FlexEffect Facialbuilding
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free skin care · Wed Aug 10, 2011 9:49 am

TheresaMary wrote:

I think because originally the bootcamp was on the general forum and so you didn't even need to own the kit to do it and they kept getting question after question about it from people who had just joined and did that alone and werent having results.

Yep I remember Loulou saying the same to me, and Loli too - and later on someone else suggested that they were both using stuff from a book just only on the cheeks - so who knows why they moved it. Its still not in the workshop forum.

I think with the 3n1 its a development thats happened since the 3rd edition by Deb so thats why she put it in the workshop which makes sense to me, and I noticed recently they said they're not answering technique questions on the general forum any longer. Something about people having pirated copies or so?

Suppose they got to protect themselves which is fair enough.

sister sweets wrote:

I don't understand why they would remove the cheek bootcamp exercises. For the record LouLou told me that she and Loli BOTH put it together.

Anyway - I signed back up on the FE forum so I can check 3n1 out. Curious what muscles it takes in.

Hi there,

Since this is seemingly a FE thread, I'll respond here:

I THINK this was one of the orig. threads regarding the cheek bootcamp: http://www.flexeffect.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=general&action=display&thread=930&page=1

You'll see I have edited out the directions a LONG time ago. We did move it to the 2nd workshop... and then finally removed all the details. When you end up with a group of newbies attempting to run before they can walk, they end up very frustrated... and many like to point fingers. So, we have people contact Loli direct. And when she's avail, she sends them the info.

Deb decided to do 3n1 on workshop...You will find that she posts her tips to for people who she knows are using her materials. Her tips often don't make sense without material knowledge. As there are no photos, and descriptions of material you already own...

You will also notice we have made the move recently to answering specific questions in workshop. We have, as mom would say, so many oranges in the air... additionally, our very gracious online trainers have lives too... or at least that's what we assume!

It seems crazy for us to bang our heads with a person that turns out is using some other program, or a pirated copy (some have even been altered...OMG!) that we don't have all the details on, can't figure out what they are doing, and they become a bit loopy.

I imagine when you choose to steal from someone (as we've been watching lately, with these very scary pirate copies... watch out for the viruses that come, and the altered material), you get what you pay for... Free training is not one of those things...

As much as I love to help people, we've have to prioritize our time. We choose to help those that come by our program honestly first and foremost, then those who are struggling with another (hopefully also honestly purchased), and well, those that think stealing is a great option (did someone REALLY? post a link to steal Carol Maggio's work????? How sad! Such entitlement!)...you're not really on my list. I've got other things to do...

If you're an actual flexer and need individual attn., just hit the workshop. If you need help with access... happy to help. If you have general questions, I do feel more comfy on my own forum, but will answer questions that only I could answer (like why we moved things)...

Of course, I always visit... Only this group has tried every crazy invention under the sun. You just never know what you'll learn! LOL!

free skin care · Wed Aug 10, 2011 11:39 am

Hi, finally found Deb's three in one, luckily someone had posted recently so I could spot it and it appears under the FE Resistance Training subforum. Very Happy

.FYI.

free skin care · Wed Aug 10, 2011 9:16 pm

I think it was Loli who developed the 3 in 1 exercise for the cheeks, but it was both Loli and Loulou who developed the cheek bootcamp based on the idea of periodization (a form of progressive training). But I think sometimes who did what gets confused Smile

For those who purchased the second edition of FlexEffect, there are a couple threads on both Loli's 3 in 1 exercise and the bootcamp on the password-protected 2nd edition forum here:

* http://flexworkshop.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=train3&action=display&thread=182&page=1

* http://flexworkshop.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=train3&action=display&thread=748

(Of course, this is only for people who own the 2nd edition of FlexEffect, so if you don't, you can't view the posts or otherwise gain entry into the forum.)

HTH Smile

free skin care · Thu Aug 11, 2011 1:13 am

ATester wrote:

Hi, finally found Deb's three in one, luckily someone had posted recently so I could spot it and it appears under the FE Resistance Training subforum. Very Happy

.FYI.

packratmack wrote:

Deb's new routine can be found on the Flex Effect forum for the third edition. It's in the resistance training sub forum. The thread is titled FlexEffect - Three In One Training.

Hey ATester, I guess you missed my post. Smile

free skin care · Thu Aug 11, 2011 2:14 am

Claudia it would be helpful to know who developed the 3 in 1 exercise and bootcamp as you can see there are many different ideas and I know with the bootcamp both Loli and Lou said to me in a PM at one point that they were the creators of it. Just for clarity sake.

free skin care · Thu Aug 11, 2011 4:21 am

Hey TM...

Wow... I'm NOT particularly interested in calling anyone a liar. I was not involved at the level of collaberation. Nor was I privy to an exchange of e-mails between LL and Loli that are likely the ONLY evidence of chicken and egg here.

My conclusions would be that based on Loli's post in 2nd workshop as posted above by CM she is the sole creator of 3 in 1 (not to be confused with Deb's 3 in 1 perhaps a new name is in order???) And by that, I mean she came up with a routine combining FE exercises...

Within the link I posted above, Loli is the trainer to post the directions to Cheek bootcamp. Said directions have been deleted as I indicated for reasons I indicated.

You'll note she indicated that she was contacted and asked for help in coming up with something for cheeks. That she borrowed a routine (counts and reps) from some other program and used FE exercises... They both tested, and reported results.

There does not seem to be a correction by anyone in the same thread as to the order of events...

I am of the understanding that Loli came up with the application of ideas.

I don't think most people realize that Loli does not speak any English AT ALL. She uses a translator. So, IMO, it seems odd to post directions from Spanish translated to English, if let's say they were in English in the first place... And from the gate Loli has been the go to girl for any questions regarding cheek bootcamp.

Honestly, I don't think that would PROVE anything in a court of law. I think there would be some much deeper digging.

I'm not sure why there is such a stink about who manipulated FE exercises and gets credit for it anyway. The fact that BOTH Loli and LL realize that FE exercises are FE exercises regardless of their combo ranks high with me.

Loli continues to like the FE way of things with her personal tweak here and there, and she very graciously shares. Have you SEEN the diagrams and such that she comes up with? You'd think she lives with a graphic designer!

LL liked the idea of intense cheek workouts, created her own methodology and ran with that...

I don't have much else for you on that...

free skin care · Thu Aug 11, 2011 5:21 am

Its just interesting to know the origins of the cheek bootcamp. As I said I had contact with both Loli and Loulou and both said they were the originator and I have since found mention in other places that they said they created it and so it just got me thinking and Im not the only one im sure. I know Loli uses a translator – that comes across in her messages but I do think her diagrams are excellent and she even gets her son to pose for photos of him doing exercises etc which is fantastic.

So in all reality the bootcamp came from another program but was adapted for Flexeffects. That makes more senses to me now so thanks for enlightening us. I do think that perhaps Deb should rename her new finding as it is causing confusion.

free skin care · Thu Aug 11, 2011 9:05 am

TheresaMary wrote:

Its just interesting to know the origins of the cheek bootcamp. As I said I had contact with both Loli and Loulou and both said they were the originator and I have since found mention in other places that they said they created it and so it just got me thinking and Im not the only one im sure. I know Loli uses a translator – that comes across in her messages but I do think her diagrams are excellent and she even gets her son to pose for photos of him doing exercises etc which is fantastic.

So in all reality the bootcamp came from another program but was adapted for Flexeffects. That makes more senses to me now so thanks for enlightening us. I do think that perhaps Deb should rename her new finding as it is causing confusion.

Hey TheresaMary,

I've read a ton of forum posts, but of course I can't read any of the PMs between Loli and Loulou. The paper trail on the FlexEffect forum indicates that Loli got an idea to create a cheek bootcamp from a Spanish doctor or exercise expert (can't remember which). What the doctor/expert was recommending was periodization, which is essentially the idea of training harder at sometimes during the year...which can be viewed as a bootcamp, so to speak. However, Loli did not use the exact same sets/reps/training schedule as the doctor/developed. I know that Loli and Loulou were the first to try it out, and they tried it out together and were a team. I don't know Loulou's involvement in determining sets/reps/training schedule; she may have been an equal co-partner, they may have split the work, or she may have simply played an important role as a first tester. Or, Loulou may have been doing her own bootcamp (while Loulou was developing hers), and they merged theirs together. I really don't know, but that's at least what I was able to piece together from the forum. (Although it was Loli alone who did develop the 3-in-1 exercise for the cheeks, which is a key focal point of the cheek bootcamp.)

The good news is that I don't think it really matters who exactly did what, as it seems from the forum that both Loli and Loulou seem to be happy (at least from appearances) in both sharing the credit for developing/working on a bootcamp. So it appears that everyone is at peace Smile

But if you want more clarification, I'm sure they both be willing to provide it.

free skin care · Thu Aug 11, 2011 7:28 pm

Found the 3 in 1 ... Thanks Claudia Wink

free skin care · Fri Aug 12, 2011 5:51 am

The Tripollar STOP has worked wonders for me, the negative is that while the skin has become tighter it's shown up the lack muscles in the face. So Flexaffect sounds like a good place to start especially because of the results its supposed to give around the jaw. Question is how does the Flexaffect differ to other facial exercise programs that dont actually cost anything to purchase?

free skin care · Fri Aug 12, 2011 6:00 am

Hi Echoe

Ok having done a lot of programs, I will give you an answer that I think will help you make a decision but I have to say upfront whilst I still do FlexEffect I always add in things from other programs and always have done so, and I think you'll find that with most people. I suspect that the same is true even for the creators of all the programs.

Now what I will say is that FlexEffect is different because

- its got exercises for the bone - no other english program I've seen has that
- it has a massage technique for skin remodelling. No other program has that
- its got 55 exercises, of which some 30 are done daily
- its got a forum which is regularly staffed by trainers who will often give detailed advice free of charge
- its very detailed, theres science bits, practical bits etc.
- its very physically based. By that I mean theres no nonsense about using the mind to expand the face or shrink the face etc.
- its founder still comes on and speaks about discoveries etc or new techniques (not like Ageless where she only comes on to sell her programme).

What program you comparing it to - that might help us better give our views of that - I've probably done them all and then some!

echoecho wrote:

The Tripollar STOP has worked wonders for me, the negative is that while the skin has become tighter it's shown up the lack muscles in the face. So Flexaffect sounds like a good place to start especially because of the results its supposed to give around the jaw. Question is how does the Flexaffect differ to other facial exercise programs that dont actually cost anything to purchase?

free skin care · Fri Aug 12, 2011 8:06 am

TheresaMary wrote:

Hi Echoe

Ok having done a lot of programs, I will give you an answer that I think will help you make a decision but I have to say upfront whilst I still do FlexEffect I always add in things from other programs and always have done so, and I think you'll find that with most people. I suspect that the same is true even for the creators of all the programs.

Now what I will say is that FlexEffect is different because

- its got exercises for the bone - no other english program I've seen has that
- it has a massage technique for skin remodelling. No other program has that
- its got 55 exercises, of which some 30 are done daily
- its got a forum which is regularly staffed by trainers who will often give detailed advice free of charge
- its very detailed, theres science bits, practical bits etc.
- its very physically based. By that I mean theres no nonsense about using the mind to expand the face or shrink the face etc.
- its founder still comes on and speaks about discoveries etc or new techniques (not like Ageless where she only comes on to sell her programme).

What program you comparing it to - that might help us better give our views of that - I've probably done them all and then some!

echoecho wrote:

The Tripollar STOP has worked wonders for me, the negative is that while the skin has become tighter it's shown up the lack muscles in the face. So Flexaffect sounds like a good place to start especially because of the results its supposed to give around the jaw. Question is how does the Flexaffect differ to other facial exercise programs that dont actually cost anything to purchase?

I would also add that virtually all of the free facial exercises out there are toning exercises, not resistance exercises. It's resistance exercises that have the most capacity to add fullness to the face. That, plus the comprehensiveness of FlexEffect (most programs don't have exercises for all the muscles of the face), are the two most important differences between FlexEffect and virtually everything else out there, in my opinion. (Although I hear that there might be a couple other programs based on resistance training, Facial Magic and Senta Maria Runge's program, but I don't know much about these programs.)

free skin care · Fri Aug 12, 2011 12:20 pm

cm5597 wrote:

TheresaMary wrote:

Hi Echoe

Ok having done a lot of programs, I will give you an answer that I think will help you make a decision but I have to say upfront whilst I still do FlexEffect I always add in things from other programs and always have done so, and I think you'll find that with most people. I suspect that the same is true even for the creators of all the programs.

Now what I will say is that FlexEffect is different because

- its got exercises for the bone - no other english program I've seen has that
- it has a massage technique for skin remodelling. No other program has that
- its got 55 exercises, of which some 30 are done daily
- its got a forum which is regularly staffed by trainers who will often give detailed advice free of charge
- its very detailed, theres science bits, practical bits etc.
- its very physically based. By that I mean theres no nonsense about using the mind to expand the face or shrink the face etc.
- its founder still comes on and speaks about discoveries etc or new techniques (not like Ageless where she only comes on to sell her programme).

What program you comparing it to - that might help us better give our views of that - I've probably done them all and then some!

echoecho wrote:

The Tripollar STOP has worked wonders for me, the negative is that while the skin has become tighter it's shown up the lack muscles in the face. So Flexaffect sounds like a good place to start especially because of the results its supposed to give around the jaw. Question is how does the Flexaffect differ to other facial exercise programs that dont actually cost anything to purchase?

I would also add that virtually all of the free facial exercises out there are toning exercises, not resistance exercises. It's resistance exercises that have the most capacity to add fullness to the face. That, plus the comprehensiveness of FlexEffect (most programs don't have exercises for all the muscles of the face), are the two most important differences between FlexEffect and virtually everything else out there, in my opinion. (Although I hear that there might be a couple other programs based on resistance training, Facial Magic and Senta Maria Runge's program, but I don't know much about these programs.)

Okay I'm trying so hard not to put any more dents in the credit card but all this talk of toning the muscles in the face is just tempting me far to much. From what I have said about after using the Tripollar STOP that the lack muscles have shown up which program would you recommend to me?

free skin care · Sat Aug 13, 2011 7:40 am

Theresa Mary, may I ask, you say that you put in exercises from other programmes next to Flex Effect. Does this mean that some FE exercises are not effective enough, or uneasy to do (can imagine that you try an alternative to the fingers in mouth exercise,especially if you have long fingernails).

In the clip there is a short demo of the skin remodelling massage. As I see it, it's breaking up fragile fibres in the skin that will be replaced (hopefully) by stronger and healthier fibres? Does this cause any swelling? And do you have to keep on doing it, or is it something you do like twice a year for a week or so, to give your skin a boost? And does it require the use of skin remodelling actives like CP?

At first I was skeptical about the bone thing. Never heard of exercise to stimulate bone growth. But when I thought it over I realised that I had encountered the principle idea, in the way people who have had an amputation are encouraged to keep on moving muscle etc. to prevent atrophy of both muscle AND bone. So I'm impressed because this shows that Deborah Crowley really researched into the changes of the face due to aging and adapts techniques used in the medical field. Of course only time can tell how effective they will be in the long run but to me it shows she's really on top of things.
I have some months to go before I have the money to spend on some programme or other so I keep on reading up, comparing reactions in these threads etc. and seriously think things over.

free skin care · Sat Aug 13, 2011 2:48 pm

Just a comment. I truly enjoy the mental mind-energy aspect of some of the other programs. I can't imagine thinking of it as nonsense. The mind is a very powerful thing.

TheresaMary wrote:

Hi Echoe

- its very physically based. By that I mean theres no nonsense about using the mind to expand the face or shrink the face etc.- What program you comparing it to - that might quote]

free skin care · Mon Aug 15, 2011 4:09 am

Hi Lotusesther

Well its not to say they’re not effective enough, but sometimes I don’t feel them as much as I do when I do exercises from other programs. For example they’ve got one for the chin which I do feel in the chin, but there’s another exercise I do of Eva Fraser’s which is similar to that, but works the whole lower face and the lower face is one of my bad parts that doesn’t seem to respond as fast as the other places do so it needs a little more work. I don’t mind so much the fingers in the mouth – but the ones that work the ml’s with the thumbs in the mouth I find difficult to do personally.

In the clip, the cross stretching I labelled wrongly as a massage and have since learned its not considered a massage at all but a technique. I think that’s tomatoe tomato kind of argument but just thought I better add it for sake of ease. It does break up fragile weak fibres in order to encourage them to become stronger. It is something you do with 2-3 days rest after each time you do it and there are two different ways of doing it, and like the exercises you kind of rotate them on a variation basis to stop the face second guessing you. You don’t need to use skin remodelling actives from what I read but she does advise you to be taking supplements to help the skin remodel itself. Deb argues it’s a remodelling process for the skin and I have to say that I do believe her on that I’ve seen the results on my own skin.

I wasn’t sceptical about the bone, as there was a thread on EDS some time ago about a Chinese bone remodelling massage but the trouble for me was that the instructions weren’t in English. I don’t know whether Deb saw that thread and used it as a basis for her method (I suspect she did) but who knows. I’m very glad that we do finally have proper instructions about bone remodelling in English though as guessing on pictures can be misleading and lead to disasterous results. I learned that the hard way!

Lotusesther wrote:

Theresa Mary, may I ask, you say that you put in exercises from other programmes next to Flex Effect. Does this mean that some FE exercises are not effective enough, or uneasy to do (can imagine that you try an alternative to the fingers in mouth exercise,especially if you have long fingernails).

In the clip there is a short demo of the skin remodelling massage. As I see it, it's breaking up fragile fibres in the skin that will be replaced (hopefully) by stronger and healthier fibres? Does this cause any swelling? And do you have to keep on doing it, or is it something you do like twice a year for a week or so, to give your skin a boost? And does it require the use of skin remodelling actives like CP?

At first I was skeptical about the bone thing. Never heard of exercise to stimulate bone growth. But when I thought it over I realised that I had encountered the principle idea, in the way people who have had an amputation are encouraged to keep on moving muscle etc. to prevent atrophy of both muscle AND bone. So I'm impressed because this shows that Deborah Crowley really researched into the changes of the face due to aging and adapts techniques used in the medical field. Of course only time can tell how effective they will be in the long run but to me it shows she's really on top of things.
I have some months to go before I have the money to spend on some programme or other so I keep on reading up, comparing reactions in these threads etc. and seriously think things over.

free skin care · Mon Aug 15, 2011 4:11 am

Great for you that you get it Sister, but for those of us who don't, its a difficult one to tread. I even asked Maggio for help via email and she came back with a one liner which wasn't helpful at all. Besides I truly am one who likes to know what i'm doing with exercise - so for example with face widener and face contour - when I wrote asking what muscles these exercises worked I was told not to focus on the muscles simply expanding or contouring the face. Nice and helpful huh!

Whilst I agree with you the mind is a powerful tool, I truly can't help nor have I seen any real proof that just thinking the face wider or contouring it has actually provided any tangible proof for anyone. I'm happy if you can prove me wrong though - please do!

sister sweets wrote:

Just a comment. I truly enjoy the mental mind-energy aspect of some of the other programs. I can't imagine thinking of it as nonsense. The mind is a very powerful thing.

TheresaMary wrote:

Hi Echoe

- its very physically based. By that I mean theres no nonsense about using the mind to expand the face or shrink the face etc.- What program you comparing it to - that might quote]

free skin care · Mon Aug 15, 2011 4:12 am

Has anyone else used any of the new Flexeffects products yet for the skin. Suppose it was only a matter of time for them to copy the others (Facercise, Facial Magic etc). Just waiting for Loulou now to come out with hers then I think we're done! ha ha.

free skin care · Mon Aug 15, 2011 5:07 pm

i have tried the new scrub once so far. i like it a lot. i am using the cucumber scented serum daily for over a week now and love it! so far no bad reactions!!!! i had to wait til a cold sore i had for a couple of weeks went away before i could try any of the new product.
i do not know what to expect from the scrub. I hope it helps tighten up my forehead a bit. I had a negative reaction to copper peptides years ago and had a tiny section of my forehead skin turn a bit crepe paperish and nothing I have done (needling, microdermabrasion, dpl nuve, 10% glycolic acid, salicylic acid, vitamin c serum, matryxil 3000, snake oil...) combined with forehead exercises has smoothed out my skin on my brow again. I am doing cross stretching twice a week. And I see a great reduction in depth in a central forehead scar I have had since I was a 9 year old kid- so I am hopeful that adding one more tool to my arsenal will help. Smile

Everyone tells me I look great. For my age. Thats all well and lovely. But
I want to look great. period!!!!

free skin care · Mon Aug 15, 2011 9:22 pm

I'm quite happy with my skin care products but I wish Deb and Claudia all the best with what they are selling.

free skin care · Sat Mar 07, 2015 8:32 am

Hi All,

Sean (FE trainer) has left the FlexEffect forums and deleted his account. We'd like to try to rebuild the forums now, so that they are a helpful resource. There are two forums:

* FlexEffect workshop forum for people who own the program to ask questions from FE trainers and veterans: http://flexeffectworkshop.proboards.com

* FlexEffect general forum: this is for people who have questions about the program. There is also a place to post questions and have discussions about other facial exercise programs. There is even a folder for discussions on Ageless, which Loulou has posted too Smile

. The website is: http://flexeffect.proboards.com

We'd love to have more people join us Smile

P.S. I am not a trainer, nor did any one ask me to do this post. I am just an enthusiastic user of the program, and I've secretly always wanted the forums to return to the fun and helpful place they were several years ago when many people posted regularly, rather than just a few people. So that is my motive Smile

Tue Mar 10, 2015 2:42 pm

Sorry to hear that Sean is not there anymore! I will say that I wouldn't be without the program. I'm a 13 year flexer. =)

free skin care · Wed Mar 11, 2015 6:29 am

I’ve already had several emails with questions over my absence, so just want to clarify things and ensure accuracy is here and no misinformation or confusion. I realised and recognised I had been on the forum as a trainer for some several years and that during that time I had devoted quite a lot of my own personal time and energy to flexers. For me recently, I noticed it just wasn’t the same enjoyable task as it once was. I was getting quite a bit of dirt thrown my way for various things that were happening and it just wasn’t working for me. I used to get bombarded with messages that I always strived to help people out with suggestions, and ideas or concepts to empower them yet interestingly enough I began to recognise that some people weren’t willing to do the work for results. This was really brought home to me during the final few weeks on the forum, and .

More worryingly, I discovered some time ago a lot of the information I had typed over the years was being reproduced (without permission) and in reading some of them I was so scared that the information was completely wrong. I was horrified reading part of a conversation I had with a flexer where I was talking about the mineral balance within the body and the role of calcium, magnesium, sodium and potassium and asking this person about their diet and with my background I could see straight away that this person was just lacking in potassium (and presented various symptoms showing this. So originally I advised this person to look at ingesting potassium rich foods and possibly supplementing. However this turned into “everyone has to take high amounts of potassium” and that wasn’t what was said and is completely wrong.

Not everyone is deficient in potassium, so working with bodies I would never advise that unless a person is highly deficient and even then I would recommend they seek medical advice first to ascertain there isn’t an underlying challenge or problem with their bodies. There were several examples where completely incorrect information was given out that looked like it was me, but would actually cause the opposite of what I aim to achieve in working with people and their bodies. I took the decision to remove those posts and that was something that didn’t go down too well but I felt safer knowing that information was removed and couldn’t be misinterpreted was a far more greater good. Luckily I also had taken steps to get the posts on the other forum removed (but had to seek legal advice to action that and it took some time).

I am so grateful for Deb & Claudia for everything they have both done, and for my fellow co-trainers but recognised that I’m wanting to devote more time to other projects and simply wanted to take time off the forum. I am remaining a trainer, just not wishing to participate in the forum to the same extent I once had chosen to do so – I’m not giving up on Flex Effect. I continue to follow the program and am pretty sure I’m going to be doing it till my final days on the planet as I love it. Whilst I’m not on the forum, there are other trainers around who do answer questions and so it really is a great program.

Wed Mar 11, 2015 4:48 pm

Totally understand Sean! You are and have always been a valuable asset to the flex effect team! Wish you the best! =)

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