “scientific” explanation I’ve seen for structured water is here: - http://www.quantumbalancing.com/energized_water_2.htm

Whether what is stated there is true or right, I couldn’t tell you because I don’t have the knowledge or background, but I would be interested in the opinions of those of with such scientific knowledge.

What is particularly interesting to me, especially as it relates to ASG, is this comment:

Quote:
These waters, which act as mineral carriers or transporters, may be used to transport other substances in the living system. Preliminary tests with cut flowers and other plants have shown a 400% increase in water and nutrient uptake when watered with a solution of liquid crystal water. (The control plants were given just distilled water).

What is true for plants may be true for animals. These high energy waters may act as more efficient nutrient carriers. Preliminary experiments with vitamins and herbal extracts show a definite increase in absorption. Riboflavin, vitamin B2, is an easy vitamin to measure in urine. Testing with riboflavin has shown an increased absorption of 500% when taken with liquid crystal colloids versus distilled water.

I saw many claims related to the growth of plants as I was looking at all the websites. Here’s a YouTube from a guy who uses structured water to grow his produce: How Structured Water can change our world - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EsL1SBlQArc&NR=1

Of course, at the end he mentions that he also uses other techniques such as compost tea which, if you’re a gardener, you know that compost tea is like steroids for plants. Also, one of the water products, Willard Water, was tested against regular water at the University of Florida on plants and there was no difference in plant height, fresh weight, and quality.

Willard Water has been around a long, long time. In fact, there was a 60 Minutes segment on it in 1980 – which you can watch here if you’re so inclined: http://www.facebook.com/DrWillards#!/DrWillards?sk=app_4949752878 and a congressional hearing held on it.

Willard Water uses catalyst altered water, but the same claims are made for it as the other structured/energized waters. It surprises me that there hasn’t been more testing of the water considering the claims and length of time it’s been around. This is an excerpt from the 60 Minutes segment, which again seems to point to this water being a more efficient transporter or carrier or penetrator:

REASONER:
About the only laboratory work on what Willard Water does, has been done at the South Dakota School of Mines by Sister Marmion Howe, a Professor of Biology.

SISTER MARMION HOWE:
I took some different species of microorganisms and tested them with CAW or with Doc Willard's Water and without it and then I used different antibiotics on it to see if Willard Water enhanced the action of the antibiotic.

REASONER:
Does it?

SISTER MARMION:
Yes. I found that it did with certain organisms, not all.

REASONER:
The water also seemed to sometimes speed up the growth of bacteria, doesn't it?

SISTER MARMION:
Yes, we found that out. Some of my students did some work on that.

REASONER:
Do you have any theories based on your tests as to why it does what it does?

SISTER MARMION:
Well no, we need about a million dollars to do some studies on it but I think the fact that this is a surfactant - or a detergent-like acting material might make it penetrate a little bit more quickly and effectively.
Also, the claim is made in the video by people using the water that their vegetables and wheat grow much bigger and better.


So, how does this relate to AGS in my mind? Maybe the energized water in the product is enhancing the effect of the MSM. Toby posted pictures of her faded brown spot and Lacy mentioned that perhaps MSM and the trace minerals were responsible for that. MSM has also been touted for other skin benefits such as elasticity.

As I was looking at websites, I was amazed at how many skincare products there are made with structured/energized water. Some of these are very expensive and others are cheap. If my theory above is any good, then I don’t see why someone couldn’t just DIY their water, as Kassy is doing, or buy the structured/energized water and add their own ingredients.

This site has skincare products, products to make your own, and lots of videos which are supposed to support the whole idea: http://www.biznet1.com/water/
This site suggests adding trace minerals or Vitamin C crystals to further enhance the water.

Camu C Serum with structured water: http://thegoddessnextdoor.com/wordpress/category/skin-care/

Perfect Waters anti-aging products - http://www.perfectwaters.net/Bath-and-Beauty/

Youthlabs Age Reversal products - http://www.cantron.com/html/youth.html

And here’s the most expensive and interesting – in a lot of ways- I’ve seen: http://www.energeticinteractions.com/common/clientCustom.asp?UID=50902&SectionID=1&guid=E0C3F498-55E2-4CD8-A1C2-2433EF2E27FC It’s worth watching the CBS News video and the video of how to use the products. Also, look at the before and afters – they use Visia to show the differences.

And then there’s something else called electrolyzed-reduced water, which is also interesting and seems to be embraced as a more serious water to use, maybe because there have been some studies which back it up:

http://livingwaterhealth.biz/studies/Enagic_Proof_Book.pdf#page=37

http://www.nature.com/ki/journal/v70/n2/abs/5001576a.html

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20944427

At any rate, I’m interested to hear what Kassy comes up with. Maybe she can test the water by using plants.

Kassy_A wrote:
My ambition to try a DIY version is two fold;

1.) I'm impressed with the health benefits I've read during my research, and that drinking energized water is a plus for those suffering with autoimmune disease. Both myself and my son suffer with those health issues, so it's a no brainer for me to do what so many others can do, in the comfort of their homes, energizing/strucutizing their water.

2.) Several of my cyber-buddies are either wanting to try ASG and can't afford to, or are happily using ASG and can't afford to continue to purchase... I am more than willing to try to duplicate ASG for them, as an aside to my main reason for purchasing the equipment.

(I will definitely douse myself in the bloody stuff, and if I look like I've had a face lift in a month you'll see the *new* me on Facebook..Very Happy )

Anyway, since I posted those U-Tube videos on this thread many months ago, I have spent some time researching the topic of energized water, and although I've concentrated on the internal benefits, I see no reason why it shouldn't have some benefit to skin as well..
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Fri May 06, 2011 7:17 pm      Reply with quote
Thanks Havana - this is a great idea. Now we can keep reviews and DIY separate.

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Fri May 06, 2011 8:11 pm      Reply with quote
Yes indeedy... Thanks be to God and havana.. Very Happy

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Fri May 06, 2011 8:31 pm      Reply with quote
Kassy_A wrote:
Yes indeedy... Thanks be to God and havana.. Very Happy


Havana is God, isn't she? Laughing

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Fri May 06, 2011 8:53 pm      Reply with quote
I'm still on the fence about whether it is possible to structure water - I want to believe in it - but the overwhelming amount of evidence that it is not possible is preventing me from embracing this concept.

http://www.chem1.com/CQ/EnergizedWater.html

http://www.chem1.com/CQ/CCdebunk03.html

http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2008/03/chem-lab-hexago/

What about "structured" waters?
One of the largest misconceptions about water is that it exists in some type of "structured" or "clustered" arrangement at the molecular level. We find it fascinating there are a number of different ideas about how many molecules make up one of these structured arrangements. Some web sites propose the ideal arrangement is 12 molecules to a cluster, others six molecules, and others claim 5 molecules is the ideal number to make water somehow more healthful.

Unfortunately, there is no critical scientific evidence to support any of these ideas. A water molecule is composed of an oxygen atom that has bonded with two hydrogen atoms. These molecules then form "polar" bonds to each other due to the distribution of the electrical charge on the molecule. (This is well explained on numerous other web sites or in any first year chemistry book.) While polar bonds do have measurable force at the molecular level, the bonds themselves form and are broken billions of times per second. Science does not recognize any force that might exist in pure water causing these bonds to maintain stability for any length of time.

There are people who propose these water "clusters" can be verified using Nuclear Magnetic Resonance or NMR equipment. Dr. Mu Shik Jhon supposedly verified the existence of water clusters using NMR technology. Most of the web sites mentioning clustered water will in some place mention NMR research as evidence clustered water actually exists. Sadly, it is extremely common to find people who will reference some piece of scientific research in support of their ideas (or products) without having any understanding of the research itself. Often, the people making the claims are unable to evaluate the research to determine if the conclusions will stand up to scientific scrutiny.

We would like to refer you to an article written by a Dr. Paul Shin who has over 18 years experience with NMR instrumentation. Here Dr. Shin reports using NMR technology to test several other fluids to see if they differed in any way from the "hexagonal" clustered water. Certainly if this idea of structured water has any real basis one would expect to find its NMR signature to be unique. Sadly, this was not the case and regular tap water, bottled water, and even urine were found to have NMR signatures almost identical to the "hexagonal" structured water. Either the NMR signature does not describe the existence of water molecules forming hexagonal structures, or the structures don't exist. In the first case, this would mean using NMR technology to verify structures of water molecules is an inadequate approach, or, in the second case, it is much more likely the data simply does not support the idea. If clusters exist and maintain their shape, then finding evidence of their existence would only be the first step towards a proof. This would have to be followed by a sound theoretical framework that would describe the forces at work holding these molecules together.

After reviewing the article by Dr. Shin, it should be obvious the evidence does not support the hypothesis water molecules exist in clusters. Further, since no theoretical body of work exists to suggest what might cause the molecules to maintain their supposed shape, we conclude structured water is an interesting idea but one without any scientific evidence to support it. Therefore, the health benefits of drinking "structured" water can probably be explained in other ways, and any benefits are most likely the result of the patient becoming well hydrated—as there does exist significant research to show hydration plays a fundamental and critical role in health and wellness.

http://www.waterfilterguide.net/

http://www.abadonna.info/teksty/artykuly/caveatemptor.pdf

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Sat May 07, 2011 2:01 am      Reply with quote
great idea havana
this might already have been said, but has anyone just tried normal water on their face using the lamp combo?
just almost to get a Control sort of baseline?

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Sat May 07, 2011 2:30 am      Reply with quote
10Sylvia5 wrote:
great idea havana
this might already have been said, but has anyone just tried normal water on their face using the lamp combo?
just almost to get a Control sort of baseline?


I would love to have the lamp and try it with Rosewater. My husband has just had a shoulder operation so I might use that as an excuse to get one.

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Sat May 07, 2011 3:57 am      Reply with quote
Here is some reading on the Osmosis Harmonised Water:

http://osmosismd.com/Research/AboutHarmonizedWater.aspx

http://osmosismd.com/Research/HarmonizedWaterFAQ.aspx

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Sat May 07, 2011 12:07 pm      Reply with quote
I think this is fantastic. I love hte stuff people have found on this already, and a huge shout out to Kassy for her info. I'll be reading with interest on people's testing and results for sure!
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Sun May 08, 2011 6:53 pm      Reply with quote
For a long time i have been interested in water. There is so much information out there.
Did you know that you should speak to your water? Smile
here check this out, and also google Dr. Emoto


http://caribooponderer.wordpress.com/2007/09/10/how-our-emotions-affect-the-molecular-structure-of-water/

I am not sure how this particular device works, but i have been very interested in Kangen water ionizer but is very very very expensive, google that if you are not familiar with it. You will get so excited on this whole matter.

I have had a water ionizing stick before, here is an example mine was not this particular one but very similar and 2 years ago it cost about 30 40$ i guess prices on these things are dropping now.
http://www.amazon.com/NewCell-Alkaline-Hydrogen-Portable-Ionizer/dp/B003HAIOC6
Pretty much it is a stick that contains minerals etc.

I am thinking to buy something like that again, since i dont know where my old one was.

Something that i found during my research a year or so ago and maybe thats why i stopped using those things was that, while it is good and it brings more minerals to your body, it is also bad because it depletes your body from minerals. I am not sure how this work,so i think i just gave up on researching lol Smile when it gets too complicated i shut down Smile
So i would love to see if anyone else is familiar with the whole water ionizing alkalizing thing.
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Mon May 09, 2011 2:06 am      Reply with quote
It would be amazing if we could DIY this!

Pleeeease keep us informed Kassy x

Jackie xx
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Mon May 09, 2011 7:39 am      Reply with quote
Reading Jim suggested on the special attributes of water that has been affected by outside forces such as writing nice or mean words and placing under the container, playing types of music, praying ect.:

Dr. Emoto

http://www.masaru-emoto.net/english/e_ome_home.html


A researcher who wanted to investigate what Dr. Emoto claims were:

There are innumerable companies today that make their livelihoods selling information and products that are supposed to be beneficial to human health. Ranging from miracle cures to last-ditch efforts, they are at best based on unsubstantiated ideas, and are at worst complete falsehoods. Unfortunately for his credibility with the scientific community, Dr. Emoto sells products based on his claims. For example, the products page of Emoto’s Hado website is currently offering “geometrically perfect” “Indigo water” that is “highly charged hexagonally structured concentrate,” and supposedly creates “structured water” that is “is more easily assimilated at the cellular level” for $35 for an eight-ounce bottle. Without providing scientific research references for the allegedly amazing qualities of his Indigo Water, Emoto’s commercial venture calls to mind ethical concerns regarding his intent and motivation—questions that would not be present if any scientist had published research supporting his claims.

Since Dr. Emoto is going it alone he receives much criticism for being a quack selling quackery. For example, the James Randi Educational foundation, an organization that offers a “one-million-dollar prize to anyone who can show, under proper observing conditions, evidence of any paranormal, supernatural, or occult power or event” (Randi, Challenge) has offered to give Dr. Emoto the prize if he will agree “to perform his tests in a double-blind fashion” (Randi, Water), yet Dr. Emoto has not responded.

Kristopher Setchfield, BA, Health Science
Natural Science Department
Castleton State College, Vermont

http://www.is-masaru-emoto-for-real.com/

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Mon May 09, 2011 4:46 pm      Reply with quote
I'm a huge doubter of the structured water theory. They'd have to show some pretty conclusive evidence for me to believe you can alter or influence the Coriolis effect (the website that sells the glasses for structuring keeps talking about rotating water in the hemispheres), in fact, they'd probably win the Nobel prize. Sorry to be a downer.

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Mon May 09, 2011 4:50 pm      Reply with quote
Apologies if my comment wasn't respectful to those that believe it in, its just that these companies research is so peppered with stuff that just doesn't make sense from a chemistry standpoint I'm having a hard time buying into it.

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Mon May 09, 2011 5:13 pm      Reply with quote
Ava with wings wrote:
Apologies if my comment wasn't respectful to those that believe it in, its just that these companies research is so peppered with stuff that just doesn't make sense from a chemistry standpoint I'm having a hard time buying into it.


You aren't alone Ava with wings,

A water molecule is H2O change the molecular/chemical makeup of that and you no longer have water. If people buy into this it is their opinion and choice. I am just not in that group.

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Mon May 09, 2011 5:14 pm      Reply with quote
Ava with wings wrote:
Apologies if my comment wasn't respectful to those that believe it in, its just that these companies research is so peppered with stuff that just doesn't make sense from a chemistry standpoint I'm having a hard time buying into it.


You, me, and a whole lotta other people! Laughing
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Tue May 10, 2011 12:01 pm      Reply with quote
it is true that there are so many things claiming to be good for you, where they only make their " inventor" rich

however i believe in the water properties. is just like the holy water.. many churches have holy water, water that has been blessed and so on.. i guess this is the same theory that the water is changed and influenced by the thoughts..

here is something similar experiment done
http://www.theintentionexperiment.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/the-first-korotkov-water-experiment.pdf
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Tue May 17, 2011 12:32 am      Reply with quote
I believe that water can behave differently from such things too vasilenka, but this doesn't seem to be the right place to discuss. Its like talking about prayer. One love isn't everyone's cup of tea!

Anyway, yeah, I came across similar water crystal studies a couple of years ago - so awesome! I'm not sure whether I'd buy such a thing from some foreign source for healing purposes though. Not saying it wouldn't work for others, but it probably wouldn't for me given that I'd already be plagued with doubt!

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Tue May 17, 2011 10:58 am      Reply with quote
At this early date, I can only say one thing with the utmost certainty regarding my 'drinking' water experiment;

* energized water tastes quite a bit better than the same water, without being energized. (This was a blind taste test with myself and 3 others.)

Quite frankly, I was very surprised. The water tasted smoother/softer/purer somehow. I enjoy water, and typically drink just shy of 2 liters per day, and this water has made that experience a little more enjoyable.

I also made a version to use on the skin, and have used it 3 times a day (quite liberally) with both a blow dryer, and the LED twice.

I'll reserve thoughts for a while longer on that. What I will say though, is I do not like the dry, tight feeling the blow dryer leaves me with.. It does calm down once my skin cools off.

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Wed May 18, 2011 5:19 am      Reply with quote
Kassy,

Which energizing product did you use? I think you said you would be ordering a couple of them. Did your skin feel softer and/or tighter after the water dried? Do you know the ph of the energized water?

Sorry for all the questions, but I'm interested in your experiment and appreciate you trying it out for us.

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Wed May 18, 2011 3:34 pm      Reply with quote
Skippie wrote:
Kassy,

Which energizing product did you use? I think you said you would be ordering a couple of them. Did your skin feel softer and/or tighter after the water dried? Do you know the ph of the energized water?

Sorry for all the questions, but I'm interested in your experiment and appreciate you trying it out for us.


Howdy Skip!

This is the vortex magnetic energizing equipment I'm using, and there's a how to video also here;

http://www.vibrantvitalwater.com/index_vitalwater.htm

I was going to hold off on sharing my thoughts for a while, but I think it's probably easier to just share as I go on the forum, because lots of folks are emailing me at this point..

As I mentioned yesterday, the taste of the drinking water I vortexed is surprisingly better tasting. Whether or not it will provide health benefits, only time will tell on that..

Since the majority are intrigued and curious about the "skin" water I've come up with, I'll just concentrate on that unless someone has questions on the 'drinking' water.

I'm not going in to details publicly (yet) on the additives I've added, but suffice it to say this is what I put in;

- Just shy of 2 liters of bottled water
- MSM
- Niacin
- Trace Minerals
- Aloe Vera (fresh from my plant)
- Capsicum Liquid Extract
- (I didn't get the Helichrysum Italicum I ordered yet, but when I do I'll put a few drops in the next batch.) I don't think it's an important ingredient though...

So since Saturday I've used this 3 times per day exclusively (other than an exfoliating mask I did prior, as I do every Saturday.) I haven't used ANYTHING else!

I don't have a mineral lamp, but did use the blow dryer for the recommended 20 or so seconds as others have shared. I also used my LED 3 times since Saturday (which included today.)

I do NOT notice any additional softness to my already very soft skin.

I DO notice a tight, dry feeling immediately after using the blow dryer, which I don't particularly care for. This goes away fairly quickly, once my skin cools off. This tightness is particularly noticable around my eyes and neck.. (I'm presuming that this is because the skin is thinner in those areas, and doesn't have the benefit of the fat, lipids and other good stuff, that's more abundant in say the cheek and mouth areas.)

Please don't take my feeling of "tightness" to translate into a visible tightening of the skin.. It simply "feels" tight, but does not LOOK tigher!

At this 5th day of just using this *water* exclusively, I would share that my skin feels a little on the dry side (which is a 1st!)... This evening I will whip up a very simple moisturizing lotion, which I will probably use each night..

So that's about it so far... Hopefully this little experiment will result in a DIY alternative to ASG, for those interested...Cool I'll use different proportions of the ingredients over the next few weeks, and let you know how it goes.


ETA: The pH checked out at 6.8, but my darn strips expired in March.. Sad New ones on order.. Very Happy

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Keliu
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Wed May 18, 2011 4:56 pm      Reply with quote
Isn't this water vortex just like water going down the plug-hole?

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Thu May 19, 2011 6:16 am      Reply with quote
Quote:
I'm not going in to details publicly (yet) on the additives I've added, but suffice it to say this is what I put in;


Thanks Kassy - whenever you're ready to share, I'm interested in your recipe.

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Thu May 19, 2011 1:41 pm      Reply with quote
Keliu wrote:
Isn't this water vortex just like water going down the plug-hole?



Bad Grin Quite like it!

I hope you guys have taken advantage of the link I posted for Skip! The video shows all, including the prayer rituals.

Looking at the 'vortex' process, reminds me of what a tornado looks like (minus the wind and flying cows..Image

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♥I'm flattered by all the lovely PM's, but I don't get here much these days. Please don't be afraid to post your quearies to other DIY members who will be glad to help you (or sell you their wares..lol) Still happy with LED, dermarolling and a DIY antioxidant regime. Peace & Hugs to all.♥
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Thu May 19, 2011 5:02 pm      Reply with quote
I watched the video (why don't these people ever make decent videos? The sound was really bad).

But the magnets and the water vortex made me think of water going down the plug-hole. Water goes down the plug-hole in different directions in different hemispheres, depending on the earth's magnetic field. In the Southern Hemisphere it spins from right to left - in the Northern Hemisphere it spins from left to right.http://www.sciencemadesimple.co.uk/page51g.html

Does that mean that water is energised after it's gone down the drain? And is the cow energised after it's been in the tornado?

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