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Mon Oct 09, 2006 1:32 pm  |
I was going to do a total review at the end of two months, but I doubt I could actually recall everything accurately. So I will update you guys as I go.
Some background on my skin
Before I started Zenbiotic I was using mostly natural skincare anyway, like Dr H, Jurlique, Decleor, but after a year of sticking to all-natural, I felt the improvements in my skin were at a plateau, the products were good for treating problems of excessive sebum production and blemishes/blocked pores - but I was not having 100% clear skin, and my skin felt 'clogged' and heaving from having to use oils day and night.
I was also having problems with dehydration which no product was treating extremely well, and as always the issue of sensitised skin was not going away.
Initial doubts
Despite the great reviews on Zenbiotic, when I actually read the underlying philosophies, I was a little apprehensive about another totally different concept of using only water and oxygen on the skin, and OILS were actually preventing nutrients from being absorbed.. So I was afraid that my skin was going be bone dry because there is no oil in the Foundation Pack, and my sebum production was going to return to those "Clean and Clear" days. 
First day
I was extremely excited to receive my goodies  and literally jumped straight into the shower to start using them.
The Cleanser will definitely be replacing my beloved A'kin gel cleanser of past 2 years, because it is simply divine. I thought the ingredients were a bit DIY (simple, too simple??) and the claims of 'gentle magnetic forces lifting dirt and oil residue' to be a bit hocus-pocus. But whatever it does, I use 1-2 pumps and it removes all traces of makeup and oil, and it cleanses the body so well too. I don't need to rub the cleanser, but instead I just use gentle sweeps and it is enough to cleanse.
After applying the Oxyprep and Phyto moisturiser, I dabbed a little of the Synergy serum on, and it did tingle slightly. One trick is to quickly spread the product over a very damp face, otherwise it just ends up drying on contact.
I knew after I had applied everything (despite still not having used any regular face oils yet) that I would not be needing anything else on my skin.. it felt SO comfortable, not taut or dry. In fact, the dehydration on my skin which is only noticeable when I smile or squint, completely disappeared, even after everything had been absorbed. Normally with the Skinceuticals B5 gel and other HA serums, I see instant hydration but it disappears within minutes and provides no lasting results.
I think most skins will have trouble adapting to absorbing the nutrients, and will feel very sticky and tacky after a while. My skin felt like that for almost 30 minutes, then it became baby soft.
I didn't have any issues with extreme oiliness the next morning, unlike when I use a Decleor Balm, I can be extremely greasy the next morning.
The first week
I have been using only the Zenbiotic range, not even other pimple treatments. At once stage I was still using Jurlique cleansing cream after the cleanser, because I still felt I needed to have some oils on my face to balance my skin. I think this was a big mistake, because the otherwise balancing film that Jurlique leaves, completely prevented the products from being absorbed. After 1-2 hours my skin became a greaseball. I don't have issues with mal-absorption unless I use Jurlique, so I feel it is only fair to begin Zenbiotic as a total regime to get a feel of the products and allow the system to work for the skin.
Last night I implemented the Cell Renew serum with the Synergy serum to step up the nutrition. I did this after I had exfoliated with the advised baking soda mix, and it drove my skin crazy. I don't know if it is the baking soda that causes the pH of the skin to revolt but it stung like mad.
Then I applied both serums and my skin was itching for about 10 minutes. When my skin is sensitive it gets these little 'bumps' which are like tiny mosquito bites, and if you scratch it, it will develop into a big sore spot. I had half a dozen of these bumps on my face after I applied both serums - and I think the baking soda misadventure made the irritation worse. But remarkably after about 10 minutes, my skin just instantly calmed down.
So after a week of Zenbiotic, I have noticed
- 100% improvement in hydration
- Clear pores like when I used the Henry Tianus clarifying serum
- Fast healing spots, even without other spot treatments
- Reduced oil production
- Stabalising my irritated skin, does not cause redness, though does nothing to improve it either
I had this persistent discoloration on the corner of my mouth from about a year ago, from excessive exfoliation, and sometimes it darkens to a brown colour, which annoys the heck out of me. Then at one stage last week it had become a scab!! I was so worried and tried to exfoliate it then applied copious amounts of vitamin e, vitamin c and rosehip oil, it just make it worse. Then I decided to wipe the whole nose/mouth area, where I was experiencing lots of flakies, with a cotton swab and the Cleanser. Then I sprayed ample amounts of Oxyprep and Phyto, and dabbed a bit of the Synergy serum on - I was so amazed that it healed the area in less than 24 hours, the dead skin peeled off to reveal soft skin underneath - something that no other product could do in the past year!! |
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Mon Oct 09, 2006 1:57 pm |
This sounds perfect for my skin! I just ordered the Foundation Pack!!
What are you using for sunscreen? No oils? My sunscreen I believe has oils in it... |
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Mon Oct 09, 2006 2:37 pm |
Miranets,
Do you know the pH of the Zenbiotics cleanser? I am looking for a new cleanser that is pH 7 or lower and detergent-free.
priscilla |
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Mon Oct 09, 2006 2:58 pm |
| miranets, thank you for this great review! It was particularly interesting to me because I think our situations are similar--- I've been trying to use mainly natural products, and while I had decent results getting my oil production under control, all those oils left my skin REALLY congested. Now, I've totally turned things around. I've cut out all the oils from my routine, actually. I've found that just by using the Zenbiotic products that I get plenty of hydration, and my clogged pores are disappearing one by one and no new ones are coming to replace them, yay!! I haven't tried any of their serums yet, but I've had such good results from the Oxytoner, O2, and Phyto that I want to add one, I just need to figure out which one. |
_________________
27, sensitive/reactive/acne prone skin, dark brown hair, blue eyes, possibly the palest woman alive... |
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Mon Oct 09, 2006 8:11 pm |
Firstly, because I had no time to finish the review, here is another miraculous and literally instantaneous result I have experienced from the foundation pack-
I have ALWAYS had severely dry skin on my legs, and now that I'm older, some parts of my body also develop scary looking dry patches. I have tried tons of different products, from supermarket moisturisers to rosehip oil. Oils are great, especially if you use them regularly, but they take time to absorb and leave a trace and smell on all your clothes. Plus, I had badly neglected my skin for years, and the skin on my shins especially, had developed deep wrinkles that could be likened to something grandmother's have.
At one stage, my body seemed to not be able to absorb any oil, and I would feel itching and tingling as soon as I had applied it, and the next morning I would see the same dried up skin again.. sometimes I wondered if it was making it worse???
Then I tried the Oxyprep toner and the Phyto moisturiser on my legs and abdomen after a shower, and before it dried I also applied the rosehip oil. Within a few minutes my skin was feeling very moist, not that greasy type of moist.. and the next morning I actually had respectable looking skin on my legs. I have never used something that has helped the rosehip oil absorb sooo well. I think my skin *needs* the oil and vitamins, but can't somehow breakup the nutrients so it wasn't doing anything but being absorbed into my pajamas. I don't know how it works, but the results speak for themselves. |
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Mon Oct 09, 2006 8:12 pm |
| Lucinda wrote: |
This sounds perfect for my skin! I just ordered the Foundation Pack!!
What are you using for sunscreen? No oils? My sunscreen I believe has oils in it... |
Lucinda, I think you will love it. Be sure to pass on your feedback to Robert from Zenbiotic, so he can realise what a cult following ZB is starting to have!!
I don't use sunscreen at all  because I have never been able to find one that won't ruin my skin's balance.. ZB does offer a sunscreen that has oil in it, they recommend it for those who are not used to using just water-based products yet. I don't want to sound elitist or pushing ZB products, but I think most people would see better results if they stuck with the whole line, especially when starting out. Like I mentioned above, so many issues with absorption because I was afraid to let go of oils..
| Quote: |
Miranets,
Do you know the pH of the Zenbiotics cleanser? I am looking for a new cleanser that is pH 7 or lower and detergent-free.
priscilla |
Prscilla I am not sure of the pH, perhaps you can email Robert from ZB to find out, but the ingredients are (all available on the site)
Purified water, vegetable glycerin, almond oil, castor oil, rosemary, aloe Vera, rose, alfalfa, kelp, sea weed, organic flax oil, horsetail and walnut oil, acrimony, borage, catnip, chamomile, chervil, comfrey, fennel sweet, feverfew.
It is a gel cleanser which is non foaming, but it is one of the best cleansers I have ever used, and it is definitely not harsh at all, if that is your concern.
Liz - yes unfortunately I didn't want to abandon the whole philosophy I had been sticking with for so long, but it was a great one for what it did to balance oily skins. I started using the Synergy serum first, I don't know why, but just picked one of the two so it won't overload myskin. The synergy serum is the one filled with HA, and it is really great for hydration, and you really need like less than a drop at first. The cell renewal serum is a little different, it has a jelly like texture, which means you have to really "dip" your finger in to get anything out, because otherwise it just has this surface tension that doesn't break  .
If it were me, I would still use both serums one for the hydration both day and night, and the cell renewal for night repair.
I am also thinking of switching to the Oxypro moisturiser, and Moisture Enrichment when winter comes. But I have been surprised at the level of hydration that has even out performed good old rosehip oil.. when I blow my nose I am always left with flakies, and they are non-existent now..
I am also thinking of buying PSF's O2 serum, but I am also really keen to try the ZB Oxygen Detoxifier which is a more 'natural' alternative,  it's like a $30 difference. |
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Mon Oct 09, 2006 8:56 pm |
Great review Miranets!
I was tempted to buy the Foundation Pack, but just bought the OxyPrep, Phyto Moisturiser, Oxygen Detoxifier and the Collodial Silver. They included a sample of the cleanser which I have tried yet, still finishing off my Henry Tianus one, but am looking forward to trying it now!
The Oxygen Detoxifier doesn't seem as 'potent' as the PSF O2 spray, but considering the price it's a great alternative, and i've been seeing good results with the Zenbiotics one.
At the moment I've just been using the OxyPrep, followed by the Oxygen Detoxifier, then the phyto Moisturiser and lastly sunscreen. I'm not sure when I should use my Skinceuticals C Serum? Before I have used any of the other products or somewhere in between? I've just ordered the IS Clinical Super Serum so can anyone suggest where in which order I should use the products?
TIA |
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Mon Oct 09, 2006 10:29 pm |
I'd do this:
Oxytoner
Oxygen
Vit C
Oxygen again (for better absorption OR a spritzer to dampen your face)
Phyto-Moisture
I know that the Vit C from zenbiotics is supposed to go before the phyto-moisture and I've also been using my Vit C before my phyto-moisture. |
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Tue Oct 10, 2006 12:39 am |
| Thanks Sormuimui |
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Tue Oct 10, 2006 1:01 am |
Sel,
Zenbiotic recommend to apply their serums after the Phyto moisture, at least that is what I have been doing. Then if I try to apply 2 serums, it dries up too fast so I have to spritz the Oxyprep in between each product, and they do recommend to apply all serums while the skin is wet so you need less because absorption is maximised.. I would also introduce nonZB products one at a time to see how they react.
I tried the Vit C & MSM serum once and it stung  but that was on the first night (oh man I felt like smearing my face with every serum I had ).
As for the other oxygen products, I will really have to see how my skin reacts and heals spots in the long run. If my skin suffers another 'plateau' with ZB, I will have to buy the PSF O2 (and get the Decleor balms out again).. I seem to be getting lots of extra bumps here and there, but they heal within a day and leave no marks. This is the kind of purging I could get used to. |
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Wed Oct 11, 2006 12:23 pm |
I emailed Robert of Zenbiotic regarding some of the issues that I felt have been raised and unanswered, mainly about the acid/alkaline issue. His reply is nothing I would not have been able to find out on the ZB site already
1. Why are the products alkaline, not neutral? If the skin is naturally acidic, why would you need to apply alkaline products? It is suggested that the acid mantle of the skin is necessary to keep bacteria and fungal growth at bay, how can this be achieved in an alkaline environment?
1) Many of our products are alkaline due to a few reasons:
a) We mathematically formulate and choose herbs and ingredients according to their specific health benefits to skin cells. The formulas come out slightly alkaline in nature to reflect the natural pH of the these ingredients.
b) In order to maintain a high energy frequency of the ingredients, we cant mix acidic and alkaline together without an energy transfer taking place. This is why you don't mix acids and bases together in the home without posing some danger. Acids steal oxygen and bases (pH 7.01 and higher) supply it. Part of the success of high absorbency and high bio-availability with Zenbiotic products comes about because we don't let that energy transfer take place until the formulas make contact with the human body. Our formulas are negatively charged due to the technology yet the body is positively charged. When the formulas are topically applied to skin, that energy transfer takes place. If it took place before it made contact, the shelf-life and efficacy would suffer substantially.
c) The magnetic nanotechnology imparted upon the formulas attracts and supplies oxygen much like blood. Blood, as we know, has to be alkaline in order to carry oxygen. Our product carry an abundance of oxygen to skin cells and attract oxygen throughout the day.
2. Our blood pH may be slightly alkaline, is this the correlation that Zenbiotic takes on how the skin should be too, and why?
2) The technology acts as a delivery system, similar to blood. Skin cells accept oxygen and nutrients via the bloodstream. It makes sense to also deliver nutrients and oxygen via a similar pH system as this is how the body evolved. The body never evolved sustaining itself with topically applied nutrition or hydration. We, therefore, have to simulate how the body actually does sustain itself but achieve this via a means that will be acceptable to the natural biology of skin. The misconception of skin care is that we assume the body will accept it when for millennia the body evolved, as did most all life, via a digestive, circulatory, and respiratory system. Do we really think that somehow we can circumvent that? Zenbiotic only strives to supplement what the body no longer does for skin cells in the same way it did when we were young.
The acid mantel is not terribly affected by introducing slightly alkaline formulas onto the skin. The body balances out the pH where it needs it and when it needs it. In fact, the body expends the most amount of energy balancing out the pH within the body, and especially in blood. By making most of our formulations alkaline, we create a window through which we may oxygenate, hydrate, and nourish skin cells. The acid mantel rebalances quickly. Our products range between 7.5 and 8.0. Many hand soaps are close to 9.0 which is 10 times more alkaline than 8.0 and 100 times more than 7.0
3. If the Zenbiotic philosophy is alkaline based, why do you offer an acid product - the glycolic polish?
3) The Glyco has an exfoliant function rather than a nutritional function. Glyco should be use with conservation and caution. Many of our clients have been asking for this product for quite a while. We acquiesced but you're right in pointing out this anomaly.
4. How are the essential oils and non water soluble products made water soluble through Zenbiotic technology?
4) Via the nanotechnology, magnetic forces break down the oils into substantially smaller, bio-available molecule chains. Due to the smaller size, they don't block pores or asphyxiate skin.
5. The formulation process mentioned on the website, regarding the 9-12 month cold-extraction process, how exactly is this possible?
5) The skin care was developed over 15 years ago as a hobby by our lead scientist. Already a multi-billionaire, he was not interested in marketing to the masses. He was and will always be interested in making the most effective skin care without compromise. We don't have the resources to supply the world; we couldn't.
And as always, if you are able to provide links to published or peer reviewed studies that would be great too.
Harvard, Monsanto, and several pharmaceutical companies have tried in vain for many years to reverse engineer this technology. Understanding the technology is necessary before a wide dissemination of studies take place. The scientist refuses to paten the technology for fear of giving away too much information. The information shared here today comes directly from the lead scientist through his work in applying the technology to areas such as cancer treatment, ecological products, and of course skin care. As far as we know, our approach is completely unique and although it runs counter to some widely accepted practices, our positive results over a period of 15 years tell a compelling argument. |
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Wed Oct 11, 2006 1:13 pm |
And this is especially for Theresa  I am always in favour of challenging any popular product, and have learnt to accept that even when it comes to one that I am using, I also have to keep an eye out for different points of view. I am totally open minded to both sides of the argument, and would like to hear other people's constructive inputs as well.
So here I attempt to explain some of the results ZB users have experienced, but ultimately it is going to come down to the long term results I experience from the product, not the theoretical possibilies of harm or benefit that will entice me to continue or look for another holy grail.
1. Sudden, clear and fast healing skin
Most of us were using oil based products, complicated regimes with prescription products + rich emollient products, and it could be possible that the sudden removal of oils from the regime did allow our blocked pores/pimples to heal faster and general skin turnover to increase because we have lifted this thick and veil off, so that in it self could have been increasing oxygen supply to the skin surface.
Ok, so I could have saved myself $300 and bought something else cheaper to do the same job, but that's the exact problem - I can't find anything out there that has the same aesthetics and moisturising qualities as Zenbiotics.. I have tons of facial lotions (Living Nature, Jurlique, PSF...) that were made for Oily Skin, but do nothing for me in terms of hydration and keeping my face balanced.
2. Increased levels of hydration
Ingredients wise, glycerine is one of the things that MAY be giving extra moisture, when emulsified with good quality water it will form a breatheable shield over the skin. The Synergy serum is supposed to have "vast amounts" of HA in it, and given my results with other HA products I was not entirely pleased, but maybe somehow the whole fermentation process of the serum does allow it to be more bio-available and absorbable.
Before starting ZB, I really put an effort to allow more WATER into my skin, so before any product went on my face, I would always spray toners like Caudalie grape water or PSF R&R, but it made my skin feel really *gross* especially when I had to layer oil products on my skin after. I did not notice any significant improvement in my dehydration, especially after the products had dried, and I still constantly suffered from flakies around the mouth/nose area.. and if I applied MMU on top it felt bone-dry.. I do not experience this with ZB at all.
I am only speaking for myself for this one. Over the years I have noticed that my REAL skintype is actually dry, because the rest of my body shoulders down is constantly needing moisture, and my face was only incredibly oily because of a. hrmones b. bad skincare c. irritation + dehydration triggers excess sebum production especially in the face to balance itself.
So now that my skin has actually reached the point where I have been able to go for a few days just using crap ol moisturisers and cleansers, and still be able to balance oil production reasonably well. Now that Zenbiotic has come at just the right time, I have been able to move onto another product that does not cause any issues of dryness so it does not send my skin helter skelter.
3. Oxygenation ?? !!
When I look at the ingredient list for the Oxygen Replenish which is meant to be the $2 version of PSF 02, I see the only ingredient as "charged water".. so here is my logical break down of this
1. ZB makes the product alkaline, which means the theory of alkaline products allows any substance to carry more oxygen anyway
2. the product does not need a chemical oxygen carrier like PSF, because of its naturally alkaline environment, and it is de ionized and "charged" water (which is another contentious issue...)
3. you need to use this product along with the whole range to reap the benefits of increased absorption and oxygenation
So I don't think this type of oxygenation is BAD, because there are no potent chemicals used in the carrier process. But again, we may not know that there is any oxygen in the products because of the lack of ingredients, so we could be paying $13 for a 2oz bottle of water.
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Those were the only issues I could think of off the top of my head, but since I have not had breakfast, more will probably arise later.
But as always, there are several changes that have occured that CANNOT be explained.. so I would have to give credit for the technology behind ZB which may seem too spiritual or hocus pocus for some, even myself.
Firstly, since I have used La Prairie's de-sensitising serum and my own green tea polyphenol face toner, the level of irritation in my skin has reduced and stabilised incredibly, but I have stopped using either products completely for almost 1-2 months now. I still get red from exfoliation, but I never experience angry flushing or redness that persists the whole day. And the ZB products have not contributed to any irritation, and in fact are very calming for the skin. I used to get rather flushed looking after applying all my oils and creams, but I don't experience that with the ZB regime.
I am a really big believer of the effect that plant and herb growth and extraction quality affect the final product. Before ZB, I have only used two natural skincare ranges that have made a significant difference to my skin - Dr H and Jurlique (and Henry Tianus, but that could be the high vitamin C content), and I believe this is because they do claim that the plants used in the extracts are cultivated in biodynamic farms at the peak of bio-vitality, and the rest of the process ensures that the plant 'essence' is not sacrificed. This is the same philosphy of ZB. But these are all claims by the companies, and it is only the end results that show through for it.
Compare this to say, a company that buys a tonne of powdered herbs to add in their 'natural' products, but nothing can be said about how the herbs were grown, how nutritious they were, if the drying process caused excessive loss of nutrition.. etc etc. |
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Wed Oct 11, 2006 3:05 pm |
Wow, miranets!!! You are so awesome for your review and research on this line!
I am SO struggling with my acne right now. I've just switched over to all Dr. H except for some Decleor oils that I'm experimenting with to see which one is best for me. Ever since manslayerliz has been lauding this line, I have been so tempted to buy the O2 spray. Now you have me tempted to try the whole line! I will give Dr. H some time yet (heck, I now have all the products, I'd better not ditch them now...I can't afford it!  ) but if my acne doesn't improve, I will try this line next. Thanks for helping me learn so much about it! |
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Wed Oct 11, 2006 3:38 pm |
Ellyp, I am still a great fan of Dr H, it was one of the first natural skincare lines I used. It took me a while, a long while, for my skin to adjust and balance, at one point I really wanted to ditch Dr H all together, but I am glad I didn't. I hope your skin will like, LOVE Dr H, don't stray and you will see results. Please feel free to drop me a line if you want some tips.. I know how frustrating it can be to want a solution for clear skin  You are not missing out anything yet by not using ZB, think of it as the next step once your skin has balanced itself. |
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Wed Oct 11, 2006 8:53 pm |
I am not sure if by publishing Robert's comments on my questions that it is doing any justice for Zenbiotic. Then again, we are certainly scrutinising this more than anything else I have seen (apart from sunscreens) on this forum, and I actually do appreciate that he takes the time to reply to all the questions. Just keep in mind that, no matter how far-out his proposed theories sound, he is actually replying to my emails which must mean he believes in what he does. Below are some more questions I posted to him, and his responses. I don't really have a background in chemistry, so these concepts are totally new to me so even I am sitting on the fence on the theories.
1. You mention that you cannot mix acid/alkaline together without creating a
reaction, then how can the apple cider vinegar in Oxyprep be stablised, and is the vitamin c in the Vit C and MSM serum stabilised (we assume that vit c has to be acidic to enetrate the skin)?
1) The ingredients, of differing pH values, are blended together. Then the technology imparts a negative magnetic field. Once that happens, they cant be blended with anything else or an energy transfer might take place. We have different serums due to the fact that some ingredients are not stable with others. The ingredients blended with the Vit. C work well with together and are stabilized by the technology and don't have the kind of pH as some of our other serums. Vitamin C is in fact extremely unstable due to the high amount of anti-oxidants it contains. Most commercial Vit. C out there is not in an active state. The body cannot utilize Vit. C unless it is kept in an active state. Our technology activates Vit. C along with the other ingredients. Unfortunately, the anti-oxidants degrade molecular structure over time so this particular product should be kept in the refrigerator. Apple cider vinegar has an acidic pH and can only be blended with other ingredients that don't create this energy transfer so the pH of certain products will vary accordingly to the blend of course.
2. Can you explain more behind the concept of the nano-technology that is applied to ZB products? How small are the particles exactly? How can particles be magnetised?
2) The technology imparts a perfect negative magnetic field at the atomic level of submicroscopic particles moving at immeasurable speeds. Its biological effect is to place cells in a perfect state of homeostasis, thus it has an enormous curative effect as well. For this reason, the technology has been applied to cancer research with some phenomenal results, of which I am in no authoritive position to comment on.
With regards to the size question, if I remember the analogy correctly, if an oil molecule is the size of a basketball, our technology renders it the size of a ping pong ball.
3. Why do you think this sort of technology and philosophy has not become well-known and accepted?
3) This is a good question indeed. It is the hopes of Zenbiotic to rattle the industry a bit with a new approach to skin care. Our lead scientist was never interested in marketing the skin care himself to the masses and those involved with it do not share the aspiration of setting up a mass distribution as well. Business development has relied almost entirely on word of mouth. They live very happily having their time to themselves. Investors always want to meet the lead scientist, inspect the labs, and analyze the supply chain. He has no interest for investors and enjoys spending his time on medical cures and treatments. For these reasons, the skin care has been kept relatively outside of the spotlight. I have collaborated with the developers to set up a company to introduce the skin care and other applications to the mass market within the confines of strict integrity, a characteristic that abounds with those involved. The great care it takes to cold-extract, formulate, and render is too expensive and time-consuming for most investors to consider.
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Everything he says is counter-intuitive to me, and in this day and age this is alarm bells for phony etc etc.. but I would give more credit to Zenbiotic for that.. again it is the long term results I will be judging. |
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Sat Oct 14, 2006 9:07 am |
My foundation pack arrived yesterday!!
So far so good!! I am really loving the products so far. My skin feels so comfortable after using them!! My skin looks wonderful today, and I've only used to system twice! Plus I only slept about 5hours in the past 48 hours!!  |
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Sat Oct 14, 2006 11:59 pm |
| I've been looking for a good cleanser and moisturizer, so I'm excited to hear all the rave about this line. Gotta go purchase this asap. Hope it works for my skin. My face is usually combo but now my cheeks and chin is getting dry and I'm breaking out (probably because I'm slathering too much moisturizer). Must be the change of weather but nothing has helped so I'm hoping this will. |
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Sun Oct 15, 2006 1:30 am |
Just an update..
I have since added the Cell Renewal serum reguarly into my night regime with the Synergy serum. I no longer have issues with dryness and dehydration.. no flakies or tight skin.
I wore makeup for the first time in 5 days (mineral with Jurlique silk dust primer, no more Pure Luxe line eraser for oil control) and I felt entirely comfortable after application - normally my skin actually feels taut, and can flake badly if I am heavy-handed and it means that I'll have to touch up with water all day.
My skin has also adjusted itself so it can take in more serums than before, given that I use more Oxyprep and Phyto. I used to have a hard time dealing with the 'grease' because of mal-absorption, but since then I have upped my usage of the serums and it has been absorbing very well.
As for blemishes and blocked pores, I did a Dr H clay mask a week ago and I had several spots come up but I have avoided treating them to see how well they heal - and so far, it is a little slower but they leave no dark marks or form white heads. But other than that no pimples that have formed along the side of my face (even though I STILL keep sleeping on my side).
I have come to realise that, YES the texture of my skin is naturally (or as a result of oily skin and bad skincare in the past) large pored, thus making me very prone to blocked pores and poor skin maintenance means bad and unclear complexion, and NO I can probably never smooth it out without the help of peels or aggresive and invase treatments, so all I can do is keep my pores clear and that is the best thing for a glowing complexion.
Another issue with my skin is its sensitivity and redness. The redness usually becomes ruddy looking once it fades, even under heavy mineral makeup. One of the worst places to look at my skin is in the workplace bathroom - the sharp and artificial lights highlight every single imperfection... I used to have good success at controlling redness with the Jurlique cleansing cream, but again it plateaued and did not manage the redness if other irritating factors worsened. Now yesterday was the first time I used makeup since starting ZB, and normally when I look close I can still see redness and to an extent, irritation.. but this time I noticed that the irritation of my skin was improved dramatically - I would hardly even call it irritation, more like natural flush, I mean, the best it has been EVER. No I am not porcelain white, but at least my skin tone is returning to its true colour, meaning it matches with my neck/chest.
I will be adding the Vit C & MSM serum tomorrow, alternating with the two foundation serums.. then after a week I will start a 3-product alternation with the Amino treatment.. I am not expecting anything spectacular or miraculous (just being a cynic in general) but just the foundation pack has already done more than all my skincare before combined has ever achieved, I am almost afraid? to think what the more potent products can achieve. |
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Sun Oct 15, 2006 7:02 am |
I have to agree, miranets, as I have the same reaction (good!) with the products. I use them currently in my AM routine and occasionally during the day when I am not wearing makeup for a nice application of moisture. They are great.
My breakouts are pretty much non-existent (except when I introduce another product my skin doesn't like). I am still happy with the other items I use (like emu oil and HA) but this line is a great adjunct, which is exactly what I'd hoped it would be. |
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42; medium, warm-toned; large pores prone to congestion; oily; using Karin Herzog exclusively right now!  |
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Sun Oct 15, 2006 2:10 pm |
miranets I have been following your review very closely and have found it all to be very interesting!
You know that I strongly disagree with the "philosohy" behind this brand. Actually I just don't feel that there is any science behind this brand. To be honest Robert's answers to your questions have only served to make me even more skeptical about this brand. So on some level I find myself not able to trust the Zenbiotics brand.
Yet despite the fact that there is no science or logic behind this brand you seem to be getting great results. I applaud your attempts to explain these results with conventional explanations instead of more "esoteric" ones. And I look forward to reading your future posts on these products as well as other member's results.
Honestly I still have concerns about the safety of the colloidal silver product and about whether it is safe to use high pH products long term. But if anyones skin would have a bad reaction to disrupting the skin barrier with alkaline products it would be those of us that have sensitive skin so I think it will be interesting to see if you encounter any problems in that area.
It may be almost impossible to convince me that the "science" behind this brand is sound. We no let me state this a little differently . Explanations like those found on the ZB website or like those that Robert has been so kind to furnish would not convince me. But if I actually started seeing studies or hearing logical explanations that would be a different story. But I will also be focusing on the results that all of you are achieving. I will be keeping an open mind to the fact that these product may despite the science be good products.
P.S. If any of you have pH strips I think it would be a great idea to actually see what the pH of these products really is. |
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Sun Oct 15, 2006 2:37 pm |
Theresa I actually really appreciate that you are raising these concerns about the product. I agree with you entirely about not being able to understand anything of the ZB philosphy, there is just one missing link between what ZB says and what we see - the scientific info!
Just because I have experienced such great results, I am being very careful to not let that cloud my judgement if eventually I do experience some unexpected irritation or reaction - so I would be entirely happy and shameless to speak of negative results too.
I have also taken into consideration about the pH of the products and how they may affect my skin long term, but seeing how my skin which is still sensitised to a lot of other conventional products, I would have expected a dramatic increase in irritation if the pH was not suitable.. I will try to pick up some litmus strips when I'm at a pharmacy next, yes to test it once and for all!!
Perhaps ZB is very misunderstood by the majority of us, because of the lack of scientific studies on the alkalinity issue, and we are unwilling to let go of old (but so logical?) philosophies on skincare. Even at this stage of my foray into skincare, I thought oil was the HG for my skin, and I have been proven wrong.
Anyhow, I will keep everyone updated especially when I start adding new products into the regime. |
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Sun Oct 15, 2006 3:02 pm |
TheresaL, you gave me the push to test out the products for Ph and here are my findings (I'm not thrilled about the cleanser at all after finding this out). I'm a bit peeved at myself for not finding my test strips earlier because I like to keep my cleansers near/at skin's normal Ph level (5.0) or I wait for 15 minutes until it normalizes so as not to further damage the barrier and especially in light of applying actives right away. Here are my test results:
-Rinseless Cleanser 7.75 (not a big deal because I generally don't apply anything after this right away)
-Cleanser 9.0 (frakkity frak!) It may even be higher but that's as far as my test scale goes. I will be using this my body from now on. Sheesh.
-OxyToner 6.25 (not too bad but not great, either)
-Phyto Moisturizer 7.25 (Relatively high but I'll keep an eye on what I apply soon after)
-Oxygen Replenish 7.25
I went ahead a tested my Devita Aloe Vera cleanser and it's 5.5 or lower (lowest spot on scale) so I will be using this from now on to save myself the 15 minute wait. |
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42; medium, warm-toned; large pores prone to congestion; oily; using Karin Herzog exclusively right now! |
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Sun Oct 15, 2006 4:15 pm |
Scalawaggirl, thanks for testing the pH
I am surprised at the pH of the cleanser! Even Robert says ZB products are between a certain pH but not that high!.. But I'm sure I would have had some severe reaction to the cleanser by now because I don't react well to soap or detergents. |
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Sun Oct 15, 2006 4:18 pm |
| miranets wrote: |
Scalawaggirl, thanks for testing the pH
I am surprised at the pH of the cleanser! Even Robert says ZB products are between a certain pH but not that high!.. But I'm sure I would have had some severe reaction to the cleanser by now because I don't react well to soap or detergents. |
I think the benefit/saving grace is that there are no detergents or soap in the cleansers! This probably accounts for the lack of reactivity. I am still not happy about the high Ph, though, especially in light of all the actives I use. If I have the 15 minutes, I won't mind but otherwise, I will use the Devita for cleansing to keep things straight. |
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42; medium, warm-toned; large pores prone to congestion; oily; using Karin Herzog exclusively right now! |
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Sun Oct 15, 2006 6:03 pm |
Now I'm wary of the cleanser pH. I have yet to purchase it but I plan to purchase a full size Phyto-Moisture and I'll probably get a sample of it. Does it help that my toner is pH 4?
Scalawaggirl, since you tested out the pH, I'm very curious as to comparatively the pH of Zen's oxygen vs. pH of PSF's O2 serum. |
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