Dermapen – value?
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free skin care · Thu Apr 04, 2013 6:19 pm

Barefootgirl wrote:

Interesting review of the Dermapen, confirming what we've discussed here... I wonder if she posts here?
the sneezing sounds familiar!

http://gouldyloxreviews.blogspot.com/2013/04/my-dermapen-experience-at-faces-med-spa.html

BFG

Interesting find BFG. Thanks

free skin care · Fri Apr 05, 2013 5:23 am

I'm on a "rest period" from the ReAura Laser so I am now going to do a further six MyM treatments - did my first one last Wednesday - so much for the "rest"!!!

I have to say that I'm loving this device - so much better than a manual roller. As for the skin tearing issue - I haven't found this to be a problem at all. I use the device on the highest speed and I find that there's no significant dragging. I apply Emla and cover with cling wrap, leave for one hour, wipe off and then apply HA. I treat the face for as much as I can stand. My Wednesday treatment was pretty intense - quite bloody and red afterwards. Next morning still a little "sore" with some needle marks but most of the redness had dissipated. Today I'm pretty much back to normal.

Between the ReAura and the MyM I feel that I'm doing the very best for my skin. I believe I'm really starting to see results - my daughter was here last week and she says she can see an enormous improvement in skin texture and tone.

free skin care · Fri Apr 05, 2013 6:04 am

For scars:

Use the Derma pen aggresively.
Microtearing or not doesnt matter-then apply iodine tincture!
Keep aplying and applying for some days till you feel a gooey hard to touch tissue has being made,
indicating regeneration is underneath from deeper dermal layers.After some days this skin will exfoliate and results will be amazing.

I am afraid all of the methods are being hindered due to the fact they act either in an epidermal level either in organisms messed up in inflammation due to the way of living.

free skin care · Fri Apr 05, 2013 7:18 am

Sorry for the confusion, I misread that. It is 12 needles (one cartridge) for $9.

I agree, it's difficult to search for these.

I think I am going to stick with the term "autostamping"

BFG

free skin care · Fri Apr 05, 2013 2:45 pm

Barefootgirl wrote:

Sorry for the confusion, I misread that. It is 12 needles (one cartridge) for $9.

I agree, it's difficult to search for these.

I think I am going to stick with the term "autostamping"

BFG

I was afraid of that ... just too good to be true. Oh well.

I did find this "If you need extra needles, please contact us. The needle price is USD2.5/pc" in the fine print of this my-m posting:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/freeshipping-Auto-Microroller-Motorized-My-M-microneedle-derma-pen/

which seems a good deal --- especially if you can buy just a few at a time. Wonder what shipping is, though.

free skin care · Fri Apr 05, 2013 5:50 pm

I have a really stupid question. Could you do lots of little "punctures", so to speak, with a single needle, like the size of a threading needle (you know v. thin sewing needle or the like) for product penetration?. I wouldn't mind using it on a small pigmentation spot so as my skin lighteners can be more effective. I'm just not sure if I should buy a dermastamp or not. I suppose my "theory" may not work in practice. If someone could answer my dumb question would be great. Embarassed

TYIA

free skin care · Fri Apr 05, 2013 6:47 pm

dionie wrote:

I have a really stupid question. Could you do lots of little "punctures", so to speak, with a single needle, like the size of a threading needle (you know v. thin sewing needle or the like) for product penetration?. I wouldn't mind using it on a small pigmentation spot so as my skin lighteners can be more effective. I'm just not sure if I should buy a dermastamp or not. I suppose my "theory" may not work in practice. If someone could answer my dumb question would be great. Embarassed

TYIA

Totally not stupid -- people definitely do this "single needling". You can probably read lots more about it on the main Dermarolling thread.

I'm not sure I would use a sewing needle, though! I think some people have used some of the smaller gauge lancets, but even those might be a bit too big. Owndoc.com sells single needles especially for this purpose. Maybe you should check those out ....

free skin care · Fri Apr 05, 2013 7:26 pm

Ok...went to that site BFG. How is she getting results from one session with a .25mm? ? I'm not buying it. I wish that was all it took. So what setting are you all using and how often? I haven't used mine yet and wondered if it was worth doing a 1.5mm session now, if I want to do a 2mm in about of month when I will have some days off and can hole up in the house.

CookieD wrote:

Barefootgirl wrote:

Interesting review of the Dermapen, confirming what we've discussed here... I wonder if she posts here?
the sneezing sounds familiar!

http://gouldyloxreviews.blogspot.com/2013/04/my-dermapen-experience-at-faces-med-spa.html

BFG

Interesting find BFG. Thanks

free skin care · Fri Apr 05, 2013 7:53 pm

Mountaingirl - the advantage of a Dermapen is that you can alter the needle length at will for various parts of the face.

I've mainly been using 1mm but on some sections I use 1.5mm - BUT you can also use needle settings in between those those settings.

free skin care · Fri Apr 05, 2013 8:26 pm

bacchus wrote:

dionie wrote:

I have a really stupid question. Could you do lots of little "punctures", so to speak, with a single needle, like the size of a threading needle (you know v. thin sewing needle or the like) for product penetration?. I wouldn't mind using it on a small pigmentation spot so as my skin lighteners can be more effective. I'm just not sure if I should buy a dermastamp or not. I suppose my "theory" may not work in practice. If someone could answer my dumb question would be great. Embarassed

TYIA

Totally not stupid -- people definitely do this "single needling". You can probably read lots more about it on the main Dermarolling thread.

I'm not sure I would use a sewing needle, though! I think some people have used some of the smaller gauge lancets, but even those might be a bit too big. Owndoc.com sells single needles especially for this purpose. Maybe you should check those out ....

Thankyou so much for that. I don't feel too stupid now. LOL
I've read up a bit on "rolling", but new to "stamping" so will read up more on this topic. Will most certainly checkout the webite recommendation as well. For now I really want to try it out a a spot treatment rather than the whole face.
Thankyou so much Very Happy

Fri Apr 05, 2013 8:27 pm

mountaingirl wrote:

I still have a brand new, still sealed in the package, MyM for sale. I accidently ordered two! PM me if you live in the US and are interested.....and I will throw in a few extra needle heads! Wink

hey mountain girl

i'm interested in buying the MyM

can you PM me?

free skin care · Fri Apr 05, 2013 8:40 pm

Mountiangirl- I am mainly using 1.5 but do vary the needle depth some. I have been doing a treatment every 4 weeks.

free skin care · Wed Apr 10, 2013 7:55 pm

Received my "MyM" yesterday and tried it last night. Tried it firstly on my hands and arms, firstly without any topical and then with aloe vera gel (bc my HA has not arrived yet). Worked brilliantly with the gel. I cant beleive what an improvement this is on regular rolling. Not painless but very doable without any numbing. I was so inspired by how easy it was, I also did my forehead and around my eyes. Previously with a roller I could almost not bear to do my forehead..but this was easy (on 1.5). A few blood spots here and there but no major bleeding.

Looking forward to results!

free skin care · Wed Apr 10, 2013 9:23 pm

Hi again,
I hope its okay if I post here as the other thread is so long and no one was able to answer my question. I'm so excited so I have to share somewhere. I didn't purchase the motorised derma stamp but I did purchase a regular one (1mm) and it came in a special package deal with a 0.5mm roller too. I think as a starting point this needle length is good. I rolled and dermastamped. Very Happy

I cant believe I finally did it, but I must be a bigger chicken than most on here because I used numbing cream. It was a little uncomfortable in sections where I purposely didn't put it, just to see what its like. I didn't like the prickly feeling.

My questions are:

*During the roll I slathered on my serums(B serum and one that came with the roller) then after the roll/stamp I wiped it down with cool water then slathered my serums on again (same ones with the addition of copper peptides). Is that okay or did I do it wrong??

*I'm using the stamp mainly on a scar I have near my wrist and pigmentation spots here and there. The rest of the face I roll because its quicker. Do most of you use both rolling and stamp methods?

*Should I apply retina-a tonight or tomorrow night?

* Should I make another attempt in a weeks time. The lady I bought it from said I could use it 2-3x per week (the roller mainly). Just seems like overkill to me.

BTW my face is red, not much bleeding except for where I stamped. Feels hot, like most describe as a sunburn.

Okay only problem now...I didn't think of this Shock

is I have to pick up my daughter from school now. I hope the sunscreen doesn't affect the actives I just put on. Ugh!!! I was too excited and couldn't wait to try Surprised

He..he..he..

Anyways thanks for any input, I know you ladies are busy gals, but soo smart, I just had to ask these questions
TYIA

free skin care · Fri Apr 12, 2013 3:14 am

dionie wrote:

Hi again,
I hope its okay if I post here as the other thread is so long and no one was able to answer my question. I'm so excited so I have to share somewhere. I didn't purchase the motorised derma stamp but I did purchase a regular one (1mm) and it came in a special package deal with a 0.5mm roller too. I think as a starting point this needle length is good. I rolled and dermastamped. Very Happy

I cant believe I finally did it, but I must be a bigger chicken than most on here because I used numbing cream. It was a little uncomfortable in sections where I purposely didn't put it, just to see what its like. I didn't like the prickly feeling.

My questions are:

*During the roll I slathered on my serums(B serum and one that came with the roller) then after the roll/stamp I wiped it down with cool water then slathered my serums on again (same ones with the addition of copper peptides). Is that okay or did I do it wrong??

*I'm using the stamp mainly on a scar I have near my wrist and pigmentation spots here and there. The rest of the face I roll because its quicker. Do most of you use both rolling and stamp methods?

*Should I apply retina-a tonight or tomorrow night?

* Should I make another attempt in a weeks time. The lady I bought it from said I could use it 2-3x per week (the roller mainly). Just seems like overkill to me.

BTW my face is red, not much bleeding except for where I stamped. Feels hot, like most describe as a sunburn.

Okay only problem now...I didn't think of this Shock

is I have to pick up my daughter from school now. I hope the sunscreen doesn't affect the actives I just put on. Ugh!!! I was too excited and couldn't wait to try Surprised

He..he..he..

Anyways thanks for any input, I know you ladies are busy gals, but soo smart, I just had to ask these questions
TYIA

Dionie...I can't answer your questions because I haven't used my dermapen yet, but I this much I know: I would not use sunscreen after the treatment. I actually avoid the sun and don't use anything cosmetic ( or chemical) for at least 48 hours.

free skin care · Fri Apr 12, 2013 4:45 am

Those of you using the My-M, please keep us updated with your results! I am really interested (especially now seeing just how "prickly" regular derma rollers are!) and would love to hear you gals getting great results.

free skin care · Fri Apr 12, 2013 8:42 pm

mountaingirl wrote:

dionie wrote:

Hi again,
I hope its okay if I post here as the other thread is so long and no one was able to answer my question. I'm so excited so I have to share somewhere. I didn't purchase the motorised derma stamp but I did purchase a regular one (1mm) and it came in a special package deal with a 0.5mm roller too. I think as a starting point this needle length is good. I rolled and dermastamped. Very Happy

I cant believe I finally did it, but I must be a bigger chicken than most on here because I used numbing cream. It was a little uncomfortable in sections where I purposely didn't put it, just to see what its like. I didn't like the prickly feeling.

My questions are:

*During the roll I slathered on my serums(B serum and one that came with the roller) then after the roll/stamp I wiped it down with cool water then slathered my serums on again (same ones with the addition of copper peptides). Is that okay or did I do it wrong??

*I'm using the stamp mainly on a scar I have near my wrist and pigmentation spots here and there. The rest of the face I roll because its quicker. Do most of you use both rolling and stamp methods?

*Should I apply retina-a tonight or tomorrow night?

* Should I make another attempt in a weeks time. The lady I bought it from said I could use it 2-3x per week (the roller mainly). Just seems like overkill to me.

BTW my face is red, not much bleeding except for where I stamped. Feels hot, like most describe as a sunburn.

Okay only problem now...I didn't think of this Shock

is I have to pick up my daughter from school now. I hope the sunscreen doesn't affect the actives I just put on. Ugh!!! I was too excited and couldn't wait to try Surprised

He..he..he..

Anyways thanks for any input, I know you ladies are busy gals, but soo smart, I just had to ask these questions
TYIA

Dionie...I can't answer your questions because I haven't used my dermapen yet, but I this much I know: I would not use sunscreen after the treatment. I actually avoid the sun and don't use anything cosmetic ( or chemical) for at least 48 hours.

Thanks for replying. Yeah I had realised after I shouldnt have. My sunscreen is pretty good though, no nasties like parabens that are harmful and uses only zinc for UV protection. It's the burnout kids one. But next time I'll do it in the evening or after school. Unfortunately I have to get out of the house the next morning anyways, either to take kids to school or go to work. So staying indoors for more than a day wouldnt be an option. Sad

free skin care · Sun Apr 14, 2013 8:31 pm

Barefootgirl wrote:

Also, with a commercial site such as owndoc, you have to consider what dog they have in the fight. The article claims they are losing money by not selling pens and that is probably a true statement - but could it not also be true that they would lose money if they offered them, since it would potentially cannibalize their roller business?

Since the pens are mostly considered for use by professionals, there might also be a problem there for the site to sell devices directly to consumers - much the same problem that happens when online beauty sites attempt to sell grey market professional hair dyes, etc.

Just my off the cuff thoughts...

BFG

So this is interesting...OwnDoc is coming out with their version of the Dermapen (DermaJet), available in July for $249. IMHO this device looks like it will be a bit unwieldy, but I guess it is a wait and see.

http://owndoc.com/dermarolling/derma-pen-review/

free skin care · Mon Apr 15, 2013 3:07 am

Panda1 wrote:

Barefootgirl wrote:

Also, with a commercial site such as owndoc, you have to consider what dog they have in the fight. The article claims they are losing money by not selling pens and that is probably a true statement - but could it not also be true that they would lose money if they offered them, since it would potentially cannibalize their roller business?

Since the pens are mostly considered for use by professionals, there might also be a problem there for the site to sell devices directly to consumers - much the same problem that happens when online beauty sites attempt to sell grey market professional hair dyes, etc.

Just my off the cuff thoughts...

BFG

So this is interesting...OwnDoc is coming out with their version of the Dermapen (DermaJet), available in July for $249. IMHO this device looks like it will be a bit unwieldy, but I guess it is a wait and see.

http://owndoc.com/dermarolling/derma-pen-review/

This is what OwnDoc says about the needle pen they tested:

Quote:

This device claims to needle to a maximum depth of 1 mm, but we found it nearly impossible to penetrate the skin.

As far as the MyM is concerned, I know for a fact that it penetrates the skin extremely effectively - far more effectively than the manual rollers that I have used in the past. As for the DermaPen (which OwnDoc did not test and which I also have not used) I don't believe that it could possibly be lacking in penetration - it is the device used by the majority of clinics who provide a professional treatment.

Obviously, OwnDoc have their own agenda at play here - but that's not to say that their device is better or worse than others out there in the market place.

Must tell you that I've been using the MyM on my nose - something that I didn't attempt with a manual roller because it's just too hard. My pores (or should I say craters) are disappearing - I'm impressed!

free skin care · Mon Apr 15, 2013 7:54 am

I guess I am repeating myself here, but these automated needling devices are not automated rollers, they are automated stampers - so as long as you envision a stamping motion versus a rolling/gliding motion - you will get the idea.(think about the needles going up and down versus sliding back and forth. I literally just moved the device up and down in rows across my skin- did not or could not, let it "glide".

I think the ones that are shown gliding over the skin are set on the shortest needle setting possible - so this may help somewhat with product penetration, but it's hard for me to understand how they would assist in collagen induction.

Also, I would think that there's a been a brisk business in regular stampers and rollers - so of course the automated devices are creating concerns about business losses.

BFG

free skin care · Mon Apr 15, 2013 9:50 am

I think owndoc is flip flopping back and forth on the automated rollers. First it says that the one it tested was nearly impossible to penetrate the skin.

Own doc says:
This is not the Dermapen® brand (because we found no way on their site to purchase one) but a similar device. This device looks very similar, is based on the same principle and uses similar components. This device claims to needle to a maximum depth of 1 mm, but we found it nearly impossible to penetrate the skin. This is due to the “Fakir effect”, which needs strong force to overcome it, which this device can’t muster. We had to press hard onto the skin at the maximum power setting to get some redness occurring, and that only on the inside of the wrist and other such places.

I know from my own experience that the MY-m has no problem penetrating my skin because I bleed when I use it. I never bled when using a .02 or .05mm roller so that leads me to believe that the My-m needles go deeper then either of those two needle lengths.

Further down the web page it talks about micro-tearing of the skin. How does this happen if the believe that it is nearly impossible for the needles to penetrate. This doesn't make any sense.

Now owndoc has come up with a machine of its own.
Have they been able to overcome the the design considerations and issues that they had below. Who knows?

Owndoc said:
After some experimentation and brainstorming, we came to the conclusion that this was not an easy task. Practical design considerations required a needling speed equal to the mains frequency (50 or 60 Hz). But that would be too fast for optimal results in our opinion, and moreover, it would require enormous power if you’d want to drive a dozen needles into the skin simultaneously.

My OWN thoughts on this is they have "a dog in the race". I think owndoc is a good company but like everyone who owns a company they want and need to make money. I do think they want to and maybe did come up with a product that they are proud to sell and that works well but that doesn't mean that the either the Dermapen or the knockoffs don't work. I think there are too many people that have used a Dermapen or its knockoff that have had success with them. I do also think this electric version of the dermaroller has probably cut into their sales. Otherwise they wouldn't have had to come up with a competing product.

free skin care · Mon Apr 15, 2013 5:36 pm

What needle depth did you use Keliu and what kind of HA are you using. Is it a gel, or spray or a DIY formula?
Very Happy

I bought one today...

Keliu wrote:

I'm on a "rest period" from the ReAura Laser so I am now going to do a further six MyM treatments - did my first one last Wednesday - so much for the "rest"!!!

I have to say that I'm loving this device - so much better than a manual roller. As for the skin tearing issue - I haven't found this to be a problem at all. I use the device on the highest speed and I find that there's no significant dragging. I apply Emla and cover with cling wrap, leave for one hour, wipe off and then apply HA. I treat the face for as much as I can stand. My Wednesday treatment was pretty intense - quite bloody and red afterwards. Next morning still a little "sore" with some needle marks but most of the redness had dissipated. Today I'm pretty much back to normal.

Between the ReAura and the MyM I feel that I'm doing the very best for my skin. I believe I'm really starting to see results - my daughter was here last week and she says she can see an enormous improvement in skin texture and tone.

free skin care · Mon Apr 15, 2013 5:41 pm

mountaingirl wrote:

What needle depth did you use Keliu and what kind of HA are you using. Is it a gel, or spray or a DIY formula?
Very Happy

I bought one today...

I'm using a setting between 1 and 1.5mm. I purchased a cheap HA gel serum from Ebay. A DIY version would be fine.

free skin care · Mon Apr 15, 2013 5:46 pm

CookieD wrote:

My OWN thoughts on this is they have "a dog in the race". I think owndoc is a good company but like everyone who owns a company they want and need to make money. I do think they want to and maybe did come up with a product that they are proud to sell and that works well but that doesn't mean that the either the Dermapen or the knockoffs don't work. I think there are too many people that have used a Dermapen or its knockoff that have had success with them. I do also think this electric version of the dermaroller has probably cut into their sales. Otherwise they wouldn't have had to come up with a competing product.

Agreed - their comments on the force needed to penetrate the skin are ridiculous IMO. But then, I also find their stance on Buckminsterfullerene hard to swallow.

Mon Apr 15, 2013 9:34 pm

Barefootgirl wrote:

these automated needling devices are not automated rollers, they are automated stampers - so as long as you envision a stamping motion versus a rolling/gliding motion - you will get the idea.

I think the ones that are shown gliding over the skin are set on the shortest needle setting possible - so this may help somewhat with product penetration, but it's hard for me to understand how they would assist in collagen induction.

BFG

that is totally it!

i just used the MY M derma-like pen
on saturday evening as an electric STAMP machine.

and while i got penetration at 2mm, i found that even at the slowest speed, the device was BOUNCING on my skin unless i was placing a great deal of pressure. still i found it a bit unwieldy and was concerned about the "evenness" of the stamping due to the automatic "in and out" pulsing of the cartridge. but managed to induce bleeding over the select areas i did stamp. (i was stamping specific acne scars and enlarged pore areas NOT the entire face). i used Peter thomas roth viz 1000 hyaluronic acid 75% (although it is the salt based one) for glide and Kinerase c8 peptide after treatment, which i thought was a copper peptide but is actually a Vitamin C based product).

for five areas on my face
lowest setting (green light) which i thought was too fast....for stamping at least

2mm for cheeks and lower face
1.5 for glabellar and forehead (the 2mm was too "bouncy" off the bones

got good penetration
but it wasn't easy or smooth
i used a stamping motion instead of a gliding one

so far i still have my face!
thank god

the areas were red immediately after
then a bit burning after a applied the c8 peptide
next day swollen and red but since this was a spot treatment nothing too bad

today about 36 hours after
redness is disappearing
and i do see improvement in the few scars i have treated but this can be due to the inflammatory healing response. i was surprised by the amount of blood i got and how quickly it stopped seeping once wiped with an alcohol pad.

i agree with you that even at 2mm penetration not sure of the collagen induction since but with most injectables i always believed that a lot of the volume created or benefit is due to the inflammatory or healing response of the body, initially, anyway. thing is how long "initial" inflammatory phase means to the body is individually based. sometimes (and hopefully) this initial inflammation can last a good amount of time until the the effects of tissue formation (collagen, aka scar tissue) and remodeling occurs which can make for a seamless result. that is volume from inflammation is seen and as this decreases the tissue is building in its place. but let's remember as with any cosmetic procedure (even structural), there is always a maintenance or "UPKEEP"element.

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